Please help me with swt, they are taking me to court and I have dont nothing wrong!

Sorry if this is long but Im being taken to court aparently and really need some advice. Being a student with a lot of debt I cant afford court costs and I have been accused of something that makes no sense as I needed to buy a ticket home anyway which costs just 10p less than a return. I dont think anyone would try and go to this effort to avoid 10p! Maybe I look like a bum I duno I had my best bling on so maybe he though I was some kind of lawless drug dealing type, rather than the charming, fashionable young gent that I am

Ok so today I got the train like I do every day almost. At my station wow guess what the ticket machines do not work still! After weeks and weeks they are still not functioning, or maybe my account hasnt got cash in. It should have but im using my reserve card after loosing my main accounts card. Ok well I'll get one on the train, oh but its not peak time and there is not guard, now I must que up for ages like an idiot.

I get to my destination at Guildford station and tell the guard at the barriers that I need to buy a ticket (this happens a lot and I am used to the process) I start to buy a ticket from a machine, but then remember that my card wasn't working before. I decide to call my bank to check incase I need to transfer money from my regular account (which I am missing the bank card) to my secondary account. At first I get no answer, I move maybe 5 feet to the edge of the station and stand still on the phone and thats when I am greeted by the 'revenue priotection officer'.

Oddly he asks me to step inside (we are already inside) and asks for details. Now I would have told him sorry but I dont want to give you any details, but the situation didnt at all seem serious. I thought he was going to tell me to buy a ticket and then I would explain that I am just transfering funds so that I can make the payment.

HE tells me its an offence to provide false data, I tell him I haven't done anything wrong so why would I and give him my details and he confirms my address on the phone. I start to worry now as I see he's not just going to ask me to buy a ticket. We begin to argue, he claims that I left the station and says they have cctv and I tell him thats good as it will show me in the station, he says I was outside over n over and we get nowhere.

He writes HIS account on a bit of paper in his book and asks me to sign it, I tell him ofcoarse I wont sign a statement that falsely incriminates myself. He tells me its normal and shows me that everyone else does it, I tell him that they are stupid in that case if like me they have done nothing wrong. I also ask if its illegal to try and make me sign the paper without impartial legal representation (not knowing if this is actually true I might add) at which point he backs of totally and tells me over and over that I have the right to refuse to sign it, I tell him I just dont want to sign it if my version of events differ and also that anyone could add information to it at a later date with my signiture below.

I am a bit dumbfounded about how nothing is being explained to me, when I ask I dont get much of a response and it leads me to think that nothing serious is going on. I am then however told that as I am contesting his version on events I will be summoned to court in a couple months when this is processed. I thought he was joking but I could tell that he wanted to see me squirm!

HE has taken all manor of details of myself down, so I then ask him for his details. He shows me his card and I write all the info down, I then ask what he asked me. His eye colour, hair length/colour, height etc. He seemed mad but if I am going to be put through this treatment then so is he! Also I want to know exactley who it was that I dealt with.

The mental thing is that I need a ticket to get my train home and this costs just 10p less than a return so this guy is accusing me of trying to run off to save 10p. I know its a recession mate but come of it, there was even 14p in copper coins left in the machine which I used immediately after the encounter. HE said I could leave implying I didnt need to buy a ticket, ofcoarse I did though, I still gotta get home!

I asked him as well, why didnt you wait till I left the station, he said I was outside. I asked did you swoop in before I had a chance to buy a ticket and he said no and implied I was fleeing. I was standing stil INSIDE the station. He also had a go at me for not bying a ticket before and when I told him why I could not he told me that I was lying about no guard being on the train. Well I get the same train every week and there are only guards on the way home during rush hour. He obviously is a driver..

I loked up advice online but nothing really addresses my circumstance, I will goto citizens advice tomorow, but I want as much help as possible. I dont want to end up with bailiffs around stealing my stuff because I cant afford court costs, please help/ I know in hindsight I should have done a lot different but I was caught ofguard and unprepared, I always buy a ticket and its not possible to get throught the barriers to get home without one so I would never try and avoid buying one. I am mad

Take your oil and pay the fine.

I was in the same boat with a car I just bought. Caught driving it with no tax but its the same principle if your using a service and dont have everything legal i.e ticket before you make the trip then you are basicaly stealing, same as driving on the road with no tax.

Man up pay the fine and move on, my fine costed me around £300 in total. Yours will be around £100. Its a life lession nothing more.

reply to post by clintdelicious


This happened to me up near the Midlands too...

The machine was broke so I could get a ticket at the station. When the inspector took my details he wanted me to sign the paper. I refused and he said that I was signing for my 'valid ticket' to continue the journey otherwise I would have to get off at the next station.

I got off at the next station and waited for the next train. They sent me two 'reminders' which I shredded and ignored. I think as long as you didn't sign away your innocence you should be fine and I believe the threats of going to court are empty threats as if they do that the court get the money not them so they don’t bother.

Chill your beans. The way I handle these things is this: If they want money out of me im dammed if im going to give it up with out a fight, I will write as many letters and dispute everything I can, try and throw as much of their own red tape and bureaucracy back at them till they give up... works also for parking tickets too.

Originally posted by michaelmcclen
Take your oil and pay the fine.

I was in the same boat with a car I just bought. Caught driving it with no tax but its the same principle if your using a service and dont have everything legal i.e ticket before you make the trip then you are basicaly stealing, same as driving on the road with no tax.

Man up pay the fine and move on, my fine costed me around £300 in total. Yours will be around £100. Its a life lession nothing more.

He already stated the ticket machine and booth at station were closed/inoperative, they were trying to fine him for not having a ticket as happened to me.

In that situation I wouldn't call paying 'manning up' I would call it 'bending over'...

Just be straight up with the judge, tell any lies and it can go down hill pretty quick. Be honest and you stand a good chance of getting through this while the ticket inspector gets a warning to straighten up.

Originally posted by CrimsonMoon

Originally posted by michaelmcclen
Take your oil and pay the fine.

I was in the same boat with a car I just bought. Caught driving it with no tax but its the same principle if your using a service and dont have everything legal i.e ticket before you make the trip then you are basicaly stealing, same as driving on the road with no tax.

Man up pay the fine and move on, my fine costed me around £300 in total. Yours will be around £100. Its a life lession nothing more.

He already stated the ticket machine and booth at station were closed/inoperative, they were trying to fine him for not having a ticket as happened to me.

In that situation I wouldn't call paying 'manning up' I would call it 'bending over'...

Yes but he also said about cash flow problems and that it might not have been the machines but rather his own personal finance problems.

I can assure you that anything that collects money from the public is top priority for any business so his reason that the machine dident work is mute it has to have been working. If not why was he the only person singled out for not paying a fare, where there not other that got on and off the train at the same stops as him?

Take you oil and pay the fine, its not worth fighting, its more of a headache than its worth and untimatly he is at fault.

reply to post by michaelmcclen


I havent been given the chance to pay a fine or I would do. They said because my events disagree it will goto court, looked up online and they aparently ask for about £250 to settle outside court. Considering im nearly in £10,000 student debt even when I earn money I cant spend it, it just pays of my outstanding bills and at the moment im not working even part time.

I would gladly paid a fine there and then but this wasnt even suggested as an option to me

reply to post by CrimsonMoon


Thats what I thought, he was so insistant on my signing s othat I would admit my guilt and I really did suspect that without that they may not have much to go on. When he mentioned the cctv I wondered if that was an empty threat. I know they rarely use cctv evidence in matters such as this.

What letters did you recieve btw? Where these asking for a settlement or court dates?

reply to post by michaelmcclen


There were 2 other who were stopped with me as well, one was trying to flee though, the other was waiting inside the staiton. I had the means to pay but as my card didnt work I wanted to check I had money in that account, and I in fact DID have money in there and paid for my ticket afterwards without a problem. Because their faulty machine wasnt working it made me doubt my bank card.

reply to post by kwakakev


I did think that since I have done nothing wrong that I should be ok. My main worry is getting a criminal record which could stop me traveling the the states which I do almosrt every year. Also I can not pay a fine and am worried about bailiffs coming and removing my stuff for a tiny amount of its value.

This website www.shrug.info... claims that

'If the guard issues a penalty notice anyway, there is 21 days to appeal to the company. However even if there is no appeal, or the appeal is not allowed, the company is not automatically entitled to its money. It first has to sue in the county court. Judges hearing such claims would not give judgment for the penalty sum unless the company could justify it.

There has been no reported case of a train company suing in this way. The last thing the rail industry would want is a pronouncement by a judge on its levying of penalty fares.'

reply to post by clintdelicious


If things do happen to go bad in court, it is a minor offence. Most people have a few tickets to their name and it should not stop a visa, like a more serious offence does. You can talk to the judge about it and he may be able to have no conviction recorded if it is going to be a problem. As for the money, I don't know what system you have but could try and apply for community service to help pay it off or set up some instalment plan. The courts would have something.

First, relax.

This guy is going to have a hard time trying to prove this and you have a pretty simple case to take to the judge.

As previously mentioned, be honest. Get caught in a lie and they will throw the book at you.

The first thing I would do is write a "complete" account of what happened from your perspective. Leave out nothing, make it as detailed as you can. If you read a book on the train, mention the book and what pages you read that day. The clearer your account of the day in question will make you look better in front of a judge - especially if the transit cop is vague about the events.

Next, see if you can find any old tickets from days previous when you have brought a ticket from the same station. This will collaborate your story and make it pretty hard for a judge to accept that you tried to utilise public transportation without paying.

I would then go to the station where the incident happened and get photos of where you were(take some chalk or masking tape with you and mark out the exact spot where you were standing) prior to being taken into custody.

Finally, go to your nearest university(with your account of the events & photos) and see if you can get advice from the legal faculty. It can't hurt to try (they can only say no, don't give up at the first no either, try someone else. Prof's are a fickle bunch) but it could do you the world of good to get a little free legal advice.

One thing, to be innocent, and totally another to make you look guillty......Get legal advice immediately.
These barstids will crucify you if given a chance now...they want to make you an example id bet its a matter of this guys "Honour" harrrumphf
I would get help with the court apearance if you get summonned.
Did you get a date yet?
Also i would look into going on the offensive, with a complaint against the officer to the transit authority he represents.
You may find hes got a record himself.....ney?(he sounds like the perfect a^&*hole)

reply to post by kwakakev


Im not too worried about going to court, its mainly the financial issues as well as getting a criminal record. I have had a bit of a turbulant past and been very glad that I have managed to avoid getting a criminal record and I would be very embarressed if when traveling to the states with my family and friends I get turned away beccause of such a minor issue.

I am just angry that I was not given the chance to pay a £20 fine which is what they usually ask. Instead they told me that they would take me to court and it really seemed very dodgey to me. There was a second guy at the side who chimed in here n there and it was only requests like 'just sign the papers' 'you were trying to leave weren't you?'. It made me feel very uncomfortable and I must say the main gentlemen was not happy at all that I asked for his name and ID as well as when I questioned him about signing his version of events.

reply to post by OccamAssassin


Thanks for the advice, I feel much calmer now about the process. I am really annoyed because I was very cooperative and they tried to imply that I did something wrong which I didnt. I was treated with contempt just because I questioned them. I just hope in court against a prosecuter I wouldnt totally be outclassed, although I feel that there isnt much that they could say without lying about the inccident (which they were ) this is what worries me.

reply to post by stirling


Tbh he seemed like the failed detective type, really angry that he has to do such a silly job for a living.

I asked for a copy of papers etc and more info but was told in a couple months I will recieve it (they are very busy it appears) I am going to get legal advice tomorow right away, I also have a friend who recently graduated from a 5 year law degree and he has always said that he would help me if anything ever came up so im hoping that he could maybe represent me for free.

Im just really wound up. I should have checked my bank before or tried to pay and then made a transfer if I didnt have the funds in that particular account. It turns out I always had the money to pay, but because of their rubbish machines I doubted my own bank card. When I was told to get a ticket as well I feel that they should have warned me to do it right away, I never did anything wrong, online there are so many similar stories as well. South West Trains are the worst by far aparently and the CEO even says that greed is part of capitalism and goes as far to make fun of southern Englishmen, implying that this is why he is so harsh on this train line.

Eh if your innocent your innocent. If your not your not. Shut up and go to court.

Seems like a big pile of nothing at all to get all worked up for.

I have gotten speeding tickets for way more while doing the same rate of speed as everyone else, you see me here making a thread? No, I paid it and moved on.

This is a small little thing you are letting consume you, and your actions and attitude are what mad it worse.

So either let it go and not care move on and be happy, or just keep being sooooo mad over something sooooo stupid and small.

Originally posted by clintdelicious
reply to post by OccamAssassin

 

Thanks for the advice, I feel much calmer now about the process. I am really annoyed because I was very cooperative and they tried to imply that I did something wrong which I didnt. I was treated with contempt just because I questioned them. I just hope in court against a prosecuter I wouldnt totally be outclassed, although I feel that there isnt much that they could say without lying about the inccident (which they were ) this is what worries me.

If I was in the same situation I would be pi$$ed

You may even try approaching the transit authority with you account and photo's and say that if they continue to push the issue, you will take it to court.

One other thing to note is that when someone is trying to push you around like this that a good tactic can be to pull the slander card....

For example
*officer pulls you up for speeding*
Officer - I logged you as doing 65km/h in a 60km/h zone
You - No, I was only doing 59km/h
Officer - I caught you doing 65km/h in a 60km/h zone
You - No, I was only doing 59km/h
Officer - You were doing 65km/h in a 60km/h zone
You - No, I was only doing 59km/h. I have just told you three times that I was only doing 59km/h. Are you calling me a liar?

*Here is where you watch the cop back away when he realises that this could end up as a "Defamation of character" case(slander) in court.*

Good luck with your case. You should be able to walk all over them

Note; Make sure you are in a suit(preferably) or at the very least, your "Sunday bests" if you do have to go to court. Judges will always be easier to deal with if you look clean cut & respectable. If you turn up in a Metallica t-shirt, you will just be wasting your time.

dont worry bud, i doubt it will go to court..... stick to your story...