No Jobs...No Hope...NO not at all - I say simply not interested. Easier to steal and commit crime.

I'm not sure how many vacancies there are in England right now?

I heard a debate on the news yesterday or the day before and someone was saying that there are about 500,000 vacancies and about 2.5m unemployed?

So that's 5 people for every job?

But again, I actually do not know... googling the figures now to find out.

And I know there are one in five 16-24 year olds unemployed.



EDIT: Seems that 5 people per vacancy is about right.

The surprising thing about the riots was that so many of those arrested were in employment.

This assumption that they were all workshy layabouts couldn't be more inaccurate. Postmen, train drivers, teachers, estate agents, council employees ... even a lawyer ... were all arrested for rioting & looting. So this wasn't just a recreational phenomenon in which only the unemployed could participate, it was for everyone.

That's why it was even more shocking.

So I reject the OP entirely.

reply to post by blupblup


I suppose the idea would be if those posts were filled - there would be more demand and therefore more jobs created to fill that demand in an improving spiral.
Figure seems a bit low to me though - I totted up 40k just in London on 3 websites..
Think about every other large city - Birmingham, Manchester, Liverpool, Leeds, Newcastle, Bristol, Norwich, Sheffield, Coventry, middlesborough, Portsmouth, southampton, and then all the smaller cities like Preston, hull, york, Carlisle, Slough, reading, etc etc - there must be an awful lot of jobs out there...

The other point is - if you are out of work, either move to an area where there is demand for your skills OR get retrained in the skills that are in demand in your area? Out of work people get free college course etc - fact.

Better yourself - stop leeching off society...

Originally posted by Niall197
The surprising thing about the riots was that so many of those arrested were in employment.

This assumption that they were all workshy layabouts couldn't be more inaccurate. Postmen, train drivers, teachers, estate agents, council employees ... even a lawyer ... were all arrested for rioting & looting. So this wasn't just a recreational phenomenon in which only the unemployed could participate, it was for everyone.

That's why it was even more shocking.

So I reject the OP entirely.

Hey, that's really interesting - do you have a link to that?
I have wondered if it all wasn't more of a broader empowerment issue. Still an us and them thing, but if the issue was maybe not more one of 'we are taking power back NOW" since, in fact, the spark was a supposed murder by police.

Originally posted by Niall197
The surprising thing about the riots was that so many of those arrested were in employment.

This assumption that they were all workshy layabouts couldn't be more inaccurate. Postmen, train drivers, teachers, estate agents, council employees ... even a lawyer ... were all arrested for rioting & looting. So this wasn't just a recreational phenomenon in which only the unemployed could participate, it was for everyone.

That's why it was even more shocking.

So I reject the OP entirely.

You reject a whole premise over a minority of people who had jobs? I say HAD because they will NOT have them anymore I assure you!

They were very few, the majority are children or on benifits. Those who HAD jobs just tagged along for free stuff.

Those reported to have jobs, how many were they? 10, 11 out of hundreds?

On that premise I reject your rejection.

reply to post by Niall197


Yes people in jobs were looting - but more people out of work were..and the point I made was in reference to seeing people on sky news, on question time (read my OP again) who made the claims that the rioting was done because they were in a hopeless situation - no jobs etc etc.

The people in jobs doing this - criminals like anyone else. Pure greed. no one has a right to an iPad or a 42" tv - people seem to think they do but they are luxury items, not like bread and milk.

Originally posted by facchino
reply to post by blupblup

 

I suppose the idea would be if those posts were filled - there would be more demand and therefore more jobs created to fill that demand in an improving spiral.
Figure seems a bit low to me though - I totted up 40k just in London on 3 websites..
Think about every other large city - Birmingham, Manchester, Liverpool, Leeds, Newcastle, Bristol, Norwich, Sheffield, Coventry, middlesborough, Portsmouth, southampton, and then all the smaller cities like Preston, hull, york, Carlisle, Slough, reading, etc etc -

Well with more companies closing everyday and public and private sector jobs cut every day, I'm not sure the job market is as buoyant and vibrant as you make it out to be.
Yes there are jobs, but there are five times as many people as there are jobs... and the figure, while going up and down over the last few months, is on the rise all the time.

there must be an awful lot of jobs out there...

There are.... half a million, 500,000..... but there are two and a half million people that want those jobs. 2.5m

And this is assuming that those jobs are just regular jobs, that any of these unemployed people can do.

The other point is - if you are out of work, either move to an area where there is demand for your skills

Well if you have no money because you have no job, how are you going to be able to relocate?
Where is the money for all these "changes" going to come from?

OR get retrained in the skills that are in demand in your area? Out of work people get free college course etc - fact.

Better yourself - stop leeching off society...

They do, but not in just anything, only courses that the government/jobcentre approve of or are affiliated with.

And yes, I agree, people should better themselves and there are opportunities out there, but some of them do not have the support, the understanding, the drive, motivation and/or willpower.

Do you think the jobcentre is this wonderful place of opportunity and lovely friendly people who all know you and want to help and go out of their way to tell you about courses and give you all the help and advice you need?

I've worked in recruitment and it really isn't like that.... it SHOULD be.... but they don't have the time, the staff or the funds to be able to provide that kind of service.

This problem is a JOINT problem.... yes, some young people are lazy and have no drive and blah blah... but also, there is not as much help, advice and support for those that DO want to better themselves... It's one hell of a rut.

reply to post by blupblup


I know people in job centres aren't much use - but there are other agencies around, and the means to find them is easy.
The thing is these people are all active on social media sites tweeting and facebooking (btw for poor people they all seemed to be using expensive blackberries and iPhones!!) so they have time to put into understanding how that works - and appear quite organised on that front.
Why not channel that into a few google searches and see what you can find.
I used to live in blackpool - and when my job finished as was maternity cover for someone who came back to work I walked through most of blackpool into shops, offices, etc looking for work and found it.
You are right about motivation - but I cannot grasp how people aren't motivated to change this sh**e life they lead?
I have been on benefits once for 7 weeks - and I applied for so many jobs every day the relief when I got one and had some real money in my pocket again was immense - yet people seem content to just live their whole lives this way? It's actually quite sad in a way.

Also thanks to everyone for their comments so far...

There are always honest ways to earn cash, window cleaning, lawn mowing, painting, yard cleaning, gardening,car washing, dog walking,tree lopping just to name a few, and you can do most without a car or experience. I agree that motivation and not wanting to start at the bottom is a big hurdle to jump but its gets easier on the other side.

You know, it's stressful for the employed when the unemployment rate is this high too.
Employers often ask more of you, and are less likely to get raises. A lot of folks act terrified they will mess up and lose their job.

My husband went through nearly 3 years of that sort of thing as his company kept laying more and more off every Friday, until finally he went too. The company went from 500 employees 3 years ago to about 20 now. EVERYONE was walking on eggshells. He never could get a day off, though he had 3 weeks of vacation - and when finally he would get a day off, his boss would tell him he had to go by there FIRST in the morning and then keep phone contact - even though he was off on paper!

Originally posted by facchino
reply to post by blupblup

 

The thing is these people are all active on social media sites tweeting and facebooking (btw for poor people they all seemed to be using expensive blackberries and iPhones!!) so they have time to put into understanding how that works - and appear quite organised on that front.

See I think the poverty excuse is a poor one, these kids wouldn't know poverty if it looted and set fire to them.

I think it's many things... breakdown of societal and family values, nowhere to channel energy and frustrations for these kids, economic crisis, media/magazines telling them what gadgets and clothes they MUST have, lack of positive role models, lack of jobs and opportunity, funds for social programmes and initiatives being cut.

A million different things to be honest.

But yes, more energy should be ploughed into positive things than negative.... but that's what a rut is unfortunately.

You are right about motivation - but I cannot grasp how people aren't motivated to change this sh**e life they lead?

Well again, A rut.... all the things above.
Let's say you've tried all the methods of getting a job, no success.... your parents (or more likely Parent) don't work, family of benefits and handouts.... maybe issues within the family, no discipline, no hope, no love, no future? This is how many see it, whether it's true or not, this is the way some people feel.

You keep telling someone they are nothing and they are useless and have no future... you keep rejecting them for jobs and not replying to their applications, you keep demonising them and lumping them all together... then you get disaffected, disenfranchised and pissed off people.

I have been on benefits once for 7 weeks - and I applied for so many jobs every day the relief when I got one and had some real money in my pocket again was immense - yet people seem content to just live their whole lives this way? It's actually quite sad in a way.

Also thanks to everyone for their comments so far...

Were you on benefits during one of the worst financial crises in living memory? Where business were failing and cutting staff, where programmes designed to get people back to work and apprenticeships were being cut?

Maybe you have a good work ethic, maybe you had a strong role model and you just knew you had to work and had the will and desire to succeed... just because others don't, it's not as simple as saying it's because they're lazy or unwilling to get a job.

It's a complex issue and every single person is different.

reply to post by facchino


How do you expect things to get better if nobody addresses the problems?

"EVERYONE STOP EXCERCISING YOUR RIGHT TO PROTEST AND GO BE A WAGE-SLAVE FOR A MULTI-BILLION DOLLAR CORPORATE ENTITY ALREADY SO THAT THEY CAN MAKE EXPONENTIAL PROFITS WHILE YOU BREAK YOUR BACK. GOSH, WHAT ARE YOU, STOOPID!"



Talk about crawling out of the grave just to start digging another one.

reply to post by TheOrangeBrood


Where exactly is the protest in smashing windows of Curry's and stealing TVs and iPads?
Hey? Please tell me.
Please show me ONE GENUINE PHOTO of a rioter with a placard or poster stating:
"No jobs for us"
"Rebuild our communities"
"Stop cutting community funding"
I think we will be in for a long long long wait indeed.

If they feel the government has let them down - then I would support a protest.

The students managed a protest about tuition fees, and although there were a few violent incidents and one or 2 damaged buildings - it was nothing on the scale of these riots and looting.

Your point is garbage - it is not about being a slave to corporate UK - it is about people feeling they are owed a living and stealing items some normal hard working people don't even have, and burning down buildings in their own run down communities - to be honest that strikes me as being the most stupid thing they have done
that suprise suprise only end up costing the normal taxpaying citizen more because the government have to repair the things they have broken, or insurance costs go up.

The perpetrators of these riots are mindless, criminal, opportunistic scum who were never protesting anything at all.

reply to post by facchino


You blame the population for insurance company standards.

Pathetic.

These organisations turn billions for offering NO SERVICES.

Then you turn around and try to preach to people about the economy?

Sorry, what?

And I never said anything about these kids protesting in the most appropriate manner, so your "point" was lost in your misconception. It's irrelevant; people will act stupid after being worked like they are milling equipment just to end up in debt at the end of the day, how this surprised you is beyond me, but then you turn around and blame them for it, and that is just pathetic and tell-tale of how powerful divisional propaganda can really be. Why bother fighting them when we can make them fight eacother?

reply to post by TheOrangeBrood


Answer the question - I propose to you that they weren't protesting but just looting - you skilfully avoided that question by claimin they protest in the way they know how - by stealing? so not actually protesting at all then is it. As I said opportunistic looting. Messaging each other on BBs and iPhones - seem like they can get quite organised but can't organise an actual protest can they - even if they had burnt govt buildings down they would have been making some kind of stand against govt - but I go back to the fact that the looting was the main thing - also then copied around the country as the scum saw opportunity to steal expensive items.
There was NO PROTEST - deal with it.
Who's pathetic?
Were you out looting? Do you not work? Are you a troll?

Read my previous post - and answer the question in orange..go on do it...

As for insurance - its a fairly simple economic fact that if there are thousands more claims then these companies will seek to increase their premiums. The rights and wrongs of insurance companies is a whole different thread - but the basic fact I stated above remains true. If you can't grasp that go and do a bit of reading on it rather than calling others pathetic.