The Elenin Haters and a Simple Question

reply to post by DJW001


I think the POTUS is sleeping in Air Force One. He is scheduled to be in Denver on the 27th. Strange reading he just made from Psalm 46.

You are kinda right about something. It's either all lies or all true. There is no middle ground. ------------

reply to post by gwydionblack


There has been plenty of information on Elenin since day one. The reason there was so much speculation regarding this is not because NASA didn't put out an article not to worry right away (which, let's face it if they did that people would just claim cover-up). It's because people don't know how to interpret the orbit diagram. Elenin was approached the same way every other comet of its size and distance are treated. It was known to be a non-threat since its discovery and since the chances of seeing it with the naked eye were going to be low, so that is why there wasn't much fanfare regarding it from NASA.

reply to post by CLPrime

And yet you say it was just a rumored break-up. Why would JPL be updating their orbit ephemeris for an event that may or may not have occurred?

The POINT is, if these groups are there to study this crap, then there should be a definite answer out there from JPL, NASA, or some other source that says whether it did or did not break up. If it were any other comet, they would have announced it needlessly and unceremoniously, but for some reason they seem to want to allow rumors to fester about this one.

However, what you first said is that the orbit diagram was changed from what it originally was. It hasn't.

No I did not. I never said the diagram changed at all. I used the current diagram to draw my own conclusions that IF the comet broke up and IF it caused it to slow down, there was the POSSIBILITY that it would be passing A LOT closer to Earth than the original diagram states.

No, it isn't moving in an elliptical orbit. It has been captured by the sun, and is now entering what will be a varying elliptical orbit.

This is an assumption and nothing more.

1 would just be patient FAMILY and see what the cosmos have to share.

I think many of us fail to realize that Elenin/Nibiru/Wormwood/Hercolubus etc. is just one symptom among many of a much bigger phenomenon plaguing the people of our world in the 21rst century.

Most everyone on this planet knows we are lied to daily. But it is especially the diligent CT community that is well aware that at this point the lies run so deep, and are spread out so far and wide, we may never be able to unravel the complete truth about anything, let alone all things.

It is for this reason that some conspiracies become a focal point. And come to epitomize the CT community. They become the glimmer of hope that at least one set of lies can be unraveled.

Those in the seats of power understand this, and do their best to lead the CT community around by the nose. They own all sides of the argument, and stir up continual division. And truthfully, they don't need to do much, because division is almost always self perpetuating once it is put in motion.

It is hard for those who have a vehement distrust of "TPTB" and their scientific consensus to take anything they say at face value. And it is equally as hard for those who consider the scientific community to be the last bastion of truth on this planet to consider that the "facts" may very well be skewed in favor of an agenda.

This is why if Elenin passes without incident, there will be another, and another after that. Because there is a driving force, and a common belief among CTers, that sooner or later, we will finally understand the agenda, catch them red-handed, and be justified in the worlds eyes that day.

Unfortunately, this is an unlikely scenario for numerous reasons we're all well aware of.

Originally posted by gwydionblack

The POINT is, if these groups are there to study this crap, then there should be a definite answer out there from JPL, NASA, or some other source that says whether it did or did not break up. If it were any other comet, they would have announced it needlessly and unceremoniously, but for some reason they seem to want to allow rumors to fester about this one.

Maybe because it's not as easy as you think it should be to know what's happening with what amounts to a tiny dot in space. Remember, the solid part of the comet is enshrouded by a massive coma. It's not always a simple matter of looking at a comet and saying, "Ooh, it's breaking up."

I never said the diagram changed at all. I used the current diagram to draw my own conclusions that IF the comet broke up and IF it caused it to slow down, there was the POSSIBILITY that it would be passing A LOT closer to Earth than the original diagram states.

Then I guess I misunderstood when you said:

The original path of this comet placed it moving relatively close to the Earth.

By "the original path," I thought you meant as opposed to the current path - therefore, implying that the path had changed. Which it hasn't. If that's not what you meant, then I apologize...but, then, I'm not sure of the purpose of your initial statement, if that's the case.

This is an assumption and nothing more.

Well...it's a mathematical extrapolation based on C/2010 X1's current trajectory. It has the possibility of being wrong, but what are we supposed to do? We have gravitational/orbital calculations down to a fine art... if this weren't the case, we'd have a hard time putting and keeping anything in orbit, let alone doing fancy things like sling-shotting probes around planets to get them to arrive at specific locations at specific times to observe specific things. How gravity works isn't exactly a guess. And, from that, combined with the current trajectory of C/2010 X1, we can extrapolate its origins, as well as its future orbit, if it is able to achieve one - and, if not, then we will be able to predict that too.

My assumption is based on the 100% tried-and-true track-record of meticulous gravitational models and orbital tracking. Your assumption is based on, what? The off-chance that this is the one time in a billion that those calculations could maybe possibly be wrong?

reply to post by phishyblankwaters


I'm a bit confused, when have NASA or any governmental organization been truthful and forthcoming?

reply to post by CLPrime


"Well...it's a mathematical extrapolation based on C/2010 X1's current trajectory. It has the possibility of being wrong, but what are we supposed to do? We have gravitational/orbital calculations down to a fine art... if this weren't the case, we'd have a hard time putting and keeping anything in orbit, let alone doing fancy things like sling-shotting probes around planets to get them to arrive at specific locations at specific times to observe specific things. How gravity works isn't exactly a guess. And, from that, combined with the current trajectory of C/2010 X1, we can extrapolate its origins, as well as its future orbit, if it is able to achieve one - and, if not, then we will be able to predict that too.

My assumption is based on the 100% tried-and-true track-record of meticulous gravitational models and orbital tracking. Your assumption is based on, what? The off-chance that this is the one time in a billion that those calculations could maybe possibly be wrong?
edit on 12-9-2011 by CLPrime because: (no reason given)"

So that's how they know exactly where that Satellite is going to land? Mmm I have real trust in the above knowledge!

Originally posted by spyder550
Are there really people who "hate" a comet, really?

yes i hate the comet...

Originally posted by quedup

So that's how they know exactly where that Satellite is going to land? Mmm I have real trust in the above knowledge!

They don't know where "that satellite" (UARS) is going to fall because:

Daily changes in the atmosphere make predicting exactly where UARS will fall difficult, according to Maj. Michael Duncan, the deputy chief for space situational awareness at U.S. Space Command.

(Source)

We can predict gravitational effects with impeccable accuracy. I think we all know how well they can predict atmospheric effects. It's the latter which is preventing any sort of accurate prediction at this point (at least 2 weeks before re-entry).

Originally posted by gwydionblack
It is comments of ignorance and know it all's that make me absolutely despise ATS.

Let me point this out to everyone who thinks they KNOW about Elenin.

YOU DON'T.

You don't know if there is any merit to the Elenin doomsayers.
You don't know if Elenin is going to hit or not.
You don't know if Elenin is going to have any affect whatsoever on the Earth as it passes.
You don't know if Elenin is even broken apart.

YOU DON'T KNOW.

Now to point this out, I am no on the Elenin bandwagon, but I do not pretend like I KNOW about the situation. There are millions of possibilities involving every single comet that passes within close range of the Earth that COULD happen and when it comes to outer space, do not pretend like science has all the answers pertaining to our solar system much less the rest of the universe.

It is the sarcastic comments in all the other threads of people who THINK they know it all that proves to me that people on Earth have not changed one bit since the dark ages. Do remember that people once KNEW that the Earth was FLAT, they KNEW that the Earth was the center of the solar system and the sun revolved around it, they KNEW that they could transform any substance into gold.

Here is what you KNOW about Elenin:

Elenin is a long orbit comet.
The information surrounding this comet was scarce compared to others in the past.
The original path of this comet placed it moving relatively close to the Earth.
Unconfirmed rumors have claimed that the comet broken up and thus slowed down.
IF these rumors are true and the comet slowed down, there is a possibility of a very near Earth pass or even an Earth collision.


Now why is this comet different from the rest? Well for starters the secrecy and the withholding of information for so long. Not only that but a series of (coincidental?) occurrences with alignments of the comet, and the fact that it matches a lot of (coincidental?) similarities to "end times" comets.

This does not mean that it is guaranteed to be so - it simply means that the possibility is there and should not be discounted. I believe what I hate more on this site more than all the Elenin threads, is the people who post in them making FUN of the posters who are actually trying to research the subject rather than assume that they have all the information, and assuming that NASA, an organization with a highly questionable past, is telling the truth about it whatsoever.

With that said, my experience on Elenin is this. According to the NASA orbital diagram, the comet was original set to pass through Earth's orbital path on October 18th. If the break up of the comet is true and it is slowing down, it only needs to slow down its projected path by 15 days to either collide or nearly pass the Earth. This is not assumption or rhetoric - this is fact. If the comet slows down, there is a HIGH chance impact with Earth according to NASA's own data.

If the orbit of the comet was affect in anyway by the "explosion" that was monitored, say it was blown of course by a little bit, it also could pass Earth's orbit a little early or a little late. However, at this time it seems that we are unable to get an updates from what people consider "credible" sources, so we are forces to wait and watch patiently as this all unfolds.

That is what I am going to do, and meanwhile I am going to hope for the best. But at the same time I am also going to hope for the worst so that all the people who thought they KNEW what was going to happen can be proven wrong just like all the rest throughout history.




Now as for my simple yet, I believe intriguing, question - what exactly is Elenin orbiting? Are we supposed to believe that with the orbit it has, and how potentially far away it is supposed to go, that it is under the orbit of our Sun?

Have you seen the film "District 9", ?
I love the bit when the authorities are going round the doors issuing eviction notices,
they come to this one house , and knock on the door. The "prawn" flings the door open, aggressively, and in sub titles shouts "F**K OFF , in subtitles. Ha ha A very funny scene don't you think friend

Originally posted by Chai_An
I'm a bit confused, when have NASA or any governmental organization been truthful and forthcoming?

Yeah remember that time NASA told us Hale-Bopp was nothing to worry about and that there was no spaceship with it, and then it hit the Earth and killed everyone and the aliens invaded the planet and took over? Bunch of liars, you can't trust anything they say!

Imo. the whole　Elenin Story is a wonderful Case-Study for everyone who want to
get a Doctor-Title, maybe even a Professor !

Originally posted by OMsk3ptic

Originally posted by Chai_An
I'm a bit confused, when have NASA or any governmental organization been truthful and forthcoming?

Yeah remember that time NASA told us Hale-Bopp was nothing to worry about and that there was no spaceship with it, and then it hit the Earth and killed everyone and the aliens invaded the planet and took over? Bunch of liars, you can't trust anything they say!

Thank you for correcting me on how transparent NASA is, you're right they would never lie, misinform, or worst yet hide anything.

reply to post by Chai_An


The fact is every time a new celestial body is discovered the conspiracy theorists claim that its Nibiru or that its going to kill us. NASA on the other hand has always said that there is nothing to worry about in these cases. From the fact that society and human life is still present I'm going to go ahead and assume that NASA was telling the truth in all of those cases. So, who's actually the more trustworthy group? The one that has claimed time and time again that such-and-such comet, or such-and-such asteroid, or such-and-such planet many lightyears away, is going to kill us; or the group that has told us in every one of these cases that we are going to be fine?

reply to post by gwydionblack


I don't hate Elenin. I just hate what they stand for.

reply to post by Human0815

Imo. the whole　Elenin Story is a wonderful Case-Study for everyone who want to
get a Doctor-Title, maybe even a Professor !

I'm seriously considering writing a paper entitled: "Elenin-mania: Mass Hysteria in the Age of the Internet." Seriously.

reply to post by DJW001


DJW001, I just wanted to say that I admire your tenacity in trying to bring logic into the Elenin discussion, it's a shame it frequently falls on deaf ears.


To the OP, those who are trying to point out the truth about Elenin are not "Elenin Haters", they are ambivalent to Elenin because they have seen the evidence and have determined that Elenin is not a threat to earth and in fact will have no physical impact on earth at all. I say "physical" because Elenin has already caused a tremendous mental impact on many of the people of earth who are running around screaming that the sky is falling because of seeing a few Youtube videos created by extremely misinformed individuals. The mental impact has been astonishing in its breadth and width. How something of no consequence can have people getting worked up into a frenzy like you see on many of the ATS threads is just beyond comprehension.

reply to post by DJW001


I've actually thought the same thing. I haven't really seen many papers written on conspiracy theorists and this whole Elenin nonsense would be the perfect case study.

reply to post by Xcalibur254


I've been chronicling the whole phenomenon, taking special care to note who introduced which aspect of the overall craze. Some people are misinformed but sincere, others are blatant hoaxers. I intended to treat the misinformed gently, but will be quite hard on the hoaxers. You know who you are... Terral.