The Gog/Magog War Prophesied In Ezekiel 38-39 Is Beginning

reply to post by goldentorch

This is planning not prophecy

So, you think that "they" sat down with a bunch of shepherds, nobodies, and fishermen several thousand years ago in order to write something that "they" wanted to do in the distant future? And no one caught on to this until just now?

reply to post by Ghost375

Christians are so close-minded.

Close-minded for sticking to our holy book? Hmm.

They need to realize there were more prophets than Jesus.

Oh, we realize that there were more prophets than those we recognize; we just call them false prophets.

They also need to realize Jesus was *just* a prophet.

This is a topic for the theology forum, but in short, Jesus claimed to be way more than just a prophet. This is fairly obvious, especially in John 8, where he names himself I AM. So, either his claims are correct and he is who he said that he was, or he was just a failed apocalyptic prophet whom no one should pay any attention to.

Originally posted by OldCorp


What other nation or group of people in the history of the world has been conquered and taken away into slavery - THREE TIMES - and dispersed throughout the entire world, only to be gathered together again after 2,000 years? That in itself is astonishing and unprecedented, but to have it predicted thousands of years ago defies logic unless there is Someone looking out for them, and using supernatural means to tell us all about it (and in the process giving that group of people hope that they have NOT been abandoned by their Father in Heaven and that one day they would once again be welcomed home to the land which was promised to them.)

First, OP, I admit I have not watched any video because I am in a position where I cannot. I did however read your entire post and your supporting sources. This isn't a new story by any means, and I feel fairly comfortable discussing the material.

A theory I would like to propose, as an alternate to prophecy inspired by a divine being:
Is it possible that because of the history of Israel and the Jews, how it was written into their scripture and then adopted by Christianity, that it has come to pass as reality simply due to the fact that so many believe in and pursue these ends?

For example; if you were to meet a psychic, and she prophesizes that you're going to meet a short, feisty redhead in the near future, and that this opportunity should not be passed up, as this girl is your soul-mate (destiny), when you saw any girl fitting that description would you not pursue this girl as if she truly were your destiny?

It is my argument that these "prophecies" have come to pass, at least in the opinions of the faithful, because of the same texts that predicted these events in the first place. The Jewish People held together and fulfilled these beliefs, precisely because they had written them for themselves in the past. The Hebrew Bible was both the plan and the glue to hold the plan together for 2500 years or so. It's a genius plan, and to date it continues to work on those of us who choose to believe it.

As others have stated, the prophecies in the Old Testament are either generic, as are most prophecies, so they could be applied to any number of situations; or they are written as an ancient "feel-good" story to keep a society of often-persecuted people together, because now they have faith that they will be triumphant and liberated in the end.

Do you think this is a possible explanation? I know your faith will fight it, but faith aside, using that right brain you were born with, could this be even a possibility?


I apologize that these ideas aren't as cleanly articulated as I would like, I'm writing in between moments of busy at work, and am losing my chain of thought over and over and over.

When they say the son of man is coming in a cloud, my interpretation is that there is going to be something in the water that alters our DNA is such a way that our offspring is more like Jesus.

Originally posted by dethduck
I prophecise that we are beyond the age of prophecy.
As such, all prophecies are false, and therefore invalid.

By the Great Pantheon,
So Say We All!

You can't do that.. because that would make your prophecy false thus making prophecies true again..

Originally posted by jeanne75018
Please OldCorp, could you display another avatar? Displaying a weapon is not right. I feel it like an aggression towards me.

edit on 28/6/2011 by jeanne75018 because: (no reason given)

Yes, because he has one of those "special" guns that uses IP addressed bullets that routes them through the internet and into your NIC, and then said bullets work their way through the layers of the OSI model and then come firing out of your computer screen at your face. Seriously?!

Originally posted by octotom
reply to post by Ghost375

 

Christians are so close-minded.

Close-minded for sticking to our holy book? Hmm.
No you're close-minded for not researching in depth all of the other holy books.

They need to realize there were more prophets than Jesus.

Oh, we realize that there were more prophets than those we recognize; we just call them false prophets.
I'm sorry but there's more evidence that Jesus was a false prophet than any of the other prophets.
Jesus states very clearly that the end of the world would occur in his colleagues lifetime.

They also need to realize Jesus was *just* a prophet.

This is a topic for the theology forum, but in short, Jesus claimed to be way more than just a prophet. This is fairly obvious, especially in John 8, where he names himself I AM. So, either his claims are correct and he is who he said that he was, or he was just a failed apocalyptic prophet whom no one should pay any attention to.
You need to understand that prophets only say what they must say. God's plan is complex.

Good job ignoring the part of my thread that was completely on topic...

YA'JOOJ MA'JOOJ (Gog and Megog)

God created a nation called Ya'jooj and Ma'jooj. In the beginning they were free. King Zulqarnian imprisoned up behind a wall. They are still imprisoned today, and will be freed near the Day of Judgement. They will come out and create a lot of trouble. Their population is ten times larger than the world's population.


www.aulia-e-hind.com...


The same Persian believe on the same legend and fable, long before Judeo/Christians and their religion pop in to scene (they will attack from east somewhere between Afghanistan and Tibet).

Iranian believed Mongols was Gog and Magog…. Now Jews calls Iranian Gog and Magog..? that’s the funny part.

reply to post by OldCorp


This was a great original post, Oldcorp. Thanks for taking the time to put that together.

I have spent a lot of time thinking about the end-times and I haven't really come to any firm conclusions. One of the dangers is represented by the recent Howard Camping fiasco: Reading wishful thinking into scripture rather than letting scripture speak to us in its own terms. Lately one idea I have been playing around with is an alternate reading of Daniel's "Statue" prophecy. Usually it is read as having to do with many things that have already come to pass in history, but in fact it is possible to unmoor it from that interpretation and entertain the possibility that everything predicted to pass in the end times is still far off, perhaps centuries even. It's a good counterbalance mental exercise to the idea that its all going down now.

Anyway, as to your specific post, what about China or India? Some readings of the Gog/Magog war have places for them. Thoughts?

OldCorp, I agree. I always appreciate anyone's point of view that takes the time to put together a logical thought process.

Too bad people have to sidetrack the point of this thread with their childish intentions of attacking a religion which is irrelevant of this discussion.

That being said, from a very high level point of view on a geopolitical and geological stage the similarities are certainly astonishing to many end time scenarios as defined in the Bible.

What I would be more interested in is if you have made these comparisons in such a detailed manner to the original hebrew or greek versions of the Bible?

Originally posted by Ghost375
Wow you write a whole post about Gog/Magog and don't even bring in any of the very detailed accounts of it in the Qu'ran?

I, personally think truth can be derived from any source. I use the culmination of all prophecies.

I believe that the Quran just rehashes what the Bible says, but in different words.

Christians are so close-minded. They need to realize there were more prophets than Jesus. They also need to realize Jesus was *just* a prophet.

Pot meet kettle . . .

reply to post by octotom
Warnig!: Some of the following might be figurative or simply not true.

These are the plans of eternal dark forces, put into play through men from the special secret clubs that created every major religion. Plans that have taken thousands of years to unfold. Civilisation didn't start at 3 000 bc, that's just where their official story started. We live in the fourth age, where evil has ruled since the beginning; to the Hindu's, the Kali Yuga.

There are five means of mass-manipulation: media, education, politics, banking and of course religion and through these we have been slowly manouevered into position for the final scene. What we are witnessing now is the final scene in the plans of the Devil to obtain his throne over God. I hate to ruin it for everyone, but...God wins - the Devil's been blinded by pride and envy.

reply to post by Backslider


Wait . . . so you are doing what the Bible tells you to do so you can fulfill prophecy, even though you do not believe it, in order to fulfill prophecy that you believe is not prophecy, but self-fulfilling.

Whoa. That is deep, man.




Edit: For those who do not understand what I am getting at: 2 Peter 3:3 - "First of all, you must understand that in the last days scoffers will come, scoffing and following their own evil desires."

Originally posted by Lemon.Fresh

Originally posted by Ghost375
Wow you write a whole post about Gog/Magog and don't even bring in any of the very detailed accounts of it in the Qu'ran?

I, personally think truth can be derived from any source. I use the culmination of all prophecies.

I believe that the Quran just rehashes what the Bible says, but in different words.

Christians are so close-minded. They need to realize there were more prophets than Jesus. They also need to realize Jesus was *just* a prophet.

Pot meet kettle . . .

edit on 6/28/2011 by Lemon.Fresh because: (no reason given)

Yeah, the Quran rehashes what the bible says, and the bible rehashes what previous religions before it said.
However, in this case, the Quran gives many more details on the battle between gog and magog.

I never once said nor implied that the OP was wrong. I merely stated that it's dumb not to include information from the Quran.

reply to post by Lemon.Fresh


Lemon.Fresh, I think you should re-read my post, because you obviously misunderstood. It's pretty clearly laid out, so I don't think I need to explain it again.

And regarding evil desires..

I am an atheist. That being said, I am more "Christ like" than most of the Christians I meet. I don't expect you to accept this on my word alone, but nonetheless it is absolutely true.

reply to post by Backslider


You were quite clear. You think they are self-fulfilling prophecies mixed in with "feel-good" prophecies that are generic.

I just showed you how you fulfilled prophecy that you do not believe in. Unless you did it purposefully to fulfill it. But then that would make your argument circular.

reply to post by Lemon.Fresh


Huh? Do you even understand yourself?

Please re-read my post, I said nothing about my own intentions or actions in it. My concept was quite clear, and even when I tell you you didn't understand you do not take a second look and enlighten yourself.

This is why the Bible is bad, people just interpret things they way they want, add ideas that never existed in the original text, misunderstand and spread lies.


Can you point out to me how I showed that I fulfilled a prophecy I do not believe in? Or are you vaguely referring to your snippet of Bible wisdom?

Originally posted by Backslider
reply to post by Lemon.Fresh

 

. . .


I am an atheist. That being said, I am more "Christ like" than most of the Christians I meet. I don't expect you to accept this on my word alone, but nonetheless it is absolutely true.

edit on 28-6-2011 by Backslider because: Evil desires? Ha!

I do not know you personally, but I can understand what you are saying. The problem is that mainstream Christianity has been deceived. They are Christ-like in name only.

But that is a topic for another discussion

REGARDLESS OF WHAT YOU ALL BELIEVE!!!!!

The fact that so much of what is happening can be interpreted as what the bible says is interesting.......

No one cares what you personally believe so leave the OP alone.

The scariest thing about religious fundamentalist is.... regardless whether it's true or not humans inherently create the reality they believe will come. Therefore, it is still an interesting thing to read about, whether or NOT you believe what the OP is saying.

For example, I read several interpretations of several prophets and enjoy seeing what happens. There is a site I read every once in a while called Thetrumpet.com and it's interesting even though I don't subscribe to it... it is interesting because PEOPLE INHERENTLY CREATE THE WORLD THEY BELIEVE IN AND THE FUTURE THEY BELIEVE WILL HAPPEN.

Originally posted by amkia
YA'JOOJ MA'JOOJ (Gog and Megog)

God created a nation called Ya'jooj and Ma'jooj. In the beginning they were free. King Zulqarnian imprisoned up behind a wall. They are still imprisoned today, and will be freed near the Day of Judgement. They will come out and create a lot of trouble. Their population is ten times larger than the world's population.

Could this be why there are rumors of advanced underground civilizations? Like the one supposidly found by that expedition to antartica in `46? (not going to go into detail of it, research for yourselfs)

Great post OP, Avatars are great and completly nonthreatening. I hate coming upon a great thread like this 5 or 6 pages in, i have so many questions, comments, and moans of anguish i cant keep up, but i had to get in it at some point.

edit on 28-6-2011 by StratosFear because: (no reason given)

edit on 28-6-2011 by StratosFear because: Sorry youu guys i`m still figuring this whole posting process out.