"Do you want to play a game" aka "put yourself in their shoes: how to pull of 9/11"

I like your thinking Gamer_Over...

Originally posted by Alfie1

So the US administration not only controls the US news media but that of Europe, the Middle East, Far East etc.
Really ?

You don't have to control the media, only what information you release to the media.

(Remember WTC 7 being broadcast as collapsed, when it was still visible behind the reporter? Was the reporter reporting something they new, or something they were told to report? I think the answer is obvious)

If you OSers want to play this game you will have to come from out of your boxes, or else you'll just make yourselves look stupid.

Originally posted by Game_Over
Perhaps you can't...perhaps it just shows the OS is true? Who knows.

Perhaps the official account - as set out by the 911 Commission and NIST - is almost completely true. It still wouldn't rule out some level of active US government participation (and, I use the term 'US government', to mean a number of individuals from either the White House, the Pentagon or any goverment agency, whether official or unofficial).

One important omission from any official account is the alleged $100,000 money transfer to Mohamed Atta, which was ordered by General Mahmoud Ahmad... at the time, head of Pakistan's secret service, the ISI. Given this man is also alleged to have been in Washington on 911 meeting officials from the White House, the Pentagon and the CIA; and given also that he met Senator Graham and Congressman Goss (who went on the co-chair the 2002 Congressional inquiry into 911) for breakfast that day, a more thorough look at his potential involvement is vital, in my opinion.

Bear this mind and, again, I encourage you to read about the Strategy of Tension and Operation Cyclone. It's easy to see, not only how 911 could have been a false flag operation, but also how the official account can, at the very same time, be almost entirely accurate!!!

All right, let's pretend...

FIRST, I wouldn't waste my time framing some toilet of a country like Afghanistan that not even the Soviet Union thought was worth fighting over. I wouldn't even frame Iraq as Hussein became fairly toothless after the first Gulf war. I'd frame Iran and knock out two birds with one stone- eliminate their power base in the region and take their oil. Framing Venezuela would be my second choice as we'd get their oil and get rid of a Communist power base in the Americas, plus we wouldn't be getting any Muslim fanatics on our case.

SECOND, I wouldn't waste my time on any retarded [censored] like staging fake hijackings to cover up secretly planted bombs. Everyone knows bombs were planted in the WTC back in 1993 so I wouldn't even need to cover up any bombing.

THIRD, I wouldn't waste my time on any pointless antics like controlled demolitions. It's unnecessarily convoluted, there's too many way that it can go wrong, and it would need to involve too many people. I'd topple the towers right over and cause tens of thousands of casualties to make sure people are thoroughly going ape sh*t. Do you high school kids even fathom what "shock and awe" even is?

FOURTH, I wouldn't waste my time attacking the Pentagon. It's too large of a target to have any significant impact, the building doesn't much of a meaning to the typical American outside of being an office buiilding for generals, and the people who'd be killed are largely unknown to the rest of us. I'd crash the plane into a major iconic landmark like the Capitol building instead. Why do you think Hitler set fire to the Reichstag and not some farmer's tool shed?

FIFTH, why in the name of Mickey Mouse would I waste my time digging up a hole to fake a plane crash in the middle of nowhere in Pennsylvania? Is there some cow I need to assassinate to keep quiet or something? Scratch that entire nonsense off the list altogether

SIXTH, I wouldn't need to spend a dime on planting any disinformation. There are enough characters out there spinning bizarre stories of controlled demolitions, Jewish World Order plots, secret cults of Satan worshipping numerologists, lasers from outer space, hologram planes, etc as it is who'd do all the work for me. That French crackpot who wrote a book claiming a cruise missile hit the Pentagon is as blatant a snake oil peddler as someone can possibly get, and there are still people who believe him.

...so how does this exercise show that the 9/11 attack was a conspiracy, precisely?

It doesn't. It is just an exercise. Thank you for participating. Now that you've told us how you wouldn't pull of 9-11 as it happened -- mind telling us how you'd do it as it did happen?

Like I said, if the OS supporters cannot honestly explain to any of us how they would accomplish it, then maybe it can't be accomplished and the OS is true.

However, I have a feeling that once you start telling us how it could be accomplished, you may come to an uncomfortable place next time you spout off on "impossibilities"....

I encourage others to use their imagination. I am not talking about det cord and conventional rigging here. I am talking about high level military tech and media manipulation.

Things like this:

video.designworldonline.com...

Things like this:

www.youtube.com...

C'mon people! Use your imagination! Det cord! hahahahaha!!!!

reply to post by GoodOlDave


And I must add: your sig, featuring a quote from Clinton should also be bookended with,

"I did not have sexual relations with..."

Originally posted by GoodOlDave
All right, let's pretend...

FIRST, I wouldn't waste my time framing some toilet of a country like Afghanistan that not even the Soviet Union thought was worth fighting over. I wouldn't even frame Iraq as Hussein became fairly toothless after the first Gulf war. I'd frame Iran and knock out two birds with one stone- eliminate their power base in the region and take their oil. Framing Venezuela would be my second choice as we'd get their oil and get rid of a Communist power base in the Americas, plus we wouldn't be getting any Muslim fanatics on our case.

But Afghanistan was the goal. It wasn't just a convenient scapegoat. You have to have an agenda for your scenario, or what is the point?

SECOND, I wouldn't waste my time on any retarded [censored] like staging fake hijackings to cover up secretly planted bombs. Everyone knows bombs were planted in the WTC back in 1993 so I wouldn't even need to cover up any bombing.

To the extent bombs would have been planted to collapse three buildings would have been ridiculously suspicious to anyone with any sense. Your tactic would create more 'truthers' than the actual attacks did.
The planes created the shock and awe, to cover the collapses. How would you explain the buildings rigged for demolition? You refuse to believe that the towers could have been rigged for the real scenario, making many excuses that you think would make it impossible.

THIRD, I wouldn't waste my time on any pointless antics like controlled demolitions. It's unnecessarily convoluted, there's too many way that it can go wrong, and it would need to involve too many people. I'd topple the towers right over and cause tens of thousands of casualties to make sure people are thoroughly going ape sh*t. Do you high school kids even fathom what "shock and awe" even is?

Then you would not have had the cooperation of Larry, who you would have needed in order to fill the buildings with explosives without anyone questioning. You had to have someone on the inside to help it go smoothly, what if you were caught hallway through planting your explosives?

If you didn't have the owner on your side they would be a 'truther', and you would have to explain to them why their buildings could have been filled with explosives.

FOURTH, I wouldn't waste my time attacking the Pentagon. It's too large of a target to have any significant impact, the building doesn't much of a meaning to the typical American outside of being an office buiilding for generals, and the people who'd be killed are largely unknown to the rest of us. I'd crash the plane into a major iconic landmark like the Capitol building instead. Why do you think Hitler set fire to the Reichstag and not some farmer's tool shed?

Rubbish everyone knows the pentagon is the control center of our defense. You really want to blow up your own capital building, when you could blow up a section of the pentagon pre-prepared to cause minimum damage?

What difference does it make what building you attack? Wouldn't crashing four planes into the center of NY at rush hour kill many more people?

FIFTH, why in the name of Mickey Mouse would I waste my time digging up a hole to fake a plane crash in the middle of nowhere in Pennsylvania? Is there some cow I need to assassinate to keep quiet or something? Scratch that entire nonsense off the list altogether

Emotions Dave, maybe you don't have any? If you want the people to look at your scenario with their emotions rather than their intellect then you better do something to trigger those emotions. Otherwise people will see right through your plan. The crashed plane gave us the American 'heroes' story, brave Americans taking on the bad terrorists armed with box cutters. How are you going to create the emotional outrage that did?

SIXTH, I wouldn't need to spend a dime on planting any disinformation. There are enough characters out there spinning bizarre stories of controlled demolitions, Jewish World Order plots, secret cults of Satan worshipping numerologists, lasers from outer space, hologram planes, etc as it is who'd do all the work for me. That French crackpot who wrote a book claiming a cruise missile hit the Pentagon is as blatant a snake oil peddler as someone can possibly get, and there are still people who believe him.

How can you be sure that would happen in your case? Your scenario would fall apart like a cheap suit.

...so how does this exercise show that the 9/11 attack was a conspiracy, precisely?

Well Dave if you believe the OS then you believe people conspired to attack the US. It WAS a conspiracy.

Originally posted by Game_Over
It doesn't. It is just an exercise. Thank you for participating. Now that you've told us how you wouldn't pull of 9-11 as it happened -- mind telling us how you'd do it as it did happen?

If given liberty to introduce convolusion simply for adding convolution's sake I would...

a) try to find some young and exceptionally stupid zealot and convince him that hijacking planes will accomplish whatever higher goal he supported, and let him organize a cadre of co-hijackers. I would lead him to believe he was merely hijacking planes rather than launching a suicide attack

b) I would set myself up as an intermediary between said zealot cadre and Bin Laden and filter the communications in between them, so that Bin Laden would be told the hijackers were acting upon the hijacking plot as if it were their own idea, and the zealots would be told Bin Laden was giving them their blessings. Any money supplied to them would be told it was Al Qaida money rather than mine.

c) in the interim, I would rig the automatic pilot on several airplanes so that they could be overridden and taken over from the ground. I wouldn't tell this to the hijackers, of course.

d) once the hijackings proceeded, I would flip the switch and take remote control of the planes and then fly them into their respective buildings. The hijackers could do nothing but go along for the ride. By the time they realized they were had, it would be too late.

e) it would also explain why the plane crashed in Shanksville, because unknown to me, ground crews upgraded some critical control board that made it incompatable with my own system, so the second I flipped the switch the craft took a nose dive into the ground. Oh well, I can't have everything.

f) it would also be a complete fluke that the towers collapsed from the impacts. I wouldn't have known until after the fact that the towers were poorly designed and were a death trap waiting to happen. I would likewise laugh my [censored] off at all the gullible people who genuinely believed the double talk from the architects that the towers really weren't a death trap. What would they expect them to say, that it really was a death trap?

g) As for flight 77, my original target would have been the Capitol building, but my crummy black and white remote cameras aboard the plane can't distinguish it from the air from the 100,000 other large buildings in Washington, so I aim the plane instead at the one building I can recognize from the video stream- the weird looking Pentagon.

h) of course, I then reveal the connections between the hijackers and Bin Laden...mainly because I'm the one who created the connections...and Bin Laden's jaw will be so busy dropping onto the floor from his "Oh, sh*t, what have those idiots gotten me into!" moment that he can't possibly deny his involvement.

I) I still wouldn't have wasted my time framing a basket case like Afghanistan, though- it makes North Korea look like a paradise in comparison- so I can't come up with even a stupid hypothetical reason why I'd do it. The only thing I can think of is if I was gambling that he'd abandon Afghanistan from international pressure and seek refuge in some other country I did want to knock over, like Iraq or Syria.

Even hypothetically, it still throws most of these conspiracy scenarios into the trash.

Great. Thanks for participating.

I can see that at least you don't subscribe to the "It's impossible" camp. I understand that you have thought about it and researched it and made your decision. Great.

I guess the point I was trying to make was that it was possible that all of this an inside job. There was motive and opportunity. And therefore, like any crime, needs to be examined.

I am really just trying to get people off of the "It's impossible" line of thought and move toward an, "It is possible, but I do not believe that it happened" line of thought.

So the US administration not only controls the US news media but that of Europe, the Middle East, Far East etc.

Exactly how many of these rear end kissing major media outlets stood up and challenged the Iraq Weapons of Mass Destruction farce?

If my goal was to attack Afghanistan and Irak:

1) Make 4 planes disappear including their crew and passengers

2) Use 2 remote controlled planes, and 2 missiles to fake an attack.

3) Let 1 rocket explode in a field, just because its fun, and pretend it was one of the planes I made disappear.

4) Let 1 rocked explode in the pentagon, planes are expensive, and pretend it was one of the planes I made disappear.

5) Let the 2 planes hit the WTC towers.

7) Because I would know that this would not be enough to convince people to attack Afghanistan, I would also rig the buildings with super silent secret explosives nobody will notice, and blow them up some time after the planes hit the towers.

8) I would also rig and blow up an additional building with super silent secret explosives, just for fun.

9) Make up a plot where a bunch of Saudis hijacked the planes, Afghans or Iraqis would be too obvious.

That sounds like a well thought out plot with a low chance of failure. To be honest, I think anyone would call me silly if I came with such an idea if the subject was not 911.

Originally posted by ANOK

But Afghanistan was the goal. It wasn't just a convenient scapegoat. You have to have an agenda for your scenario, or what is the point?

All right, I'll bite- just *why* in the name of Kermit the Frog would anyone seriously want to conquer Afghanistan? The whole reason why the place is so [censored] up because once the Soviets left everyone abandoned it because it's so worthless to begin with. If the place had any secret reserves of oil, gold, or even Big Macs do you seriously think the Soviets would have left?

To the extent bombs would have been planted to collapse three buildings would have been ridiculously suspicious to anyone with any sense. Your tactic would create more 'truthers' than the actual attacks did.

Do you genuinely not know that the WTC was already bombed back in 1993?

Then you would not have had the cooperation of Larry, who you would have needed in order to fill the buildings with explosives without anyone questioning. You had to have someone on the inside to help it go smoothly, what if you were caught hallway through planting your explosives?

Easy- I would use whatever excuse you people would come up with for what I'd do if someone caught me in the hallway carrying the explosives, becuase your scenario has 110 times more likelihood of being discovered than mine.

Emotions Dave, maybe you don't have any? If you want the people to look at your scenario with their emotions rather than their intellect then you better do something to trigger those emotions. Otherwise people will see right through your plan.

Are you seriously suggesting that unless I fake a crash site out in the middle of nowhere that people will see right through my plan...?

The crashed plane gave us the American 'heroes' story, brave Americans taking on the bad terrorists armed with box cutters. How are you going to create the emotional outrage that did?

In case you hadn't noticed, toppling over two giant buildings and killing 10,000 people would create plenty of emotional outrage to spare. And you say that I'm the one without emotions?

On retrospect this is actually a very good thread. In the zeal of the conspiracy people pointing out how my conspiracy scenario is untenable, they're only submitting the exact same reasons for why their own conspiracy scenarios are untenable. The only difference is, I fully acknowledge my scenario is make believe.

FIRST, I wouldn't waste my time framing some toilet of a country like Afghanistan that not even the Soviet Union thought was worth fighting over.

A toilet of a country which is responsible for 90% of the world's poppy production. You do know what extremely profitable, illegal and tax free product is made from the poppy plant, right? You do know who directly controls and greatly profits from this product right? You do know that the Taliban was eradicating this plant prior to 911 right? You do know that this toilet country also has other valuable resources right? You also do know that the Afghanistan attack was planned well before 911 right? Or maybe I am just overestimating your intelligence and knowledge on this matter.

I wouldn't even frame Iraq as Hussein became fairly toothless after the first Gulf war. I'd frame Iran and knock out two birds with one stone- eliminate their power base in the region and take their oil.

If you're going to attack a powerhouse country like Iran (located half way around the world from the USA), would it not make sense to first attack and take over the surrounding oil rich/resource rich countries so you can have military bases (and fuel) nearby to initiate your bombing and ground missions from? Or does it make more sense for the US to attack Iran from thousands of miles away with no access to oil/fuel in the immediate area?

It's a good thing you're not a strategist for the American military. With your logic, you would have the entire armed forces decimated due to immense stupidity. But my guess is your "stupidity" is just an act for your little game of coverup, which obviously needs some brushing up.

All right, I'll bite- just *why* in the name of Kermit the Frog would anyone seriously want to conquer Afghanistan?

In September of 2001 the various branches of the United States Government released several statements detailing how The Taliban had control of the heroin industry in Afghanistan and was using the income to fund terrorism. The answer to your question is "To control the multi-billion dollar heroin infrastructure of Afghanistan".

reply to post by jprophet420


So what if the Afghans captured OBL and gave him to the USA? Wouldn't that be one enormous mission failed for the plotters? Doesn't that make it an extremely silly plan to begin with?

I wasn't saying your scenario goal is to conquer Iran or Iraq. I was saying your goal was to pull off the events of 9/11.

Is it not plausible that there are multiple goals achieved with this one day?

I find it odd how you don't include the erosion of America's freedom into your objectives. That was a goal and they have succeeded.

Just because elements of the US gov't were involved, does not mean they were doing it on behalf of any benefit to the US. Globalists are not tied to any one particular country.

I find it interesting in a way to hear what supporters of the OS think were the desired goals of this operation. It is pretty clear from even the few posts written that many have a difficult time looking at it from a NWO implementation angle.

reply to post by -PLB-


Who is to say they didn't hand him over? Maybe not even literally. Do I need to dig up the accounts of him being offered up on several occasions by foreign intelligence?

And perhaps part of your plan is that he is dead and or near death.

Remember, in this game, you control the media.

Is that plan really so silly now?

reply to post by Game_Over


It seems to me you also need to be in control of the military and the intelligence agencies, and have people inside that know of your plan.

So you are in control of almost everything, why not just make up a story that the Taliban wants to attack Pakistan, or another neighboring country, and the brave USA comes in to help out. You can even lie about the amount of troops you send, you can lie about anything. No need to blow up any WTC towers?

Originally posted by -PLB-
reply to post by jprophet420

 

So what if the Afghans captured OBL and gave him to the USA? Wouldn't that be one enormous mission failed for the plotters? Doesn't that make it an extremely silly plan to begin with?

Depends on who the plotters actually are KSM said he planned it, and there is a video of a person claiming to be OBL saying he plotted it.

I'm not an authority on silly plans as I am non-government affiliated.

reply to post by -PLB-
you for get that EPA was to fine the owner of WTC for not being up to date and having toxic martial, it was needed for them to come down the owner and the then pres were cousins and then through in the question of the gold. Was there or not gold? does any one really know and then you have the "P act" 20 lb book of rules passed in a week??? think about that one and yes it does weigh 20lbs

"It seems to me you also need to be in control of the military and the intelligence agencies, and have people inside that know of your plan."

-- I am telling you that, yes, in this scenario/fantasy/discussion, you do have control of the military and intelligence agencies. YOU ARE THE MILITARY/INTELLIGENCE AGENCIES. It is a simulation I am asking about.

"So you are in control of almost everything, why not just make up a story that the Taliban wants to attack Pakistan, or another neighboring country, and the brave USA comes in to help out. You can even lie about the amount of troops you send, you can lie about anything. No need to blow up any WTC towers? "

-- Watch a great documentary called, "War Made Easy". Narrated by Sean Penn. It really lays out clearly the way wars are started and then supported by North Americans throughout history. It is not conspiracy tinged, it is truth.

Read the Project for a New American Century (PNAC). You will find that in order to get Americans behind a war, one must first give them an event which brings them all together. Pearl Harbor. Tonkin. 9/11.

So, again, that is why you have to use your imagination my friend. Seriously, do you think Americans cared who the Taliban attacked before?