Idea of Oneness similiar to theology faith concept?

As in many theologies, you are required to have some degree of faith in something you cannot see or prove is there in a sense. There seems to be a big group of people who believe in a concept of oneness but how do you prove that anymore than someone who is trying to prove the god of the bible real? I agree people have a valid viewpoint when they believe in oneness. I just don't quite understand it all and if it's structure any different than other religions out there as far as faith goes. Believing in something you can't see or prove. You can't prove that you are one with everything and everyone but you can think or believe it.

Anyone else see this or am I not seeing this correctly?

reply to post by Ralphy


It's a fairly easy concept to grasp... Energy and matter are interchangeable. The same root force is found throughout the known Universe. What sort of logic do you arrive at then?

How can you prove that? You are taking for granted assumed knowledge. How do we prove that we ourselves are energy? Our bodies are made up of energy and matter but is that us or just a body?

Originally posted by Ralphy
How can you prove that? You are taking for granted assumed knowledge. How do we prove that we ourselves are energy? Our bodies are made up of energy and matter but is that us or just a body?

1. Mass is structured/ patterned energy (think aspect ratios)
2. You deduce from mass how we get our bodies
3. It's a form of us caged in the World

reply to post by Ralphy


I am a deep thinker as well.

When you think of reality and time and space and so on your mind takes a journey to places you never thought of before.

When you think of micro-waves, waves, light, love, hate, a ray (sun ray), energy, and so on....you cannot see it but you sense it. You know it's there.

When one becomes spiritual (or religious) they may take a journey of seeking out Truth's. You grow up looking at the world one way only to find out it's another so ....you take this journey and one truth leads to another.

My personal journey lead me to believe in a Oneness. I could go on and on with my deep thinking and will if you want me to.

reply to post by Ralphy


The difference with oneness is that you can know it to be true. You can experience it. See it. Feel it. It is not just an idea that you believe with the mind.

Oneness is what exists beyond all of the ideas that we have about ourselves. Ideas are just beliefs. Beliefs reside within the mind. This is the ego. I am a woman. I am black. I am important. I am a believer. I am rich. I am a mom. I am right. I am successful. I am married. I am good. I am better than you. I am smart. I am powerful. I am popular. I am a husband. I am charitable. I am loyal. etc... These are all ideas that we have about who we BELIEVE we are based on the physical world.

The truth is that who we are is so much more than any idea that we could ever possibly have about ourselves and so much more than the physical world could ever be used to validate. Break down all of these ideas and you transcend the ego. You move yourself out of the mind and into the heart. You align with the true self. By doing this you will not only be able to view yourself, others and life from this place of oneness but will also be able to create your experience from this foundation that is the true self. This is a very powerful thing. This is conscious co-creation. This way of viewing ourselves and creating experience is part of what we going to be collectively moving into very soon...

Originally posted by Ralphy
Believing in something you can't see or prove. You can't prove that you are one with everything and everyone but you can think or believe it.

Anyone else see this or am I not seeing this correctly?

I can't see "you". I can see a body that is a representation of you... but I can't see the you that you experience every moment of your awareness (even in dreams with different bodies). I can't see that you, and you can't prove to me that it exists... yet you know you exist.

That's the way it is with oneness. Either you see it or you don't... though you don't necessarily see it all the time, especially around these parts called Earth, heh.

Don't believe any of us that it's true though... because it's not true for you until you have experienced it yourself.

Namaste!

Originally posted by Ralphy
As in many theologies, you are required to have some degree of faith in something you cannot see or prove is there in a sense.

This isn't what theological faith is at all really. The term belief would be more appropriate. A belief is something that is based primarily on subjective reasoning and does not have any real proof to verify its validity. Faith is something profoundly more interesting. Faith is when you know something will occur against all odds, and if you have enough faith it will occur. Faith and belief are closely related, but faith is what "moves mountains" and belief is just information based on no facts that is accepted anyway. Belief is associated more with belief in a deity that exists. Faith is associated more with belief in a future event that doesn't yet exist where when you have faith, you create it to exist. There is a difference.

There seems to be a big group of people who believe in a concept of oneness but how do you prove that anymore than someone who is trying to prove the god of the bible real? I agree people have a valid viewpoint when they believe in oneness. I just don't quite understand it all and if it's structure any different than other religions out there as far as faith goes. Believing in something you can't see or prove. You can't prove that you are one with everything and everyone but you can think or believe it.

Anyone else see this or am I not seeing this correctly?

edit on 26-8-2011 by Ralphy because: (no reason given)

Oneness is obvious and doesn't require proof. You claim an identity and you let that define who you are. Try claiming a more general identity. Instead of saying, "I am Bob", say "I am the Earth". Then you will view the earth from the Earth's perspective. However, this is an incomplete analogy because this is an incomplete description of what you are. You are what we are and that is beyond your imagination.

For one thing, you are intelligent energy. For two, energy is neither created or destroyed, so you are infinitely lasting. When you multiply infinity by any number (for example: 1), you would get infinity one time and you would get one an infinite number of times. This is what happens with intelligent energy. You multiply intelligent energy by infinity and you get intelligent energy an infinite number of times and you get intelligent infinity. In infinity is all there is and can ever be. Infinity is the oneness.

Star and Flag, because you raise a very legitimate question.

I tend to talk a lot, so before I continue, my main point is:

You can understand, see, and experience Oneness.

Oneness is not a theology, because there are no restrictive or oppressive laws/rules. It is more of an understanding the mechanisms of existence.

If you can not understand Oneness, allow me to illustrate an example: The Human Body. We have individual cells that grow tissue, repair damage, fight off illness/infection/disease, carry oxygen, etc. We have organs such as the heart which pumps blood throughout our bodies, and lungs that respirate, and a stomach with intestines that digest/process nutrients, etc. These things I just mentioned do their jobs on their own without me telling them to. Take cells and organs out of a body and they can continue to live and reproduce if given the proper environment. Because they work without me giving orders, and because they continue to live and function outside the body, it is my opinion that my cells are sentient beings. A blood cell is not me, but fully combined as a collective, they become 'me.'

There is not one thing in existence that arises or exists 100% independently from something else. Not one thing can 'be' without a relationship to something else. Everything is connected and interconnected. You may see an individual thing, but ponder it and you will realize everything is a chain-linked system to something smaller and something bigger. This linked system that goes down to the subatomic and beyond, while also going to the cosmic and beyond is the 'fractal' concept. Micro to infinity and macro to infinity.

I honestly see the Oneness now. Not at all moments of my day, but intermittently through meditation, or being aware of it, and even spontaneously. First I was exposed to Oneness through my studies, then I began to understand it, then I began to purify my emotions/thoughts/intentions, then I began to meditate while being mindful of Oneness, interconnectedness, dependent co-arising, and the fractal concept.... then for the first time I saw and experienced Oneness. If you read first-hand accounts of spiritually enlightened individuals (especially eastern disciplines), they will tell you that they also see and experience Oneness. They may use different wordings, and may describe it according to their subjective experience, but nonetheless you will see many people do see Oneness.

Here is my first hand account of experiencing Oneness: I Have Seen The Veil

Here is a thread I wrote describing universal consciousness and oneness:
King Dome's Throne Is On Water

Any questions, comments, rebuttals, and differing opinions from any and everyone is greatly welcome!
May Peace be upon us all.

Wow... so far, GREAT replies everyone!!! Everyone is contributing in such a way that this thread is already overflowing with depth!

Originally posted by Ralphy
As in many theologies, you are required to have some degree of faith in something you cannot see or prove is there in a sense. There seems to be a big group of people who believe in a concept of oneness but how do you prove that anymore than someone who is trying to prove the god of the bible real? I agree people have a valid viewpoint when they believe in oneness. I just don't quite understand it all and if it's structure any different than other religions out there as far as faith goes. Believing in something you can't see or prove. You can't prove that you are one with everything and everyone but you can think or believe it.

Anyone else see this or am I not seeing this correctly?

edit on 26-8-2011 by Ralphy because: (no reason given)

A polite answer is that finding the Oneness as you call it is an actual learned process. No faith is required except the commitment. Faith is something else. It need not have an actual reward--and actually doesn't--in this life and probably doesn''t even according to the specific faith that offers it.

In short, the Oneness of the Universe is a natural, learned functions and what has been perverted into any one of the types of religions and that includes Buddhism. TM clearn shows religioin is not necessary to access the spirit of the Universe. (The core training of TM need not be recognized as a religion. It has/had teachers, not Gods.)

Originally posted by smithjustinb
Faith is associated more with belief in a future event that doesn't yet exist where when you have faith, you create it to exist. There is a difference.



Oneness is obvious and doesn't require proof.

Faith is just a form of belief.
All belief is a form of LIMITATION.-John Lilly,MD,(worked with dolphins)

Oneness is known through INTUITION or DIVINE GRACE.
This occurs through intelligent RADICAL UNDERSTANDING
THAT YOU ARE CREATING THE SEPARATION IN THIS MOMENT.
Read The KNee of Listening at beezone.com

reply to post by Ralphy


Hi Ralphy,

There are very good posts that have shed light about the concept of 'oneness'.

No matter how you look at it, you will see it as it is. The idea of God, i believe, may very well have being derived from the concept of 'oneness', but the concept was misinterpreted for whatever purpose, and the true meaning lost.

Everything stems from the source, even science agrees, the 'BIG BANG'.

All paths will lead to the same path, it is what is.

Peace

reply to post by Ralphy


The 'oneness' is the unified field. It is now. Where ever you are it is now!!! And it is now everywhere in the universe, there is nowhere where it is not now. This now joins everything together.
It all happens within the now. That now looks like different 'things', but it is only the mind that splits it all up. It comes as one complete package.
This 'now' can not be separated from what you are. When now is, you are. They never arrive separately.
Now/you=Holy communion.

It is not faith, it is truth. When the truth is seen, faith will look like the result. But it is just facing facts, no one can know anything beyond now. Some just 'think' they do!!

Eckhart Tolle 'Now'.
youtu.be...

Originally posted by RRokkyy

Originally posted by smithjustinb
Faith is associated more with belief in a future event that doesn't yet exist where when you have faith, you create it to exist. There is a difference.



Oneness is obvious and doesn't require proof.

Faith is just a form of belief.
All belief is a form of LIMITATION.-John Lilly,MD,(worked with dolphins)

I would say this is a good understanding of faith. But the limitation that faith puts on experience is external. So by faith, you limit potential outcomes.

reply to post by Ralphy


Actually, it's a "New Age" concept.

Cheers.

reply to post by angeldoll


I'm sorry, you are mistaken. For starters, these concepts are found in Buddhism, Christian Gnosticism, and Sufi Islam... we're talking a couple thousand years here. Learn more about these concepts and you will become aware of the fact that our ancestors knew these concepts dozens of thousands of years ago... and I would bet hundreds of thousands of years, but we've lost and hidden our most ancient past.

New Age is not something 'new,' it is bringing the ancient and universal truths out into the open.