An understanding of Islam ,from a convert

reply to post by Ranthenae


I am a christian lady and I walk behind my husband.
I wear dresses and skirts down to my ankles.I only
wear shorts and sweatpants around my house,never
out in public.
I consider myself equal to my husband in many ways.
He works to provide for his family,I run the house and
pay the bills.

Even though the flag talks of peace the sword below it tells me it is a peace forced by the sword.

your words sound all cool and all but when I look to the left and see you in military camo's and touting guns your not giving off the impression of peace but one of military dominance. you're telling me your trained and ready for a fight. Peaceful religions don't need to fight unless they are political in nature. And two things that never mix is politics and religion. Political Religions throughout history have always sough world dominance and that is not a peaceful event.

You said something about not being Islamic but Arabic in practice of the Koran. that is interesting that you make a distinction between them. So can you make and give us the distinctions where something is not Islamic but Persian practice of the Koran as in the case of Iran? Or something not Islam and Turkish in practice of the Koran? Or Something that is Syrian in practice of the Koran?

What you say when you make a statement like that is each race or ethnic group or nation practices the Koran according to their culture differences and interpretation. So what you are telling us is Arab Muslims make Koranic practice that is different than Persian Muslims. Black Muslims have Koranic practice differently than white Muslims.

Is that ...SERIOUSLY... a GUN in your display picture?

Sorry. That's where you're going to lose people here. Promoting the 'religion of peace' with guns and swords.
I don't care what God, or the priest, or your holy book says at all. The presence of a weapon does NOT promote peace. Done. No explanation required.

This is why Islam is frowned upon - Weaponry and violence contradict peace. Period.

Originally posted by benrl
reply to post by buster2010

 

Im not aware, because I haven't done the research but do majority christian nations still stone and kill Gay men and Women adulterers in the streets?

Cause I think that could be the problem people have with islam?

Yeah, the way i remember it, it was the christians who were stoned in the streets, crucified, beheaded, fed to lions, and thrown to gladiators for sport.

Now there was a branch of catholics called the Dominicans in the Spanish Inquisition that had a taste for butchering, torturing and burning protestant christians because they refused to worship Mary, the human mother of Jesus. This ofcourse was sanctioned by the Holy Roman Catholic Church (which the Lord is going to have a bone to pick with those when he returns).

Before that there was the Crusades that were also sanctioned by the Holy Roman Catholic Church where again they urged christians to go on rampages and murder other peoples and defy the Lord Jesus Christ's commandment to "love your enemies as you love your neighbor" and to "turn the other cheek" and "forgive and pray for those whom offend you" and last but not the least "do unto others as you would have them do unto you".

Christianity went through its dark period when corrupt men used the Lords word to gain personal power for selfish reasons and they will burn in hell for it. It wasnt until peasants were given the right to learn to read and write that we learned we were being lied to and saw the corruption of T.H.R.C. and began to seek the Lord by ourselves during the Martin Luther Reformation where the birth of the protestant churches began.

God does not hate gay people, he hates their sin. If they gave up their sin he would have no problem saving them. If you cannot give up your wicked ways he will not save you. You must purify yourself by giving up your sin. If you run into a crowd of people and detonate the bomb you were wearing and kill people, there will not be 72 virgins waiting for you in heaven, because you will go to hell for breaking the commandment "thou shalt not murder", there won't be 72 virgins waiting for you anyway because fornication is a sin, not to mention you wont have genitalia because we will have new bodies so there wont be sex anyways. Good luck having sex when youre junkless.

reply to post by racasan


Well, that is your perfect opinion and I am no one to take that away from you or criticise you. At teh end we all believe what we want.
I am just saying in biased way that people believe because of what their life has been and I can see why people would believe in religions.
As I said I am not religious but cannot say I am right to the ones opossing my ideas

Originally posted by azulejo
reply to post by racasan

 

Well, that is your perfect opinion and I am no one to take that away from you or criticise you. At teh end we all believe what we want.
I am just saying in biased way that people believe because of what their life has been and I can see why people would believe in religions.
As I said I am not religious but cannot say I am right to the ones opossing my ideas

actually you can check to see if some ideas are right or wrong - simply see if they agree with reality


The quran* gives us a way of testing some of its contents against reality so we can see if what is claimed for it is true – stars for lamps, sun sets in a muddy pool, sky held up on invisible pillars and so on

It failed the reality test – it’s as simple as that

My guess is mo never expected or didn’t care that humans would one day be in a position to test his story – he was wrong about that as well

*the bible also failed the reality test

As Al Capone once said you can get more with a kind word and a gun, than you can with just a kind word

here is the so called religion of peace and tolerance of all religions from a non Arab Muslim country.

www.foxnews.com...

Going to kill him if he does not recant his Christian faith.

reply to post by ChesterJohn


Wow your going to bring something from corrupt MSM on THIS site, wow you don't even need to log on anymore.

reply to post by lonewolf19792000


That's not an AK learn your weapons.

Originally posted by ShamilAbdullah
-Originally posted by Ranthenae
Why is it considered the woman's 'shame' if she is raped? It's not like they wanted it to happen, so why do they get the punishment?

If it teaches tolerance, why must all the nonbelievers of the Muslim faith be called infidels and killed?-


Yes, ill try and answer them the best i can , but keep in mind you must decipher what is coulter and what is religion regarding your questions .

Interesting thread.

You failed to answer all of the questions posed and it appears your not going to answer them?

I'm interested also. As a "convert" you must surely know how the tenants of Sharia Law look to us?

I'll repeat a couple of questions.

We've all seen how women who are raped are treated under Sharia Law and had it confirmed through reports from reliable groups like Amnesty International. We have seen actual video's of Muslim women being stoned in Iran. This is not information coming from our government, but from groups we know to be honestly reporting facts. Please explain?

We used to have another Muslim man here who was very reasonable and open to discussion and debate. He made it very clear that the intent was that the whole world should come under a Muslim Theocracy and that that was the end game. In a discussion with him (he was not a convert but a life long Muslim from the Middle East) he argued that we should willingly give up and submit. He saw no problem with it at all. He told me that we would not be forced to join and would be treated humanely, but would have no rights of citizenship and could not run for office or vote. Your thoughts on these words from a man raised in your Faith in an Islamic country?

Why is it right for Muslims who move to other cultures to insist that their culture and laws replace our culture and laws? We have seen this play out in Europe and now it is starting here. Why do you believe you have the right to impose your Faith and your laws upon other cultures?

I'd really like to hear from you answers and your thoughts on those issues?

I also think your avatar does not match your words. Are you being honest with yourself and us?

nvm

reply to post by Blaine91555
Hey Blaine! I hope you don't mind if I answer some of your questions.

First off, though, I'd like to clear up some misconceptions you may possibly have about "Shariah". I'd suggest you (try to ) go through this thread I made on the topic a while back, but if it is too long and cumbersome, here is a relevant quote:

The Shariah Conspiracy

Originally posted by babloyi
...it, in basic terms, refers to a way of life, or a code of conduct for muslims to follow.
It would be akin to a Christian saying "I follow christian morals", and is subject to the same sort of vagueness.
If you asked different christians about specific morals, you would get different answers. For example, one might be completely pacifist to the point of accepting violence on him/herself (i.e. literally turning and offering the other cheek when someone slaps one cheek). Another might say "it is okay to fight back in self-defense if I or my family is attacked. A third might say that a pre-emptive attack is justifiable in some cases.
All three of these people would vehemently affirm that they are following "Christian Morals", and depending on their interpretation of Christianity, all three would be right.
So when someone asks a muslim "Do you support shariah?" or "Do you adhere to shariah?" or "Do you accept shariah?", and they answer "Yes", it isn't some insidious exposé of "silent jihad". It's exactly akin to asking a christian "Do you follow christian morals?"

A more appropriate term for what (I believe) you mean would be "fiqh", which would translate, in the context of Islam, to "Islamic Jurisprudence". The problem that some detractors of Islam have with this term (and probably the reason it isn't as widespread), is that it is very clear in the Islamic world that fiqh can be interpreted in different ways, understood in different ways, and there are many different schools of thought on different aspects.

Originally posted by Blaine91555
We've all seen how women who are raped are treated under Sharia Law and had it confirmed through reports from reliable groups like Amnesty International. We have seen actual video's of Muslim women being stoned in Iran. This is not information coming from our government, but from groups we know to be honestly reporting facts. Please explain?

So again, with respect to my previous comments, I hope you don't mind if I slightly alter your initial statement to "We've all seen how women who are raped are treated in some countries according to their laws.." (and I think it is possibly only Iran now...it used to be Pakistan and Afghanistan(?) as well, but they amended their laws).

And the answer is quite simple, if unfortunate: If I am not mistaken, Iran considers rape a form of adultery, and thus follows the Islamic requirement for accusations of adultery, that there must be 4 witnesses to the act. Since such a situation is unlikely ever to occur (if there were 4 witnesses who saw someone being raped and did not intercede, they were probably in on it), unfortunately, many victims of rape are then accused of adultery, and their aggressor/s get off scot-free. It should, of course be noted that this understanding of rape as adultery is certainly not the normal Islamic opinion, so it is a bit unfair to use it as an example that is endemic to Islam.

Originally posted by Blaine91555
We used to have another Muslim man here who was very reasonable and open to discussion and debate. ... Your thoughts on these words from a man raised in your Faith in an Islamic country?

I've been here for 8 years now, and that seems to be fairly opposite to the general muslim opinion here. One person with extreme views doesn't speak for everyone. Still, I'd be curious where this was said, and who this person was. Care to link?

Originally posted by Blaine91555
Why is it right for Muslims who move to other cultures to insist that their culture and laws replace our culture and laws? We have seen this play out in Europe and now it is starting here. Why do you believe you have the right to impose your Faith and your laws upon other cultures?

Nobody is replacing anything. Are you suggesting that moving to another country necessitates that you give up ALL your own beliefs and traditions? Nothing is being replaced. It is an imagined thread. Again, check that Shariah thread I linked.

Originally posted by Blaine91555
I also think your avatar does not match your words. Are you being honest with yourself and us?

There has been a recent flood of "Crusader" avatars here (and other christian symbolism+weapons), and several people have avatars with weapons, or praising their military. Why would the OP be different? Support or honouring the military isn't the same as advocating violence.

"When We substitute one revelation for another, and Allah knows best what He reveals (in stages), they say, "Thou art but a forger": but most of them understand not." Surah 16:101

Since latter revelations are considered binding, why do people pretend what Mohammed said in Mecca is what Islam is about? He peaceful there, but later, in Medina, he became a warlord.

reply to post by 547000

A popular misconception, that is spread around by certain people in their malicious attempts. All revelations are considered binding, but even if one were to assume your line of thought, the most famous example of the "peaceful" passages "Let there be no compulsion in religion" was a verse that was revealed in Medinah, several years after the Prophet migrated there.

reply to post by babloyi


So then what is the final doctrine? Slay infidels or be peaceful to them?

reply to post by 547000

Final doctrine?
Again, even if one were to take the understanding of abrogation as you do, there is no blanket statement requiring (or asking) for "slaying infidels", simply because they are infidels, that could be used to "abrogate" all other statements.

And please, don't provide me with out-of-context quotes as "proof" that I am wrong. Read the chapter (or at least the verses immediately before and after) to make sure your point isn't directly contradicted in the next statement.

I don't think the violence committed in the name of Islam is some perversion of it. The life and character of Mohammed makes clear the context of these. Submit to Allah or die. No they won't let Allah kill you himself--they will do his will for him. I think "moderate" Muslims take it out of context because they have their own theology and philosophies that disagrees with what the Koran and Hadiths plainly say. Kind of like liberal Christians who think homosexuality is okay and that there is nothing morally wrong about abortion.



At least this dude is upfront about it.

So again, what should muslims do to serve Allah? I seem to think the goal is to establish Allah's global dominion--by sword if necessary.

reply to post by 547000

I'm sorry, you are mistaken. The scriptures quite clearly state that if God had wanted the world to be entirely muslim, he would've made it so. It isn't the job of muslims to be doing it.

And Anjem Choudary as a "muslim leader"? That is the most hilariously absurd thing I've ever heard. He's nothing more than a media-obsessed idiot who tries his best to get in front of the cameras at every chance he can, with his nutjob opinions.

Originally posted by 547000
Since latter revelations are considered binding, why do people pretend what Mohammed said in Mecca is what Islam is about? He peaceful there, but later, in Medina, he became a warlord.

After the prophet was subjested to the killing conspiracy by polytheists and went to Madinah, he returned to Makkah about 9 y later,"victorious", How did he behave ?

He entered the sacred hall to face the wall opposite the door and there again performed devout prostrations, and went around acclaiming Allâh’s Greatness and Oneness. Shortly afterwards, he returned to the door-way and standing upon its elevated step, gazed in thankfulness on the thronging multitude below and delivered the following celebrated address:

"There is no god but Allâh Alone. He has no associates. He made good His Promise that He held to His slave and helped him and defeated all the Confederates alone. Bear in mind that every claim of privilege, whether that of blood, or property, is under my heel, except that of the custody of Al-Ka‘bah and supplying of water to the pilgrims.

"O people of Quraish! surely Allâh has abolished from you all pride of the pre-Islamic era and all conceit in your ancestry, (because) all men are descended from Adam, and Adam was made out of clay."

He then recited to them the verse:

"O mankind! We have created you from a male and a female, and made you into nations and tribes, that you may know one another. Verily, the most honourable of you near Allâh is that (believer) who has At-Taqwa [i.e. one of the Muttaqûn: i.e. pious and righteous persons who fear Allâh much (abstain from all kinds of sins and evil deeds which He has forbidden), and love Allâh much (perform all kinds of good deeds which He has ordained)]. Verily, Allâh is All-Knowing, All-Aware." [Al-Qur'an 49:13]

He further added:

"O you people of Quraish! What do you think of the treatment that I am about to accord to you
They replied:

"O noble brother and son of noble brother! We expect nothing but goodness from you."

Upon this he said:
"I speak to you in the same words as Yusuf (the Prophet Joseph) spoke unto his brothers: He said: "No reproach on you this day," [Al-Qur'an 12:92] go your way, for you are freed ones..

To know more about Prophet Muhammad Biography:
www.sultan.org...
www.pbuh.us...
www.wefound.org...