30 Round mags not enough? cant make up your mind 5.56 or 7.62 ? then you need a MGI Hydra!

reply to post by macman


Guns like that are not 'fun toys', they are an immensely powerful weapon for killing people.
I think i understand now why there are so many people in america obsessed with gun control

Originally posted by Dionisius
reply to post by macman

 

Guns like that are not 'fun toys', they are an immensely powerful weapon for killing people.
I think i understand now why there are so many people in america obsessed with gun control

I stand by my initial comment.

If you don't like it, then go play with something else.

I really thought that the Anti crowd would stink the thread up earlier, but it was coming.

Take your crap to another thread, or maybe the toilet.

Originally posted by Dionisius
reply to post by macman

 

Guns like that are not 'fun toys', they are an immensely powerful weapon for killing people.
I think i understand now why there are so many people in america obsessed with gun control

Since this is your first post I'm here to help you out - this is the Weapons and Tactics forum. This is what it is and isn't in the words of the person who created it.

Originally posted by projectvxn...
This is NOT a political or social issues forum. Your stance on gun control and war, for or against, is NOT what this forum is for.

PLEASE respect these very basic tenets of the Weapons and Tactics forum and respect the Terms and Conditions of Use. This forum is for the exploration of past, present, and future weapons of any kind. Please do NOT take a loose interpretation of weapons and tactics. Weapons are augmentations of human abilities in order to defend from and/or destroy/incapacitate people, animals, places and things. Tactics refers to the employment of strategies, scenarios, and how to incorporate certain weapons into such strategies and scenarios. It is very much a STUDY forum. Please do NOT take a loose interpretation of Tactics either. If you want to discuss sit-ins, protests, and other civil disobedience tactics do so in one of the links provided above.

If you go here to the original www.abovetopsecret.com... link for the Weapon and Tactics Thread rules you will see there are plenty of places to go to discuss gun control.

This; however, is not the place. This is where the issues of the tech and tactics of guns and their use are discussed by presumably people who like to keep and use them.

Cheers and welcome to ATS.

reply to post by Golf66


the The M249 (SAW) while introduced back in 1984 dint become a production gun until 1989...

the current laws concerning full weapons prohibits owning a machine gun produced after 1986... meaning all the legal machine guns you can by... have to be made before that 1986 cut off date... so the SAW is was and never will be for sale to the civilian market...

besides who among us can afford to shoot that much ammo at once???

Originally posted by Dionisius
reply to post by macman

 

Guns like that are not 'fun toys', they are an immensely powerful weapon for killing people.
I think i understand now why there are so many people in america obsessed with gun control

Having thought long about this. You are right. This rifle is not a toy, but just a killing machine.

Now, this is a toy I would love to play with!!
[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/09f666c15938.jpg[/atsimg]

Originally posted by DaddyBare
reply to post by Golf66

 

the The M249 (SAW) while introduced back in 1984 dint become a production gun until 1989...

the current laws concerning full weapons prohibits owning a machine gun produced after 1986... meaning all the legal machine guns you can by... have to be made before that 1986 cut off date... so the SAW is was and never will be for sale to the civilian market...

besides who among us can afford to shoot that much ammo at once???

Cool, thanks for the info - I have never really looked that hard at buying full auto weapons to be honest.

Having a background in SF - I think full auto is very over rated all around unless you are part of a large maneuver element (like a platoon maneuvering squads over a large area) that needs heavy suppression over a wide area.
We never really used it except for a few ambushes in which the initial volume of fire was necessary. Again, though I think with some good operators you could achieve better or equal results with any main battle rifle on semi with a sustained rate of accurate fire.

Besides, like you said, I can barely afford to shoot the M14 I have as much as I'd like to with the cost of ammo.

Who could afford enough ammo to remain proficient with that rate of fire.

I fire the heck out of the AK I have because it’s very cheap to do.

My dad baught the full auto conversion kit for it but I haven't put it on. Don't see the need and don't have the required licence myself. I guess I could if I felt it necessary; I supose situationaly would come in handy if SHTF for room clearing or something.

reply to post by Golf66


Nah, full auto is highly over-rated. I can see the application useful for a mounted or stationary position. it is very hard to control.
Even the 3 round burst of the MP5 has muzzle climb to the point that we were taught to aim first for the lower chest and allow the climb to place 3 shots in a vertical string up towards the throat.

A good shotgun is great for room clearing, second is a short AR.

reply to post by Golf66


ya know

there is one full auto I have been tempted to get... one I could maybe afford to shoot every once in a while...
youtu.be...

Seems to me the interchangeability of platforms is very over rated.

How many of us have the evil black gun at home? Likely 90%+ of us who frequent the weapons forum have at least one.

Given all the calibers that the standard 5.56 lower will accommodate with a simple upper swap how many of us are swapping out uppers with any regularity? How many of us even own more than one alternate caliber upper? If we did how many of us would just plop down the extra $150 for a dedicated lower for that alternate caliber upper just so we could have one more gun in the collection?

Even in military or police actions why wouldnt you just want that second gun in somebodys hand rather than have detached gun parts being lugged around?

It sounds nice and all but the way I figure it the real world necessity or usefulness of such modularity is pretty much nil.

reply to post by thisguyrighthere


it was the price that did me in... almost 5 grand...whatever their smoking I want some too...

Look I still buy and trade in weapons... just picked up a nice Rock River Arms 15 with red dot reflex scope, laser and tactical flashlight and four mags for just under 1 grand....

so when you look at it that way I can buy 5 rock arms or one MGI???
5 rock arms I know I can resell or one MGI I might not ever get rid of.... Hmm let me think???

reply to post by thisguyrighthere

The interchangeability I think is not with the quick reaction scenario, but for the Armory application. One receiver, one platform dual calibers for mission specific roles.

reply to post by TheLoneArcher

I have heard nothing but good things about the FN FAL/L1 SLR!

In fact many of my British Army friends are adamant that the SA-80 is very much a step back, while it's been improved over the years it does not come close to the SLR.

reply to post by Golf66


I appreciate your sentiment and fully respect what this thread is for, but not the fact you guys are talking about them as if they are fun toys to play around with

reply to post by macman


Halfway there mate, suppose i cant ask for much more

Originally posted by Dionisius
reply to post by Golf66

 

I appreciate your sentiment and fully respect what this thread is for, but not the fact you guys are talking about them as if they are fun toys to play around with

Shooting sports are fun. IDPA is fun. Skeet is fun. 3-gun is fun. Just plinking at plates is fun.

Fun doesnt mean reckless. As reckless is often not fun at all with all of the stress that is involved.

Some people really think driving is fun. Does that mean cars are to be treated with reckless abandon flying down sidewalks, into buildings and over pedestrians?

Shooting is fun.

reply to post by thisguyrighthere


I think your missing my point, of course i can understand shooting is fun, i have a bb gun myself and have enjoyed shooting a lot of high powered air rifles with night vision scopes etc. but i got past looking at guns as 'toys' when i was about 15. Understand my point?

Originally posted by macmanEven the 3 round burst of the MP5 has muzzle climb to the point that we were taught to aim first for the lower chest and allow the climb to place 3 shots in a vertical string up towards the throat.

I have carried the MP5 in combat as an SF Team Leader it’s a good weapon for the role since I hardly ever shot at anyone anyways - more for my personal protection than anything else. Usually I was on the radio or coordinating things on the objective.

With a silencer on and the subsonic ammo the muzzle climb is much better. I miss ordering guns and ammo on the government dime!

My favorite was the SOCOM M1A I carried it as my every day all purpose weapon.

Originally posted by macmanA good shotgun is great for room clearing, second is a short AR.

Agreed a good shotty is the best for CQB IMO. We had an A12 at one point but I found it kind of big for inside. I didn't get to fire it but once at the range - my operators did most of the shooting.

Always some friggin briefing due or a video conference to attend or some awards or orders to write - their range time was my office time for the most part.

This is not a weapon I would choose as a primary any time soon. As far as hunting/survivalist weapons go I'll stick with the time-tested and proven platforms with lots of spare parts lying around. That's not to say this weapon is crap, hell, without an in-depth look it looks like it takes some fairly common AR parts.

I do like the fact that you can throw this into the bi-monthly "if you could only have ONE gun when the SHTF..." threads. If you are talking pure survivalist/post-apocalyptic scenarios, why not have a platform that you can interchange parts to suit any ammo you come across?

Call me old school, there's still no more beast of a portable MG platform than the king pig himself, Mr. 60. The E4's were in fairly heavy use with various units and detachments up to the point I discharged. Nothing like the sound of a 60 spitting 7.62 downrange.

reply to post by Golf66


See you guys are lucky... I never got to mess mess around with the small special weapons...
but on the other hand lots of folks would kill for the chance to play with toys I did have...
[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/8b8ec7f3c859.gif[/atsimg]

Originally posted by Dionisius
reply to post by Golf66

 

I appreciate your sentiment and fully respect what this thread is for, but not the fact you guys are talking about them as if they are fun toys to play around with

They are fun. Maybe you have never been introduced to the shooting sports.

Make your way across the pond and hit any of us. I would love to take you out shooting. You actually might enjoy yourself a bit.