Locked Up and Left Behind: Hurricane Irene and the Prisoners on New York`s Rikers Island

Originally posted by gandamack2
Prisoners are the last ones out...bottom line....

Yes, I agree, but in this case there was no "out".

Okay, tell me how they should evacuate the prisoners? The sheer logistics makes it seem impossible. Remember, these are men who want to escape, unless they enjoy the free shelter and food. They are not going to sit around, complying with everything they are told.

Originally posted by 547000
Okay, tell me how they should evacuate the prisoners? The sheer logistics makes it seem impossible. Remember, these are men who want to escape, unless they enjoy the free shelter and food. They are not going to sit around, complying with everything they are told.

edit on 28-8-2011 by 547000 because: (no reason given)

When one considers that virtually any court in the land would entertain 12,000 counts of negligent homicide, if not outright murder (states vary for which charge), I think the whole thread is kinda moot. Bloomberg has been in fantasy land and gleefully scaring the living heck out of millions for his own personal political gain. Today proves myself and others 100% correct in having been saying this to varying degrees for almost 2 days now.

Yesterday and last night, only guessing could be made (however well educated those guesses have been) but today removes any doubt....and the raw data feeds from NOAA's sensors are perfectly intact for all to go look up and see WHY some of us were calling B.S. on this before it even started to rain in N.C.. Bloomberg and Obama had MUCH better information that lowly bloggers like us to go by...so they can not even play at ignorance to the real level of threat or NO THREAT this storm posed.

Had Irene made it to New York as a Cat 3 storm with a 15ft storm surge as predicted by some of the computer models 3 or 4 days ago, I have my doubts that the city of new york could properly evacuate/shelter the citizens adequately. The only real threat I see to rikers would've been storm surge and the jails itself should provide far greater shelter than the average home. Also the flight level winds of Irene was much greater than the winds on the surface which makes those high rise condos vulnerable wind damage. Sadly there is a great lack of understanding to the general public about tropical cyclones and how a weak tropical cyclone with a massive wind field can be more devastating than small compact major hurricane. Irene was large sized hurricane with large wind field at her peak strength days ago and wasn't intially expected to weaken this much so quickly.

Any news on how the island did?

Originally posted by billy197300
reply to post by Signals

 

. You don't get to Rikers Island from getting a jay walking ticket or getting caught with a blunt.

edit on 27-8-2011 by billy197300 because: (no reason given)

Yes, as a matter of fact you do.

Half the member poosting in this thread have no clue what they are talking about.


Riker's Island isn't a Prison, it's a Jail.
It's where you, your mom, everyone goes when they are arrested for anything in NY, before they take you before a judge to asses your status in pre trial intervention. that's when they officially charge you.


75% of the people in Riker's Island are awaiting pre trial to see if the city even has a case against them. the rest are past trial, awaiting transfer to prison.

since when are you guilty and sentenced to death before you even get a trial?


I'll await the mass lawsuits that will stem from this inaction.
The state is required by law to keep all prisoners safe and in good health.
period.
Bloomberg the billionaire screwed the dog on this one.
This is what happens when we allow rich morons with no idea how reality works run a major city.

Originally posted by Signals
reply to post by billy197300

 

Then we should probably just line them up in front of firing squads and get it over with, right?

On a side note, how did you know how old my daughter is?

Creepy....

I have done time in California and I learned my lesson..I have not and will not, knowingly commit another crime. That being said, I understand maybe not every person in prison will make that change but ALL OF THEM THAT ARE NOT ON DEATH ROW DESERVE THAT CHANCE TO BE RELEASED AN MAKE THAT CHOICE! Thank You OP for reminding me why I made the decision to change my thought process so I don't go back.. Any person who thinks it's OK to keep a person not convicted of a crime or a minor offense or even a felony in Prison while the rest of the people are evacuated should be put in prison too in my opinion an see if that changes their opinion.. Some of these men/women are smart people with families that made a bad decision and are willing to change.

To the people that say do you really think that our Taxes should be used to move these people..I say Absolutely!!! And it's not OUR TAXES that would pay for it..Prisons are Private Businesses Except Federal Ones.. So it would cost the Company money not us, which is exactly why they didn't move them. According to some people and books I've read (Behold A Pale Horse Is One) there is Orders to kill all Convicts during a Major Disaster/Martial Law because it's easier than moving ""Undesirables"" Also we have plenty of ""Residential Centers"" (FEMA CAMPS) built Exactly for this reason according to FEMA.. So why aren't they being used???

Answer = Because that is not why they built them, they built them for the Undesirables they can't just Gas in their Cells..

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Originally posted by BadNinja68

Originally posted by billy197300
reply to post by Signals

 

. You don't get to Rikers Island from getting a jay walking ticket or getting caught with a blunt.

edit on 27-8-2011 by billy197300 because: (no reason given)

Yes, as a matter of fact you do.

Half the member poosting in this thread have no clue what they are talking about.


Riker's Island isn't a Prison, it's a Jail.
It's where you, your mom, everyone goes when they are arrested for anything in NY, before they take you before a judge to asses your status in pre trial intervention. that's when they officially charge you.


75% of the people in Riker's Island are awaiting pre trial to see if the city even has a case against them. the rest are past trial, awaiting transfer to prison.

since when are you guilty and sentenced to death before you even get a trial?


I'll await the mass lawsuits that will stem from this inaction.
The state is required by law to keep all prisoners safe and in good health.
period.
Bloomberg the billionaire screwed the dog on this one.
This is what happens when we allow rich morons with no idea how reality works run a major city.

Starred, great comment.

Not only have some posters proved themselves to be ignorant, but also utterly sociopath

Originally posted by Signals
reply to post by billy197300

 

Then we should probably just line them up in front of firing squads and get it over with, right?

On a side note, how did you know how old my daughter is?

Creepy....

I have done time in California and I learned my lesson..I have not and will not, knowingly commit another crime. That being said, I understand maybe not every person in prison will make that change but ALL OF THEM THAT ARE NOT ON DEATH ROW DESERVE THE CHANCE TO BE RELEASED AN MAKE THAT CHOICE! Thank You OP for reminding me why I made the decision to change my thought process so I don't go back and I know you were being sarcastic in the post I quoted but other people were not... Any person who thinks it's OK to keep a person not convicted of a crime or a minor offense or even a felony in Prison while the rest of the people are evacuated should be put in prison too in my opinion an see if that changes their opinion.. Some of these men/women are smart people with families that made a bad decision and are willing to change.

To the people that say do you really think that our Taxes should be used to move these people..I say Absolutely!!! And it's not OUR TAXES that would pay for it..Prisons are Private Businesses Except Federal Ones.. So it would cost the Company money not us, which is exactly why they didn't move them. According to some people and books I've read (Behold A Pale Horse Is One) there is Orders to kill all Convicts during a Major Disaster/Martial Law because it's easier than moving ""Undesirables"" Also we have plenty of ""Residential Centers"" (FEMA CAMPS) built Exactly for this reason according to FEMA.. So why aren't they being used???

Answer = Because that is not why they built them, they built them for the Undesirables they can't just Gas in their Cells..

My Edit..Sorry I didn't know Rykers Island is actually a jail and not a prison but even so that makes it that much worse that they did not evacuate it.. Hopefully they all sue that institution for unlawful endangerment

Originally posted by Signals
reply to post by Wrabbit2000

 

I understand where you are coming from but he already had ordered mass evacuations (250,000 people)...so this doesn't pass the sniff test IMO...

Moving 12k criminals is different from moving 250k civilians.

Originally posted by Signals
We have more prisons per capita in the U.S. than any other country, surely we could make room..

Many of which are over populated to the max as it is. Some cells designed for a single prisoner houses several in the extreme cases. If they could "make room", don't you think they would have long ago?

I'm not agreeing with leaving prisoners behind. I'm sure many of them are there for low collar crime (like failure to pay taxes or child support etc). But some of the responses here aren't really well thought out.

**Edit**
Besides, the sheer logistics that would happen is scary. It's one thing letting free men and women move on their own, something totally else for prisoners under lock and key. It's not just putting them on a bus, they have to be properly secured.

Originally posted by crazydaisy
Where would they evacuate
12,000 prisoners to?

Congress, pack em in like they did during katrina then expect the piliticians to do their job in spite of the conditions they created.

Originally posted by Frontkjemper

Originally posted by Signals
reply to post by Wrabbit2000

 

I understand where you are coming from but he already had ordered mass evacuations (250,000 people)...so this doesn't pass the sniff test IMO...

Moving 12k criminals is different from moving 250k civilians.

Originally posted by Signals
We have more prisons per capita in the U.S. than any other country, surely we could make room..

Many of which are over populated to the max as it is. Some cells designed for a single prisoner houses several in the extreme cases. If they could "make room", don't you think they would have long ago?

I'm not agreeing with leaving prisoners behind. I'm sure many of them are there for low collar crime (like failure to pay taxes or child support etc). But some of the responses here aren't really well thought out.

**Edit**
Besides, the sheer logistics that would happen is scary. It's one thing letting free men and women move on their own, something totally else for prisoners under lock and key. It's not just putting them on a bus, they have to be properly secured.

edit on 28-8-2011 by Frontkjemper because: See **Edit**

You are totally missing the facts.
They are NOT prisoners.
Most of the residents of Riker's Island have NOT been convicted of any crime.

Not prisoners... innocent ( until proven guilty) citizens.


and lastly, when prisons fill in a given area, Correction companies build new ones, and wait for them to fill up.
Don't ever believe the hype that "our prisons and jails are full".
That's 100% BS.
"That's like saying business is soooooo good at walmart, we can't keep the shelves stocked".
What hapens then?
Another store opens.
Privatized jails have become HUGE business.. not a chance any conmpany would let a dime or profit slip away.

Remember the releases in LA ?
That was staged to set up funding for a new round of people warehouses.

Big biz jailing folks.. up to 80k a year per filled bed:LOL:
guess who pays the Correction companies?
We do.

reply to post by BadNinja68


I hadn't thought of it that way. Thanks for bringing new light to my thought process.

reply to post by Signals


Bloomberg doesn't really care about anyone except the wealthy in NYC.

He showed how much he cared in the botched blizzard and told us NYer's to get over it and move on.

Rikers Island was not in any of the danger zones. its listed in white on the Evac map. no zone letter given. but if there is one it's zone D or above which is high ground and not prone to any flooding,

That landfill that Rikers was built on. was like a mountain sitting in the channel.

In all my years living with in a few miles of it, i've never heard Rikers Island being in trouble from weather, the bridge leading to it maybe , that has been closed on occasion. the water there is not all that deep.

Bloomberg wasn't about to get 200+ buses, Police escorts, choppers, closing of streets for the convoy plus no where to bring or house them. He rather spend the money on useless bike lanes and tourist parks in the middle of Manhattan streets.

I get your point though. They still are human. Not so sure about cell block C though, the worst of the worst are housed there.

Bloomberg is 3 beers short of a six pack when it comes to things like this or compassion. A Mayor who tells the citizens to go to a Broadway show or restaurant in the middle of a blizzard or hurricane isn't quite functioning properly.

reply to post by BadNinja68

Originally posted by BadNinja68
Half the member poosting in this thread have no clue what they are talking about.

So predictable that people would miss the distinction between a prison and jail, I didn't even really bother to read much of this thread.

Good luck denying ignorance.

I'm too fatigued for it today.

So let's see, we're supposed to cry for the convicted rapist, we're supposed to cry for the convicted child molester, we're supposed to cry for the convicted murderer?

I don't think so.

I say get the ones that are awaiting trial out of there (innocent before proven guilty), the rest of them should be on their own and may god have mercy on their souls.