Does Al Qaeda Have Spiritual Protectors?

DANGER: Ludicrously Long Post Alert!

Notes on Protocol

I debated as to whether or not this may be suited to a different forum, notably the new BTS predictions incarnation, but decided this was more a matter of observations and questions related to paranormal studies than dreams or predictions per se. More importantly, I am hoping to see if any students of the paranormal might be able to shed light on this one way or another, and there are plenty to be found in this particular forum.

This topic doesn�t seem right for the War on Terrorism forum as I understand it, although maybe it wouldn�t be bad to lump the �paranormal� WoT stuff with the �normal� WoT stuff. Definitely a judgment call, especially in light of the number of topics addressed, and my judgment may admittedly be wrong in this case.

If the mods don�t share my appraisal, I encourage them to place this thread where it best belongs (including a fiction section or the trash can, if need be ). With apologies to topical style -- especially in light of the outlandish length of this diatribe -- there are at least three different discrete topics wound up within this post, but I think they interrelate enough to excuse my sloppiness in including them all, because they all work in support of a theory. Again, I defer to the mods for guidance.

Background

The background on this is that I have been trying, through various means with which I am most certainly nothing better than the basest neophyte, to somehow locate members of Al Qaeda, and Osama bin Laden in particular.

I am not a psychic, and most (but not all) of my experiences in the �paranormal� realm have been unexpected and incidental. Only recently have I decided to return (another story for another thread) to the realm of the spiritual for further study.

Thus I expect and prefer that those reading my posts understand that I do not, in any way shape or form, present myself as an �expert� on any of this, or that anything I perceive or claim should be believed without corroboration. Hopefully, my signature sufficiently reflects my philosophies about that. I am always at The Beginning, which is my place.

Also, I am going to ramble more afield in this post than I usually like to, and hope you can excuse that in light of the subject matter. There�s some sort of connection, I think, if not an obvious one. Now, on with it�

The Wall

My recent attempts are effectively new variations on previous exercises (I�m adding attempts at remote viewing [RV] to the mix), but all of them are based on some form of meditation and visualization. Most recently, I have been meeting obstacles, but not the usual obstacles.

My dilemma in this task was brought to the forefront of my mind by my chancing to notice the following thread, which seems to echo my experiences: When the chatter stops!!!!.

Without speaking to the specifics of kimberlynn�s posts or that thread topic, it seems as if her observations have some similarity to mine. Specifically, from my point of view at least, it seems like it has become hard to �see� Al Qaeda members lately, more than before -- if that makes any sense.

Does anyone else encounter similar experiences when attempting to �see� Al Qaeda targets?

But wait, there�s more�

The Guardians

Normally in the past, when I read something like I am about to relate here, I�d roll my eyes and move on. So if you do the same, I�ll understand that you�re a kindred spirit, and I�m with you buddy. Having said that�

I live in a rural part of Northwest Nevada. As luck would have it, on a recent trip, I had occasion to drive both down and back up on U.S. 95. This highway passes to the west of the huge Nellis complex, which I am sure most ATSers have some familiarity with.

The trip down was uneventful and made during the daytime. The trip back was made at nighttime, and that fact, plus my state of mind, probably is what made a big difference.

On the way down, I was focused mostly on trying to sense law enforcement down the road as a supplement to my radar detector. Sounds silly, I know, but it�s a fun game and keeps me alert as I cruise down the motorway. And I like to drive fast, if not recklessly (drive as many Nevada two-laners as I do and you�d drive fast too).

On the way back, I did the same at first, but eventually my attention drifted after I left Indian Springs and moved onto the two-lane portion that begins at Mercury. Of course, I was listening to some loud music as I drove (a mixture of Yes and U2 as of late), so I was mainly focused on driving and singing along with the music, not a care in the world, hardly anyone else on the road at that hour (it was late).

As I came into the Amargosa Valley, my attention wandered around in a sort of casual way, sometimes I �drift� like that. I thought, �Hey, Area 51 is northeast of me. I wonder if they�ll be doing any test flights tonight?� I decided to let my mind wander over in that direction to �see� if anything was going on.

That�s when I became aware of �them�. It was not something I was expecting -- I was planning to try �visualizing� the Groom Lake base, and this was sort of a shock in being much different than what I was looking for. I�ve driven through around the Nellis range on all sides plenty of times -- I love Nevada -- and this was the first time anything like this had happened. This is going to sound really dumb, I know, but here goes�

�They� appeared as an image in my mind, like a thought, but nothing obscuring my driving or anything. I hate saying this, but they looked like classic �grey� aliens with the bald heads, big eyes, tiny mouths and pointy chins. I don�t think they were really aliens, though, I think they were humans. Call it a hunch.

There were three that I �saw�, but I felt there may be others with them, maybe five in all. Maybe they work on shifts? They were very stoic, did not move or blink (almost like a still image), and never �said� anything that might be mistaken for words, but one thing was eminently clear to me: they were not going to �let me in�. They projected no emotion at all, other than the idea that their �appearance� was the best I could hope for at that time. No Hangar 18 for me tonight!

I don�t know if they were at Area 51, but there seemed to be a connection to that area. I haven�t yet tried �returning� to see if they are still there (maybe I�ll try that later tonight or tomorrow morning as I meditate), but I am left with the impression that someone, or something, is being employed to protect either Area 51 or a place like it from �prying minds�. I had never even considered the idea that �blocking thought� was possible until that night, but they stopped me cold.

So what does this have to do with�

Osama bin Laden and Al Qaeda

In recent months, and most recently last night, I have tried to visualize members of Al Qaeda, with an emphasis on Osama, since he is such a public figure and easiest to visualize. He has a very distinctive face and air about him, so it would seem like cake. Not so.

In past months, when I would try to �find� Osama, I would get a lot of seemingly random images of people in Pashtun garb and rocky landscapes that were almost certainly just residual images in my mind from videos he has appeared in. Never anything useful, but I wasn�t trying to use remote viewing techniques then, just my trademark and wildly inaccurate �intuition� method.

Last night was the first time I�d tried in a while, was also the first time I tried an RV method on the problem, and was different from any other attempt. As before, I focused on images of his face and my senses of his personality in my mind, but this time, I �hit a wall�.

What was weird about the wall was that it seemed to be deliberately placed, and �conscious�. With the wall, which seemed more like an invisible barrier of will, I got an impression of a huge genie with his arms crossed (Hassan� chop!) who seemed to be barring my way. It seemed oddly stylized, like someone�s personal touch.

Puzzled, to say the least, I decided to try quieting my mind of this and taking a stab at the remote viewing version instead. I�m very new to RV so it�s sort of an add-on for now, since I rarely �see� anything this way.

Last night I �saw� something RV-style while thinking of Osama, and got a visual image of kind of a box-like thing that became a more complex set of connected boxes which I ultimately took to be a Pashtun-style fortress, like the kind found in the Tribal Areas. It appeared in classic �RV gray� at first, but as it rotated in my behind-the-eyelids vision, my imagination or whatever took over and added �details�.

This one was not very large, and it was very isolated -- no other buildings except the walled compound itself. It is in a valley, but didn�t seem like a rocky valley. Surprisingly smooth, actually, with mild foothills curving up to a wall of very tall mountains. The valley and a good portion of the mountains are covered with many trees, mostly deciduous with conifers on the mountains.

The compound is very isolated, with very few roads -- almost all jeep trails around it. It also seems �clean�, with few inhabitants, not some huge command center or heavily guarded. I saw no evidence of heavy weapons of any sort. There seem to be orchard rows among the trees, but no plowed fields. Unlike with other �visions� of mine, I was not able to determine compass point direction, which is very unusual, since I habitually and subconsciously keep track of direction wherever I go.

Again, as I pondered the RV-inspired �impressions�, �Hassan� appeared, and distracted me so that I saw no more. He really was reminiscent of the Bugs Bunny character. Inside joke?

I don�t think Osama is dead yet, by the way, but I do think he is in failing health, and will die soon. Of course, I have no way of knowing if any of this is even close to reality, but that�s what I have for now.

So�

The Theory: How All This Might Fit Together

My working theory for now is this, with all the caveats attendant thereto: That Al Qaeda may be using some form of psychic or spiritual protectors to secure their operations.

I think it is possible that they may now be aware that the U.S. and other governments employ psychics to aid in investigations, and have acted to counter this vulnerability. I do not know how or if Islamic fundamentalists might come to employ or even tolerate psychics, but I think they may be on to the game.

For those who have persevered through this shockingly long (but hopefully not too terribly dull) post hoping to find something of substance, I must apologize, because I truly don�t know if there is anything to this or not. I am not an authority on anything, especially matters such as these, have a vivid imagination, which I treasure, but which sabotages my receptivity to thoughts outside my own, and I have a horrid track record when it comes to my �impressions� of events.

So what�s the point?

My hope in posting what may be no more than a weird tale of imagination is this: To ask those of you out there who are more enlightened in these matters if any of this corroborates anything you have �seen�. Does this make sense to anyone? Heck, I�m not sure it even makes sense to me, but it�s all I have for now.

If anything in this article rings a bell for anyone, please let me know. If you think it�s utter nonsense, I think we can all accept that as the default case, but feel free to chime in on that score as well, if you like.

Any and all feedback of any kind will be cheerfully appreciated.

As I have posted before, I personally do not believe that there is a genuine extraterrestial presence at Nellis.

I think the stories of ET contact there were generated to create what I will call a "mythos," so that any RV'er will pick up on the phantasy instead of the reality of groom lake.

If you try to RV Nellis, you start picking up on the "tulpa," or thought-impressions, created by the shared subconscious fears of the whole culture. This makes it so you'll never trust your results.

I think there are active RV countermeasures officers, who are totally human US citizens who impersonate alien gray entities to throw you off the track.

Obviously, I wouldn't be telling you this if I was worried about being RV'd myself. I personally don't do RV and am not active in that discipline. It is correct to say that I believe I have found a high quality 'jamming' protocol, so I wont be tracked down or harmed that way.

I think that Al Qaeda has developed its own "jamming system." I believe that AQ is now "using" the thoughts and dreams of the Pashtun populace to throw any RV'ers off the track. I believe the Genie you and others have seen was originally a cartoon in a propoganda booklet, distributed elsewhere in the Middle East. The image was randomly chosen, and connected to the prayers of the faithful in particular religious centers.

You may have noticed that the depth of the image, its apparent reality, surges, especially during the late night. One theory is that the image construct is powered by groups praying the shehadah during the 5 prayer times daily.

If you investigate not the image, but the source of its origins, in terms of geography, you may see that the instigators of the image have left a trail in emotional space that can be RV'd. The desolate and deserted edifice, I gather, is simpy a red herring to draw special forces into a trap, or at least away from important activities. I conclude that the mental construct is actually maintained from another location entirely. I am confident that it is possible to RV their location at the time of the image's creation.

I am interested as to what you make of this.

Well, first off, you have presented a great deal of information to ponder (then again, so have I). While I have been around the block a few times, I am very new to a lot of what I have been exploring since I came to ATS, and there is clearly much for me to learn.

I am likewise skeptical of claims that physical aliens walk or fly above the earth, but frankly don�t know one way or the other. Due to personal experiences, I think non-human presences can be found on earth in abundance, but not as physical aliens.

I have heard of tulpas before, but did not make a connection of that kind to the �greys� I �saw�. It is an intriguing one, however, and one which I thinks deserves further examination, particularly in light of what I know about MJ-12 -- speaking of crimson clupeoids.

I did get the impression (�hunch� if you will) that the forces behind the rather static �alien� image were human. For a brief instant that night, I think I caught a glimpse of some young men in light-blue jumpsuits lying on some sort of conformal couches or chairs (like fancy recliners) in a dimly-lit room (also light blue) comically reminiscent of an opium den, for some reason. Nothing on the walls or the jumpsuits to identify them or the place. Their hair was short and military in appearance. One guy had a total buzz cut (Marine? Hehe).

I also think they were probing me, in the mental sense vice the traditional �abducted� sense, if you catch my drift. They did seem aware of me, for sure, and me personally, even though the �grays� seemed almost as static as a placard.

As for Al Qaeda�s jamming system, those are some intriguing concepts. �Hassan� seemed to me almost like someone�s �psychic avatar� -- personal in nature, like a signature, but I certainly wouldn�t rule out the possibility that he was being projected by multiple people.

The thing about the Shehadah is particularly interesting to me, because one of the things that popped into my mind last night as I tried to �find� bin Laden was a muezzin�s �call to prayer� song (�Allahu ackbar.. Allahu ackbar� Alla-a-a-aaahu ackbar��). I assumed it was just an association on my part (to get in the �mood�). Now I wonder.

I also wonder: Is there an organized effort on the part of non-governmental psychics to find Al Qaeda -- and conversely, to help them?

With apologies to Blue Oyster Cult, I never imagined I might someday become a �Veteran of the Psychic Wars�. Yet now I wonder if I may be drafting myself into all this. I must meditate on this matter.

As for jamming protocols, I frankly hadn�t considered a need for them until now that you mention it. My assumptions that I am no one of consequence and thus of no interest to �the powers that be� are probably correct, but I suppose that sooner or later, if there is anything to any of this, I may attract attention to myself.

If your jamming protocols are not subject to being compromised by being discussed, I would be interested in knowing what techniques you use.

If I am going to work my way more deeply into all this, I probably should pay more attention to guarding my anonymity and security, both of which I prize highly.

Thanks so much for your response!

Before we go into a lot of details, we might consider asking this thread to be moved to RATS. Suddenly I too, am wondering if any precautions and countermeasures are good enough.

I will say that the trick for an organization is to create a mythos or avatar or whatever that is so potent that all your future ipressions are shaped by the past experience of it. Certainly, cartoon images are arresting, and so simple that they practically draw themselves in one's mind. If someone says "snoopy" or "mickey mouse," those images pop into your head automatically. Even if you try to think of Mickey mouse from the 1930's, the image is instantly overwritten with the more familiar image from the 1960's. Especially when dealing with people viewing a culture they are unfamiliar with, they tend to think in stereotypes anyway, this could prove quite effective.

I've heard a blue genie compared to the character from Disney's Aladdin, which is why my thoughts are turned that way, as well as compared to a crude cartoon of a genie from a carwash or a garage door opener.

A genie is an image that would be very real for readers of the Qur'an, which refers to genii; yet the same image would be a joke to westerners, and impossible to focus concretely.

The image reported to me was part of a more complicated construct, sort of like "OZ" in the movie, that Dorothy and her friends are so frightened of.

What I have heard of was a series of decoy images, actually reinforced on a daily (nightly) basis, from a distant location in a more populated area.

I am torn between discussing countermeasures on this thread for everyone, and u2uing you later privately.

I will say that if you live in a city, you probably have enough post-modern archetecture that an image of you could be made to give a totally corrupt impression of your locale, if you tried to do it that way. What if you RV'd from a building that was Stucco? would RV'ers assume you were in Mexico?

What would happen if you RV'd from a suite in a hotel with a medieval theme, would they think you were in a castle? What if you wore a turban and listened to a recording of the street sounds of Cairo while doing your work? What effect would that have?????

gotta go.

Here's a final question, a leading one, admittedly. There have been reports of an image of a tower, like maybe a prayer tower, that could be confused with a missle? Not a real one, but a sham? Maybe part of archaeological ruins in the desert waste? A missing or unexplained pillar.

[edit on 17-8-2004 by dr_strangecraft]

This might be a bit lengthy post, but it gives an insight into "paranormal" part of islam.

A belief in spiritual world and beings in much stronger and much more diverse in islam then in christianity. What is refered to as genie in the west are not the kind of genies muslims believe in.

According to Qur'an, before God created humans, he creted a spiritual race of beings called jinns. THere are both good and bad jinns. When he then created Adam and Eve he told them to bow to his creation. One of their leaders, Iblis, and a bunch of bad jinns refused to do it, so God cast them down from the spiritual realm to earth. Iblis is also known as Shaitan, Satan. They are the evil force on this earth. Jinns live around us, but we are not able to see them. According to some legends they can break the veil separating the two realms and appear in our world as anything they want to be, animal, human. In the past, God himself has commanded the good jinns to serve humans in time of need, the most prominent human to make use of this was Solomon, he had a whole army of Jinns.
The good force on earth are Melek, angels, beings of light that are sent as protectors of humans.
Now depending on one's strength of faith and the way they live their lives, they are either influenced by angels or by jinns. There are ways to evoke both spiritual beings, ask for help, guidance or in the case of jinns, ask to harm someone or conceal evil from good. The more evil one is, the easier is to evoke evil spirits and have them do your bidding. Same goes for good people and angels.
In my country, Bosnia, there are people called "dobri", the "good ones" who are born with a 6th sense and a gift to comunicate with good spiritual beings. They are healers and can also counter any evil spells or influence.
The evil is controled by dark priests who can cast very powerful spells on people, send jinns to their homes so they have bad luck, all kinds of things. However, if your faith in good is strong, these spells cant harm you much. Good is always stronger then evil, you just gotta have faith.

Generaly, magic, spells, pagan rituals are not allowed in islam, but as people so are, they have incorporated practical ways of "paranormal" that they already had with theoretical stories in Qur'an.

Now, on topic, it is very much possible that Bin Laden is using jinns to protect himself. He is evil enough to be able to evoke a few of the very evil ones. To break this, it would take a powerful good force.

Very very interesting topic

After reading this though, a lot more stuff makes sense.. Sometimes when I have "RV'ed" I come up against something that stops me.. Like I cant see in there? That or there is fog over everything. But now I see that this may very well be an actual force, and not just my mind getting lazy lol.

I never thought that "psychic warfare" could be plausible.. But this thread is making me wonder. I, too, would be interested in learning techniques to block unwanted guests.. I use a very rudimentary one which I recently came up with. I just imagine my room being filled with smoke.. getting thicker and thicker until you cant make anything out. Very similiar to what I have seen when RV'ing other places.

Once again, great thread, and dont worry about the length of your post.. I certainly found it interesting!

good topic and very interesting too, I am glad you brought it up because i have had similiar thoughts. I had a dream/vision, whatever, about Osama being on a ship and got the distinct feeling afterwards like i was snooping and wasn't supposed to be there, I felt guilty seeing what I saw, whether real or not I don't know.

Anyways, i have tried unsuccessfully since to focus on Osama and some of the other high profile members of Al-Qaeda, but instead of seeing them, what I saw was a very old man, almost ancient looking, long white beard, traditional white islamic robes, turban and all, and he gave off the vibe of being a protector. He was writing on tiny slips of papers, chanting etc and placing these papers in little silver amulets. I got the impression that these men all wear these amulets, which offer them some sort of protection.

I mentioned this to my granny (since we discuss all dreams) who immediately warned me to stop attempting to see these people and not to mess with any meji's (muslim mystics). She wouldn't tell me more except that I was once saved by a muslim meji and if I continued doing what I did and this man noticed me or percieved me as a threat, i could be grave danger.

either way, danger or not, I would still attempt it, however, i seem to be going thru an odd state right now, where things are all out of whack and whatever abilities i have, developed or not, are acting out of sorts...perhaps my chakras aren't aligned, perhaps it's a graw, planetary influences??/ but over the past two to three weeks, I am overwhelmed with oddities.

Originally posted by worldwatcher
who immediately warned me to stop attempting to see these people and not to mess with any meji's (muslim mystics). She wouldn't tell me more except that I was once saved by a muslim meji and if I continued doing what I did and this man noticed me or percieved me as a threat, i could be grave danger.

Perhaps you were indeed noticed....

Having meditated on this matter, I am satisfied that I am willing, without reservation, to proceed. In fact, there was so little deliberation on my part that its absence itself concerned me, but I am resolved to do what I will, and I wish to continue without fear.

I already knew full well that darkness enshrouds Al Qaeda, but I have, myself, walked in darkness, and know that fear feeds it no less than love feeds light. So I shall not offer mine.

Back to Area 51

Last night, I attempted to �view� Area 51 again. My rationale was that the defenders there would be less vindictive and dangerous than Al Qaeda�s defenders, so it seemed like a good �training exercise�. I doubt these guys would try to have me blown away -- I think.

This was a nighttime exercise, which I do as I lie down for bed, but before I actually fall asleep. During all that follows I was conscious, and I actually got up after it to start up my computer and write it down, but decided against it, thinking I should process it a bit first. Although I was awake, it had a very dreamlike quality, especially the communication (�dreaming in Dreamland?�), and I thought then, as I do now, that it was probably just my hyperactive imagination as usual.

So, as is my custom for all posts on this sort of subject, I present this without warranty, assume it�s nonsense, and post it less with expectations of accuracy, but in hopes that someone more skilled than I might see commonalities with their experiences and pluck wheat from the chaff. That said�

This time, I got to �look around� for a while, and was trying to orient myself around the airstrips and buildings and those funky pits they have out there where they bury God-knows-what (seems like nasty industrial waste). These images did not have the definition I would expect from a more rigorous technique such as remote viewing or better yet an astral projection method (voluntary AP still eludes me for now), so I�m not sure what to make of it all.

Doubtful that I was really �there�, I decided to try �entering� one of the big white hangar buildings, and right as I got to it, I met �them� again. But this time it was disarmingly different.

No aliens, I was �talking� to the �guys� themselves, and the exchange was so rapid and candid that I was sure it was all just my imagination (which most likely all this really is, anyway). I was firing off questions at them in rapid succession, like a data transfer -- it was very fast, and I was getting answers. Hence my skepticism.

They were five in number, and they normally keep that many on duty at all times. They �link� their consciences when on duty, and operate as a sort of group mind, each an individual, but part of a team that is greater than the sum of its parts. I somehow caught them unawares, and they seemed thrown off guard by this. Something had disrupted their link, and I got in as they were regrouping. They seemed embarrassed!

I was firing off questions at them so fast that I had to tell myself to �hold up� several times. I wasn�t sure this was happening, it was very weird. It seemed like many of my questions would be involuntarily answered by one of them, just naturally, bam. Others would seem to trigger some sort of �group mind� confusion, like they would mentally look at each other and hem and haw or something -- very odd -- and no answer would come.

Questions that would get that weird �ummmm� response were things like: What are you guarding? Do you have aliens there? Who do you work for? In other words, questions for which they would most likely have been prepared.

Questions I would get answers to were things like: Officers or enlisted? (enlisted, sergeant first class leading team) Male or female? (all males, no females in detachment) Natural or trained? (both. Selected and trained) Are there others like you on other bases? (yes, there is a command) And so on.

These answers seemed to come from one of the guys -- not the same one each time -- and at one point, when I thought �are they really answering me?� one of them said �dude, you so busted us!� They all seemed very young. Strangely, they all seemed to think the exchange was very humorous, and didn�t seem to view me as much of a threat.

There were many questions, they streamed from me at a ridiculous rate, and I don�t remember them all. Many of them hit that strange �group blank� response, and the ones that got an answer gave me answers that sounded almost like someone �heckling� from an audience. The exchange was reminiscent of a tennis match, with me serving balls at a rapid rate and them sending some back or letting them go.

I am not sure what to make of it all. Did I �catch them with their pants down�? Or was this just a different technique for keeping me out? Or was this all just my fertile imagination again? They seemed pretty amused for soldiers who had �dropped their guard�. Most significantly: I didn�t �get in� to Area 51. Again.

I think they were toying with me, and I am left with the distinct impression that they know more about me than I know about them. This is conjecture, but it felt like I had somehow linked to them, and for a short time, was part of their �circle� somehow. And they knocked me around for a bit like frat boys before showing me the door.

Of course, all this is probably just a flight of my imagination rather than a bona fide �exchange�. But it can be hard for me to know. Thus I include these things here in the hope that someone might be able to pick fact from fiction.

As For Al Qaeda

This business of jinns and mejis is intriguing. I have heard of jinns, but am somewhat ignorant of Islamic mythology. My gut sense is that perhaps it is best that I remain that way, and reduce the powers of suggestion that these persons and/or beings (is there really a difference, in the end?) they might have over me.

In other words, I don�t want to be scared away by tales of their powers. In this case, ignorance may well be a blessing. Or I could be terribly mistaken. Regardless, I don�t wish to discourage anyone from posting what they know (or suspect or may have heard) about Al Qaeda and their methods, because I imagine at some point that this information will prove useful.

I wanted to decide last night if I wished to continue attempting to probe Al Qaeda, and thus made no further attempts to visualize them. After days of clouds and storms, today the sun shines brightly, and it seems a good day to recharge.

Thanks to all contributors to this thread. Regardless of where it this all may end up, I already find the topic more fascinating than when I first posted on it. Who knows where this rabbit hole will lead?

Majic, I was fascinated by your last post. As you say, everything in the following post is unverifiable, and may be total hogwash for the next person.

Did it really happen? All you can say is "It happened to me!" Speaking for myself, I think you did interact with SOMETHING, more than just imagination. I say that only because the thought processes you describe sound familiar.

You getting info out of them is believeable, and fits in with what I have been told about RV. It is supposedly a lot easier to get truthful thoughts from people, because they first think of the truth, before they try to construct a falsehood.

Trying NOT to give up information is kind of like trying to avoid thinking about something. It sounds like the other had prepared answers, but only for initial questions. Like you were supposed to be so shocked at finding them that it'd cause you to run. Dare I say that if you asked creative questions, they didn't always have prepared lies to hand you, and instinctively thought of the truth instead.

If you were in a hypnogogic state, then maybe someone else was, too. That is the state of semi-consciousness that truth serums try to create in a person.

As far as foiling people prying on YOUR privacy, I think it works the same way. If you have a "prepared image," then that is what the other will see when seeking you. It needs the strength of conviction in order to have much reality to the viewer. Obviously religious conviction is the most powerful, especially when it is repeated.

Tibetan Buddhism uses "prayer wheels" with a prayer written on a wheel or windmill that turns and is repeated that way. Another method is a flag, that is thought to repeat every time it whips in the wind. It is not that the wheel is a psychic being in its own right, but that the person who sets it in motion subconsciously knows the prayer is going through one more iteration with every repeated motion.

If that idea seems silly to Jews or Christians, consider how quickly a Christian can say the Lord's Prayer, or Jew can say Kiddush, or a Muslim can say the Declaration, almost without using their conscious mind. A praying person can tell you about the experience of their lips finishing the words before their mind actually "thinks through" the whole prayer.

Protecting your person or environment could make use of a similar discipline. Native Americans traditionally made 'dreamcatchers' which have become quite popular, and one can imagine that they might negatively affect the ability of an intruder to RV a certain place. I suspect that you'd need to make your own, rather than simply purchasing one created by someone else. It is the mental effort of constructing it that provides the conviction of its efficacy.



[edit on 17-8-2004 by dr_strangecraft]

Well, one thing I suppose I should get over is worrying about how much, if any, of this whole business is �true�. Whether it is or not, it is fascinating as hell to me, and who knows? As more than one psychologist can tell you, we create our own realities anyway.

So I�ll leave the disclaimers up, but -- without necessarily abandoning skepticism, which is dear to me -- I�ll just try to �go with it� and see what shakes out.

As for the use of symbols as a form of cover, that seems like an almost universal way to go. Your observations about this method in different cultures and systems of belief seem dead-on. We invoke symbols for power and protection, and they represent, in themselves, a foundation for ordered thought.

In refining a means for �jamming� or protecting oneself from unwanted visitors, it seems that the choice of symbols should, for optimum effect, be meaningful to both the defendant and would-be intruder.

I have always found the image of holding up a cross to ward off a �Jewish vampire� highly amusing. �What? Are you kidding me? Blah!� If the symbol has no meaning to the intruder, it will probably not be as effective as a consequence.

However, simply focusing will through a symbol may still be enough. Even if the symbol has no meaning to the intruder, the concentration of will, and its intent, may be enough to ward it off.

I already have an eclectic range of symbols around me. I think I will increase the collection with an eye toward things that would not obviously relate to me as a person.

Also, I have found it seemingly wise not to leave mail or other items with my address or personal information lying around in plain sight. Silly, perhaps, but probably more prudent than paranoid if I am truly allowing for the possibility of psychic visitors attempting to identify me. If I suspect a �presence�, I plan not to look into mirrors, either, just in case. (Geez, quirky or paranoid? You decide).

My favorite symbol at the moment is my sickeningly cute anime avatar, whose name happens to be �Majic�. I had never heard of the little guy before, until one day I was searching for theme art for my handle (�Majic� being a cryptonym for �Operation Majestic�) and he popped up. Turns out there�s a character named �Majic� who is an apprentice of a magician in an anime called �Orphen�. Majic is the �sorcerer�s apprentice�. The original comic series was titled �Sorcerous Stabber Orphen� which I find hilarious.

The depth of coincidence or perhaps �kizmet� between myself and this character is so tremendous that I think I�ll adopt the little rascal as my �totem� for a while. I�m not really a fan of anime, although I always enjoyed watching �Speed Racer� back in the day (the way the characters say �Ho!� when startled is priceless). Now, however, I�ve ordered to �Orphen� boxed set just to see what this is all about. Should be amusing.

Anyway, it�s a beautiful blue-sky day, so it seems wise for me to head out and play and recharge my batteries. Until later�

TextMajic

I don't think Al Qaeda have spiritual protectors. I believe most people can be viewed. Photos can help connect. If someone would publish suspected Al Qaeda members photos it would be helpful..........You may be correct with your viewing of Bin Laden. I also tried viewing months back. I also saw a remote area...but there was a farm...crops. But I find your results interesting and similar ...we may have viewed the same area. Going to a place where a subject was, or possesing an object, are two others ways to connect.

Some might say this thread is out of date because of some of the subject, but I think the topic is worth discussion. Do terrorists have spiritual protectors. I say - YES. Evil spirit protectors. I have no doubt about it. The evil spirits delight in when people do evil .. and since the terrorists are doing evil, the evil spirits will try to help them out as much as possible. And I think that includes blocking remote viewers from seeing what is going on as well.

a reply to: FlyersFan

come on stop digging up threads that never went anywhere..

originally posted by: amraks
come on stop digging up threads that never went anywhere..

come on stop posting off topic remarks in threads that are just fine.
No comment on bad guys having spiritual protection? Then go away.

a reply to: FlyersFan

No doubt about it.
I've been blocked / halted during visualization by the wall before.
(Sometimes it's white, sometimes it looks like it's made of iron, like a thick vault door.) I know exactly what Majic is talking about.
Not just when trying to read someone,but also sometimes when doing Tarot card readings for someone. That's a sign for me to stop digging further.
"Access denied" so to speak.

I've had this happen to people I would consider very good in nature,but I also secretly snooped around really nasty people. I think demons are investing a lot in them ( Perhaps there was a deal made?),hence the extra protection for them.

So I'd say for all people who RV or visualize/read other people to just slowly and carefully walk away, if they meet the "wall". And always protect your home and yourself from negative energy/beings.

I haven't formed a solid opinion one way or the other on remote viewing. I'm cautious and skeptical, but I haven't really spent any time looking into it so I don't feel qualified to speak about it.

As to whether "bad" people have spiritual protectors? I think that I object to the term "protectors," but only because for me that would involve these spirits operating in the best interest of said bad guys and I don't believe, being evil, these spirits would be bound by that.

However, do I think there are evil spirits that might, in some fashion and for a time, facilitate the actions and agendas of a group or a person if those actions and agendas served the cause or maybe even just appealed to the nature of the evil spirit? Sure.

Having read Rainbow's explanation and gotten a better sense of the way "protection" is being used here in the context of remote viewing, you can just disregard my objection to the term "protection".

It's not only terror groups but all level of human activity which attract the attention and derive 'power' from 'Dark' entities...
Blood Lust is one particular type of Evil Activity which attracts those dark-demons

the Bankers attract another kind of dark Spirit force... different from Terror per se... but equally as destructive


We are told in the Book Of Daniel about one of those Dark Princes (the Prince of Persia) who might be lending some support to human 'Terrorists' of today...but is not the sole sponsor of death-destruction-chaos of the various Terror groups or governments in the geo-political landscape of the 21st Century

All religions and All the major, world stage players.... are being coaxed or prodded by Dark Spirits... discernment is needed to 'see' that the USA is no longer the Hope-of-the-World as it once was...

China & Russia are seemingly 2 steps away from being the same corrupt, fraud ridden state as the USA/NATO military & financial Beast Empire is now..


Zion-Islam-Vatican-NATO- 'The West'- 'The East'- Europe-Central Asia-Middle East are all destined to enter into one Hellacious War in the very near future ==> As Peace is removed from the Planet
(soon after the 2nd Blood Moon of 2014)


Men are not really 'led astray'... Menkind 'Submit' to the Dark Spirits & allow those sinister forces to rule & lead them

According to the scriptures there is a war between spirits:

"But the prince of the Persian kingdom resisted me twenty-one days. Then Michael, one of the chief princes, came to help me, because I was detained there with the king of Persia...'Do you know why I have come to you? Soon I will return to fight against the prince of Persia, and when I go, the prince of Greece will come'" -Dan. 10:13,20

"We know that we are children of God, and that the whole world is under the control of the evil one." -1 John 5:19

"Again, the devil took him to a very high mountain and showed him all the kingdoms of the world and their splendor. 'All this I will give you,' he said, 'if you will bow down and worship me.'" -Matthew 4:8,9

Daniel made it seem that the spirits take part in maneuvering groups and called them the princes of different groups that were in a conflict with the side that Michael the prince that defended the Jews was a representative of. Later, the evil one who controls this world offered the kingdoms of the world to Jesus, the savior of the Jewish people and one who earned the right to be king over the world who is in conflict with those other spirits. It is the Christian belief that there are spirits who are at war with God and his angels as shown at Revelation 12:7, 9 "Then war broke out in heaven. Michael and his angels fought against the dragon, and the dragon and his angels fought back...The great dragon was hurled down—that ancient serpent called the devil, or Satan, who leads the whole world astray. He was hurled to the earth, and his angels with him." The Christian belief is that when the war is over Jesus will rule as king, but until then those evil spirits are still fighting for control.

As a Christian, it wouldn't surprise me one bit if evil spirits were protecting evil groups.