Anders Behring Breivik, the Norway killer

I'm catching up on reading this thread, thank you for your observations. It's good to see somebody still following this story.

Originally posted by Aeons
They are of course concerned about him getting a podium. Do you think that if he were as crazed as Loughner, that they would be concerned about how he might come off to people? I doubt it.

So apparently he isn't a drooling crazy smile wide-eyed wierdo. Then he'd probably be allowed to have as much TV time as he could possbly soak up before they had to escort him out.

I must agree with this. After reading his document in its entirity (and summarizing it for ATS), I do not believe him to be "insane" in any traditional senss of the word. He is probably a sociopath/psychopath, and I find the decision to kill children abhorant and hard to justify with any coherant political philosophy, although he attempts to. Clearly his thinking is extreme -- very extreme -- and shows signs of instability ...but is this per se evidence of insanity in the sense that Loughner is clearly insane? I don't think so.

We have an interesting interpaly here. The politically correct system is so rotten that it cannot stand the heat of public scrutiny that a Brievik trial would bring. So they gag him with the "insanity" label...just like the Soviets used to do with dissidents. (It's interesting to me that the left always tries to pathologize its opponents when they fear rational argument). On the other hand, Brievik himself is hardly a hero...I would say he damaged his ideological goals badly by killing children.

There is nobody to admire in this situation. I condemn all parties, both Brievik and the Norwegan state.

reply to post by jaamaan


please pause the video at 1:05 and tell me what is floating on his head?

ty RT.

baka.

P.S. Great thread S.F.

reply to post by Aeons


my favorite thing about this thread all in 2 lines.
keep on truckin.

"If found guilty on terrorism charges he faces 21 years in prison.

Breivik has admitted killing 77 people last month, including eight in a bombing in central Oslo."



Read more: www.dailymail.co.uk...
baka.

are we sure his plan is not working?

edit on 28-12-2011 by bakadesu because: oops..... baka!

reply to post by bakadesu


His plan is working, it just isn't working exactly in the way that he most hoped it would. Which doesn't matter, because he's effectively planted the idea, and his time line parses so it might yet.

"The reasonable man adapts himself to the conditions that surround him... The unreasonable man adapts surrounding conditions to himself... All progress depends on the unreasonable man."-George Bernard Shaw

Every time something he says gets out, he's resetting parameters. With intent.



example of it working, though you have to be pretty insane to keep going after the people your new leader called "Martyrs." Motivated the wrong crowd - the insanely stupid. However, the insanely stupid are a good barometer for resonance of a narrative.
www.vg.no...

Originally posted by bakadesu
reply to post by jaamaan

 

please pause the video at 1:05 and tell me what is floating on his head?

ty RT.

baka.

P.S. Great thread S.F.

The fixture's anchor to the boat is less obvious because it is white and the shirt of the man behind it is also white.

www.dagbladet.no...

A sim card belonging to a Swedish mother of two was found in a PC during the searching process of the farm as Anders Breivik Behring had rented at Asta.

It is INEXPLICABLE.

Unless of course you realize that he explained he's been buying mobile phones that are not attached to him for several years.

www.dagbladet.no...

About the untested alarm system.

Picture of the blast area under the building. Much more interesting. It did this while falling through the damn ground. Damn.

Blast chambers at the foot of newly constructed government buildings. Get on it. If you can retrofit it might be worth the effort.

www.dagbladet.no...

The Russian nationalist leader Dmitry Demusjkin claimed to Danish Extra magazine in August that Anders Behring Breivik was in contact with Datsik and other Nazis from the Slavic Union.

Look at this beast. Who wants a beast like this being their face? Talk about a face only a Mother could love.

The taste of Russia is all over Anders Behring, so I'm not surprised. It's my opinion his extremist links stem out of Russia and Denmark primarily, and whatever/whoever he's been using to get into the training camps is probably out of Russia or a former Soviet State.

I expect he's been intentionally progressively trading up to move from one group to find the link in each one to the next more extreme group. It is one of the things that he didn't put into 2083. He assumes that because he can do it, anyone can. This isn't so, and when they do most of them don't know how not to get caught up in it or how not to invoke the pack's to want to keep you when you're ready to leave.

bioprepwatch.com...

In the United Kingdom, the Channel Project was set up to identify and dissuade at-risk individuals from continuing down a dangerous path. In France, individuals are arrested and prosecuted on the basis of being involved in terrorist plotting and no distinction is made as to whether they are acting alone or not. The United States has taken the approach to identify individuals, often through online activity, and to send covert agents in to identify what the individual might be planning. The undercover agents will then assist the individual in order to establish documented actions that can be used in court.

The only thing that never occurs to them - give these people a place to land. Why counter them, when you can get them to work for you?

Seriously, I can't be the first person to have thought of it.

Letting everything sit in dark corners because it is tough to talk about is clearly the answer. As all the Western nations have been ramping up that behaviour, this behaviour has been increasing with it. There can't be a correlation.

You sure wouldn't want to address things with facts and honesty. That way lies the madness of ... not being on control of the message. Which is far more important.

www.europe1.fr...

dredging up the Fundie Christian, belonged to a political party rhetoric again.

Shocking.

They consistenly fail on this, because they can't help but use it for politics even though this is exactly the wrong tactic. Doesn't matter. They can't help themselves. There are actually real things that he can be attacked on that would work with all sides....but they aren't nearly so much fun.

And yes, they do it because it is fun. It is the dirty little secret that no one admits to themselves.

All in the spirit of "openness" and "tolerance." Or tradition and whatever. They don't do the right things because, they really don't want to. As a somewhat serious true believer, It took me decades to figure this out.

There are several journals starting to come out with their top ten news / crime / newsmakers that sort of thing, and Anders Behring is starting to show up on them.

reply to post by Aeons


www.vg.no...

The caller allegedly said, "Behring, Behring, Behring," before he hung up.

I thought I should point out that I am quite certain that I am the only person on the net who is regularly referring to Anders as Anders Behring. It is somewhat likely that this individual is a reader here.

www.ohtuleht.ee...

However, police managed to track down one of telefoniahistajale. However, it is possible that such offenders may be several.

telefoniahistajale - don't know exactly what this word is but context seems clear enough.

I'd check out the insane dude on Youtube if he's local - which he looks as if he could be and whom seems to think he's funny.

If the Templars were supposed to be stupid drolling bullies who are off their meds, so far so good.

www.brusselsjournal.com...

Ah, legitimate political commentary.

Victory, in the face of the greatest danger ever seen by the West, Churchill foresaw, would require all parties and their members to voluntarily and consistently adhere to one new common “Ideology” and one new common “Principle” alone. Peter Carl sees here in Britain’s grim situation and Churchill’s ingenious actions clear reference points and requirements if the West is ever to succeed at both turning back Islamization and preventing the rise of truly fascist individuals such as Anders Behring Breivik.

In today's lesson, let's discuss some neuroscience!

Why does being aggressive, violent and demanding work, even if one wants to pretend that it doesn't?

This will perhaps explain what he's doing, and why it is a useful behaviour, and why releasing his statements does have impact. It may also give some insight into why releasing his statements and demands, while using the passport photo is a fantastic idea - for him.

First up, let us discuss the use of dopamine and testosterone and the fully functioning hormone system of an alpha male. I understand some will want to bicker this point, please realize you are doing so based on how you wish things were not how they are. There are ways to move an individual out of this position - the one society is going to use in this case is pharmacology directed at dopamine.

While testosterone is generally associated with maleness and is certainly very important in body/mind system of a male, impacting aggression, status, and dominance behaviours it isn't the most important aspect of the alpha male's brain chemistry - dopamine is. Dopamine drives the motivation force, and the sense of saiety. Self-satisfaction, drive, etc.

The passport photo, unlike the doctored photos, show clear indications of a fully functioning hormone system. These physical clues are not as obvious in the doctored photos. In the other photos out currently, his hormone system is in shut down or just booting back up from coming off the steroid stack.

In primates, and humans are a primate, the tribe is known to engage in affliative behaviours with dominant males, favoured females, (this works the opposite way too, but as far as I can tell isn't studied perhaps due to bias or small sample size), and PREVIOUSLY aggressive individuals.

This is likely a very important point here. The person isn't currently aggressive. They have been previously aggressive.

An individual's brain mechanics, their Superior temporal gyrus - STS - kicks off the process of evaluating the intentions of the previously aggressive individual and the opiate system drives the need to engage in affliative behaviours.

Opiate system. We all have heard of drug opiates, like heroin, oxycodone, and morphine to name a few. Well the human body gives off an opiate antagonist - it deprives you of natural opiates. This in turn causes an increase in affliative behaviours. Your brain deprives you of your drugs to make you play nicely with others.

The parts of the brain involved in the opiate system - and are therefore being deprived of opiates to drive affliative behaviour - are the amygdala, the periamygdala cortex (smell) and the sensory neocortical areas.

The amygdala processes memory and emotional reactions and are part of your limbic system (loop back up to dopamine here which is also driven by your limbic system). The smell part we can probably skip here, though I find it personally interesting. The sensory neocortex is a pretty complex area, which in the case of affliative behaviour in the complex human is likely co-opted in this process to drive your cognition of the patterns of social-political behaviours as part of a internal map of human interaction.

When you affliate with a dominant, a favoured of the dominant, or a previously aggressive individual you are rewarded by your limbic system for doing so. In the case of humans, being presented with specific pattern information about how to do so, it likely changes their internal map of society.

Resetting parameters.

security.blogs.cnn.com...

Another concern is the growing ease with which individuals can assemble increasingly complex bombs and then plan attacks. Anders Behring Breivik is an example of this perfect storm coming together, and in the wake of his attack police forces and security services globally have revisited the potential threat from such lone wolf terrorists.

Radical and militant ideas continue to hold sway among a small minority; and deranged individuals are an age-old part of society.

Understanding the distinction between the two is important – both to help prevent attacks by individuals and to try to minimize the damage they can do to our societies.

Lone Wolf is moving to Lone Attacker.

nyhederne.tv2.dk...:breivik-brugte-svensk-mors-simkort.html?forside

Meanwhile, in Denmark they have started using a new photo.

Friends in Denmark/Sweden - never leave them with a picture of you after a bad night of gaming all night.

More controlling of dietary intake evidence in this picture. Seems to go in cycles.

Thank you for the picture of the bookshelf. It is about what I was expecting.

svt.se...
Video in Sweden - I can't access it.

www.scancomark.se...

More on the interviews with Dad, Dad and Mom. Narcissist, Jerk, Passive Aggressive Histrionic/self-centered. What a great combination.

nyhederne.tv2.dk...:breivik-bes%C3%B8gte-krigsh%C3%A6rget-land.html

Police in Norway confirms that Anders Breivik Behring in 2002 visited the African country of Liberia, who was then in the middle of a civil war.

According to Breivik manifesto, he has also been at training camp for right-wing extremists in Belarus. Police confirm that he also visited Belarus.
Account in tax haven
Further he writes that he transferred money to an account he had fiscal paradise Antiqua, an island in the Caribbean.
Also this information is true, says police are now working to identify the account.

So the original orgy of he's lying turns out that... he wasn't? He shines the apple, doesn't mean the apple doesn't exist.

Books on history, and details about local history, culture, battles, and structural design. This picture is from 2002?

No detail too big or too small.

Wouldn't this suggest that it is unlikely that all his influences came from the evil counter-jihad groups? The ones that didn't exist in 2002, when he was clearly already educating himself on his interest in culture and history?

Already had these ideas based on his own assessment without the evils of the right-wing Interwebz.

That's way more concerning isn't it? Not people being influenced by anything other than raw information.

Originally posted by Aeons
nyhederne.tv2.dk...:breivik-brugte-svensk-mors-simkort.html?forside

Meanwhile, in Denmark they have started using a new photo.

Friends in Denmark/Sweden - never leave them with a picture of you after a bad night of gaming all night.

More controlling of dietary intake evidence in this picture. Seems to go in cycles.

It could be a photo taken after a party where they play the music he likes.
I have seen many people looking like that after attending one of those parties

This could explain the "dietary intake" to.

Originally posted by jaamaan

Originally posted by Aeons
nyhederne.tv2.dk...:breivik-brugte-svensk-mors-simkort.html?forside

Meanwhile, in Denmark they have started using a new photo.

Friends in Denmark/Sweden - never leave them with a picture of you after a bad night of gaming all night.

More controlling of dietary intake evidence in this picture. Seems to go in cycles.

It could be a photo taken after a party where they play the music he likes.
I have seen many people looking like that after attending one of those parties

This could explain the "dietary intake" to.

Raver/Clubber. Yeah, entirely possible. Usually you look worse, and but you feel much better.

This is why I assumed gaming all night. A dusk-to-dawn party and all its craziness (man I miss that) usually leaves you with a good high. Maybe though, this is bad down.

The Right-Wing Blogosphere is in a tissy about their want for him to be a Narcissist again. My points still stand. He is missing core traits for a narcissist, and many aspects of 2083 do not fit this diagnosis. They should probably roll back to he's a psychopath without any modifiers.

They and others are also suffering from a monitor centered view - if it doesn't have web-presence it doesn't exist.

www.ba.no...

The experts describe this as "grandiose delusions".

Police have now for five months together with international police in several countries investigated the allegations. Police have not uncovered anything to suggest that such an organization exists. Police have not found anything that indicates that the meeting in London took place. Police have not found traces of other cells, and the police have found evidence suggesting that Breivik's "cell" was "activated" by others.

Ever occur to anyone that the vast network doesn't exist, that he was hoping to harness what is there? But that the original does, they simply couldn't have accounted for one of them being so serious and capable? This probably blew their fracking minds too. Anyway, I'll stop pushing on this one. The effect he was looking for is in motion, even if the police/media don't want to feed it by acknowledging it. No human group exists.... until it does. Their perspective has boundaries of retrospective views of minutia.

www.tnp.no...

The 39-year-old man who chatted with Breivik in a discussion forum on the internet in 2005 said that Breivik told him that he went to Africa to buy blood diamonds. There he was threatened with death.

Several of Breivik's close friends also explained that the Breivik told them about the illegal diamond trade and travel to Liberia. The Norwegian Police had previously confirmed Anders Breivik visited a Serbian 'crusader commander' in Monrovia, Liberia. There he reportedly joined the Knights Templar, who 'are planning attacks in Europe'. Police is still investigating the track, but facing challenges in getting information from the authorities in Liberia.

In his manifesto, Breivik mentions Liberia trip. But he claims that the trip was a cover story to hide the trip's real purpose, namely a meeting with a Serb whom Breivik describes as a great war hero who should have killed many Muslims in the battle.

I would guess that all of this is true, including his stated reason for going. He did go primarily to train, he did use the blood diamonds story as a cover, and the death threat as a reason why he returned with none. He may have even tried to see if he could get into the blood diamonds business - this would have allowed him to fund his campaign without resorting to turning himself into Loki.

www.vg.no...

Requirements List 2: * PST manager Janne Kristiansen need to Justice Committee proposing the introduction of the death penalty in Norway by hanging, and that "waterboarding" entered as a torture method.

The mass murderer was immediately notified that the claim was unrealistic. Just Psychiatry Torgeir Husby and Synne Sørheim points out in his declaration that the immediate interrogation of Utøya provides information about Breivik's mental state during actions on Utøya.

No it doesn't. He had all those demands worked out in advance. In most societies without the death penalty, his atrocity would kick off a new debate about its function in justice. It sure would here.

Secondly - he hates himself for what he's done even if he's okay with himself for it. Parallel processes. Hated it before hand, so expecting and wanting to be punished for it is both emotionally and intellectually inline with his ideological views. It is an indication of internal integrity to a core ideology.

The argument "how would you want to be treated" is clearly answered - "I'd expect you to hurt and kill me. I sure would." Unequivocal.

This is one of those things where he has positioned himself in the spot of maximum cultural dissonance. The psychiatrists see it as internal dissonance. The strategic thinking aspect of this as a social-political push is not taken into account, but it surely factors in his plans. Ever detail is to push his agenda. These details, they aren't unaccounted for.

www.scribd.com...

Mentioned in this Anti-Muslim round up as a bit of sensationalism for added effect. More of that "fun" factor - little substance but lots of impact. They know it isn't right, but they do it anyways. Integrity is not most people's strong point.

One day, I'll find people who actually have something to say about the ideas presented other than to round them up and point at them in horror. Now they can point to them in extra horror.

Much like the Norwegian PM's comments referencing Anders atrocious acts - He wants people to confront these bad ideas.

It isn't enough to just tell people they are wrong, there has to be reasons why they are wrong. It is generations of people given training from birth on critical thinking - some of it actually took. Worse, high-functioning sociopaths and autistics can do math and hold lots of information without being led astray by appeals to the heart. You sure you want people finding truth and facts only in their mouths? I'd really think hard on that.

www.vg.no...

Aid lawyers are demanding a new psychological report, and the final decisions on it are due in a couple of weeks.

What do you think about the need to bring in experts from abroad? - Out of that there is a small academic community in Norway, I think it would be nice for assessing experts from abroad, he says.

That I leave to the court, he said. - Norwegian research groups are narrow Sigurd Klomsæt is clear that he thinks it only right is to go abroad to get a new forensic psychiatric assessment. - I am very skeptical of the report. We have seen in many contexts, that the Norwegian communities are too narrow and self-centered, says Klomsæt, who is counsel for one Utøya-survivors.

Didn't Anders ask for foreign experts at the beginning?

Breivik want Japanese Defense Geir Lippe City have repeatedly expressed that he is satisfied with the just-appointed psychiatrists Synne Sørheim and Torgeir Husby, who this fall concluded that Breivik is criminally insane, on the basis of a total of 13 conversations they had with him in prison. The terror accused is willing to be examined by the foreign law psychiatrists. Behring Breivik has said that he wants the Japanese right psychiatrists, because of their honor.

This case has me working on a new idea. That the dark energy of the Universe is God's sense of Irony.

www.fvn.no...

Lawyer Mette Yvonne Larsen believes that the terrorist accused Anders Behring Breivik should have been placed under observation right from the moment he was detained.

The ethics of leaving a psychotic individual untreated is very interesting. I don't think he's psychotic, so I am more in the vein of thinking that treating a person who is not psychotic with those sort of drugs is unethical.

Strange animal in the zoo still. A completely calm, pleasant, cooperative, lucid, 5 month long psychotic state.


www.welt.de...

There is going to be another documentary coming out today around the survivors.

Emma Martinovic swam for their lives when they saw Anders Breivik Behring in the distance. "He moved quietly. Then he raised the gun and pointed it at us, "says the 18-year-old. But then Breivik has become clear that the group in the water he would not be able to kill, and have targeted in a different direction, fleeing to a boy.

"You could see the panic of the girl next to him. She was all ready. "The girl had clung to the boy. Exactly what I want to see the killer, believed Martinovic. Finally, the killer started to laugh. "He took a breath and laughed out loud, so that his shoulders were trembling."

This is the same reaction he had when shooting birds while training with the Teutonic group.

www.dw-world.de...

About increased tracking of right-wing internet due to Anders Behring’s acts.

www.dagbladet.no...

www.nrk.no...


He dated a woman from Belarus, and this is the reason for his travel.

Crack in the armour – doesn’t just like Nordic women? Has consistent mating preference outside of his chosen ethnic group to advocate on behalf of. Yes it is true - women really are the crack in your armour and the chink in your story.

My guess has been that he prefers sexually subordinate women. Eastern European women are more likely to use this myth to draw flies. So his preference takes him outside the group he advocates for.

(Lithuanian, Belarusian/Russian, Hungarian…)

There were reports from Belarus that he was there for training. I’d still like to know if the terminology Cheryne is common in Norway.

Anders says he took training there, white nationalist groups say he took training there, police say they have found no evidence for this. The logic error is apparent to me here - absence of evidence isn't evidence of absence.

I like the idea that someone can’t be going somewhere for two things – hitting on women is a mutually exclusive activity.

www.dagbladet.no...

"He is of the opinion that the educated assessment testimony at the trial of those who have knowledge of politically motivated terrorism, history and political science is more relevant." states the letter.

Anders Behring’s legal team is not asking for new experts.

He has probably has decided to include psychiatrists in his list of professions that should be abolished, along with sociologists.

nyhederne.tv2.dk...:vurdering-breivik-ikke-skizofren.html

Friends in Denmark with bad photos - Starting to fill out in this photo, so later than the previous bad photos.
He might be downplaying the amount of party drugs he might have consumed.

www.dagbladet.no...

www.dagbladet.no...

www.vg.no...

www.vg.no...

www.vg.no...

www.vg.no...

(Still using the modified Hitler/Breivik photo. Lots of these stories in lots of languages but they all say about the same thing.)

All about experts wanting new reports, or how Anders Behring’s legal team doesn’t think it makes any difference. Prison doesn’t think he is psychotic and has checked him 80 times.

They also don’t think he is suicidal. On this I disagree, in that given the chance to make a spectacular statement he’d do it. He might have decided that his message needs more babysitting so that his continued life is required, and decide against it on that basis.

I’d make sure all weapons are pretty securely attached to security personnel during the trial.

www.vg.no...

He was concerned about things other than school work, has one of the teachers said in interviews.

Childhood evaluation noted a lack of attachment. Not interested in school. He is heavily interested in drilling down and educating himself in his own interests down to minutia, evidenced on his bookshelf. He has an undiagnosed sensory disorder. May I say again – Autism. High functioning sociopaths and autists have overlap, even in brain scans.

His attentiveness to gaming his internal chemistry is the one aspect that most suggests psychopath rather than autistic. As it is a function of achieving his goal and making himself into a proof of concept, perhaps he is crossing the boundary between autism and psychopathology. There has to be a cross over point, and he might be sitting on it.

Psychopaths (sociopaths) tend to be sexually promiscuous. However, many high functioning autistics I’ve known are not, and find this trait unpleasant and undesirable in mates. From what he has in 2083, his views on it seem pretty clear.

In every picture, and all the statements about his clothing I have another observation – the clothing thing may not just be about appearance. This may be an outcropping of the sensory disorder. The textures or movement of the fabric against his skin bother him, and he layers with certain fabrics because of it.

I’ve suspected this for quite a while, but I lack a good sampling of Norwegian male fashion to pin him against and I usually have more to go on than photos and video when I've seen it before. I've been looking at Norwegian men's everyday pictures, and trying to recall all the ones I've met. Friendly attentive guys on the slopes usually, nice to talk to on the chair lifts or drinking some coffee afterwards.

Compliance in interviewing is also a potential indicator for autism. Trichotillomania is not unheard of with high functioning autism, and is evidenced in his pictures: the passport photo, and the photos in masonic gear show it.

www.aftenposten.no...

Can receive mail, and visits. Is now willing to give interviews. Specifically mentions that he would do interviews with cultural conservative bloggers.

www.vgtv.no...#!id=47849

Interview with someone near the bombing. Pictures of victims and of the damage, including the hole the bomb fell into. Close ups of the structural cement, showing it wasn't buckled.

www.slate.fr...

Apparently, Norway is seeing an upswing in people reading the Bible since July 22, 2011.

www.aftenposten.no...

Today these bans lifted. He has read the psychiatric report, he is aware of the criticism against it, he has gained access to the media have written about Utøya and its ministries. The immediacy Husby and Sørheim experienced in conversations with him, will hardly new expert experience. He can adapt and make tactical response.

Do people who are considered in a vegetative state make rational strategic decisions? The concern itself speaks to the level of confidence found even in supporters of the psychiatric report.


www.aftenposten.no...

One could thus see the psychiatric ruling - with its questionable diagnosis - which commissioned the work. Hamsun did not understand that Langfeldt was called in to rescue him. Conversely, Behring Breivik understood that his psychiatrists are there to lock him up for life. Hamsun was furious, while Behring Breivik reacted with "insult". In both cases, psychiatrists serving public purposes. It's about saving the Norway and the Norwegians, especially the relatives from ever meeting Behring Breivik more in reality.

The politics of psychiatry. The comments section is certainly worth a read.


www.aftenposten.no...
More on Hamsun, saying that people misunderstand what happened to him and what his diagnosis meant.