Why is everyone afraid of a place called HELL?

reply to post by sHuRuLuNi


That is reassuring, for a minute there I thought I missed the memo that said I was born to be evil... and I had no choice. Sorry the prevoius post I commented on got me all fired up...

reply to post by spy66


That is assuming that a tree has the ability to think and reason.
Oh yeah and has a soul or spirit.

Originally posted by Minori
reply to post by sHuRuLuNi

 

Ok...so do you agree that we have free will??
That we ourselves by our actions determine our fate after death??
Is not our destiny able to change based on the choices we make??

PLPL

edit on 12-10-2011 by Minori because: after thought

You dont have the authority to alter anything. Just like yo cant change what is bound to happen to you in the future. You cant alter the choices you make, once you make the choice, you can only make a new one. Your choice will only seam like its a choice by free will to you. That is the illusion of having free will.

reply to post by spy66


Ok so then your calling the bible, the people that wrote it, and what is stands for a lie??
Did you at all read my previous post??
It is in the great book itself.
Please scroll up and find my post and read it.

Why would God want us to break the very commandments he gave us??
The rules to follow to achieve heaven, why would he want us to perish??
What is the name of your God so I can stay away.

Why would he want any of us to be evil..... he feels bad for Lucifer so he wants him to have a few friends??
It makes no sense.

Originally posted by Minori
reply to post by spy66

 

That is assuming that a tree has the ability to think and reason.
Oh yeah and has a soul or spirit.

edit on 12-10-2011 by Minori because: (no reason given)

No it dosent. The tree will grow once it is planted, if it wants to or not. Once you are born you will live until you die if you like it or not. It has nothing to do with free will. You have to stay the course set for you.

reply to post by spy66


So people who choose to take their own life...they really had no choice, God said " When you turn 25 I want you to go to the garage and hang yourself, even though you are breaking one of the very commandments I gave you , Thou shall not kill. I know that when you do this you have to suffer for your sin, but it will be OK because I said so. Do you hear yourself????




Galatians 6:7-8

Do not be deceived: God is not mocked, for whatever one sows, that will he also reap. For the one who sows to his own flesh will from the flesh reap corruption, but the one who sows to the Spirit will from the Spirit reap eternal life.

Originally posted by Minori
reply to post by spy66

 

So people who choose to take their own life...they really had no choice, God said " When you turn 25 I want you to go to the garage and hang yourself, even though you are breaking one of the very commandments I gave you , Thou shall not kill. I know that when you do this you have to suffer for your sin, but it will be OK because I said so. Do you hear yourself????

I don't think he does hear himself ...

According to him then it means Hitler was actually a good fella' - he can then on the Judgment day stand before God and say to him "YOU MADE ME DO IT".
What perverted thinking is that?

reply to post by sHuRuLuNi


Thank God for like minds.....
I do not want to meet his God...
I'll stick to mine....

PLPL

Wait did God tell you to post this...or did you choose to post this......

Originally posted by Minori
reply to post by spy66

 

Ok so then your calling the bible, the people that wrote it, and what is stands for a lie??
Did you at all read my previous post??
It is in the great book itself.
Please scroll up and find my post and read it.

Why would God want us to break the very commandments he gave us??
The rules to follow to achieve heaven, why would he want us to perish??
What is the name of your God so I can stay away.

Why would he want any of us to be evil..... he feels bad for Lucifer so he wants him to have a few friends??
It makes no sense.

edit on 12-10-2011 by Minori because: shock

Ok so then your calling the bible, the people that wrote it, and what is stands for a lie??

I am not, but you are. The bible tells us exactly what will take place in the future by prophesies.
It dosent exactly say what will happen to you. But you are a part of this event like every one else is. You are condemned to experiance this life as well. And you have a part to play like every one else does.

Why would God want us to break the very commandments he gave us??

God dosent want us to break his commands, You are living exactly like you are condemned to live, we all are.

We are commanded to experience good and evil. And that is exactly what we are doing. Non of us live by Moses 10 commandments. Because we can't and we wont. We are condemned by God to live the way we are.

Dont you understand that?

reply to post by spy66


How am I calling the bible a lie?? I have quoted verses from the bible that back up what I am saying.
Where do you get your information from??
Wait.....the devil??? Because God determined you to be evil??
Now it makes sense.

Originally posted by Minori
reply to post by spy66

 

How am I calling the bible a lie?? I have quoted verses from the bible that back up what I am saying.
Where do you get your information from??
Wait.....the devil??? Because God determined you to be evil??
Now it makes sense.

How do you know if i am evil?
How do you know that you are good?

Who gave you authority to judge me or your self?

You dont know what good is. You only know that we have a difference of opinion.

reply to post by spy66


I have no authority to judge ANYBODY...there is only one person who does that. GOD
But wait why would he need to judge any of us, he already knows what type of person we are..good or evil.
So that makes the whole judgement day thing a farce as well.....he already judged us before we were even here.

So all religions are going against Gods plan, trying to conform those evil people into believers. I wonder how big of a sin that is...wait a minute, did'nt that get Lucifer kicked out??? I'm confused??

Your concept makes God accountable for our sins... when we are accountable for our own actions.
Someone steals or cheats or lies...standard response " the devil made me do it".... so we need to change that to "God made me do it"....yeah not so much.



I don't think there is a moment when God is not willing to give His people the power to avoid sin. In fact, the Bible says that "with every temptation He has also made a way of escape, that you may be able to bear it" (1 Corinthians 10:13).

Originally posted by spy66
You are living exactly like you are condemned to live, we all are.

And We did not wrong them, but it was they who were the wrongdoers.
- Qur'an, 43.76

There shall be no compulsion in the religion. The right course has become clear from the wrong. So whoever disbelieves in Taghut and believes in Allah has grasped the most trustworthy handhold with no break in it. And Allah is Hearing and Knowing.
- Qur'an, 2:256

reply to post by spy66



con·demn
   [kuhn-dem] Show IPA

verb (used with object)
1.
to express an unfavorable or adverse judgment on; indicate strong disapproval of; censure.

2.
to pronounce to be guilty; sentence to punishment: to condemn a murderer to life imprisonment.

3.
to give grounds or reason for convicting or censuring: His acts condemn him

God condemned me before I even began to live........takes original sin to a whole new level.
I would really love to know where you got your information from.......it intrigues me.

Originally posted by Minori
reply to post by spy66

 

I have no authority to judge ANYBODY...there is only one person who does that. GOD
But wait why would he need to judge any of us, he already knows what type of person we are..good or evil.
So that makes the whole judgement day thing a farce as well.....he already judged us before we were even here.

So all religions are going against Gods plan, trying to conform those evil people into believers. I wonder how big of a sin that is...wait a minute, did'nt that get Lucifer kicked out??? I'm confused??

Your concept makes God accountable for our sins... when we are accountable for our own actions.
Someone steals or cheats or lies...standard response " the devil made me do it".... so we need to change that to "God made me do it"....yeah not so much.

edit on 12-10-2011 by Minori because: (no reason given)

edit on 12-10-2011 by Minori because: spelling

So all religions are going against Gods plan, trying to conform those evil people into believers. I wonder how big of a sin that is...wait a minute, did'nt that get Lucifer kicked out??? I'm confused??

I dont see how religion is going against Gods plan. It is making Gods plan work perfectly. It creates two camps exercising good and evil against each other. Exactly as we are condemned to live.

But who is really good and who is really evil between religious believers and non believers is actually a debatable question. Non of the religious people live according to their own religion, or the commandments they have given them selves to live by. So they can not be trusted to be all good can they?

So the question about who is good and who is evil is quite open. We have no idea who is who.

I was listening to an MP3 of a reading of a 1850 novel where one of the characters, an artist who was working on a painting of a scene from this play by Euripides, did a recitation from it so I decided to look it up and here I am posting a segment from the Wikipedia article, which fits the topic of this thread.

With Apollo's help, Admetus completed the king's task, and was allowed to marry Alcestis. After the wedding, Admetus forgot to make the required sacrifice to Artemis, and found his bed full of snakes. Apollo again helped the newly wed king, this time by making the Fates drunk, extracting from them a promise that if anyone would want to die instead of Admetus, they would allow it. Since no one volunteered, not even his elderly parents, Alcestis stepped forth. Shortly after, Heracles rescued Alcestis from Hades, as a token of appreciation for the hospitality of Admetus. Admetus and Alcestis had a son, Eumelus, a participant in the siege of Troy, and a daughter, Perimele.

Alcestis

reply to post by spy66


So then my friend maybe you are the one with inner turmoil. Do you know if you are good or evil. I do not see how you can not separate the two. You do know that killing someone is bad...I hope, but offering to help someone in need is good.

I know that you can not have one with out the other. I also know that in order to get to the light you have to go through the dark. In my opinion their is a battle for all souls, it depends which side you choose.
I hope you make the right choice, safe passage.

PLPL

reply to post by spy66

Why would God condemn him self to hell, or to burn for eternity?

Each one of us have Gods soul (the i am function), in a living body created by flesh

You would have to imagine a god who is not really like us, and also, may not have even made us, or anyone related to us. Or maybe a god who made us and then died, to where the remaining gods cared not for us, not being of their own making. Or maybe a god who made us, but then once he got a good look at us and his self pride in his workmanship wore off, he decided he really din't like us as much as he though he would, back when he came up with the plan to make us in the first place.
The only god who would care about us was one who made us from himself. That sounds more encouraging but if this god broke himself into fragments to make us, how does a god remain to care for us? I think we have to realize that we, as a whole are still that god's equal, or maybe even greater than the sum of the parts. When Cain asked, "Am I my brother's keeper?" he was asking the right question but he came up with the wrong answer. We need to worship the god fragments all around us and that caring about someone outside our own selves is what we need to do to become a god as one.

reply to post by spy66

It is also predetermined by God who will do evil. If not; than the bible is false.

Another way to see it, maybe, is the god created a garden in the midst of this world as a showcase for his greatness and how benevolent he was. He placed in this garden every tree which was good to look at and was good for food and in the midst of this garden was the tree of life which was the greatest and most direct representation of his benevolent nature.
Also, in the midst of this garden sprung up from the earth (not one this first god planted) the tree which represented the god of the underworld. The first god who fancied himself as the god of life showed his true nature, as being in an unfriendly league with the second god, not of death itself, but the caretaker of the earth in general, and of the dead in particular, which soon came into existence through this self-styled god of life.
I think my point is that we are really doomed by our very existence. We need to look at a bigger God than the god of this world because that one only gives one option.

reply to post by spy66

I dont see how religion is going against Gods plan. It is making Gods plan work perfectly. It creates two camps exercising good and evil against each other. Exactly as we are condemned to live.

But who is really good and who is really evil between religious believers and non believers is actually a debatable question. Non of the religious people live according to their own religion, or the commandments they have given them selves to live by. So they can not be trusted to be all good can they?

So the question about who is good and who is evil is quite open. We have no idea who is who.

Good and evil are man made "subjective" concepts... but why is it your job to decide who is good or evil?


Have you heard this before?

24Another parable put he forth unto them, saying, The kingdom of heaven is likened unto a man which sowed good seed in his field:

25But while men slept, his enemy came and sowed tares among the wheat, and went his way.

26But when the blade was sprung up, and brought forth fruit, then appeared the tares also.

27So the servants of the householder came and said unto him, Sir, didst not thou sow good seed in thy field? from whence then hath it tares?

28He said unto them, An enemy hath done this. The servants said unto him, Wilt thou then that we go and gather them up?

29But he said, Nay; lest while ye gather up the tares, ye root up also the wheat with them.

30Let both grow together until the harvest: and in the time of harvest I will say to the reapers, Gather ye together first the tares, and bind them in bundles to burn them: but gather the wheat into my barn.