Anders Breivik and "hidden" Freemasons

reply to post by F.E.A.R.


The OO is exactly as you say .. except one thing. It's not Masonic. It was actually part of the OO's protestant zeal that lead to the British cracking down on Masonry.. they didn't appreciate Masons having dinners and drinking with mere Irish Catholics.
reply to post by Masonic Light


Thanks for the correction Not a York Riter myself, and am living proof not belonging to an organization will more often than not lead to misunderstandings about said organization.

What is interesting to me is; He must have shared his world view and anti ideology (isn't that an ideology in itself?) with some of his fellow brothers.
I do not believe that he was the only one in on this! (Though it is possible) I believe someone else knew about it as well, and perhaps helped him with funding and equipment.

I am also curious as to why he is expelled so fast....
Either the decision was made in haste (and was an emotional decision)
Or they where prepared for it, if you read his manifest, it would suggest that this was all planned to the smallest detail, the media exposure, no friends or family speaking his anti Islamic and anti Marxist point of view, his mason brothers all making the knee jerk reaction of expelling him.
And he hasn't been convicted of anything, even though he confessed...

Originally posted by Schrödinger
What is interesting to me is; He must have shared his world view and anti ideology (isn't that an ideology in itself?) with some of his fellow brothers.

I hate to say it but I'd be surprised if there weren't telltale clues of his feelings though I'd think it rather unlikely anyone would've expected this severity of outcome.

Originally posted by Schrödinger
I am also curious as to why he is expelled so fast....snip...And he hasn't been convicted of anything, even though he confessed...

If he were protesting his innocence and claiming to be railroaded, I'd side with you. That he took ownership of it so quickly says he's proud of being a murderer and I don't see that their Grand Master would've had any alternative.

Originally posted by Schrödinger
What is interesting to me is; He must have shared his world view and anti ideology (isn't that an ideology in itself?) with some of his fellow brothers.
I do not believe that he was the only one in on this! (Though it is possible) I believe someone else knew about it as well, and perhaps helped him with funding and equipment.

I am also curious as to why he is expelled so fast....


Either the decision was made in haste (and was an emotional decision)
Or they where prepared for it, if you read his manifest, it would suggest that this was all planned to the smallest detail, the media exposure, no friends or family speaking his anti Islamic and anti Marxist point of view, his mason brothers all making the knee jerk reaction of expelling him.
And he hasn't been convicted of anything, even though he confessed...

I'm not surprised at all, as a Freemason is BOUND by Civil, Moral and Religious laws and it was here that he broke all of them.

reply to post by Schrödinger


I'm right-wing fringe Libertarian myself, I am very anti-government in my own personal ideologies.. does that mean I'm going to run around killing people? No..

Just because he may have appeared extreme in his views, does not mean he was violent.. well, in this case he is, however how could they know? Surely he had many friends and people he know or worked with that thought his ideas were a little crazy and wouldn't have guessed he'd do this.

Either the decision was made in haste (and was an emotional decision)

?????? .. He was just implicated and confessed to slaughtering 90+ people.. I'd give him the boot too!

reply to post by OnTheLevel213

Before my Internet died a few days ago, I saw many Masonic sites show that he was a Mason and condemned his actions. Doing what he did goes against the very principles that make Freemasonry what it is. He is definitely a bad apple and apparently didn't pay heed to the lessons of the Compasses.

reply to post by eyespying

If anything he let far-right fanaticism, and extreme anti-government sentiments, get the best of him.

reply to post by eyespying

The Grand Master has already said he will assist in the investigation.

reply to post by Schrödinger

He may or may not have, but if Nordic Freemasonry is anything like it is in America in regards to politics, there would be hardly any discussion. Then we also must look to see if he was very active and social.

The investigators will find out if he had help or not.

He is guilty of a heinous crime and conduct unbecoming a Mason. If anything I'd say the Grand Master acted within his power (I'm not familiar with the Norwegian by-laws).

Hey don't get me wrong, I wasn't attacking your fraternity, I just stated some open questions.
I have read his manifest, and while he is biased and one sided, most of what he writes is true, and I agree with most of it.
That's the real conspiracy, because we can't agree with his POW anymore publicly, because then we are like him, and apparently capable of doing the same atrocity as him...

We have been invaded by the political correctness and multicultural, and not all of us agree with that direction, and now we can be legitimately called things like right-wing nut job and racist and so fourth...

It is a sad day, not just for Norway, but for Scandinavia.

Originally posted by skekke

What level is his "Masonic Regalia"?

He's a member of Saint Johannes lodge in Oslo, level 5.

Level 5?

reply to post by Saurus


Yes the 5th degree in the norwegian freemasonry, also known as the saint andreas lodge...
You know this.
Since the first 3 degrees are in the saint johannes lodge, the next 3 is in the saint andreas lodge, and the last 6 are in the chapter lodge.
If my memory serves me right

reply to post by Schrödinger


Thanks, Schrödinger.

I didn't know about the Norwegian degree structure - it seems to be completely different from English and American Freemasonry.

I really must do more reading about different constitutions!

reply to post by Saurus


The Swedish Rite is analagous to the Scottish Rite, whereas our American Blue Lodges are York Ritre bodies. The Swedish Rite, which is practiced in Norway, is quite different.

However, I had read that this guy was a member of a Lodge of St. John, not a Lodge of St. Andrew. In the Swedish Rite, St. John's Lodges end at third degree.

reply to post by Masonic Light


Interesting... Thanks for the info, ML.

I just had a look at a photo of Anders Breivik in regalia:



This is the only photo I can find of him in regalia on the web.

From the three rosettes and the square on his apron,it seems that when the photo was taken, he was a Master Mason, and Worshipful Master of his lodge.

My guess is that if he had joined a Lodge of St. Andrew, he would have a Jewel to indicate such.
There is a Jewel that he is wearing, but I can't identify it. It looks like the English R.A.M. Jewel, but upside down.

Does anyone recognize the Jewel?

reply to post by Masonic Light


You are right ML, the news stated he was from the saint johannes lodge, but as far as I can tell the saint johannes lodge is corresponding to your blue lodge, with 3 degrees, if he is of the 5th degree he must be in the saint andreas lodge...

It goes like this.

1-3 = Saint Johannes Lodge
4-6 = Saint Andreas Lodge
7-12 = Chapter Lodges

reply to post by Schrödinger


I just can't believe that the most this guy's going to do is 21 years. I'm hoping the Norwegian Parliament will quickly pass a law legalizing the death penalty. No punishment is too harsh for this scumbag.

Originally posted by Masonic Light
reply to post by Schrödinger

 

I just can't believe that the most this guy's going to do is 21 years. I'm hoping the Norwegian Parliament will quickly pass a law legalizing the death penalty. No punishment is too harsh for this scumbag.

"Vengeance is mine saith the Lord". An eye for an eye just leads to a world full of blind men.

Originally posted by Fitzgibbon

"Vengeance is mine saith the Lord". An eye for an eye just leads to a world full of blind men.

I'm all about forgiveness. But some people are beyond it. When a guy kills 93 people in cold blood, most of them kids, then I have absolutely no problem with ridding the world of such a piece of garbage.

reply to post by Masonic Light


You are not the only one with that sentiment.
He is being charged with their terrorist law, and will probably see maximum sentence, as you say; 21 years!
That's around 3 months sentence per death... Pretty cheap I agree.. But changing ones laws because we are emotionally touched by this atrocity, is not the way forward in a civilized society....

Personally I don't think we can give him a harder sentence.
There is also a section in the Norwegian (as well in the Danish) law, that gives the state the right, to keep a person in jail, if he is considered dangerous to the general public.
So theoretical, he might just get life imprisonment.

Originally posted by Masonic Light

Originally posted by Fitzgibbon

"Vengeance is mine saith the Lord". An eye for an eye just leads to a world full of blind men.

I'm all about forgiveness. But some people are beyond it. When a guy kills 93 people in cold blood, most of them kids, then I have absolutely no problem with ridding the world of such a piece of garbage.

But who are we to make that ultimate decision? Can you with all absolute certainty say that two decades in the Norwegian penal system won't effect improvement? If we believe in the GAOTU and the morals as explained in the 3rd Degree WT, does it no come off as hubris to gainsay the Will of the GAOTU?

I might also add that there's no guarantee that there isn't a similar law-of-the-jungle internal justice system by the inmates that there is in the North American prison system. So you may yet get your wish

reply to post by Fitzgibbon


There is, the prison guards will probably leave his cell unlocked at night, and tell some hardcore inmates, where his cell is...