ATF Project Gunrunner Is THE Smoking Gun...Obama signed 09 Stimulus Package Funding The Project!!!

reply to post by Signals


It appears this plan has backfired. i just hope this story doesn't go away

But wait, I thought Obama was the most honest, transparent, greatest person to ever grace our Govt.

Sorry, but this has been foreseen years ago.

reply to post by TupacShakur

I was about to argue that Americans wouldn't be dumb enough to allow such a stupid thing to happen, because obviously disarming the public of legal weapons won't keep us safe from Cartel members with illegal weapons. But to be completely obvious, it's clear that a good portion of the American people's opinions are swayed heavily by biased mainstream media outlets, so I think some will be more than happy to give away their constitutional rights for freedom.

Please do not take what I am about to say as criticism in anyway. I've seen your postings in the past and you seem to be a person with intelligence and reason, but.....

1. If the American people did not get off their butts in order to try to overturn the Patriot Act which has wording in it that would allow for all 'freedoms' to be stripped .....
2. We have done nothing (generally speaking) about the out of control and overbearing actions of Capt. Oblivious and her Merry Band of Idiots (Janet Napolitano and DHS) continuing to take our freedoms....
3. We have not as a group demanded justice over the Banksters and Govt. taking this county's economy down as well as putting individuals economies in dire straights....

What would make any of us think that the stripping of our Constitutional right to keep and bear arms would get us to finally wake up and take any kind of action? Perhaps that would be the straw that broke the camels back or perhaps it would be more of the same.... only time will tell.

reply to post by MyMindIsMyOwn


These are definitely some valid points you are making here, and I don't question for one second the complacency of America's general public. Although I do believe an attempt to remove US citizens Second amendment rights will be the straw that broke the camels back. At this point the gov't is no longer making shady moves behind the scenes....at this point the US gov't is striking the US citizen at a much more personal level, home, family, and personal defense.

What's that old saying???? Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twice, shame on me.... There must be some form of double negative rule that can be applied here. The American Public has been shamed, day in and day out for a countless amount of years... well the Calderon has reached the boiling point and it is only a matter of time before the water bubbles over...

Thanks for the post S&F!! The more people that can be made aware of this the better!!!

Two things about this story that still get me -

This quote from SJE98's links-

. “The acting director said ATF was kept in the dark about certain activities of other agencies, including DEA and FBI.”

So...10 years after 9/11, and these 3 agencies still have communication problems?

And I know you've seen this one from Obama-

"I just want you to know that we're working on it," Obama was quoted as saying to gun-control advocate Sarah Brady in March. "We have to go through a few processes, but under the radar."

www.nypost.com...
www.washingtontimes.com...

Thanks SJE98

It seems clear to me that this whole fiasco would be mostly unheard of on MSM or congress except for the fact that a US agent was murdered with one of the "project guns". If mere citizens (US or Mexico) were murdered with "project" weapons, would we know about the project at all? This is the very definition of blowback, except a LEO was a victim not just civs this time. Machiavellian ideals don't work very well any more in the age of the internet, or when a fellow LEO is offed due to some upper level idiots playing politics and attacking the 2ndA.

Many of these same guns are being recovered from crime scenes in Arizona[32] and throughout Mexico,[33] which is artificially inflating ATF's eTrace statistics of U.S. origin guns seized in Mexico. One specific gun, recovered at the scene, is alleged to be the weapon used to murder Customs and Border Protection Agent Brian Terry on December 14, 2010.[34]

Wikipedia link

85% of firearms traded around the world are not regulated. Then they wonder where all these weapons come from all over the world.

85% of firearms traded around the world are not regulated. Then they wonder where all these weapons come from all over the world.

Something bothers me. Naturally this whole mess bothers me but something else as well.

Back when Obama was running and after he won ATS was loaded up with threads about his gun-grabbing desires and every one of those threads, as unfounded and hyperbolous as they were, was relentlessly assaulted with posters saying this was crazy and he "respected" the 2nd and that he wouldnt do anything remotely gun-grabby.

Now ATS is loaded with threads about the ATF scandal arming cartels in Mexico and Honduras, Obamas "under the radar" executive orders coming in the next week or two all backed and substantiated by several quality sources and even Carney and Obama himself and there hasnt been a peep in any of these threads by those posters.

Where did they all go? Are they upset he's deeply involved in doing exactly what they said he wouldnt do or are they smirking with glee having supported this all along while attempting to cover it from the beginning?

It has often been shown that history repeats itself; in that context: look at the current Gunrunner/Fast and Furious scandal, and go back 30 yrs or so to the Eugene Hasenfus/Barry Seal days. Replace CIA with ATF, Richard Secord with Eric Holder, Ollie North with Kenneth Melson, Nicaragua with Mexico, Contras with SOA Zetas, then fill in the blanks. Large number of weapons with no tracing sent to Mexico and MS-13 in Honduras. Who gets what in return? A giant screw-up, or more likely the same type of "product" sent back to USA to enrich the coffers of those who would still do dirty deeds to the citizens while enriching themselves? I lean toward history repeating and a severe LEO Brian Terry murder blowback (maybe, depending on MSM influence of the masses) blowing the whole thing wide open.

About the CIA guns for drugs project:

The contents of the actual report were largely ignored by the national media. In the 623rd paragraph, the report described a cable from the CIA's Directorate of Operations dated October 22, 1982, describing a prospective meeting between Contra leaders in Costa Rica for "an exchange in [the United States] of narcotics for arms, which then are shipped to Nicaragua."[14] The two main Contra groups, US arms dealers, and a lieutenant of a drug ring which imported drugs from Latin America to the US west coast were set to attend the Costa Rica meeting. The lieutenant trafficker was also a Contra, and the CIA knew that there was an arms-for-drugs shuttle and did nothing to stop it.[13]

Wiki Link

reply to post by thisguyrighthere


Yes, good observation.

Where are they? I think most of the supporters gave up a while ago, even they figured out what this guy is all about...

He's let everyone down.

I can't believe racism hasn't been mentioned in this thread, that's really all his supporters have left.

Something bothers me. Naturally this whole mess bothers me but something else as well. Back when Obama was running and after he won ATS was loaded up with threads about his gun-grabbing desires and every one of those threads, as unfounded and hyperbolous as they were, was relentlessly assaulted with posters saying this was crazy and he "respected" the 2nd and that he wouldnt do anything remotely gun-grabby. Now ATS is loaded with threads about the ATF scandal arming cartels in Mexico and Honduras, Obamas "under the radar" executive orders coming in the next week or two all backed and substantiated by several quality sources and even Carney and Obama himself and there hasnt been a peep in any of these threads by those posters. Where did they all go? Are they upset he's deeply involved in doing exactly what they said he wouldnt do or are they smirking with glee having supported this all along while attempting to cover it from the beginning? signature: "Tyranny is defined as that which is legal for the government but illegal for the citizenry." Free State Project Watch Harrison Bergeron | Read Harrison Bergeron Read "Everything I Want to do is Illegal" | FlexYourRights.org

People "disappear" when they find out they were wrong and lied to,good observation Thisguyrighthere.

It was pretty obvious something like this was going to happen with Barrys administration...they are just carrying on what Bush was doing!

Call me Ed Whiner (my wife is Wendy) but I really thought this would get more responses....

My hope is MSM will run wild with this, it's HUGE.

I knew Obama had to approve this illegal ATF project, and now the 'smoking gun' has been found tying the two together. I agree that impeachment proceedings have to start immediately to get Obama ousted before he can possibly do any more serious damage to this nation!

Who didn't see this coming? Ironically, someone spoke about the threads after the election where they said Obama was coming for our guns. I was in those threads, and tried to tell people something was going to happen.

He continues to do things that shred the Constitution, because he has gotten away with it so many times already. He started with small things, and he got greedy and overstepped a lot of boundaries on this one. Bad move, he should have had more sense to stop before it got this far, because he has gotten away with so much already.

I would guess once the nation realizes the depth, breadth, and scope of this, it will be - as someone else stated - the straw that breaks the camels back. First, the gun owners, second the Constitution defenders, and lastly, the rioters and race riots when impeachment is even suggested.

He used to be untouchable, he felt invincible, now I bet he just wishes he was invisible.

People have been wondering, wishing for, hoping for a revolution, wondering what will trigger our citizens to the streets. I think this could be the one that seals the deal.

Obama, the gift that keeps on giving.

How's that change working for you?

Not only should the POTUS be impeached - he should be deported to Mexico...
S&F Bump

I mentioned in my last post about a small town sheriffs office in Columbus, New Mexico
( a border town ) selling weapons to the cartel. This story has changed a few times but these two entail some details. This involves the ATF also this past March


Here is the story with some recent updates.

There were 10 people involved in this known as straw buyers. There were over 200 weapons purchased at Chaparral Guns in Chaparral, N.M. A search warrant was also obtained for the Columbus Police Department from the US Attorneys office.

From another board with detailed information with a local comment from someone living their.

Story 2

“Everyone around here knows Eddie ( Mayor Eddie Espinoza) is a crook but I wouldn’t doubt if he wasn’t enticed by the BATF to commit this particular crime. They already knew he was a crook and would probably come along easily.”

Story 2 also mentions U.S. firearms agents estimate that around 80 percent of the weapons used by Mexican drug traffickers come from the United States.

But here is a report in story 2 that states otherwise.

Mexico's Gun Supply and the 90 Percent Myth

How many other small town were used in this operation, and how many people in the operation are being thrown under the bus with criminal charges? like this mayor and sheriff. One thing that is not mentioned in any of these stories is Where did the Mayor and the Sheriff get the money to make the purchases? in small town like that these guys don't make much. The gun shop owner was also charged but, the charges were later dropped.

Could these guys have been set up ?

-----------------------

This story is interesting, you can see who get to take blame for this first.. This sheriff might have been corrupt, but it seems like he is the one taking all the blame. yeah right. I guess this is where the operation started getting know well though out the media; they had to find easy fall guys and worked their way up from this point on.

In additon check out this site from it home page. You can see some American Weapons AR 15 M16, some AK47, Flash bangs. etc.. and all the violence caused.

Borderland Beat


My point is, is that this operation goes very deep and I believe they only have just scratched the surface of this corruption. It will take some time to uncover all the fine details.

Debt ceiling talks = wag the dog event

ATF Project Gunrunner will never get the light of day...

I was watching CNN and the crawler at the bottom said," ATF admits mistakes were made involving Project Gunrunner" That was it. A little blurb at the bottom of the screen. They are going to do their best to bury this and the MSM is helping by not making this one of the big stories.

I thought this was relevant to the thread, a short blurb from Obama while he was on the campaign trail in '08 -



I don't think that we can get that done...

That certainly wasn't a "NO", was it?