World leaders confer on debt crises this weekend

China is not self sustainable. They have built themselves some mighty thick glass walls in dealing with the USA but they to will crumble. I think the big problem here is AMERICANS already feel our reign is over. Instead of actually doing anything about it, we HOPE for better and elect people that will bring CHANGE.

I think if we all realize we need to tighten our belts we can still continue to be the best. WE are nowhere near defeated, but we are certainly creating the conditions for such a thing to happen at a much faster rate than it should.

Lets stand up and do something!

Many forward thinking members here on ATS have been warning us about China and its threat, WW3 is here,and has been for a while,they are buying up farms and mining rights all over the world.
The nukes aren't going to stay in the silos forever, thats why credit is not that important, when a nation becomes bankrupt they start a war.
China may win a few battles but not the war.

Quite frankly,

I do not give a horses pa toot

about what the chinacons have to say.

What are they going to do?

Send the * samurais*

I'm not to worried. What are they going to do, come and take their money? No.

Originally posted by gimme_some_truth
I'm not to worried. What are they going to do, come and take their money? No.

That is very simplistic, shame you haven't aknowledged that the US has been pissing off most of the Eastern world for the past 30 years. China may not be credible on their own but if they partner up then you may be in trouble.

Originally posted by hillynilly
Quite frankly,

I do not give a horses pa toot

about what the chinacons have to say.

What are they going to do?

Send the * samurais*

Samurai are Japanese dude.

Just sayin..

Cosmic...

...we wouldnt have a debt problem if we werent spending trillions on war and sticking our nose in everyone's biz... thats the problem... not china...

reply to post by proteus33

tell china they can go blank themselves we as a nation need to quit buying manufactured goods from china we need to tell corporations if they want to sell goods here they need to make them HERE the global corporations crap has got to go .

Agreed! Who do we owe? The Saudis, the Chinese and the bankers we bailed out.

Investigative Journalist Greg Palast (You remember him; discovered the funny business that disenfranchised thousands of black voters in FL during the 2000 election) had this to say;

Solution: Don't pay the banksters

There's another wrong assumption controlling this debate over debt, that the banks, the debt holders, must be paid. When the bankers and the Chinese and the Saudis lent Bush three trillion dollars for his wild-ass buying party, they were betting, like any investor, on the good faith of the borrower to pay it back.

So, let Hu Jintao and King Abdullah stick a collection agency on Cantor and the other Republican shirkers. Repossess their limousines or send The Boys around to remind Cantor what happens when you don't pay what you owe.

The President should say to Hu, the Sheik and Goldman-Sachs:

"I have identified $3 trillion in Treasury notes issued between 2001 and 2008 which were lent to fund President Bush's expenditures. Unfortunately, those who borrowed your money don't want to pay it back. You made a bad investment -- but that's how the free market works. Therefore, I am suspending payments on these Treasury notes until we can round up the deadbeats and make them live up to their commitments.

"As President, I have the Constitutional duty to pay the bills of the Veterans Administration, the Social Security fund and other vital services already voted and appropriated by Congress. Military pay before banker pay. Get used to it."

Will the bankers have heart attacks? I hope so. (Maybe if bankers are ill, the GOP will vote for universal health care.) Will China refuse to buy more US debt? Not a chance: The Chinese cannot afford a devaluation of the $2-3 trillion in US Treasury notes they have in their pokey, a devaluation which would surely follow their abandoning the US treasuries.

I don't know about the last part, but Greg did attend the Free Market courses of Milton Friedman, right alongside many of those who would later move on to rape South America under the Privatization Loans. And it was Milton, who was one of the main gurus of Free Market/No Regulations. When that went into effect the trouble began, and the jobs started to leave.

Simply put they pulled the rug out from under us and now we are going to pay them for it? No! They already have the money the stole, and are still stealing from us, and the bailout money/oil money/jobs. Now they want to turn us upside down and shake the last nickel out of our pockets? Let the thieves pay it back.

And they will get it too. Why? Because the Federal Reserve will just print us into oblivion. They are well along the way already. The whole thing is based on a fraud perpetrated almost 100 years ago and, why in the world would we want to continue to play along?

I'd say Mr. Palast's idea sounds pretty damn sane, especially in comparison. Sounds like a good start anyway

reply to post by Wyn Hawks

...we wouldnt have a debt problem if we werent spending trillions on war and sticking our nose in everyone's biz... thats the problem... not china...

And there is step two!

What the US should do.

A) Impose steep Tariff on imports
B) Reclaim all foreign land holdings from their owners
C) Reclaim foreign ownership of all mineral rights on US soil (Nationalize Resources)
D) Take ownership of oil operations on US soil (Nationalize Energy)
E) Declare Jubilee and forgive personal debts
F) Abolish the FED establish silver standard
G) Assume control of farm lands for distribution to citizens (Temporarily)
H) Abolish legality of PATENTS which relating to sources/method of energy
I) Annex Canada peacefully (merger) for reasons of potential energy and resources
J) Divide stake and share amongst the people of America evenly. (Nationalized Resources)
K) Compensate the wealthy to a point where they are comfortable.
L) Close the borders
M) Improve education
N) No taxes
O) Use Nationalized resources to pay back debts

Tell the world (bankers) if you want your money....come and get it. In the meantime put all efforts into R&D and developing and producing the means to make tomorrows technology today. Then when the US has catapulted itself and raised the bar regarding technologies start loosening up and putting things back the way they were in the good ole days.

Only problem with my super extreme plan is that the bankers will war us but alternatively we can not do this and go to war as well. My way is just the best way to give em all the finger, but, then again maybe they wouldn't war the US.

Just joken

reply to post by michael1983l

That is very simplistic, shame you haven't acknowledged that the US has been pissing off most of the Eastern world for the past 30 years. China may not be credible on their own but if they partner up then you may be in trouble.

True, but we have also been giving them our technology so they could steal our jobs successfully. As intelligence veteran Chalmers Johnson illustrates so well in his book "Blowback".

It is just possible Hu baby is on cue on this, much the way Obama is on teleprompter. Get my drift? I mean it's not like we haven't been down this road before. I for one do not believe this is any accident. If it were an accident, someone would have been prosecuted for it.

We have been spoon fed our information and news for so long we ought to expect more of it and start to see through it.

reply to post by stevcolx

In 2009 Bush detailed the implementation of the North American Union whereby Canada, America and Mexico will become 1 union just like the EU. The currency will change from the dollar to the 'Amero'.

With the Euro failing right now, I think they are probably figuring on skipping the Amero and goin straight to the Worldo? Eartho? What the heck will they call it? Obama-os sounds like a cereal, that's no good. Hey, I know! we can call it the Soro!! Get it, the Sore-o?

Originally posted by Wyn Hawks
...we wouldnt have a debt problem if we werent spending trillions on war and sticking our nose in everyone's biz... thats the problem... not china...

Hate to break it to you but our wars are a small fraction of the big problem.

I think some people are forgetting what is actually made in china, the majority of the products on the shelves are made there, it's scary to think about. People may also find that they won't be able to afford said products if they are not made in china. It certainly is a conundrum.

My family was recently in China and you would be surprised at how affluent the society is becoming. It seems that they may have gotten to a point where they don't need to rely on western demand for their products because their own people are getting to where they can largely afford to sustain their own industries, you really would be surprised at how affluent they are becoming.

There has been a sharpened axe hanging over America's head for a while now and it was only really a matter of time. I also think that China have definitely played the 'long game' here and basically let the States dig itself so deep it can never climb out. Can you blame them? It's been working great for them.

I thought they ditched the Amero? I don't see how after all the years of exploiting the American continent that when the States are bought to their knees that countries who quite literally despise America will welcome them with open arms. Take a look at Panama, Venezuela, Ecuador etc, after all that the economic hit men and jackals have down to these countries I don't find it likely that they will welcome a power diminished United states with open arms. I could be wrong though.

reply to post by Dreine


this news of emminent credit rating downgrade is a few weeks old. enough time for a statement.

also when you loan someone money, it is your right to ask the people taking the loan to give it back.

america has been taking loans to payoff previous loans... which if i remember correctly is similar to a ponzi scheme.

Originally posted by sir_slide
I think some people are forgetting what is actually made in china, the majority of the products on the shelves are made there, it's scary to think about. People may also find that they won't be able to afford said products if they are not made in china. It certainly is a conundrum.

My family was recently in China and you would be surprised at how affluent the society is becoming. It seems that they may have gotten to a point where they don't need to rely on western demand for their products because their own people are getting to where they can largely afford to sustain their own industries, you really would be surprised at how affluent they are becoming.

There has been a sharpened axe hanging over America's head for a while now and it was only really a matter of time. I also think that China have definitely played the 'long game' here and basically let the States dig itself so deep it can never climb out. Can you blame them? It's been working great for them.

I thought they ditched the Amero? I don't see how after all the years of exploiting the American continent that when the States are bought to their knees that countries who quite literally despise America will welcome them with open arms. Take a look at Panama, Venezuela, Ecuador etc, after all that the economic hit men and jackals have down to these countries I don't find it likely that they will welcome a power diminished United states with open arms. I could be wrong though.

Unfortunately...I believe you are right. I believe that China is trying to be the superpower country....and right now...compared to the U.S. ..(financially they are).......I never thought in my wildest dreams that America would be in this sort of trouble. During the Clinton administration...we were doing fine....what happened?

Originally posted by caladonea
I never thought in my wildest dreams that America would be in this sort of trouble. During the Clinton administration...we were doing fine....what happened?

...the short scope answer is - the gwb regime... they "sold" a huge chunk of our national debt to china, then dubya told the citizens of the usofa to go out and show your patriotism by spending money you dont have...

...the wide scope answer is - this is a homemade set up thats been in the cooker for a long time... the gwb regime was just another step...

reply to post by Wyn Hawks


You guys really need to get over the blame George W game. Our debt to China started in earnest with Clinton. Secondly if both parties could keeop the credit card in check we wouldnt need china to buy our debt.

If the American people werent so apathetic about politics we wouldnt rubber stamp these morons back into office.

We are the reason we are in the mess we are in.

Originally posted by Xcathdra
reply to post by Wyn Hawks

 

You guys really need to get over the blame George W game.

...i'm not a guy nor am i a plural and i'll blame anyone i want, kid...

Originally posted by Wyn Hawks

Originally posted by Xcathdra
reply to post by Wyn Hawks

 

You guys really need to get over the blame George W game.

...i'm not a guy nor am i a plural and i'll blame anyone i want, kid...

I will use plural and the generic term of guys anytime I wish. This "kid" doent take orders from the old, misinformed or obnoxious. Sounds like you need to take a nap to get over your crankiness.

Let me get a care check on aisle 3 please.. Care check aisle 3.

Thats the problem with people like you. You would rather blame people than confront the issue and fix it.

Calling me a kid makes as much sense as me calling you an informed female.