Food For Thought.

According to freemasonry.bcy.ca...

Albert Pike's Morals & Dogma (1871) is a, "poorly organized, unindexed, and unreferenced, study in comparative religion..."

So, before you call me deranged, misled or evil you have to take into consideration the lack of proffesionalism Albert Pike displayed with his text.

You may argue that some of the sentences unreferenced are actually words and beliefs of Albert Pike. But you cannot however prove they aren't his words.

Originally posted by DetectivePerez
So, before you call me deranged, misled or evil you have to take into consideration the lack of proffesionalism Albert Pike displayed with his text.

First of all, the thought of you accusing Albert Pike of being unprofessional and not citing sources sufficiently recalls an old turn of phrase... "That's rich."

Anywa, regarding Albert Pike's supposed "unprofessionalism," the fact of the matter is that "Morals and Dogma of the Ancient and Accepted Scottish Rite" was written for who? Any guesses? Could it have been "The Ancient and Accepted Scottish Rite?" Yes! The book was written for consumption only by Scottish Rite members (I should note that it only makes sense after taking the degrees, but that's not the point I'm driving at here). The bok was most assuredly NOT written as an academic treatise. Pike himself mentions in the introduction that he has used other sources so freely, and without attribution, that nothing in the book should be considered his own work. I personally think he was being humble there, and that he simply wanted to avoid a book full of extensive footnotes, when his target audience may not have been used to such reading.

Regardless of all of this, if you actually READ the book (something I very sincerely doubt you have done, Detective Perez), you will see that it is fairly easy to distinguish where Bro. Pike is presenting his own views and where he is referring to the views of others. For the places where it isn't obvious, the reader is supposed to (SHOCK!) think for her- or himself.

I will buy the book and be posting comments on it in the coming week. After that i will make sure to burn it and purge my thoughts of his ideas and study the Bible and pray.

Originally posted by DetectivePerez
After that i will make sure to burn it

So... you enjoy wasting money, or what? If you already know you're going to burn the book before you even read it, why are you bothering to buy it? After all, the book is $45 off of Amazon... that's a lot of scratch. Tell you what, you send me $45 in the mail, and I'll burn half of it (the rest is a service fee).

Seriously, though, why bother buying the book when you've already made up your mind?

P.S. There's no way you're going to read through "Morals and Dogma" in a week, unless you intend to spend eight hours a day doing it, and already have a very good grounding in ancient religion and philosophy.

[edit on 9-8-2004 by AlexKennedy]

I've been reading "Morals and Dogma" for the last several months, taking my time to carefully contemplate Pike's profound thoughts. Often times I've found it necessary to reread entire sections inorder to properly understand Pike's writing in the context of Masonry and the time period in which it was written. Thus far I have completed roughly 2/3rds of M&D starting at the Apprentice degree going forward and I have also selectively read the sections most often used by Pike's critics. My conclusion is that Pike's critics are either liars or fools as no reasonable individual would conclude that Pike is a satanist.

Morals and Dogma as an ebook:
www.freemasons-freemasonry.com...
.


[edit on 9-8-2004 by df1]

Originally posted by DetectivePerez
According to freemasonry.bcy.ca...

Albert Pike's Morals & Dogma (1871) is a, "poorly organized, unindexed, and unreferenced, study in comparative religion..."

So, before you call me deranged, misled or evil you have to take into consideration the lack of proffesionalism Albert Pike displayed with his text.

You may argue that some of the sentences unreferenced are actually words and beliefs of Albert Pike. But you cannot however prove they aren't his words.

Perhaps we should examine the entire paragraph that you extracted your qoute from; agenda driven, and lessons in context.

From Detective Perez's own linked source!
Albert Pike's Morals & Dogma (1871) can easily be quoted out of context by anti-masons attempting to prove Freemasonry is satanic, luciferian, pagan or gnostic. Morals & Dogma quotes extensively from the texts of earlier authors. As a poorly organized, unindexed, and unreferenced, study in comparative religion, it is only by carefully noting context that the reader can determine where Pike is voicing an opinion and where he is simply detailing the opinions and beliefs of other writers, other cultures, or other times.
Not content with merely quoting Pike out of context, some anti-masonic writers will either concoct their own "quotes" or resort to the discredited "Lucifer is God" hoax of confessed fraud L�o Taxil.

I don't even know that I need to expand upon the quote DP, you took a quote out of context from a paragraph explaining how Anti-Masons take Albert Pikes "Morals And Dogma" out of context to portray him and Freemasonry in a negative light. Did you think that no one would check your source? I'm flabbergasted... really... a good piece of advice, don't go to a Grand Lodge website trying to get Anti-Masonic material unless you're really sure of what you're doing.

Barrel of Monkeys, not just for fun anymore...


[edit on 9/8/2004 by Mirthful Me]

And I thought you got my point which is: Pike brought all the rumors, theories and beliefs upon freemasonry.

And no, I am not going to burn the book before I read it Alex. I went to the mall tonight and they didn't have the book.

Originally posted by DetectivePerez
And I thought you got my point which is: Pike brought all the rumors, theories and beliefs upon freemasonry.

Huh? Are you trying to say that Albert Pike created all the theories and beliefs of Freemasonry, or are you trying to claim your bigotry, ignorance, and hatred are all Albert Pike's fault?

And no, I am not going to burn the book before I read it Alex. I went to the mall tonight and they didn't have the book.

Really? They didn't have Morals and Dogma at your local mall?! There's a shocker. My local mall has lots and lots of thousand-page books from the 19th century.

Anyway, you vastly misinterpreted what I said, which was (and I'm paraphrasing here) "Why bother buying a book you're just going to burn?" After all, you yourself said you were going to burn Morals and Dogma right after reading it (I think you may have trouble both with reading and burning such a big book).

Perez: I provided a link to an M&D ebook version in my previous post, so you have no excuse to continue misquoting or taking Pike out of context. Any devils or evil demons found in M&D are of the readers own making.
.

I tell you what... I will GIVE a free digital copy of morals and dogma, in MS Word format to anyone that emails me at [email protected]... no charge.

Originally posted by df1
I provided a link to an M&D ebook version in my previous post .

Perhaps it would be more beneficial if DetectivePerez read the ebook and then burned his computer.

I am utterly amazed at the number of people who seem twist facts and misquote others in an attempt to support twisted beliefs.

For several years I have been considering applying to join the ranks of the many great men called the Masons. My curiosity with the Masons began a few years ago when I had the honor of doing some construction work at the Supreme Council building in Washington D.C., I've gotta say that is one impressive building. My interest peaked about three weeks ago when I was up in Pennsylvania helping my dad sort through some of my recently departed grandmothers belongings. I happened upon the obituaries of my grandfather and uncle and found out that they had both been Masons. During my search to find out more about Masonry I stumbled upon this site. It didn't take too long to rationalize the few kernals of truth from the abundant chaff of lies presented here.

In my opinion, how can an orginization such as the Masons be bad when its opponents have to distort facts and even outright lie in a feeble attempt to slander it.


Thanks to DetectivePerez and his counterparts i shall be making further inquiries into joining the Brotherhood at the local lodge in Fredericksburg, Virginia

Perhaps.....

Starting with the Freemason connection to Dulce will send you in angles that will most likely force you to evade information. I would suggest to avoid the angles by moving through circles so to speak. For example. If you are 100% set on investigating freemasonry involvement, you will discredit other information that would conflict with information you want to here.

... you should follow your own advice?

This is getting ridiculous.

I'd love to know whether the same poeple who make these wild accusations about freemasonry ever spent any time in a University program that actually required them to do research and write essays. Would this crap have flown with your professors?

As far as I'm concerned, people who have not been exposed to the rigors of an intensive research-oriented unicversity/college program should be EXTRA careful when attempting to conduct "research."

Of course, I know people who have flunked out of such programs. I wonder why . . . . . .

Originally posted by Darktalon
Perhaps.....

Starting with the Freemason connection to Dulce will send you in angles that will most likely force you to evade information. I would suggest to avoid the angles by moving through circles so to speak. For example. If you are 100% set on investigating freemasonry involvement, you will discredit other information that would conflict with information you want to here.

... you should follow your own advice?

i second that big time...