Chemtrails? Contrails? Don't know so YOU decide!!! (PICS)

OK... I 've been running around this site trying to get my 20 posts so I could make this thread. Well this morning I had been hearing rumblings of jets and it was actually getting pretty nerve racking!!!! So around 1:00 pm I decide to just check and see whats going on outside... I looked up and in the sky and seen these trails... I immediately jumped on the computer and looked up images of chemtrails and contrails to compare with and I decided to go ahead and snap some photos... I'm not swaying either way... i just want the opinion of fellow ATSers... what do you think these are?

All of these pictures were taken on my front step right outside my door today. It was around 1:10 or 1:15 pm. I'm in North Carolina. I live out in the boonies and I do see jets in the air constantly but I don't see these trails on a constant basis though.

Well I couldn't figure out a way to embed the images so I'm just gonna give you guys the link to a slideshow and the photo album.

Pic Slideshow

Photo Album

They look like standard contrails.. I live near a major commercial airport ( about 15 minutes from me ) and a major USAF base ( about 3 minutes from me ) .. The sky around me is always covered in contrails when the weather permits. ( proper humidity, proper air pressure, proper temperature )

I noticed a lot around here as well. Did you see the one where the plane made the line cloud then right after that, another plane was following the same line like about 2 inches above the other cloud. Sorry, I don't know what they are.

Welcome fellow N. Carolinian

There are a number of your pictures that look like standard contrails.....but there were a couple of images that were a bit 'off' from the normal contrail's development.....This could be atmospheric, or something else....but a few of your pictures are a bit 'different'.....

Thank you for your replies... and thank you for the welcome Manhater....

like i said I'm not swaying either way because I'm no expert on chemtrails or contrails... that's why I posted this thread to seek the opinion of others who are more familiar with this.

Once again thank you guys for the replies.....

Thanks for taking the time to share the pictures. There is a certain crowd on this site who live to discredit anything to do with chemtrails. According to them, every chemtrail is a persistent contrail. If you learn to ignore them and not let their negativity discourage you from discussing this topic you will find many people willing to share their opinion on this phenomena.

I have some pictures of chemtrails that I took today. I'm on my iPhone so I can't post them until I get home. It is Thanksgiving Sunday in Canada and they are spraying as usual. Whatever the reason for the spraying, they still spray on holidays. The debunkers will tell me it is normal air traffic, but as I explained many times the airspace in my area is restricted due to local military installations. These planes flying overhead are not recretional or commercial.

Some great pics.

I don't know if you have been following this particular forum, but expect a deluge of replies from the usual suspects who will say they are ordinary contrails, nothing to see here, move on back to reality T.V.

Personally, without actually seeing them being made it is difficult to judge, but some of them look like the sort of Chemtrails I have seen around the South West of the U.K.

Best of luck with search for answers.

Can someone explain how to tell the difference between a persistent spreading contrail, and a chemtrail?

Originally posted by Uncinus
Can someone explain how to tell the difference between a persistent spreading contrail, and a chemtrail?

You're the expert. You tell us.

reply to post by TheAnnunakiReturn



I see 11 (eleven) photos in the photo album. All contrails, and cirrus clouds.

Could not see anything in the ImageShack "slideshow". Are they the same eleven (11)??


Now I have a question:

What material can possibly be "sprayed" and will suspend in the atmosphere so that it looks exactly identical to cirrus clouds, and jet contrails? Down to the same color, and behavior and opacity??

Also, after you pick a material with those characteristics, then how much (in weight, or volume...we can do math) do you suppose would be needed in order to make such displays?

(Sorry, I said "a question"....but that was more than one....Good luck).

Originally posted by Uncinus
Can someone explain how to tell the difference between a persistent spreading contrail, and a chemtrail?

good question....

and thanks once again for the replies everyone... stars for everyone... i'm just trying to figure it out so I can know. Debunkers can come in here and curse me to high heaven but it's not gonna stop me from trynna find answers. On the flip side It's not like we can do a damn thing about what our gov't does if it is true but at the same time it just lets you know how freakin twisted TPTB are.....

you guys are really helpful

They can't stop me from snappin pics though

Originally posted by ProudBird
reply to post by TheAnnunakiReturn

 

I see 11 (eleven) photos in the photo album. All contrails, and cirrus clouds.

Could not see anything in the ImageShack "slideshow". Are they the same eleven (11)??


Now I have a question:

What material can possibly be "sprayed" and will suspend in the atmosphere so that it looks exactly identical to cirrus clouds, and jet contrails? Down to the same color, and behavior and opacity??

Also, after you pick a material with those characteristics, then how much (in weight, or volume...we can do math) do you suppose would be needed in order to make such displays?

(Sorry, I said "a question"....but that was more than one....Good luck).

edit on Sun 9 October 2011 by ProudBird because: (no reason given)

Dont have the slightest clue... and im not the type to pretend to be an expert in anything... just put the pics up for the fellow ATSers... if it is fully explained to me that it's just contrails and clouds then oh well it's just that... but at the same time I just found it quite odd the volume of jets flying over (to the point it woke me up) and the formation of some of the "trails" / "clouds"

...and yes the photo album is the same as the slide.... same pics....


I also have a question... when contrails disperse do they get really wide? cuz I watched some of those trails go from small to really wide.... once again I don't know the behavior of contrails or chemtrails.. this is brand new to me so if I come off sounding like a preschooler then sorry in advance

Originally posted by Corruption Exposed

Originally posted by Uncinus
Can someone explain how to tell the difference between a persistent spreading contrail, and a chemtrail?

You're the expert. You tell us.

Well, since all the photos that are supposed to be "chemtrails", look just like persistent spreading contrails, then I really don't know.

I take it you don't know either?

Does anyone know what the difference is?

I can't view the slide show, but the pictures look like contrails to me.

They have dispersed somewhat in a few cases, and are all accompanied by cirrus clouds - which are essentially they same sort of thing - ice crystal cloud - so it is unsurprising that ice-crystal contrails would form in the sort of conditions that support ice-crystal cloud.

So far the only visible differences I've ever heard suggested between contrails and chemtrails are

1/ that contrails only last a short time - I've seen suggestions from 10 seconds to 40 minutes. But this is clearly untrue unless you think there were chemtrails being sprayed by B-17 bombers over England and Germany in WW2 when they literally covered the sky with contrails that could last for hours.

2/ chemtrails spread out and can cover the sky in cloud - contrails do not - but again that seems proved wrong by ample historical evidence going back at least as far as 1940, when a French reconnaisance pilot reported:

The German on the ground knows us by the pearly white scarf which every plane flying at high altitude trails behind like a bridal veil. The disturbance created by our meteoric flight crystallizes the watery vapor in the atmosphere. We unwind behind us a cirrus of icicles. If the atmospheric conditions are favorable to the formation of clouds, our wake will thicken bit by bit and become an evening cloud over the countryside.

Written in "Flight to Arras, by Antoine Saint-Exupery, and reported in Wakes of War Pt 2 - along with many other WW2 cases.

And pre-WW2 contrails are examined in Wakes of War Pt 1 for good measure.

so while I am concerned about the possibility of "something" being sprayed, to date I am unconvinced by the poor evidence advanced to show that it is actually happening.

reply to post by TheAnnunakiReturn

but at the same time I just found it quite odd the volume of jets flying over (to the point it woke me up) and the formation of some of the "trails" / "clouds"

Well.....now, let's be clear, the sounds that woke you up were *probably* not made by the jets that were responsible for those contrails. Unless you are somewhere very, very quiet (usually in the remote desert, where the flat land reflects the sound readily) you won't be able to hear the airliners from their cruise altitudes of 31,000 to 39,000 feet. Certainly, that should not be loud enough to wake you up (unless a very light sleeper).

Another possibility was from other, lower altitude jets....which of course, would not be obvious from contrails, since they won't make any. Even if there is a major airport nearby, but you normally don't hear the air traffic (because of the way they are routed)....on occasion jets do fly off the *normal* routes, in the vicinity of airports. Many reasons....

... when contrails disperse do they get really wide?

Sometimes yes, sometimes no. Depends on the variables, such as current conditions, and the types of winds, speed, direction, shears, etc.

Really, when you think about it.....contrails are just a form of cloud. Cirrus clouds, to be exact. And, clouds come in many, many shapes, and are affected by winds, shears, humidity, conditions, etc. Not much difference between contrails and cirrus....except the initial shapes, and the fact that indeed...they are artificially produced. But, it's just the by-product of our airplane technology.

Originally posted by TheAnnunakiReturn
I also have a question... when contrails disperse do they get really wide? cuz I watched some of those trails go from small to really wide.... once again I don't know the behavior of contrails or chemtrails.. this is brand new to me so if I come off sounding like a preschooler then sorry in advance

No, that's a good question. There's three types of contrail formed by the water in engine exhaust:

[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/c9500d414e8d.jpg[/atsimg]

The persistent spreading contrails spread because of the wind. Specifically they spread because the ice crystals they are made of will sink though the air, at different rates depending on the size of the individual crystals. So it will naturally spread vertically. It can almost act like a cloud, precipitating ice crystals like high altitude snow.

If it spreads vertically enough then the difference in wind speed between the top and the bottom of the contrail will spread it out horizontally. See the top right image above, The contrail is moving from right to left. The leading edge of the contrail is higher, so moving faster, it's leaving behind a "tail", like on a cirrus uncinus cloud, but all the way along the trail, so it kind of smears across the sky.

Not all contrails spread though. If there's low wind, or low humidity, the trail will pretty much just sit there (the middle column, above).

VERY informative posts..... Uncinus, Proudbird, and Aloysius the Gaul.... thanks alot guys. You guys have painted a clearer picture and I dont feel as "helpless" as I did before I'll keep them eyes to the skies though... hopefully I'll catch something interesting....

stars to you all!

Some contrails are even more persistent than those already illustrated, they can spread far wider and persist all day and do increase cloud cover. You have to assume then that a contrail does increase earth's albedo. What you don't have to assume though, is that a contrail has its own chemical effects, due to both engine conbustion, and exhaust reaction with the atmosphere, in which there are unknowns. These unknowns will, in part be due to what jet fuel may contain the the form of 'easy running' additives, some of which are a 'secret formula' It would not be true to say that there are limits to where a contrail might be seen, that is down to temperature, you can see contrails on the ground in the right conditions, and in some extreme cases contrails on the ground have caused icy fogs and airport closures. Humidity is always an improving factor, and the arbitrary temperature figure for forming a contrail is -40º so the aircraft, and it need not be a jet, needs only to be flying in airspace where there is that temperature.

Originally posted by TheAnnunakiReturn
VERY informative posts.....

See following for timeline going back 71 years of people viewing contrails. If you watch 'Chemtrail' videos then you will probably be told that they didn't exist before the mid 1990s. Don't believe them!

See the archive at Flight Magazine starting with observations during World War 2

www.abovetopsecret.com...

www.abovetopsecret.com...

www.abovetopsecret.com...

Persistent contrails were also observed back in World War 1.

www.abovetopsecret.com...

See following.

contrailscience.com...

The die-hard chemtrailers will also inform you that propeller driven aircraft can't produce contrails. They can.



TJ

You said you don't see them on a constant basis.

I am glad you are taking note of when you see them and when you don't.

Keep watching and you will eventually see that it's not consistent at all with the science of persisting contrails.

And of course... my opinion is that your pics are of Chemtrails.