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Revelations: The secret of life, as revealed to John by the only-begotten Light.
page: 2share:
Originally posted by Joecroft
reply to post by Olise
Originally posted by Olise
Yes, he, the Only-Begotten Light is the Son of the Father; not the primate/carpenter, but the Spirit he hosted: as you can see from the Apocryphon of John, which I quoted earlier, "I took form in my SEED". What you call the Barbelo aspect is the TRUE WORD of the LIGHT, whom you refer to as Jesus: what you are troubled of is that which was referred to as The Stone which the builders rejected.
I don’t see Jesus as a “name”, I see him as a character with an essence and a personality. It is the personality of the spirit that dwelled in the body of a man named “Jesus”, whom I have come to know, and have accepted. I have also come to know the Father through him.
Blessed are you: for you have found!
Originally posted by Joecroft
reply to post by Olise
Originally posted by Olise
What do the builders of the Kingdom use in their construction?
My answer to your question is…”The Spirit of God.”
The building of the temple is a temple that is built from within a person.
Originally posted by Olise
What do the builders of the Kingdom use in their construction? Is it not the Word, which they compiled into what they call the Bible? Yet the most important of all the books, which is the True Revelation of the Savior who is the Divine Light of the Father, they left out: in essence, in rejecting his Word they rejected Him; but what's new. As it is written, "The Stone which the builders reject is (will) become the Head-Stone of the corner: (it states, IS because all things have been written into being, see Psalm 139: 16); it is a stone of stumbling and a rock of offence to both the houses of Israel, (which houses are Judaism and Christianity).
Jesus is regarded as the “corner stone” which people have rejected, but like I said above, people (Christians) come to believe in "Jesus", the personality. So even if they are not aware of the Barbelo aspect; have they really rejected Jesus?…I don’t believe they have...
Judaism on the other hand, I can understand…
The builders of the Kingdom, NOT builders of the Temple (two different things), which are the priests, pastors, preachers, etc, use the Word of God as their material with which they build the kingdom of God; that's why I posed the question to you. The Spirit of God should be the Guide/Director they should look to in the construction, which is not the case; but the material used is the Word. And the Wor d of God comes by inspiration/thought to man; but in this case, the Word came directly from the Spirit of Jesus to John, after his resurrection; but this Word was one of those disallowed by the church from being included in the canoncical Bible.
The Stone is the Savior, the Rock of Salvation, which is the Spirit that Jesus hosted as Man; but if you go back to Moses, when the children of Israel sought water in the desert, they cried up to Moses, and he was instructed (inspired) to strike the rock and the water (Word of life) will flow to nourish the children of Isarel; and this happen on two seperate occassions: the first time, Massah/Temptation/Sin, conciliated in the example of Jesus, in whose stripes you were taught the antidote of sin; and the second time Meribah/Strife/Iniquity, to be conciliated in the Last, making peace, reconciling all in the unity of faith: Exodus 17 and Numbers 20; for striking the rock signifies striking the Rock of Salvation.
Thus Isaiah 12 states, "With joy shall you draw water out of the wells of salvation"; and Hosea 6, "For the Lord shall come to us as the latter and the former rain unto the earth: (teachers of righteousness, according to righteousness)". So as you can see, the water is the Word which comes from the Rock/Stone, the Corner-Stone; even as the law came on two stones which were not cut out by the hands of a man, but by the Spirit: likewise the Word (Apocryphon of John) did not come by the inspired handwriting of man, but by the Spirit of the Son of God who revealed it directly to John after the Resurection: yet the church rejected it.
The Jews did not reject the Spirit: they rejected Jesus because they could not understand the Spirit which was in him, the things he was saying and doing being contrary to what they were conditioned to believe; the same goes for the Christian church which also could not understand the Spirit in the Word which was revealed to John, being contrary to the Word they have been conditioned to believe: for to them it was somewhat different from that which was written in the book of the man Moses. Hence Isaiah 52 had said, "That which had not been told them shall they see, (as in the first coming in Jesus); and that which they had not heard shall they consider!
This also is the reason why it states, "I lay in Zion a chief corner stone, elect, precious: and whosever believes on him shall not be CONFOUNDED. (Believing on him is believing on what he is saying.) To you which believe he is precious; but to them which are disobedient, the stone which the builders DISALLOWED, the same is made the head of the corner, and a stone of stumbling, and a rock of offence, even to them which stumble at the WORD": 1st Peter 2; of which Isaiah also adds, "But for a stone of stumbling and for a rock of offence to both the houses of Israel"; both the houses of Israel are the Jews and the Christians.
So believing Jesus does not constitute believing his word: for it is not about the man, but the Word which the man was sent to deliver, which Word in question was actually delivered directly by the Spirit. Its the same as if the Jews had known who it is they were condemning, would they have condemn the rock of their salvation? Yet so also shall the Christians reject the rock of their salvation!
Originally posted by Joecroft
reply to post by Olise
Yes I agree, and you have much wisdom. It was easier in one respect, for myself, in that I had no prier religion clouding my judgment, but it was difficult in another sense because I didn’t believe in a God, and there were so many people out claiming to have truth, it was a daunting task to know where, and how to begin. I found God by searching with all my heart, soul and mind and I believe others can do the same.
Yes, one finds God by seeking within: for nothing a man can tell you will make a difference in you if the Spirit does not awaken you. The problem is the human seeks from without, hence they look up to idols, and hence they make the man Jesus to be God, instead of looking within, through the "Worm hole" so-to-speak back to the source; hence this word, "When you find the true Word, you will be troubled, and will become amazed".
Originally posted by Joecroft
reply to post by Olise
On a Side note – When you first appeared on the other thread, I started to read an article on your “WaterofShiloh” website, entitled “truth” (I think), I really enjoyed some of the things you had to say, regarding creation and science; I read about 7 pages, but didn’t have time to read anymore. I went back few days later to read more, but your site was and has been since, closed for reconstruction.
Yes, the website "Life" is under reconstruction: changes are being made; and when it is ready, it will be relunched. If you are still following this thread at that time, you will know: for I will let everyone known.
Peace be with you Joe!!!
edit on 26-6-2011 by Olise because: (no reason given)
edit on 26-6-2011 by Olise because: (no reason
given)
edit on 26-6-2011 by Olise because: (no reason given)
edit on 26-6-2011 by Olise because: (no reason
given)
reply to post by Olise
Hey Olise
Thanks… but I don’t feel better than anyone else; if anything I feel a greater responsibility. But I also understand that God works in Spirit, and that in some ways it us up to each individual to try and find God themselves. In other words, no man can give you the born of the Spirit experience, because it is something that must be sought after.
When I brought up the word “temple”, I wasn’t taking about a building. Jesus said he would rebuild the temple in 3 days, but he really meant his body and the resurrection. So he was talking about his body, and the foundation of the body, is the Spirit! Hence the building of the Kingdom is built up by the Holy Spirit i.e. the “Spirit of God”, within those who come to believe in Jesus.
Well, apart from what I have read on this thread, I’ve never read the ‘Apocryphon of John”, although I am slowly working my way through all of the Gnostic texts. Maybe the ‘Apocryphon of John”, should not have been rejected by the early church, but I can’t really give an opinion until I learn more about it.
But the point I am trying to make is that whether or not the “Apocryphon of John” should have been included; it has not prevented people from hearing/finding Jesus words through the rest of the 4 gospels. I myself am living proof, of someone who came to find Jesus and understand what it means to believe in him, based only on the 4 gospels.
The Jews rejected Jesus because that day at the temple, they thought he was claming to be God, when he said, “I and the Father are one”. But IMO I believe the Jews misunderstood what Jesus really meant, which is the one of the main reasons they rejected him; because it is written the Old Testament that “you should have no other Gods before me” and ‘God is one” etc. This belief has carried over today, into most Christian denominations, but the difference is, that at least the Christians have accepted Jesus the person, even if they don’t get it.
Yes, but many Christians do believe in his Word, which was delivered by the man (Jesus). IMO The Spirit of God shines through the 4 gospels, so even if people do not fully understand it, they can still come to receive the Holy Spirit through it… including those, who wrongly IMO, see Jesus as God. The reason I say this, is because even if their understanding is slightly incorrect or wrong etc, they have still gotten to know the personality who is Jesus, which is why I don’t believe they have rejected him.
Yes, I agree. All truth lies within a person…
Outward things should only confirm the truths that are already hidden within…
Peace be with you Olise!!!
- JC
Hey Olise
Originally posted by Olise
Blessed are you: for you have found!
Thanks… but I don’t feel better than anyone else; if anything I feel a greater responsibility. But I also understand that God works in Spirit, and that in some ways it us up to each individual to try and find God themselves. In other words, no man can give you the born of the Spirit experience, because it is something that must be sought after.
Originally posted by Olise
What do the builders of the Kingdom use in their construction?
Originally posted by Joecroft
My answer to your question is…”The Spirit of God.”
The building of the temple is a temple that is built from within a person.
Originally posted by Olise
The builders of the Kingdom, NOT builders of the Temple (two different things), which are the priests, pastors, preachers, etc, use the Word of God as their material with which they build the kingdom of God; that's why I posed the question to you. The Spirit of God should be the Guide/Director they should look to in the construction, which is not the case; but the material used is the Word. And the Wor d of God comes by inspiration/thought to man; but in this case, the Word came directly from the Spirit of Jesus to John, after his resurrection; but this Word was one of those disallowed by the church from being included in the canoncical Bible.
When I brought up the word “temple”, I wasn’t taking about a building. Jesus said he would rebuild the temple in 3 days, but he really meant his body and the resurrection. So he was talking about his body, and the foundation of the body, is the Spirit! Hence the building of the Kingdom is built up by the Holy Spirit i.e. the “Spirit of God”, within those who come to believe in Jesus.
Originally posted by Olise
Thus Isaiah 12 states, "With joy shall you draw water out of the wells of salvation"; and Hosea 6, "For the Lord shall come to us as the latter and the former rain unto the earth: (teachers of righteousness, according to righteousness)". So as you can see, the water is the Word which comes from the Rock/Stone, the Corner-Stone; even as the law came on two stones which were not cut out by the hands of a man, but by the Spirit: likewise the Word (Apocryphon of John) did not come by the inspired handwriting of man, but by the Spirit of the Son of God who revealed it directly to John after the Resurection: yet the church rejected it.
Well, apart from what I have read on this thread, I’ve never read the ‘Apocryphon of John”, although I am slowly working my way through all of the Gnostic texts. Maybe the ‘Apocryphon of John”, should not have been rejected by the early church, but I can’t really give an opinion until I learn more about it.
But the point I am trying to make is that whether or not the “Apocryphon of John” should have been included; it has not prevented people from hearing/finding Jesus words through the rest of the 4 gospels. I myself am living proof, of someone who came to find Jesus and understand what it means to believe in him, based only on the 4 gospels.
Originally posted by Olise
The Jews did not reject the Spirit: they rejected Jesus because they could not understand the Spirit which was in him, the things he was saying and doing being contrary to what they were conditioned to believe; the same goes for the Christian church which also could not understand the Spirit in the Word which was revealed to John, being contrary to the Word they have been conditioned to believe: for to them it was somewhat different from that which was written in the book of the man Moses. Hence Isaiah 52 had said, "That which had not been told them shall they see, (as in the first coming in Jesus); and that which they had not heard shall they consider!
The Jews rejected Jesus because that day at the temple, they thought he was claming to be God, when he said, “I and the Father are one”. But IMO I believe the Jews misunderstood what Jesus really meant, which is the one of the main reasons they rejected him; because it is written the Old Testament that “you should have no other Gods before me” and ‘God is one” etc. This belief has carried over today, into most Christian denominations, but the difference is, that at least the Christians have accepted Jesus the person, even if they don’t get it.
Originally posted by Olise
So believing Jesus does not constitute believing his word: for it is not about the man, but the Word which the man was sent to deliver, which Word in question was actually delivered directly by the Spirit. Its the same as if the Jews had known who it is they were condemning, would they have condemn the rock of their salvation? Yet so also shall the Christians reject the rock of their salvation!
Yes, but many Christians do believe in his Word, which was delivered by the man (Jesus). IMO The Spirit of God shines through the 4 gospels, so even if people do not fully understand it, they can still come to receive the Holy Spirit through it… including those, who wrongly IMO, see Jesus as God. The reason I say this, is because even if their understanding is slightly incorrect or wrong etc, they have still gotten to know the personality who is Jesus, which is why I don’t believe they have rejected him.
Originally posted by Olise
Yes, one finds God by seeking within: for nothing a man can tell you will make a difference in you if the Spirit does not awaken you. The problem is the human seeks from without, hence they look up to idols, and hence they make the man Jesus to be God, instead of looking within, through the "Worm hole" so-to-speak back to the source; hence this word, "When you find the true Word, you will be troubled, and will become amazed".
Yes, I agree. All truth lies within a person…
Outward things should only confirm the truths that are already hidden within…
Peace be with you Olise!!!
- JC
In continuation:
"And he devised a plan with his powers; and he sent his angels to the daughters of men so that they might take some of them for themselves and raise offspring of their seed through them, to be a pleasurable respite for them. At first they were not successful; and so they gathered together again and made another plan: they created a despicable spirit in the likeness of the Spirit who had descended so that through it they might pollute the souls.
And the angels altered their appearances into the likeness of the women’s husbands, and sated the women with their spirit out of wickedness, pervading them with the spirit of darkness and evil, which they had mixed for them. They brought them gold, silver, gifts, metals of copper, iron and all sorts, with which they distracted them, beguiling them into temptation and enslaving them to vanity: leading them astray so that they would not remember their immovable Pronoia. Having enticed them with these things, they took them and begot children of darkness according to the likeness of their counterfeit spirit: for the despicable spirit closed the children’s hearts, hardening them even up till now.
Therefore I, the perfect Pronoia of the All, took form in my seed, for I existed first, traveling on every road: for I am the wealth of the light, the remembrance of the Fullness. I traveled into the vast realm of darkness, and I persevered until I entered the midst of the prison/flesh; and the foundations of chaos quaked. And I hid myself from them because of their wickedness, and they did not recognize me.
Again I returned for the second time and I went about: I came forth into those who belong to the light, which light is I, the remembrance of the Pronoia; I entered the midst of the dark and the inside of Hades, seeking to put my household in order: (that she might rectify her deficiency): and the foundations of chaos quaked in such a way that it seemed they would fall down upon those who dwell in the chaos and destroy them; and again I fled back up to my luminous root so that they would not be prematurely destroyed.
Still for a third time, I who am the light that exists in the light and the remembrance of the Pronoia, I traveled in order to enter into the midst of the darkness and the inside of Hades. I filled my countenance with the light of the consummation of their aeon; and I entered the midst of their prison, which is the prison of the body: and I said, ‘Whoever hears, arise from lethargic sleep!’ And he wept, shedding tears; heavy tears he wiped from himself: and he said, ‘Who is it who calls my name and from where does this hope come to me, I who am dwelling in the fetters of the prison/flesh?’ [This is the calling.]
And I said, ‘I am the Pronoia of the pure light; I am the thought of the virginal Spirit, the one who raises you to the place of honor: [hence the deficient yet ask for proof]. Arise and remember that it is you who hearkened (to the call); and follow your root, which is I, the compassionate. Fortify yourself against the angels of poverty and the demons of chaos and all those who ensnare you; be watchful of the lethargic sleep and the garment of the inside of Hades.’ And I raised him up and sealed him with the light of the water with five seals so that death would not have power over him from this day on.
[This is the calling which is heard within everyone, which some choose to ignore, having been hardened; and some hearken to, seeking the true light of life which was veiled.]
Behold, now I will go up to the perfect aeon. I have completed everything for you in your hearing. I have told you (John) all things so that you might write them down and give them in secret to your fellow spirits. I will teach you about what will happen, which is to come. For this mystery is of the immoveable generation.”
And the Savior gave these things to him so that he might write them down and keep them secure. And he said to him, “Cursed be any one who should exchange these things for a gift, whether for food or drink or clothing or anything else of this kind.” [And that you should know, this is why the so-called church left this Stone out of the canonical Bible, for fear of the curse; in that all the church is interested in is their belly: profiteering.]
And these things were given to him in a mystery. And immediately the Savior disappeared before him. And he (John) went to his fellow disciples; and he related to them all these things which the Savior had said to him.
Jesus Christ Amen.
This is the Secrets of the Heavens which was revealed to John: this is the Stone which the builders of the kingdom rejected: the hidden Manna right before your eyes, which you rejected, seeking instead worldly doctrines, which the quails signify: see Numbers 11. The kingdom of heaven is built with the Word of God, which serves as the constructing material: it’s not a kingdom built with hands and with worldly materials; but the so-called builders of the kingdom at the first rejected the Stone which came in human form, and they that supposed they knew him also disallowed his Word from being included in the canonical Bible, deeming it unworthy, which Word is the Revelation of the Secrets of the Heavens which the Only-begotten Light of the Father revealed to John, which is the sure foundation of the kingdom, the knowledge of the beginning and the mystery of all that is.
It is written, 1st Peter 2, "I lay in Zion a chief corner stone, elect, precious: and whosoever believes on him shall not be confounded. (Believing on him is believing on the Word.) To you which believe he is precious; but to them which are disobedient, the stone which the builders disallowed, the same is made the head of the corner, and a stone of stumbling, and a rock of offence, even to them which stumble at the Word"; of which Isaiah also adds, "He shall be for a sanctuary sought; but for a stone of stumbling and for a rock of offence to both the houses of Israel"; and both houses of Israel are the Jews and the Christians, the supposed children of promise who do not know their right from their left: having been misled by the counterfeit spirit, they contaminated the Word of God to justify their prejudice. Thus you were told, The Man's sensibility was covered with insensibility.
It is written in Moses, Numbers 11, "The mixed multitude that made up the children of Israel fell a-lusting; and they wept, saying, ‘Who shall give us flesh to eat? We remember all the goodies that we received in Egypt freely (which is what you call blessings today), but now all we have is this manna.’ And the manna was as coriander seed (medicinal) and its color was of bdellium (crystal-like/pearly). And the people went about gathering it, and ground it in mills, or beat it in a mortar, and baked it in pans, (hence you were told in Revelation 3: 18, I counsel you to buy of me gold tried in the fire; discern also Matthew 13: 44-48), and made cakes of it: and it tasted as fresh oil (an anointing).
And when the dew fell upon the camp in the night (a time of darkness), the manna fell upon it. And Moses was instructed by the LORD to tell the children of Israel, "In that you have despised the LORD which is among you (in your midst: for as it was at the first, so shall it be at the last), seeking instead to return to the ways of Egypt, sanctify yourselves against tomorrow: for you shall eat flesh until you loath it. And there went forth a wind from the LORD, and brought quails from the sea, and let them fall by the camp, as it were the way of this day (the times: as in the First), and as it were the way of that day (to come: the Last), and as it were two (2) cubits high (as in, two thousand years) upon the face of the earth (throughout the earth). And they stood up all day and all night gathering quail; and they spread them all abroad for themselves. And while the meat was yet in their mouth, the LORD smote them with a very great plague. And it is called The Graves of Lust today."
You were told in Luke 17, "As the lightening that lightens/enlightens out of the one part under heaven, shines unto the other part under heaven; so shall also the Son of man be in his day (the time of the Last). But first must he suffer many things, and be rejected of this generation. And as it was in the days of Noah, so shall it be also in the days of the Son of man. Likewise also as it was in the days of Lot (days of the abominable deeds of Sodom, which you see today), they did all their heart’s desires; but the same day that Lot went out of Sodom it rained fire and brimstone from heaven, and destroyed them all. Even thus shall it be in the day when the Son of man is revealed". Discern also Acts 3: 19 – 26.
To be continued tomorrow...
Peace be with you!!!
"And he devised a plan with his powers; and he sent his angels to the daughters of men so that they might take some of them for themselves and raise offspring of their seed through them, to be a pleasurable respite for them. At first they were not successful; and so they gathered together again and made another plan: they created a despicable spirit in the likeness of the Spirit who had descended so that through it they might pollute the souls.
And the angels altered their appearances into the likeness of the women’s husbands, and sated the women with their spirit out of wickedness, pervading them with the spirit of darkness and evil, which they had mixed for them. They brought them gold, silver, gifts, metals of copper, iron and all sorts, with which they distracted them, beguiling them into temptation and enslaving them to vanity: leading them astray so that they would not remember their immovable Pronoia. Having enticed them with these things, they took them and begot children of darkness according to the likeness of their counterfeit spirit: for the despicable spirit closed the children’s hearts, hardening them even up till now.
Therefore I, the perfect Pronoia of the All, took form in my seed, for I existed first, traveling on every road: for I am the wealth of the light, the remembrance of the Fullness. I traveled into the vast realm of darkness, and I persevered until I entered the midst of the prison/flesh; and the foundations of chaos quaked. And I hid myself from them because of their wickedness, and they did not recognize me.
Again I returned for the second time and I went about: I came forth into those who belong to the light, which light is I, the remembrance of the Pronoia; I entered the midst of the dark and the inside of Hades, seeking to put my household in order: (that she might rectify her deficiency): and the foundations of chaos quaked in such a way that it seemed they would fall down upon those who dwell in the chaos and destroy them; and again I fled back up to my luminous root so that they would not be prematurely destroyed.
Still for a third time, I who am the light that exists in the light and the remembrance of the Pronoia, I traveled in order to enter into the midst of the darkness and the inside of Hades. I filled my countenance with the light of the consummation of their aeon; and I entered the midst of their prison, which is the prison of the body: and I said, ‘Whoever hears, arise from lethargic sleep!’ And he wept, shedding tears; heavy tears he wiped from himself: and he said, ‘Who is it who calls my name and from where does this hope come to me, I who am dwelling in the fetters of the prison/flesh?’ [This is the calling.]
And I said, ‘I am the Pronoia of the pure light; I am the thought of the virginal Spirit, the one who raises you to the place of honor: [hence the deficient yet ask for proof]. Arise and remember that it is you who hearkened (to the call); and follow your root, which is I, the compassionate. Fortify yourself against the angels of poverty and the demons of chaos and all those who ensnare you; be watchful of the lethargic sleep and the garment of the inside of Hades.’ And I raised him up and sealed him with the light of the water with five seals so that death would not have power over him from this day on.
[This is the calling which is heard within everyone, which some choose to ignore, having been hardened; and some hearken to, seeking the true light of life which was veiled.]
Behold, now I will go up to the perfect aeon. I have completed everything for you in your hearing. I have told you (John) all things so that you might write them down and give them in secret to your fellow spirits. I will teach you about what will happen, which is to come. For this mystery is of the immoveable generation.”
And the Savior gave these things to him so that he might write them down and keep them secure. And he said to him, “Cursed be any one who should exchange these things for a gift, whether for food or drink or clothing or anything else of this kind.” [And that you should know, this is why the so-called church left this Stone out of the canonical Bible, for fear of the curse; in that all the church is interested in is their belly: profiteering.]
And these things were given to him in a mystery. And immediately the Savior disappeared before him. And he (John) went to his fellow disciples; and he related to them all these things which the Savior had said to him.
Jesus Christ Amen.
This is the Secrets of the Heavens which was revealed to John: this is the Stone which the builders of the kingdom rejected: the hidden Manna right before your eyes, which you rejected, seeking instead worldly doctrines, which the quails signify: see Numbers 11. The kingdom of heaven is built with the Word of God, which serves as the constructing material: it’s not a kingdom built with hands and with worldly materials; but the so-called builders of the kingdom at the first rejected the Stone which came in human form, and they that supposed they knew him also disallowed his Word from being included in the canonical Bible, deeming it unworthy, which Word is the Revelation of the Secrets of the Heavens which the Only-begotten Light of the Father revealed to John, which is the sure foundation of the kingdom, the knowledge of the beginning and the mystery of all that is.
It is written, 1st Peter 2, "I lay in Zion a chief corner stone, elect, precious: and whosoever believes on him shall not be confounded. (Believing on him is believing on the Word.) To you which believe he is precious; but to them which are disobedient, the stone which the builders disallowed, the same is made the head of the corner, and a stone of stumbling, and a rock of offence, even to them which stumble at the Word"; of which Isaiah also adds, "He shall be for a sanctuary sought; but for a stone of stumbling and for a rock of offence to both the houses of Israel"; and both houses of Israel are the Jews and the Christians, the supposed children of promise who do not know their right from their left: having been misled by the counterfeit spirit, they contaminated the Word of God to justify their prejudice. Thus you were told, The Man's sensibility was covered with insensibility.
It is written in Moses, Numbers 11, "The mixed multitude that made up the children of Israel fell a-lusting; and they wept, saying, ‘Who shall give us flesh to eat? We remember all the goodies that we received in Egypt freely (which is what you call blessings today), but now all we have is this manna.’ And the manna was as coriander seed (medicinal) and its color was of bdellium (crystal-like/pearly). And the people went about gathering it, and ground it in mills, or beat it in a mortar, and baked it in pans, (hence you were told in Revelation 3: 18, I counsel you to buy of me gold tried in the fire; discern also Matthew 13: 44-48), and made cakes of it: and it tasted as fresh oil (an anointing).
And when the dew fell upon the camp in the night (a time of darkness), the manna fell upon it. And Moses was instructed by the LORD to tell the children of Israel, "In that you have despised the LORD which is among you (in your midst: for as it was at the first, so shall it be at the last), seeking instead to return to the ways of Egypt, sanctify yourselves against tomorrow: for you shall eat flesh until you loath it. And there went forth a wind from the LORD, and brought quails from the sea, and let them fall by the camp, as it were the way of this day (the times: as in the First), and as it were the way of that day (to come: the Last), and as it were two (2) cubits high (as in, two thousand years) upon the face of the earth (throughout the earth). And they stood up all day and all night gathering quail; and they spread them all abroad for themselves. And while the meat was yet in their mouth, the LORD smote them with a very great plague. And it is called The Graves of Lust today."
You were told in Luke 17, "As the lightening that lightens/enlightens out of the one part under heaven, shines unto the other part under heaven; so shall also the Son of man be in his day (the time of the Last). But first must he suffer many things, and be rejected of this generation. And as it was in the days of Noah, so shall it be also in the days of the Son of man. Likewise also as it was in the days of Lot (days of the abominable deeds of Sodom, which you see today), they did all their heart’s desires; but the same day that Lot went out of Sodom it rained fire and brimstone from heaven, and destroyed them all. Even thus shall it be in the day when the Son of man is revealed". Discern also Acts 3: 19 – 26.
To be continued tomorrow...
Peace be with you!!!
Originally posted by Joecroft
reply to post by Olise
Hey Olise
Originally posted by Olise
Blessed are you: for you have found!
Thanks… but I don’t feel better than anyone else; if anything I feel a greater responsibility. But I also understand that God works in Spirit, and that in some ways it us up to each individual to try and find God themselves. In other words, no man can give you the born of the Spirit experience, because it is something that must be sought after.
That is correct; and that is the reason for the tribulations: for they do turn your mind toward God when you go through rough, life changing, experiences.
Originally posted by Joecroft
reply to post by Olise
Originally posted by Olise
What do the builders of the Kingdom use in their construction?
Originally posted by Joecroft
My answer to your question is…”The Spirit of God.”
The building of the temple is a temple that is built from within a person.
Originally posted by Olise
The builders of the Kingdom, NOT builders of the Temple (two different things), which are the priests, pastors, preachers, etc, use the Word of God as their material with which they build the kingdom of God; that's why I posed the question to you. The Spirit of God should be the Guide/Director they should look to in the construction, which is not the case; but the material used is the Word. And the Wor d of God comes by inspiration/thought to man; but in this case, the Word came directly from the Spirit of Jesus to John, after his resurrection; but this Word was one of those disallowed by the church from being included in the canoncical Bible.
When I brought up the word “temple”, I wasn’t taking about a building. Jesus said he would rebuild the temple in 3 days, but he really meant his body and the resurrection. So he was talking about his body, and the foundation of the body, is the Spirit! Hence the building of the Kingdom is built up by the Holy Spirit i.e. the “Spirit of God”, within those who come to believe in Jesus.
I understood what you were trying to say Joe, but I had to clarify it for others reading this thread to understand. Also, as I stated above, the material used in building the kingdom is what I am referring to: for though the Spirit directs the construction, the material used is the Word of God. And discern what it is saying, "The builders of the kingdom", NOT "The Builder of the Kingdom": the Builder of the Kingdom is he, the Holy Spirit, which directs the construction, and whom they do not listen to: and he WILL NOT reject the foundation stone of the Kingdom; but the builders which rejected (at the first) and disallowed the STONE as a part of the MATERIAL for constructing the kingdom are the priests, preachers etc. For as he was rejected at the first, and his word also; so has his word been disallowed by those who claim to be his, who also will reject him at the last.
Originally posted by Joecroft
reply to post by Olise
Originally posted by Olise
Thus Isaiah 12 states, "With joy shall you draw water out of the wells of salvation"; and Hosea 6, "For the Lord shall come to us as the latter and the former rain unto the earth: (teachers of righteousness, according to righteousness)". So as you can see, the water is the Word which comes from the Rock/Stone, the Corner-Stone; even as the law came on two stones which were not cut out by the hands of a man, but by the Spirit: likewise the Word (Apocryphon of John) did not come by the inspired handwriting of man, but by the Spirit of the Son of God who revealed it directly to John after the Resurection: yet the church rejected it.
Well, apart from what I have read on this thread, I’ve never read the ‘Apocryphon of John”, although I am slowly working my way through all of the Gnostic texts. Maybe the ‘Apocryphon of John”, should not have been rejected by the early church, but I can’t really give an opinion until I learn more about it.
But the point I am trying to make is that whether or not the “Apocryphon of John” should have been included; it has not prevented people from hearing/finding Jesus words through the rest of the 4 gospels. I myself am living proof, of someone who came to find Jesus and understand what it means to believe in him, based only on the 4 gospels.
The Apocryphon of John, which really means "Texts of the Secrets of the Heavens which the Lord revealed to John", (1) to reveal to his brethren, fellow disciples; and (2) to safeguard, for it will be rejected, yet shall be restored: hence Matthew 13: 44-49; and it is that which I have been unveiling on this thread.
You must understand that the four Gospels in the canonical Bible have been contaminated through prejudice, and they do not explain to you the beginning of all things and the reason for all that is: and because of that, the Christian faith today is in such disarray, misleading and condemning not only each denomination, but also other religions, contrary to the teachings of Jesus. You were told, It is not the hearers of the word that are righteous, but the doers, they that exemplify godliness; and one cannot exemplify that which he is ignorant of. And for this same reason today you have a multitude of people turning away from Christianity and speaking evil of God.
As it was with Judaism, so it also is and shall be with Christianity, even that which Jesus spoke to the Pharisees in Matthew 23, saying, "Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees! for you compass sea and land to make one proselyte, and when he is made, you make him twofold more the child of hell than yourselves." As stated in The Gospel of Thomas, "Have you found the beginning yet, that you seek to understand [the experience, let alone] the end? When you discern the beginning, then you will understand all these things, including the end: for where the beginning is there shall [that which might seem as] the end also be.”
So you see, it is necessary to understand the beginning, which will help you understand why man is in the state he is in, why Christ is exemplifying the Word, and the purpose of the Last, as contained in both revelations to John: without understanding the first revelation, one cannot make sense of the last revelation.
Originally posted by Joecroft
reply to post by Olise
Originally posted by Olise
The Jews did not reject the Spirit: they rejected Jesus because they could not understand the Spirit which was in him, the things he was saying and doing being contrary to what they were conditioned to believe; the same goes for the Christian church which also could not understand the Spirit in the Word which was revealed to John, being contrary to the Word they have been conditioned to believe: for to them it was somewhat different from that which was written in the book of the man Moses. Hence Isaiah 52 had said, "That which had not been told them shall they see, (as in the first coming in Jesus); and that which they had not heard shall they consider!
The Jews rejected Jesus because that day at the temple, they thought he was claming to be God, when he said, “I and the Father are one”. But IMO I believe the Jews misunderstood what Jesus really meant, which is the one of the main reasons they rejected him; because it is written the Old Testament that “you should have no other Gods before me” and ‘God is one” etc. This belief has carried over today, into most Christian denominations, but the difference is, that at least the Christians have accepted Jesus the person, even if they don’t get it.
The Jews rejected Jesus because they could not understand the doctrine he was preaching to them, going back to the beginning of his ministry, see Luke 4: and it was not the poor that rejected him, but they that assumed they had knowledge. They also assumed that, inspite of him saying to them that the words he speaks to them is from his Father, he was making himself equal with God by the things he said and calliing God his Father, which if they knew the truth they would not condemn him for that; and the four gospels do not expound on how Jesus became Son of God: if anything, it opens the door for questions and disbelief; but the Apocryphon of John explains in detail what makes him, i.e. the Spirit he embodied, the Only-begotten Son/Light of the Father.
And as stated in John 8, "I speak that which I have seen with my Father; and you do that which you have seen with your father (the counterfeit spirit: discern also John 3: 32-34; and think about it, If someone were to tell you that, without you understanding what he is actually saying to you, will you take it lightly? Will you not seek to silence him, if not kill him? for he just called you the child of the devil!). For if God were your Father, you would love me: for I proceeded forth and came from God; neither came I of myself, but he sent me. You do not understand my speach because it is foreign to you, being that your father is the devil, and the lusts of your father will you do."
And it is one thing to accept Jesus as Lord, sent from God; yet it is another thing to worship the man Jesus as God. It will surprise you to learn what the second/last coming of Christ is, when it will be and the purpose. Yet without understanding the foundation of all things, the purpose and coming of the Last will not make sense. You will be surprised that as Jesus was rejected at the first, so also shall the Last be rejected: for what they are expecting is not what they will see! So as you said, "At least they have accepted Jesus the person, even if they don't get it"; you cannot accept what you don't get: for all it takes is for someone to question your belief, seekiing proof, and you find yourself looking like a fool; and you cannot be what you do not comprehend!
I hope this all helps in addressing your questions? Thanks for your contribution Joe!
Peace be with you!!!
reply to post by Olise
Hi Olise
Yes, some of the material for building the kingdom has been rejected by men in the past, but The "The Builder (Jesus) of the Kingdom" is more powerful than "The builders (books) of the kingdom".
Yes I agree, and have witnessed these condemnations first hand myself. The problem I see is that faith is a double-edged sword. On the one hand it leads people to Jesus and the receiving of the Holy Spirit, but at the same time it leads people to thinking that their denominational doctrines, and everything else along with it, are the complete truth.
IMO the only truth they have received and come to know; is that Jesus and God are real. Jesus tells us that we must “seek the truth”, and I believe his words are directed not just solely at atheists, but at those who have already come to a belief in Jesus.
Yes again I agree; any book, which sheds light on the “Book of Revelations”, needs to taken seriously, by those who belong to any Christian denomination.
Well, the many non-Trinitarian Churches have been able to discern the truth of what you speak of above, which IMO is derivable from the four Gospels. Therefore, I am not against anything that sheds further light on that truth.
Well, I don’t worship Jesus as God, so the above doesn’t apply to me; I see Jesus as the “Son of God”, sent to bring Gods message and to testify to the truth.
Where do I start… I have accepted you, to some degree on ATS, because many of the things you have said, have resonated with me; But I don’t know everything about you, and neither do I completely understand and know everything about you. In other words, I have accepted the parts of you I have come to know, although I do not understand or know everything about you.
It’s the same with believers in Jesus. They have come to know the man behind the words in the four Gospels, even if they don’t fully understand him, and even if they are not aware of other texts, which should have been included in the bible.
This kind of hits close to home for me on a very personal level, because I received the Holy Spirit by believing who Jesus was and who the Father was. The “born again” Christians (Trinitarians) who first introduced me to God, told me that I was wrong. But I couldn’t deny my own experience, and so I stopped going to their church. In one sense I was happy that I had found God, but at the same time I felt sad, because the very people who introduced me to God, didn’t believe in the same way that I did.
I have since moved on from that now, but I came to understand that God works in Spirit, over head knowledge; (not that there isn’t a correct understanding to be reached and found etc) I also realized that the Holy Spirit was being poured out on those believers who practiced in the Spirit, in both the Trinitarian and the non-Trinitarian churches. I thought to myself, how can this be, when they both see things so differently?
It dawned on me that this was how God was building up his church, through the “Holy Spirit”, and that any wrong doing to the scriptures, or books left out etc…was not going to stop God from building up his Church.
This does not mean however that believers should stop searching for truth, which is what you are trying to reveal on this thread.
So from what you have written above; IMO using the word “reject” is too strong a word to be using, and applying to people, who today, come to a belief Jesus, regardless of their denomination.
Yes, I agree with you; books were rejected by men hundreds of years ago, and they probably should have been included; hence the divisions that exist in Christianity today etc…
But I see it more as them accepting Jesus, but just not fully “understanding”… rather than using the word “rejecting”.
Peace be with you Olise
- JC
Hi Olise
Originally posted by Olise
I understood what you were trying to say Joe, but I had to clarify it for others reading this thread to understand. Also, as I stated above, the material used in building the kingdom is what I am referring to: for though the Spirit directs the construction, the material used is the Word of God.
Yes, some of the material for building the kingdom has been rejected by men in the past, but The "The Builder (Jesus) of the Kingdom" is more powerful than "The builders (books) of the kingdom".
Originally posted by Olise
You must understand that the four Gospels in the canonical Bible have been contaminated through prejudice, and they do not explain to you the beginning of all things and the reason for all that is: and because of that, the Christian faith today is in such disarray, misleading and condemning not only each denomination, but also other religions, contrary to the teachings of Jesus.
Yes I agree, and have witnessed these condemnations first hand myself. The problem I see is that faith is a double-edged sword. On the one hand it leads people to Jesus and the receiving of the Holy Spirit, but at the same time it leads people to thinking that their denominational doctrines, and everything else along with it, are the complete truth.
IMO the only truth they have received and come to know; is that Jesus and God are real. Jesus tells us that we must “seek the truth”, and I believe his words are directed not just solely at atheists, but at those who have already come to a belief in Jesus.
Originally posted by Olise
So you see, it is necessary to understand the beginning, which will help you understand why man is in the state he is in, why Christ is exemplifying the Word, and the purpose of the Last, as contained in both revelations to John: without understanding the first revelation, one cannot make sense of the last revelation.
Yes again I agree; any book, which sheds light on the “Book of Revelations”, needs to taken seriously, by those who belong to any Christian denomination.
Originally posted by Olise
…They also assumed that, inspite of him saying to them that the words he speaks to them is from his Father, he was making himself equal with God by the things he said and calliing God his Father, which if they knew the truth they would not condemn him for that;…
Well, the many non-Trinitarian Churches have been able to discern the truth of what you speak of above, which IMO is derivable from the four Gospels. Therefore, I am not against anything that sheds further light on that truth.
Originally posted by Olise
And it is one thing to accept Jesus as Lord, sent from God; yet it is another thing to worship the man Jesus as God.
Well, I don’t worship Jesus as God, so the above doesn’t apply to me; I see Jesus as the “Son of God”, sent to bring Gods message and to testify to the truth.
Originally posted by Olise
So as you said, "At least they have accepted Jesus the person, even if they don't get it"; you cannot accept what you don't get:
Where do I start… I have accepted you, to some degree on ATS, because many of the things you have said, have resonated with me; But I don’t know everything about you, and neither do I completely understand and know everything about you. In other words, I have accepted the parts of you I have come to know, although I do not understand or know everything about you.
It’s the same with believers in Jesus. They have come to know the man behind the words in the four Gospels, even if they don’t fully understand him, and even if they are not aware of other texts, which should have been included in the bible.
This kind of hits close to home for me on a very personal level, because I received the Holy Spirit by believing who Jesus was and who the Father was. The “born again” Christians (Trinitarians) who first introduced me to God, told me that I was wrong. But I couldn’t deny my own experience, and so I stopped going to their church. In one sense I was happy that I had found God, but at the same time I felt sad, because the very people who introduced me to God, didn’t believe in the same way that I did.
I have since moved on from that now, but I came to understand that God works in Spirit, over head knowledge; (not that there isn’t a correct understanding to be reached and found etc) I also realized that the Holy Spirit was being poured out on those believers who practiced in the Spirit, in both the Trinitarian and the non-Trinitarian churches. I thought to myself, how can this be, when they both see things so differently?
It dawned on me that this was how God was building up his church, through the “Holy Spirit”, and that any wrong doing to the scriptures, or books left out etc…was not going to stop God from building up his Church.
This does not mean however that believers should stop searching for truth, which is what you are trying to reveal on this thread.
Originally posted by Olise
Yet so also shall the Christians reject the rock of their salvation!
So from what you have written above; IMO using the word “reject” is too strong a word to be using, and applying to people, who today, come to a belief Jesus, regardless of their denomination.
Yes, I agree with you; books were rejected by men hundreds of years ago, and they probably should have been included; hence the divisions that exist in Christianity today etc…
But I see it more as them accepting Jesus, but just not fully “understanding”… rather than using the word “rejecting”.
Peace be with you Olise
- JC
edit on 28-6-2011 by Joecroft because: (no reason given)
In continuation:
1st Corinthians 4 admonishes you, "Judge nothing prematurely, until the Lord comes, who both will bring to light the hidden things of darkness, and will make manifest the counsels of the hearts: and then shall every man have praise of God." Thus Zechariah prophesied, "Rejoice greatly, O daughter of Zion, shout, O daughter of Jerusalem: for your King shall come to you; humble, and riding upon an ass, and upon a colt the foal of an ass. And I will cut off the chariot from Ephraim/Christianity and the horse from Jerusalem/Judaism and the battle bow (of Islam) shall be cut off: and he (the King) shall speak peace. And as for you (the Last), whose covenant is also by blood, I have sent your prisoners out of the pit/religiosity wherein is no water (nourishing word: discern Isaiah 42)."
"Ask the LORD for rain in the time of the latter rain; so the LORD shall send you showers of enlightenment." For Psalm 18 assures you this, "You shall be delivered out of many waters (diverse religions), when the LORD shall send out true enlightenment, discomfiting the world; then the channels of waters shall be seen, and the foundations of the world shall be discovered."
And thus Ephesians 4, "And all shall come together into the unity of faith; and no longer children tossed to and fro with every wind of doctrine/religiosity, by the sleight of men." And this is signified by Moses striking the rock on two separate occasions, that the water (word of life) may flow, to nourish the people: the first being Massah/Temptation/Sin, conciliated in the example of Jesus, in whose stripes you were taught the antidote of sin; and the second being Meribah/Strife/Iniquity, to be conciliated in the Last, making peace: Exodus 17 and Numbers 20; for striking the rock signifies striking the Rock of Salvation.
And thus Isaiah 12 states, "With joy shall you draw water out of the wells of salvation"; and Hosea 6, "For the Lord shall come to us as the latter and the former rain unto the earth: (teachers of righteousness, according to righteousness)"; and thus John 16, "I speak these things to you in parables now; but the time shall come when I shall reveal plainly of the Father."
True freedom comes by understanding who you are, not what you have been conditioned to believe: though this is a hard thing to come by while yet in your primatial state; as Jeremiah 10: 23 states, "The way of man is not in himself: for it is not in him (the primate) that walks to direct his own steps." And hence the Pharisees were told, "You are of your father the devil; and his deeds shall you do", having been confounded by the counterfeit spirit; and again, "God sent his Son into the world, not to condemn the world; but that the world through him might be saved."
Till now each faith has judged and condemned the other, being swayed with every wind of doctrine generated by the counterfeit spirit in the primate; to which is this statement in Ecclesiastes 3, "Who knows the spirit of man that ascends, and the spirit of the beast (the counterfeit spirit) that goes downward to the earth?" Know this, Whosoever believes that the All is deficient is himself deficient: he that disparages another disparages himself.
The spirit of Man came through the perfect first Man; and though it got contaminated through the defilement of Eve by the counterfeit spirit, yet it is being purified and restored to perfection and out of mortality, and shall ascend back to where it came from. All shall be clothed with imortality, to the glory of the Father.
You might wonder why God allowed the despicable spirit to defile Eve, and why he allowed the women to be defiled; well having inherited omnipotence and omniscience from God, Sophia took it upon herself to by-pass the laws of creation, and brought upon all condemnation; therefore, it was necessary to allow the existence of evil as an option for the soul to learn godliness and heal its deficiency, returning to perfection. For when in the travail of tribulation the Inner True Mind seeks answers, invoking the metamorphosis of the soul, which then leads to repentance, which is a change in your way of thinking, from direct access, by-passing the consort of the Spirit, as did Sophia, to protected access through the Spirit: thus, "Blessed is the man who has suffered and found life."
When you are born into this world, entering the experience, you enter as a baby, your senses become covered so that you forget who you truly are and where you came from: in essence, you find yourself at the center/middle of the experience, and as such, can only see that which is within the experience, learning that which it has conditioned for you to learn: thus, “The man’s sensibility was covered with insensibility.” It is designed such and the despicable spirit was allowed such: for without that which it conditions within you, how would you come to understand the Lordship of the Spirit and why you should never attempt to by-pass It upon inheriting perfection?
You were told, "When you see the One who was not born of a woman, fall on your face and worship him: for that One is your Father." For he that is born of a woman is simply a creature, including the Only-begotten Light of the Father; and even the despicable spirit is a creature. And yet the magnificence of these cannot be comprehended through the primate; hence you are told not to idolize anything or anyone: for the image of the Father cannot be seen; as it is written, "The images are visible to humanity, but the light within them is hidden in the image. The light of the Father will reveal itself, but his image is hidden by his light."
Hence Paul stated in 2nd Corinthians 5, "Wherefore henceforth know we no man after the flesh: yea, though we have known Christ after the flesh (as Jesus), yet now henceforth know we him no more: for all things are of God, who in Christ is reconciling the world to himself; and we walk by faith, and not by sight." For though the mind perceives through patterns/shapes, the heavenly things themselves have no form: hence the word Faith.
The Inner True Mind learns through experiences, hence an example was given in Jesus; and at an appointed time another example shall be given on the fulfillment of the second great commandment. The primate learns nothing; the Inner True Mind learns through the experiences written into the story and experienced through the primate: and it is necessary that the two great commandments get written into your Inner True Mind in preparation of the glory to come. And thus Paul stated in Colossians 1, "The mystery of the word of God, which had been hid from ages and from generations, is now being made manifest to his saints: to whom God would make known what is the riches of the glory of this mystery among the Gentiles; which is Christ in your midst, the hope of glory."
And as you were told in Jesus, "I am come a light into the world, that whosoever believes on me should not abide in darkness. And if anyone hears my words and does not believe, I will not judge them: for I did not come into the world to judge the world, but to save the world." And hence, "The Spirit of truth, whom the world shall not receive, in that it cannot see him, and therefore does not know him, shall come, and he shall testify of me." And though you receive through the mind, it is the Spirit that validates the testator’s testament.
Since knowledge is learned through the experience, a testimony/example must be given in the flesh, not in spirit, else it will not benefit the Inner True Mind: for the Inner True Mind relates to that which it sees through the eyes of the primate, hence the patterns; and that’s how the Inner True Mind gets written into. But a testament must be made in flesh, which is the experience: and hence the two Cherubims of glory shadowing the mercyseat, ordained examples that fulfill the two great commandments of the covenant of life.
And hence you were told in Jesus, "I have many things to say to you, but you cannot hear them now: howbeit when he, the Spirit of truth, is come, he will guide you into all truth: for shall not speak of himself; but whatever he shall hear, that shall he speak; and he will show you things to come."
Peace be unto you!!!
To be continued tomorrow...
1st Corinthians 4 admonishes you, "Judge nothing prematurely, until the Lord comes, who both will bring to light the hidden things of darkness, and will make manifest the counsels of the hearts: and then shall every man have praise of God." Thus Zechariah prophesied, "Rejoice greatly, O daughter of Zion, shout, O daughter of Jerusalem: for your King shall come to you; humble, and riding upon an ass, and upon a colt the foal of an ass. And I will cut off the chariot from Ephraim/Christianity and the horse from Jerusalem/Judaism and the battle bow (of Islam) shall be cut off: and he (the King) shall speak peace. And as for you (the Last), whose covenant is also by blood, I have sent your prisoners out of the pit/religiosity wherein is no water (nourishing word: discern Isaiah 42)."
"Ask the LORD for rain in the time of the latter rain; so the LORD shall send you showers of enlightenment." For Psalm 18 assures you this, "You shall be delivered out of many waters (diverse religions), when the LORD shall send out true enlightenment, discomfiting the world; then the channels of waters shall be seen, and the foundations of the world shall be discovered."
And thus Ephesians 4, "And all shall come together into the unity of faith; and no longer children tossed to and fro with every wind of doctrine/religiosity, by the sleight of men." And this is signified by Moses striking the rock on two separate occasions, that the water (word of life) may flow, to nourish the people: the first being Massah/Temptation/Sin, conciliated in the example of Jesus, in whose stripes you were taught the antidote of sin; and the second being Meribah/Strife/Iniquity, to be conciliated in the Last, making peace: Exodus 17 and Numbers 20; for striking the rock signifies striking the Rock of Salvation.
And thus Isaiah 12 states, "With joy shall you draw water out of the wells of salvation"; and Hosea 6, "For the Lord shall come to us as the latter and the former rain unto the earth: (teachers of righteousness, according to righteousness)"; and thus John 16, "I speak these things to you in parables now; but the time shall come when I shall reveal plainly of the Father."
True freedom comes by understanding who you are, not what you have been conditioned to believe: though this is a hard thing to come by while yet in your primatial state; as Jeremiah 10: 23 states, "The way of man is not in himself: for it is not in him (the primate) that walks to direct his own steps." And hence the Pharisees were told, "You are of your father the devil; and his deeds shall you do", having been confounded by the counterfeit spirit; and again, "God sent his Son into the world, not to condemn the world; but that the world through him might be saved."
Till now each faith has judged and condemned the other, being swayed with every wind of doctrine generated by the counterfeit spirit in the primate; to which is this statement in Ecclesiastes 3, "Who knows the spirit of man that ascends, and the spirit of the beast (the counterfeit spirit) that goes downward to the earth?" Know this, Whosoever believes that the All is deficient is himself deficient: he that disparages another disparages himself.
The spirit of Man came through the perfect first Man; and though it got contaminated through the defilement of Eve by the counterfeit spirit, yet it is being purified and restored to perfection and out of mortality, and shall ascend back to where it came from. All shall be clothed with imortality, to the glory of the Father.
You might wonder why God allowed the despicable spirit to defile Eve, and why he allowed the women to be defiled; well having inherited omnipotence and omniscience from God, Sophia took it upon herself to by-pass the laws of creation, and brought upon all condemnation; therefore, it was necessary to allow the existence of evil as an option for the soul to learn godliness and heal its deficiency, returning to perfection. For when in the travail of tribulation the Inner True Mind seeks answers, invoking the metamorphosis of the soul, which then leads to repentance, which is a change in your way of thinking, from direct access, by-passing the consort of the Spirit, as did Sophia, to protected access through the Spirit: thus, "Blessed is the man who has suffered and found life."
When you are born into this world, entering the experience, you enter as a baby, your senses become covered so that you forget who you truly are and where you came from: in essence, you find yourself at the center/middle of the experience, and as such, can only see that which is within the experience, learning that which it has conditioned for you to learn: thus, “The man’s sensibility was covered with insensibility.” It is designed such and the despicable spirit was allowed such: for without that which it conditions within you, how would you come to understand the Lordship of the Spirit and why you should never attempt to by-pass It upon inheriting perfection?
You were told, "When you see the One who was not born of a woman, fall on your face and worship him: for that One is your Father." For he that is born of a woman is simply a creature, including the Only-begotten Light of the Father; and even the despicable spirit is a creature. And yet the magnificence of these cannot be comprehended through the primate; hence you are told not to idolize anything or anyone: for the image of the Father cannot be seen; as it is written, "The images are visible to humanity, but the light within them is hidden in the image. The light of the Father will reveal itself, but his image is hidden by his light."
Hence Paul stated in 2nd Corinthians 5, "Wherefore henceforth know we no man after the flesh: yea, though we have known Christ after the flesh (as Jesus), yet now henceforth know we him no more: for all things are of God, who in Christ is reconciling the world to himself; and we walk by faith, and not by sight." For though the mind perceives through patterns/shapes, the heavenly things themselves have no form: hence the word Faith.
The Inner True Mind learns through experiences, hence an example was given in Jesus; and at an appointed time another example shall be given on the fulfillment of the second great commandment. The primate learns nothing; the Inner True Mind learns through the experiences written into the story and experienced through the primate: and it is necessary that the two great commandments get written into your Inner True Mind in preparation of the glory to come. And thus Paul stated in Colossians 1, "The mystery of the word of God, which had been hid from ages and from generations, is now being made manifest to his saints: to whom God would make known what is the riches of the glory of this mystery among the Gentiles; which is Christ in your midst, the hope of glory."
And as you were told in Jesus, "I am come a light into the world, that whosoever believes on me should not abide in darkness. And if anyone hears my words and does not believe, I will not judge them: for I did not come into the world to judge the world, but to save the world." And hence, "The Spirit of truth, whom the world shall not receive, in that it cannot see him, and therefore does not know him, shall come, and he shall testify of me." And though you receive through the mind, it is the Spirit that validates the testator’s testament.
Since knowledge is learned through the experience, a testimony/example must be given in the flesh, not in spirit, else it will not benefit the Inner True Mind: for the Inner True Mind relates to that which it sees through the eyes of the primate, hence the patterns; and that’s how the Inner True Mind gets written into. But a testament must be made in flesh, which is the experience: and hence the two Cherubims of glory shadowing the mercyseat, ordained examples that fulfill the two great commandments of the covenant of life.
And hence you were told in Jesus, "I have many things to say to you, but you cannot hear them now: howbeit when he, the Spirit of truth, is come, he will guide you into all truth: for shall not speak of himself; but whatever he shall hear, that shall he speak; and he will show you things to come."
Peace be unto you!!!
To be continued tomorrow...
edit on 28-6-2011 by Olise because: (no reason given)
edit on 28-6-2011 by Olise because: (no
reason given)
Originally posted by Joecroft
reply to post by Olise
Originally posted by Olise
Yet so also shall the Christians reject the rock of their salvation!
So from what you have written above; IMO using the word “reject” is too strong a word to be using, and applying to people, who today, come to a belief Jesus, regardless of their denomination.
Yes, I agree with you; books were rejected by men hundreds of years ago, and they probably should have been included; hence the divisions that exist in Christianity today etc…
But I see it more as them accepting Jesus, but just not fully “understanding”… rather than using the word “rejecting”.
edit on 28-6-2011 by Joecroft because: (no reason given)
Beloved Joe, my response might seem a little lengthy, but it is necessary to explain these things.
To start with, if the Word says so, then so shall it be: for no nation/religion is any more precious than another; and there is no diplomacy in the Word of God: it is either this, or it's opposite: its either black or its white. As you were told in Jesus, "Either make the tree good, and HIS fruit good; or else make the tree corrupt, and his fruit corrupt: for the tree is know by his fruit." Did the Jews not reject Jesus at the first? Ofcourse they did! And so shall the Christians: for so it is written. So we cannot say, The Jews rejected; but then become diplomatic when it comes to the Christians, and say, They just did not understand. No, that which applies to one applies to the other! The Jews did not understand, and that's why they rejected: and so shall it be with the Christians.
The reason the Christians will reject the Christ is because they do not understand what or who they are to expect: for as it states, "He is a rock of offence to them who stumble at the Word". This does not mean they are rejecting the Spirit they uphold as Jesus or the words presented in the manner the Bible presents it; but they shall reject him in that they do not understand the mysteries: not only his Word, but also the Son of man himself. And why do they stumble at the Word, because they rejected the Word of the kingdom, which came directly from the glorified Son of God after the resurrection; and this is why they disconcert each other, condemning each other and each religion, seeing themselves as the only true way: they ignore what Jesus said to Peter, "Feed my sheep (ALL): for other sheep I have also, which are not of this fold, them also I MUST bring in!"
You might wonder why I say this; but the scriptures mention this all through, in spite of the fact that it has been diluted by the church. In the Gospel of John, which was made part of the Bible, Jesus said, "The Spirit of truth, which proceeds from the Father, which the world cannot receive (accept), because it cannot see him, (in essense, because the world cannot see the Spirit in the Man, they will reject the Man in whom is the Spirit, even as Jesus was rejected), neither does it know him, shall come, and he shall TESTIFY of me"; (a testimony can only be made in flesh, that all flesh might perceive).
And again, discern the mystery of John 21, "Peter, (signifying the Church), I assure you this, when you were young, you girded yourself, and walked everywhichway you would; but when you shall be old, (i.e. the Church), you shall stretch forth your hands, and another shall gird you (with the truth: for which was Matthew 17: 11, and Acts 3: 21), and CARRY you where you would not." And in your seeking, seek the meaning of John 21: 6, 7 and 22; and understand that John 21 contains the mystery of the coming of the Son of Man.
And thus Paul said in Corinthians, "We speak the wisdom of God in a MYSTERY, even the hidden wisdom, which God ordained before the world unto our glory: which none of the princes (religious leaders) of this world knew: for had they known it, they would not have crucified the Lord of glory."
Originally posted by Joecroft
reply to post by Olise
Where do I start… I have accepted you, to some degree on ATS, because many of the things you have said, have resonated with me; But I don’t know everything about you, and neither do I completely understand and know everything about you. In other words, I have accepted the parts of you I have come to know, although I do not understand or know everything about you.
edit on 28-6-2011 by Joecroft because: (no reason given)
As your response denotes, it is not I that you accept, it is the word I presented that you accept: for you do not know me, as you have never met me: this is very true. So you see, without the Word delivered to the world, how would the Holy Spirit confirm the truth within you? For it is only because the Holy Spirit opened your mind to receive that which I wrote that you accepted; and it is only because the Holy Spirit drew you to the Word that you came to discern it; yet something drastic had to happen to awaken you from your slumber: hence Jesus said, "No man can come to me unless the Father which has sent me draws him to me."
You came to know of Jesus through what the Trinitarians presented to you, yet the Holy Spirit clarified the truth to you, building the kingdom with the material that was present (presented to you). If the Holy Spirit had not drawn you and opened up your mind to learn, you would first of all not have listened to the Trinitarians, neither would the word they presented have made any sense to you; and secondly there would have not been an option for you to learn of, which the Holy Spirit led you to discern and believe. If I walked up to you and said, I am Christ; would you not tell me to get lost, (or use other choice words)?
It has everything to do with the Word, which is the material with which the kingdom is built, and not the man; same as with the construction of a house or anything: without the material the constructor/builder cannot build: without the Word, presented to the experience/world, the Holy Spirit cannot build the kingdom in you: for you cannot see the Holy Spirit, being Spirit; hence the Word is the Stone which the supposed builders of the kingdom rejected/disallowed. The true builder is the Holy Spirit, but the laborers are the priests, preachers, etc.
As stated in the Dialogue of the Savior, Judas asked, "How will our garments be brought to us?" And the Lord said to him, "Some will bring them to you, and others will received them." In essence, the materials come (are revealed) to and through man by way of the Holy Spirit; but the corner stone/material which the Holy Spirit sent was rejected by the on-site laborers who were laying the stones one after another.
Now having said this, understand that the rejection does not constitute a condemnation of the rejecters: for it is necessary that this should happen, that the scriptures should be fulfilled, and the fulfillment of the second great commandment manifested. And yes, the kingdom is being built by the Holy Spirit: for it is a kingdom built without hands, and built in the Inner True Mind; but the materials are necessary: for without them man would not know of the Holy Spirit, let alone what to look for, or understand what the Spirit is trying to tell them; this is why the true Word is crucial.
Paul stated in Romans, "If the casting away of the Jews (due to their rejection of Jesus) be the reconciling of the world, what shall the receiving of them be, but life from the dead?" And again, "For as you (Christians) in times past have not believed God, yet have now obtained mercy through their (the Jews) unbelief; even so have/shall these (Christians: at the time of the Last) not believed, that through your mercy (which shall be accorded you) they also may obtain mercy. For God has concluded ALL in unbelief, that he might have mercy on ALL." But this will not make sense if you do not understand why man is in the state he is in, which is only revealed in The Secret Word of the Lord unto John, also known as the Apocryphon of John.
And now, discern Daniel 7, "Four great beasts came up from the sea (and SEA signifies religiosity), diverse one from the other (see also Revelation 13: 1). The first beast was like a lion: (the lion of the tribe of Judah); and had eagle’s wings, signifying a Cherub. And the wings having been plucked off, and the beast being made to stand as a man, with a man’s heart given to it, signifies its transformation in the hands of man from spiritual to religious, in the aftermath of the fist cherub. For once the rod of God touches the earth, it is turned into a serpent.
The second beast was like a bear, and raised itself up on one side, signifying the self-righteous bias of each religion; and having three RIBS in its mouth between its teeth, signifying the three brides/religions; and told to arise and devour much flesh, evidenced in the state of the three religions that stemmed from Abraham, which are Judaism, Christianity and Islam, inspired to devour each other; each one profanely seeking to justify itself, yet self-righteously dividing the body of Christ.
The third beast was like a leopard, and had four wings on its back and four heads, and dominion was given to it: this signifies the unification of all faiths in the unity of spirit, in the aftermath of the second cherubim of glory, which man shall again turn into a religion. Peter, signifying Christianity, was told, "If you love me, feed my sheep (all faiths): for I assure you this, When you were young you girt yourself and walked wherever you would, (did as you pleased): but when you shall be old you shall stretch forth your hands and another shall gird you, and carry you where you would not. The path that I walk you cannot now follow: for Satan has desired to have you; but you shall follow me afterwards (after the Last): for the cock shall not crow, till you have denied me THRICE".
And the fourth beast was dreadful and terrible, exceedingly strong, having great iron teeth, devouring and breaking in pieces, and stamping the residue with its feet: it was diverse from all the beasts that were before it; and had ten horns (horns of sight). And out of the horns arose another little horn, before whom three of the first horns were plucked up by the roots; and it had eyes like the eyes of man, and a mouth speaking great things: the false prophet, which is the beast of the earth, in whose guile the essence of the sacrificial offering shall be eliminated, setting up the abomination that will cause desolation; (for it supposes the end to have come: discern Exodus 32 and from that time to the end there shall be a thousand two hundred and ninety days; blessed is he that waits, and comes to the thousand three hundred and thirty fifth day. He that has an ear, let them hear!
So you see, as you also said below...
Originally posted by Joecroft
reply to post by Olise
Yes again I agree; any book, which sheds light on the “Book of Revelations”, needs to taken seriously, by those who belong to any Christian denomination.
edit on 28-6-2011 by Joecroft because: (no reason given)
it is necessary to understand these things, so that when they do come to pass, as they will, the world will realize what it is going through, and not only those who belong to Christianity: then they shall come to glorify God, in that his Word is TRUE! And the self-righteous, which are as described in Isaiah 65: 5 and Revelation 3: 15-19, shall wake up to their nakedness, and become humbled.
Peace be with you Joe!!!
edit on 29-6-2011 by Olise because: (no reason given)
edit on 29-6-2011 by Olise because: (no reason
given)
edit on 29-6-2011 by Olise because: (no reason given)
edit on 29-6-2011 by Olise because: (no reason
given)
edit on 29-6-2011 by Olise because: (no reason given)
FYI, there are three more posts after this to get to The Book of Revelation, at which point the signs you see of the time you are in will make sense
to you: for it is today as it was in the days of Noah and as it was in the days of Lot. He that has an ear, let him hear; and an eye, let him see.
In continuation:
Moses was directed to build the pattern of the Ark of the Covenant precisely as he was shown; having a Mercyseat upon it, which is shadowed according to the matter of the Mercyseat by two Cherubims of glory on each end, which matter is the Two Great Commandments that make up the law: and within the Ark was stored the two Stones of testimony and the Manna from heaven, and also Aaron’s rod that budded: as denoted in Exodus 25 and Hebrews 9: 4; and these are all relative to the Covenant, an assurance made to you.
The manna is the divine Word from heaven, which the builders/artisans of the kingdom reject; the two Cherubims testify of these things, exemplifying the fulfillment of the law, benefiting the All: and though their exemplifications are perceived righteously, their testimonies are rejected, thereby rejecting the Spirit of both Cherubims of glory.
Know this, God, in perfect wisdom, will neither inspire a pattern nor the institution of an order without it benefiting his creation. The two great commandments came to you on two stones of testimony: Exodus 31: 18, Isaiah 8: 14 and Matthew 22: 36-40; and two sacrificial lamb offerings were also ordered: one in the morning, to exemplify fulfilling of the first great commandment, fulfilled in Jesus, and the other in the evening to exemplify fulfilling the last great commandment; and understand the fulfillment is not in the shedding of blood for a sacrifice of appeasement, but in the act of the testator giving his life to exemplify the only way to fulfill the law, which is love.
As stated in Exodus 29, "The sacrificial offering of both lambs shall be at the door of (act as an exponent to) the tabernacle/body of the congregation; and the tabernacle shall be sanctified by my glory. And there will I meet with you, to testify to you; I am the LORD your God": and hence it is called The Ark of his Testament: Exodus 25: 22 and Revelation 11: 19. Numbers 28 refers to it as Meat Offering, signifying the sacrificing of the flesh; the beaten oil signifies the stripes of the Anointed One; and the Wine Offering signifies the passion by which it is done. Thus Moses said to you, "You are being fed with manna which you know nothing about; that you might come to know that man does not live by bread only, but by every word that proceeds out of the mouth of the Lord does man live."
You were told in Isaiah, "There shall come forth a rod out of the stem of Jesse, and a Branch shall grow out of his roots: and he shall stand for an ensign of the people; his rest shall be glory, and in that day shall the Lord set his hand again to gather the remnant of his people from the four corners of the world." For as is written in Hebrews 4, "If Jesus had given you rest, then would he not afterward have spoken of another day to come."
It is also stated in Hebrews 6, "By two immutable things, in which it is impossible for God to lie, man shall have a strong consolation, for entering into that which is veiled." Hence the Mercyseat has two Cherubims of glory shadowing it, relative to the pattern of the heavenly throne which Solomon was inspired to build, as described in 2nd Chronicles 9, which states, "There were six steps to the throne, with a footstool of gold, which were fastened to the throne": this signifies six steps of refinement that lead to perfection, and the throne/perfection is set on the seventh; and hence it is written in Job 5, "He shall deliver you in six troubles: yea, in seven no evil shall touch you."
And the throne had stays on each side of the sitting place, and two lions standing by the stays: (and the two lions signify they of who Zechariah prophesied, saying, "These are the two anointed ones that stand by the Lord of the whole earth"; and understand that the Anointed Ones are the seed in which the Light of life enters into the experience). And twelve lions (the twelve tribes/apostles) stood there on the one side and on the other upon the six steps (behind the two Sons of oil). There was not the like made in any kingdom.
As Daniel prophesied, "Seventy weeks are determined to make an end of sins (exemplified in the First), and to make reconciliation for iniquity (peace offering: the Last)"; to which Isaiah 53 declares, "He made his grave with the wicked and with the rich in his deaths. When his soul shall make an offering for sin, he shall see his seed, he shall prolong his days, and the pleasure of the LORD shall prosper in his hand. He shall learn fully from the travail of his soul: by his knowledge shall my righteous servant justify many: for he shall bear their iniquities": which is the peace offering.
Thus Hebrews 9, "It was necessary that the patterns of things in the heavens should be purified with the blood of animals; but the heavenly things themselves with better sacrifices (examples) than these." And he that mocks this, thinking it to be foolish, it is written in Job 24, "They are those that rebel against the light; they know not the ways thereof, nor abide in the paths thereof."
It was prophesied in Numbers 24, "There shall come a Star (the First) out of Jacob, and a Scepter (the Last) shall rise out of Israel (the converted)"; and as Jacob prophesied in Genesis 49, "The scepter shall not depart from Judah, until Shiloh come: and unto him shall the gathering of the people be." Thus it is stated in Isaiah 52, "Your watchmen shall sing together: for they shall see eye to eye, when the LORD shall bring again Zion."
You were told in 1st Kings 6 regarding the pattern of the temple, "Within the oracle are two cherubims of olive tree, (anointed sons: Zechariah 4: 14: thus, 'No man has ascended up to heaven, but he that came down from heaven: the Son of man which is in heaven'). And for the entering of the oracle he made two doors of olive tree: (the First and the Last); and each door had two leaves folding in one": union. For as Paul stated in 1st Corinthians 1, "The Jews require a sign, and the Greeks seek after wisdom; but we preach Christ crucified, to the Jews a stumbling-block, and to the Greeks foolishness (a rock of offence): that no flesh should glory, to the Jews Christ (the First) manifested the power of God, and to the Greeks/Gentiles Christ (the Last) manifests the wisdom of God."
Discern that which Joshua 3 signifies, "There shall be two thousand years between the time when you shall see and then follow the ark of God’s covenant (the First), and when you shall receive the knowledge of the way by which you must go (the Last), a path you have neither heard of nor followed. The waters (word of life) which come down from above shall stand, rising above the waters of Adam (doctrine of the primate), which is the salt (salted) sea: for when the mystery of the Ark of the Covenant is revealed, the waters of Jordan (religiosity) shall be cut off, that all may pass clean over."
And why am I telling you these things? First of all, crossing the Jordan which empties into the Dead Sea signifies overcoming religion which genders to death, with which the counterfeit spirit confounds you; and secondly, it is necessary to understand the mystery of Christ and of the second coming of the Son of Man, as the time is upon you; though many go about their business of worldly living, supposing all to be normal .
To be continued...
Peace be with you!!!
In continuation:
Moses was directed to build the pattern of the Ark of the Covenant precisely as he was shown; having a Mercyseat upon it, which is shadowed according to the matter of the Mercyseat by two Cherubims of glory on each end, which matter is the Two Great Commandments that make up the law: and within the Ark was stored the two Stones of testimony and the Manna from heaven, and also Aaron’s rod that budded: as denoted in Exodus 25 and Hebrews 9: 4; and these are all relative to the Covenant, an assurance made to you.
The manna is the divine Word from heaven, which the builders/artisans of the kingdom reject; the two Cherubims testify of these things, exemplifying the fulfillment of the law, benefiting the All: and though their exemplifications are perceived righteously, their testimonies are rejected, thereby rejecting the Spirit of both Cherubims of glory.
Know this, God, in perfect wisdom, will neither inspire a pattern nor the institution of an order without it benefiting his creation. The two great commandments came to you on two stones of testimony: Exodus 31: 18, Isaiah 8: 14 and Matthew 22: 36-40; and two sacrificial lamb offerings were also ordered: one in the morning, to exemplify fulfilling of the first great commandment, fulfilled in Jesus, and the other in the evening to exemplify fulfilling the last great commandment; and understand the fulfillment is not in the shedding of blood for a sacrifice of appeasement, but in the act of the testator giving his life to exemplify the only way to fulfill the law, which is love.
As stated in Exodus 29, "The sacrificial offering of both lambs shall be at the door of (act as an exponent to) the tabernacle/body of the congregation; and the tabernacle shall be sanctified by my glory. And there will I meet with you, to testify to you; I am the LORD your God": and hence it is called The Ark of his Testament: Exodus 25: 22 and Revelation 11: 19. Numbers 28 refers to it as Meat Offering, signifying the sacrificing of the flesh; the beaten oil signifies the stripes of the Anointed One; and the Wine Offering signifies the passion by which it is done. Thus Moses said to you, "You are being fed with manna which you know nothing about; that you might come to know that man does not live by bread only, but by every word that proceeds out of the mouth of the Lord does man live."
You were told in Isaiah, "There shall come forth a rod out of the stem of Jesse, and a Branch shall grow out of his roots: and he shall stand for an ensign of the people; his rest shall be glory, and in that day shall the Lord set his hand again to gather the remnant of his people from the four corners of the world." For as is written in Hebrews 4, "If Jesus had given you rest, then would he not afterward have spoken of another day to come."
It is also stated in Hebrews 6, "By two immutable things, in which it is impossible for God to lie, man shall have a strong consolation, for entering into that which is veiled." Hence the Mercyseat has two Cherubims of glory shadowing it, relative to the pattern of the heavenly throne which Solomon was inspired to build, as described in 2nd Chronicles 9, which states, "There were six steps to the throne, with a footstool of gold, which were fastened to the throne": this signifies six steps of refinement that lead to perfection, and the throne/perfection is set on the seventh; and hence it is written in Job 5, "He shall deliver you in six troubles: yea, in seven no evil shall touch you."
And the throne had stays on each side of the sitting place, and two lions standing by the stays: (and the two lions signify they of who Zechariah prophesied, saying, "These are the two anointed ones that stand by the Lord of the whole earth"; and understand that the Anointed Ones are the seed in which the Light of life enters into the experience). And twelve lions (the twelve tribes/apostles) stood there on the one side and on the other upon the six steps (behind the two Sons of oil). There was not the like made in any kingdom.
As Daniel prophesied, "Seventy weeks are determined to make an end of sins (exemplified in the First), and to make reconciliation for iniquity (peace offering: the Last)"; to which Isaiah 53 declares, "He made his grave with the wicked and with the rich in his deaths. When his soul shall make an offering for sin, he shall see his seed, he shall prolong his days, and the pleasure of the LORD shall prosper in his hand. He shall learn fully from the travail of his soul: by his knowledge shall my righteous servant justify many: for he shall bear their iniquities": which is the peace offering.
Thus Hebrews 9, "It was necessary that the patterns of things in the heavens should be purified with the blood of animals; but the heavenly things themselves with better sacrifices (examples) than these." And he that mocks this, thinking it to be foolish, it is written in Job 24, "They are those that rebel against the light; they know not the ways thereof, nor abide in the paths thereof."
It was prophesied in Numbers 24, "There shall come a Star (the First) out of Jacob, and a Scepter (the Last) shall rise out of Israel (the converted)"; and as Jacob prophesied in Genesis 49, "The scepter shall not depart from Judah, until Shiloh come: and unto him shall the gathering of the people be." Thus it is stated in Isaiah 52, "Your watchmen shall sing together: for they shall see eye to eye, when the LORD shall bring again Zion."
You were told in 1st Kings 6 regarding the pattern of the temple, "Within the oracle are two cherubims of olive tree, (anointed sons: Zechariah 4: 14: thus, 'No man has ascended up to heaven, but he that came down from heaven: the Son of man which is in heaven'). And for the entering of the oracle he made two doors of olive tree: (the First and the Last); and each door had two leaves folding in one": union. For as Paul stated in 1st Corinthians 1, "The Jews require a sign, and the Greeks seek after wisdom; but we preach Christ crucified, to the Jews a stumbling-block, and to the Greeks foolishness (a rock of offence): that no flesh should glory, to the Jews Christ (the First) manifested the power of God, and to the Greeks/Gentiles Christ (the Last) manifests the wisdom of God."
Discern that which Joshua 3 signifies, "There shall be two thousand years between the time when you shall see and then follow the ark of God’s covenant (the First), and when you shall receive the knowledge of the way by which you must go (the Last), a path you have neither heard of nor followed. The waters (word of life) which come down from above shall stand, rising above the waters of Adam (doctrine of the primate), which is the salt (salted) sea: for when the mystery of the Ark of the Covenant is revealed, the waters of Jordan (religiosity) shall be cut off, that all may pass clean over."
And why am I telling you these things? First of all, crossing the Jordan which empties into the Dead Sea signifies overcoming religion which genders to death, with which the counterfeit spirit confounds you; and secondly, it is necessary to understand the mystery of Christ and of the second coming of the Son of Man, as the time is upon you; though many go about their business of worldly living, supposing all to be normal .
To be continued...
Peace be with you!!!
edit on 30-6-2011 by Olise because: (no reason given)
edit on 30-6-2011 by Olise because: (no reason
given)
edit on 30-6-2011 by Olise because: (no reason given)
reply to post by Olise
Olise!
Where is it written?
Perhaps the verses point to another house of Israel, or maybe you have discerned it incorrectly…
But the difference is, that the Jews reject Jesus completely, where as, at least the Christians accept that which they know of him.
And what are they to expect? Because whatever it is, it needs to be alignment with what Jesus and the prophets have already testified to.
But that verse above, is generally regarded as referring to those who reject Jesus completely, and not about rejecting books, which should or should not, have been put into the bible.
Yes, this is what I have been trying to say, they accept the Spirit but they do not understand all of the mysteries. And most people who first become a Christian are not aware of the books that have been rejected in the distant past; In other words, they cannot reject, what they do not know of.
The only thing I can discern from those verses is, that if John has not passed on; then where Jesus states, “this generation shall not pass until I return”, it may well mean that there is a connection to John.
Well, I have read a few of your other posts and I like the way you present yourself, and it’s not just about the material you are presenting. So that is the part of you I have come to know; But I was really only using you as an analogy, to point out how believers in Jesus accept parts of him, even if they do not know of other parts, or understand them; that was really my point.
Some truths I searched for, while other truths were revealed by people that God put on my path etc, which incidentally seems to be ongoing…
How do you know “Apocrypha of John” is the “corner stone” that Christians (in the past) rejected? There were many books that were rejected, why is that particular book, the “corner stone”?
And how can the “Apocrypha of John”, be the “corner stone” rejected by the Jews, when they don’t even entertain any of it, (the 4 gospels) to begin with?
I mean, it’s not like the Jews had a major decision to make lol in terms of accepting that book, because they don’t accept any of the New Testament books to do with Jesus.
So I’m just not sure how this fits into your idea of the 2 houses of Israel rejecting the “corner stone” as you see it i.e. the “Apocrypha of John”.
Just to reiterate what I said further up: the “corner stone”, is generally regarded as Jesus, and not one particular book, left in or out.
I’m not sure I follow you here. Where is there mention of the fulfillment of the second great commandment being manifested?
Again I’m not sure I follow you… what does Exodus 32 have to do with the book of revelations?
Peace be with you Olise!
- JC
Olise!
Originally posted by Olise
Did the Jews not reject Jesus at the first? Of course they did! And so shall the Christians: for so it is written.
Where is it written?
Perhaps the verses point to another house of Israel, or maybe you have discerned it incorrectly…
Originally posted by Olise
So we cannot say, The Jews rejected; but then become diplomatic when it comes to the Christians, and say, They just did not understand. No, that which applies to one applies to the other!
But the difference is, that the Jews reject Jesus completely, where as, at least the Christians accept that which they know of him.
Originally posted by Olise
The reason the Christians will reject the Christ is because they do not understand what or who they are to expect:
And what are they to expect? Because whatever it is, it needs to be alignment with what Jesus and the prophets have already testified to.
Originally posted by Olise
for as it states, "He is a rock of offence to them who stumble at the Word".
But that verse above, is generally regarded as referring to those who reject Jesus completely, and not about rejecting books, which should or should not, have been put into the bible.
Originally posted by Olise
This does not mean they are rejecting the Spirit they uphold as Jesus or the words presented in the manner the Bible presents it; but they shall reject him in that they do not understand the mysteries:
Yes, this is what I have been trying to say, they accept the Spirit but they do not understand all of the mysteries. And most people who first become a Christian are not aware of the books that have been rejected in the distant past; In other words, they cannot reject, what they do not know of.
Originally posted by Olise
And again, discern the mystery of John 21, "Peter, (signifying the Church), I assure you this, when you were young, you girded yourself, and walked everywhichway you would; but when you shall be old, (i.e. the Church), you shall stretch forth your hands, and another shall gird you (with the truth: for which was Matthew 17: 11, and Acts 3: 21), and CARRY you where you would not." And in your seeking, seek the meaning of John 21: 6, 7 and 22; and understand that John 21 contains the mystery of the coming of the Son of Man.
The only thing I can discern from those verses is, that if John has not passed on; then where Jesus states, “this generation shall not pass until I return”, it may well mean that there is a connection to John.
Originally posted by Olise
As your response denotes, it is not I that you accept, it is the word I presented that you accept: for you do not know me, as you have never met me: this is very true.
Well, I have read a few of your other posts and I like the way you present yourself, and it’s not just about the material you are presenting. So that is the part of you I have come to know; But I was really only using you as an analogy, to point out how believers in Jesus accept parts of him, even if they do not know of other parts, or understand them; that was really my point.
Originally posted by Olise
As stated in the Dialogue of the Savior, Judas asked, "How will our garments be brought to us?" And the Lord said to him, "Some will bring them to you, and others will received them." In essence, the materials come (are revealed) to and through man by way of the Holy Spirit; but the corner stone/material which the Holy Spirit sent was rejected by the on-site laborers who were laying the stones one after another.
Some truths I searched for, while other truths were revealed by people that God put on my path etc, which incidentally seems to be ongoing…
How do you know “Apocrypha of John” is the “corner stone” that Christians (in the past) rejected? There were many books that were rejected, why is that particular book, the “corner stone”?
And how can the “Apocrypha of John”, be the “corner stone” rejected by the Jews, when they don’t even entertain any of it, (the 4 gospels) to begin with?
I mean, it’s not like the Jews had a major decision to make lol in terms of accepting that book, because they don’t accept any of the New Testament books to do with Jesus.
So I’m just not sure how this fits into your idea of the 2 houses of Israel rejecting the “corner stone” as you see it i.e. the “Apocrypha of John”.
Just to reiterate what I said further up: the “corner stone”, is generally regarded as Jesus, and not one particular book, left in or out.
Originally posted by Olise
Now having said this, understand that the rejection does not constitute a condemnation of the rejecters: for it is necessary that this should happen, that the scriptures should be fulfilled, and the fulfillment of the second great commandment manifested.
I’m not sure I follow you here. Where is there mention of the fulfillment of the second great commandment being manifested?
Originally posted by Olise
And now, discern Daniel 7, "Four great beasts came up from the sea (and SEA signifies religiosity), diverse one from the other (see also Revelation 13: 1). The first beast was like a lion: (the lion of the tribe of Judah); and had eagle’s wings, signifying a Cherub. And the wings having been plucked off, and the beast being made to stand as a man, with a man’s heart given to it, signifies its transformation in the hands of man from spiritual to religious, in the aftermath of the fist cherub. For once the rod of God touches the earth, it is turned into a serpent.
The second beast was like a bear, and raised itself up on one side, signifying the self-righteous bias of each religion; and having three RIBS in its mouth between its teeth, signifying the three brides/religions; and told to arise and devour much flesh, evidenced in the state of the three religions that stemmed from Abraham, which are Judaism, Christianity and Islam, inspired to devour each other; each one profanely seeking to justify itself, yet self-righteously dividing the body of Christ.
The third beast was like a leopard, and had four wings on its back and four heads, and dominion was given to it: this signifies the unification of all faiths in the unity of spirit, in the aftermath of the second cherubim of glory, which man shall again turn into a religion. Peter, signifying Christianity, was told, "If you love me, feed my sheep (all faiths): for I assure you this, When you were young you girt yourself and walked wherever you would, (did as you pleased): but when you shall be old you shall stretch forth your hands and another shall gird you, and carry you where you would not. The path that I walk you cannot now follow: for Satan has desired to have you; but you shall follow me afterwards (after the Last): for the cock shall not crow, till you have denied me THRICE".
And the fourth beast was dreadful and terrible, exceedingly strong, having great iron teeth, devouring and breaking in pieces, and stamping the residue with its feet: it was diverse from all the beasts that were before it; and had ten horns (horns of sight). And out of the horns arose another little horn, before whom three of the first horns were plucked up by the roots; and it had eyes like the eyes of man, and a mouth speaking great things: the false prophet, which is the beast of the earth, in whose guile the essence of the sacrificial offering shall be eliminated, setting up the abomination that will cause desolation; (for it supposes the end to have come: discern Exodus 32 and from that time to the end there shall be a thousand two hundred and ninety days; blessed is he that waits, and comes to the thousand three hundred and thirty fifth day. He that has an ear, let them hear!
Again I’m not sure I follow you… what does Exodus 32 have to do with the book of revelations?
Peace be with you Olise!
- JC
Originally posted by Joecroft
reply to post by Olise
Originally posted by Olise
Did the Jews not reject Jesus at the first? Of course they did! And so shall the Christians: for so it is written.
Where is it written?
Perhaps the verses point to another house of Israel, or maybe you have discerned it incorrectly…
[
Hello Joe,
There are only two houses of Israel; but to understand this, you must first discern what Israel means. Israel means A Prince of God, a cultivated one, or converted, having overcome; and this example was given in Jacob, who was coverted and crowned after he had wrestled with the angel of God and prevailed unto a new day: the dawn of a new age: discern Genesis 32: 24-30; and also, a second time in Genesis 35: 8-15, which signifies the second manifestation. Read through both chapters, and you will understand.
Now regarding the Christians rejecting the Christ, I mentioned the scriptures in my earlier responses to you; but here again are a couple of mysteries: in Matthew 26, Peter, signifying the Church, said to Jesus, "Though ALL men shall be offended because of you, yet will I (the Church) never be offended." And Jesus said to him, "I assure you this, Before the cock crow (before the dawn of the new age), you shall deny me THREE times."
And again, in John 21, Jesus said to Peter (the Church), "I assure you this, When you were young (the bubbling days of the Church) you girded yourself, and walked everywhichway you would: but when you shall be old (the latter days), you shall stretch fort your hands, and ANOTHER shall GIRD you, and CARRY you whither you WOULD NOT." And this Jesus spoke, signifying by which death the Church shall glorify God.
And yes, as you said, 'The Christians did accept Jesus for what they knew of him, but the Jews rejected him completely'; but know that not all the Jews rejected him: many followed and believed him, including his disciples. But the rejection I speak of is not of Jesus, as in the First, but of Christ, the Word, and also the Last: and I know this is foriegn to you. And just so you may know, when Peter was on his way out of Rome, toward the end of his ministry, he encountered Jesus, the Spirit/Christ heading toward Rome, signifying Christianity today; and when he asked Jesus where he was going, Jesus said to him, "To Rome, to be crucified AGAIN!"
Here's wisdom, At the time of the Ten Commandmnets, were two sacrificial lamb offerings not instituted? One in the morning (the First), and one in the evening, (the Last)? There is a reason or this!
The marriage of Jacob to the daughters of Laban was a symbol of UNITY, which today is disregarded, hence there is no peace: for Laban was of the leneage of Ishmael, which is Islam: see Genesis 28; and this is done to let everyone know that God is not divided, but ONE: discern verse 16. Hence Isaac instructed Jacob to marry from that lineage, in that he himself had done the same thing. This is for those who still to date disparage each other simply because one is Islam and the other is Christian or Judaic: your forefathers tried to teach you unity, but you chose division instead: and I speak this to the dividers.
And regarding the Stone, discern Genesis 29: for this stone regards all three religions, Judaism, Christianity and Islam; as it states, "Jacob took his journey toward the East, and saw a well in the field, and there were THREE flocks of SHEEP lying by it: for out of that well they WATERED/nourished the flocks (the sheep of all three religions, all being of the SAME lineage, Abraham); and a GREAT STONE was upon the WELL's MOUTH: and to it were all the flocks gathered: and they rolled the stone from the well's mouth, (the Word that nourishes the congregation comes from the WELL's MOUTH), and watered the sheep, and put the stone AGAIN upon the the well's mouth in HIS place.
And further down, it states, "Jacob said, The day is yet great/high, it is not yet time that the cattle SHOULD be gathered TOGETHER: water/nourish the sheep/congregation, and go and FEED them; and they said, 'We cannot, until ALL the flocks be gathered together (unified as one), and till they ROLL the STONE from the WELL's MOUTH (till the testator unveils the Word); then we water the sheep." And notice that Jacob was the one who rolled the stone from the well's mouth (unvailing the Word), and watered the flock: and Jacob is he who was converted to Israel!
Originally posted by Joecroft
reply to post by Olise
Originally posted by Olise
for as it states, "He is a rock of offence to them who stumble at the Word".
But that verse above, is generally regarded as referring to those who reject Jesus completely, and not about rejecting books, which should or should not, have been put into the bible.
Its not about a general consensus; its about the actual meaning: in rejecting the WORD the glorified Son spoke, you reject not only the glorified Son, but the Father also; hence Jesus said, "He that receives me receives him that sent me; and he that rejects me rejects also the Father who sent me." Why is the Son of Man referred to as a "Stumbligstone and a Rock of offence"? It is not because you will trip over him; it is because of the Word he speaks: the Jews stumbled at the Word because they could not make sense of what he was saying; and the Christians shall be offended because for one, the are not expecting Christ to come in the form of man, and two they have been conditioned to believe a certain way, yet they are being told something different.
And as you said, "They cannot reject what they do not know"; this is why it is being restored to them, that they might know. Fact is many shall reject the Word, spoken and in person. And understand, it is not the congregation we are talking about, but the "builders of the kingdom", the priests, preachers etc: the leaders of the Church who disallowed the congregation from receiving the Word; just like it was at the time of Jesus on earth.
Originally posted by Joecroft
reply to post by Olise
Originally posted by Olise
And again, discern the mystery of John 21, "Peter, (signifying the Church), I assure you this, when you were young, you girded yourself, and walked everywhichway you would; but when you shall be old, (i.e. the Church), you shall stretch forth your hands, and another shall gird you (with the truth: for which was Matthew 17: 11, and Acts 3: 21), and CARRY you where you would not." And in your seeking, seek the meaning of John 21: 6, 7 and 22; and understand that John 21 contains the mystery of the coming of the Son of Man.
The only thing I can discern from those verses is, that if John has not passed on; then where Jesus states, “this generation shall not pass until I return”, it may well mean that there is a connection to John.
There is a connection to John, but this also is a mystery; and it has to do with the coming of the Son of Man. And it is not about that generation, it states, "If I will that he TARRY till I come, what is that to you?" It is also the mystery of John 19: 26-27: for John did not need to look after Mary, as she had other children including daughters that she could have lived with if she did not have a place to live; infact one of her children was James, who also was a firm believer of Jesus in the later days of his mission. Let the Spirit unveil this to you.
Originally posted by Joecroft
reply to post by Olise
Originally posted by Olise
As stated in the Dialogue of the Savior, Judas asked, "How will our garments be brought to us?" And the Lord said to him, "Some will bring them to you, and others will received them." In essence, the materials come (are revealed) to and through man by way of the Holy Spirit; but the corner stone/material which the Holy Spirit sent was rejected by the on-site laborers who were laying the stones one after another.
Some truths I searched for, while other truths were revealed by people that God put on my path etc, which incidentally seems to be ongoing…
How do you know “Apocrypha of John” is the “corner stone” that Christians (in the past) rejected? There were many books that were rejected, why is that particular book, the “corner stone”?
And how can the “Apocrypha of John”, be the “corner stone” rejected by the Jews, when they don’t even entertain any of it, (the 4 gospels) to begin with?
I mean, it’s not like the Jews had a major decision to make lol in terms of accepting that book, because they don’t accept any of the New Testament books to do with Jesus.
So I’m just not sure how this fits into your idea of the 2 houses of Israel rejecting the “corner stone” as you see it i.e. the “Apocrypha of John”.
Just to reiterate what I said further up: the “corner stone”, is generally regarded as Jesus, and not one particular book, left in or out.
The Jews did not put together the canonical Bible, the Christian Church put it together, deciding within themselves what books should and should not be included. The Jews rejected the Word spoken in person and rejected the person as well, thereby rejecting the Rock of their Salvation and the Father who sent him. But the Word which the glorified Son committed to John to deliver was disallowed by the leaders of the Church.
Rejecting the Word is rejecting Jesus and that which he signifies, and in this they reject the corner-stone: for, again, the stone is the material used in constructing the kingdom; and the material the builders use is the Word of God: for it is a kingdom not built with hands: it is not a terrestrial kingdom, but a celestial kingdom. So you see, rejecting the Word is not just that the Apocryphon of John was rejected: for as you said, its not just one particular book that was disallowed; it is that the very Word spoken by the GLORIFIED Son was rejected: meaning, the Word that came directly from the SPIRIT, revealing the TRUE mysteries of the kingdom. The four gospels were words spoken while he was in flesh; and rejecting the STONE is not just one instance, it is a combination of things: the Word, the person, and his signification; the Apocryphon is just one of them.
In the Gospel of Thomas, Jesus said, "Have you found the beginning, that you seek the end?" And again, to the teacher who sought to teach him Greek, "First explain the Alpha (Beginning) to me and then I will explain the Beta to you." So you see, if the Word that reveals the beginning were not important, it would not have been revealed the way it was, and the caution specified at the end of it would not have been spoken. In was necessary that the congregation understood these things; for in that they lack this knowledge, Christianity is what it is today. And the Book of Revelation reveals its current state of being.
Originally posted by Joecroft
reply to post by Olise
Originally posted by Olise
Now having said this, understand that the rejection does not constitute a condemnation of the rejecters: for it is necessary that this should happen, that the scriptures should be fulfilled, and the fulfillment of the second great commandment manifested.
I’m not sure I follow you here. Where is there mention of the fulfillment of the second great commandment being manifested?
Originally posted by Olise
And now, discern Daniel 7, "Four great beasts came up from the sea (and SEA signifies religiosity), diverse one from the other (see also Revelation 13: 1). The first beast was like a lion: (the lion of the tribe of Judah); and had eagle’s wings, signifying a Cherub. And the wings having been plucked off, and the beast being made to stand as a man, with a man’s heart given to it, signifies its transformation in the hands of man from spiritual to religious, in the aftermath of the fist cherub. For once the rod of God touches the earth, it is turned into a serpent.
The second beast was like a bear, and raised itself up on one side, signifying the self-righteous bias of each religion; and having three RIBS in its mouth between its teeth, signifying the three brides/religions; and told to arise and devour much flesh, evidenced in the state of the three religions that stemmed from Abraham, which are Judaism, Christianity and Islam, inspired to devour each other; each one profanely seeking to justify itself, yet self-righteously dividing the body of Christ.
The third beast was like a leopard, and had four wings on its back and four heads, and dominion was given to it: this signifies the unification of all faiths in the unity of spirit, in the aftermath of the second cherubim of glory, which man shall again turn into a religion. Peter, signifying Christianity, was told, "If you love me, feed my sheep (all faiths): for I assure you this, When you were young you girt yourself and walked wherever you would, (did as you pleased): but when you shall be old you shall stretch forth your hands and another shall gird you, and carry you where you would not. The path that I walk you cannot now follow: for Satan has desired to have you; but you shall follow me afterwards (after the Last): for the cock shall not crow, till you have denied me THRICE".
And the fourth beast was dreadful and terrible, exceedingly strong, having great iron teeth, devouring and breaking in pieces, and stamping the residue with its feet: it was diverse from all the beasts that were before it; and had ten horns (horns of sight). And out of the horns arose another little horn, before whom three of the first horns were plucked up by the roots; and it had eyes like the eyes of man, and a mouth speaking great things: the false prophet, which is the beast of the earth, in whose guile the essence of the sacrificial offering shall be eliminated, setting up the abomination that will cause desolation; (for it supposes the end to have come: discern Exodus 32 and from that time to the end there shall be a thousand two hundred and ninety days; blessed is he that waits, and comes to the thousand three hundred and thirty fifth day. He that has an ear, let them hear!
Again I’m not sure I follow you… what does Exodus 32 have to do with the book of revelations?
Jesus said, "Till heaven and earth pass, not one jot or one tittle shall in any way pass from the law, till all be fulfilled." The Ten Commandmnets are made up of two great commandments: the first was fulfilled in Jesus; and the last he left you with, see John 13: 34&35 and 15: 12 & 17; and this has not been kept either.
Now know this, God will not create a pattern or institutes an order without a fulfilling purpose. The commandments came on TWO STONES of TESTIMONY; and at which time TWO SACRIFICIAL LAMB OFFERINGS was also ordered; and hence also the Ark of the Covenant has TWO CHERUBIMS of Glory shadowing it on EACH END, regarding the MATTER of the commandments. The first was fulfilled in Jesus, exemplified in the first sacrificial offering; but the last is yet to be fulfilled: hence Hebrews 4 tells you, "If Jesus had given you rest (meaning, fulfilled all things), then would he not afterward have spoken of another day. There remains therefore a rest (another fulfillment) to the people of God." And chapter 2 tells you, "We are yet to SEE all that has put put under him to fulfill; though we have SEEN Jesus."
And again, Acts 3 tells you, "He shall send again Jesus, which before was preached unto you: whom the heaven must receive until the times of restitution (restoration) of all things (see Matthew 17: 11), which God had spoken by the mouth of all his holy prophets since the world began (see Daniel 9: 24, Isaiah 53: 11 and Zechariah 6: 12 - 13: there are two different things, Sin and Iniquity: the first great commandment regards Sin against God, and the second regards Iniquities/transgressions against each other)." And study Isaiah 11 through and through, discerning every word.
And I tell you this now because it is the time of unveiling: for as you were told in Hebrews 9: 5, it is something that could not be spoken particularly of until the appropriate time, even as Revelation 10: 7 also denotes. And that which Exodus 32 has to do with the Book of Revelation has to do with the Beast of the earth, who will propagate that the end has already come and gone, turning many into idolatry, forcing them to worship the image which they shall make, even as the children of Israel did in Exodus 32 and as Daniel prophesied in Daniel 3: read in my previous post why I referred to Exodus 32.
All that I have said to you are in the scriptures; and in seeking diligently the Holy Spirit will unveil them to you!
Peace be with you Joe!!!
edit on 1-7-2011 by Olise because: (no reason given)
edit on 1-7-2011 by Olise because: (no reason
given)
In continuation:
In the wilderness of the True Mind you might suppose you pretty much know all there is to know, reveling in the deluded and vain glory of the adversary of your soul, until you find yourself on your dreadful death bed, then you realize you never made time to discern the important matters of life. Thus Hebrews 5 admonishes, "At the time when you ought to be teachers (of the oracle), you have need that one teach you again those things which are the first principles (the kindergarten) of the oracles of God; and are become such as have need of milk (taking baby steps), and not of strong meat: one who is ready to receive the secret wisdom/mystery of God.
For everyone that uses milk is unskillful in the word of righteousness: and as such is a babe: an eccentric infant seeking attention. But strong meat belongs to they that have come of age, who make a habit of exercising their senses to discern both good and evil. When you come to the knowledge of that which you ought to know, your mind shall no longer be wild, but tamed, manifesting the true light of life.
Therefore leaving the principles/basics of the doctrine of Christ behind, let us go on to perfection, (likeness of the perfect Man); not laying again the foundation of repentance from dead works, and of faith toward God, of the doctrine of baptisms, and of laying on of hands, and of resurrection of the dead, and of eternal judgment. For it is impossible for those who were once enlightened, and tasted of the heavenly gift, and were made partakers of the Holy Ghost, and have tasted the good word of God, and the powers of the world to come, if they shall fall away, to renew them again unto repentance; seeing they crucify to themselves the Son of God afresh, and put him to an open shame. For as the earth is nourished (blessed) by the rain of heaven, and brings forth herbs meet for them by whom it is dressed, so is the soul nourished by the manna from God."
Psalm 85 declares, "Mercy and truth are met together; righteousness and peace have kissed each other. Truth shall spring out of the earth, and righteousness shall look down from heaven. Righteousness shall go before him; and shall set us in the way of his steps." Thus John 13: 36, "Where I am going, you cannot follow me now; but you shall follow me afterwards."
There is a time appointed for everything: for as you were told in John 16, "I have many things to say to you, but you cannot hear them now: for you are yet babies; howbeit when he, the Spirit of truth, comes, he will guide you into all truth: for he shall not speak of himself (randomly); but whatsoever he shall hear, that shall he speak, and he will show you (reveal) things to come, (discern Revelation 5: 5). He shall glorify me: for he shall receive of mine, and shall show it to you. All things that the Father has are mine, (being the reason for creation): therefore said I, that he shall take of mine, and shall show it to you. A little while, and you shall not see me; and again, a little while, and you shall see me, because I go (return) to the Father." And thus Hebrews 9: 5 states, "And of the two Cherubims of glory shadowing the Mercyseat, we cannot now (then) speak particularly."
And regarding the significance of the Ark of the Covenant, it was purposely veiled to protect its mystery as directed in Exodus 26: 31-34, and which signification is denoted in Exodus 25: 16-22, Zechariah 4, Acts 3: 20-21 and Matthew 21: 1-9: for you were told in Matthew 21, "Tell this to the daughter (offspring) of Zion, and say, Behold, your King is coming to you: he is just, and having salvation; meek, and riding upon an ass (the first manifestation), and upon a colt the foal of an ass (the Last: both times bearing the burden of proof: for the enlightenment of the cross is its signification; not the wooden cross, but the act: for the cross overcomes and unites the four beasts, igniting their assemblies with the light of life)"; and thus John 12: 28, "I have both glorified it, and will glorify it again."
Having been contaminated by the counterfeit spirit, it is necessary to restore you back to perfection, and part of this restoration is to have love written into you, the Inner True Mind: for it is a deficiency that arose out of Sofia’s insolence, and propagated by the offspring of that insolence, the counterfeit spirit. As you were told, Moses described the righteousness which is of the law this way, He who does the things contained in the law lives by them; but the righteousness which is of faith states, The word/law is within you.
Love is that which is within: and its restoration comes through experiencing its dynamics in the law which governs the experience; hence, "Till heaven and earth pass, not one jot or one tittle shall in any way pass from the law, till all be fulfilled": the law governs the experience, and its signification governs the soul.
An example of its signification was given in Jesus, who manifested the first great commandment of the law; and also taught you the second great commandment in the parable of the Good Samaritan, and in that which he said to you, "Love your neighbor as yourself, love your enemies, do good to them that hate you, bless them that curse you, pray for them which despitefully use you, to him that smites you on one check turn to him the other, he that takes your cloak allow also to have your coat, give to everyone that asks without seeking a return: as you would want done unto you, do also unto others: for in so doing, the law/love permeates your being."
Attempting to abide in the law without embodying its essence is hopeless: for the essence of the law is exercised from within, and its manifestation is perceived without; and its dynamics both dictates and affects the glory of the world to come. Without embodying true love, it is impossible to abide in the law: for though your conscience responds to every thought and action, guiding you to truth, you are still susceptible to guile and its tendencies; for your sensibility was covered with insensibility.
This is why it is necessary for you to embody the essence of the law: for it uncovers your insensibility and restores your sensibility, which you will need; for once you have been perfected, you, the True Mind, shall dictate the functions and abilities of the primate through which you shall experience life in all purity and wholesome bliss infinitely in the book/story of Life; and in that you are part of a whole, it is necessary to discern how to co-exist in harmony.
As Hebrews 8 denotes, "We have a high priest who is set on the right hand of the throne of the Majesty in the heavens: (and if it were possible for you to see the technology of the soul you would understand this); a minister of the sanctuary, and of the true tabernacle, (the soul), which the Lord pitched, and not man. For every high priest is ordained to offer gifts and sacrifices: wherefore it is necessary that this man have somewhat also to offer.
The priests on earth who serve unto the example and shadow of heavenly things offer gifts (sacrifices) according to the law, even as Moses also was admonished of God to make the things pertaining to the tabernacle according to the pattern he was shown. But he that is set at the right hand of Majesty has obtained a more excellent ministry, by how much also he is the mediator of a better covenant. For if that first covenant had been faultless, then there would not be a need for a second. For finding fault with the first, he said, Behold, the days come, (not, The day comes; but, The days), when I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel (in Jesus) and with the house of Judah (in the Last): for I will put my laws into their mind, and write them in their hearts, that they will need no one to teach them anymore; they shall all know me, from the least to the greatest."
And thus you are told: "When you come to know yourself, then you will become known, and you will realize that it is you who are the Sons of the Living Father. If you will not know yourself, you dwell in poverty; and it is you who are that poverty": for the flesh you deem precious and cater to is a poverty/vanity that is not worth the magnificence you are. In awakening to who you are, you recognize the importance of your mate; for which you were told, "When you make the two into one, and make the inside like the outside and the above like the below: that is, to make the male and the female into a single one, so that you are not two separate eccentric entities, but both become a living male spirit: (in the similitude of the Father, not the eccentricity of Sophia), then you will enter the kingdom."
The love that causes fusion eliminates eccentricity and generates a powerful incorruptibly enlightening force: of which Isaiah stated, "The light of the moon shall be as the light of the sun, and the light of the sun shall be sevenfold, as the light of seven days, in the day that the LORD binds up the breach of his people." But when eccentrically you divide yourselves into individuals/halves, you each become selfish and lifeless idols of darkness.
This darkness of the despicable spirit rules over man, hence, intoxicated, they dividedly wallow in vanity, which was introduced to them by the angels of the Chief ruler through the female, with which she rules the male today. And do not be decieved, the world is what it is today because the male has been snared in the allure of the female, and hence she rules him; and his subjection to vanity is mainly for the benefit of the female whom he ever seeks to please, otherwise he could care less; but as you were told she must correct her deficiency: and this can only be done through the male spirit. So in being subject to her, you are not doing your part.
As is written, "I took my place in the midst of the world/experience, and I appeared to them in flesh. I found all of them intoxicated (with vanity); I found none of them thirsty (seeking the true water of life). And my soul became afflicted for the sons of men, because their minds have been blinded, (for the man’s sensibility was covered with insensibility), such that they do not have sight: for empty they came into the world, and empty too they seek to leave the world. But for the moment they are intoxicated; when they shake off the wine, then they will repent."
To be continued...
Peace be with you!!!
In the wilderness of the True Mind you might suppose you pretty much know all there is to know, reveling in the deluded and vain glory of the adversary of your soul, until you find yourself on your dreadful death bed, then you realize you never made time to discern the important matters of life. Thus Hebrews 5 admonishes, "At the time when you ought to be teachers (of the oracle), you have need that one teach you again those things which are the first principles (the kindergarten) of the oracles of God; and are become such as have need of milk (taking baby steps), and not of strong meat: one who is ready to receive the secret wisdom/mystery of God.
For everyone that uses milk is unskillful in the word of righteousness: and as such is a babe: an eccentric infant seeking attention. But strong meat belongs to they that have come of age, who make a habit of exercising their senses to discern both good and evil. When you come to the knowledge of that which you ought to know, your mind shall no longer be wild, but tamed, manifesting the true light of life.
Therefore leaving the principles/basics of the doctrine of Christ behind, let us go on to perfection, (likeness of the perfect Man); not laying again the foundation of repentance from dead works, and of faith toward God, of the doctrine of baptisms, and of laying on of hands, and of resurrection of the dead, and of eternal judgment. For it is impossible for those who were once enlightened, and tasted of the heavenly gift, and were made partakers of the Holy Ghost, and have tasted the good word of God, and the powers of the world to come, if they shall fall away, to renew them again unto repentance; seeing they crucify to themselves the Son of God afresh, and put him to an open shame. For as the earth is nourished (blessed) by the rain of heaven, and brings forth herbs meet for them by whom it is dressed, so is the soul nourished by the manna from God."
Psalm 85 declares, "Mercy and truth are met together; righteousness and peace have kissed each other. Truth shall spring out of the earth, and righteousness shall look down from heaven. Righteousness shall go before him; and shall set us in the way of his steps." Thus John 13: 36, "Where I am going, you cannot follow me now; but you shall follow me afterwards."
There is a time appointed for everything: for as you were told in John 16, "I have many things to say to you, but you cannot hear them now: for you are yet babies; howbeit when he, the Spirit of truth, comes, he will guide you into all truth: for he shall not speak of himself (randomly); but whatsoever he shall hear, that shall he speak, and he will show you (reveal) things to come, (discern Revelation 5: 5). He shall glorify me: for he shall receive of mine, and shall show it to you. All things that the Father has are mine, (being the reason for creation): therefore said I, that he shall take of mine, and shall show it to you. A little while, and you shall not see me; and again, a little while, and you shall see me, because I go (return) to the Father." And thus Hebrews 9: 5 states, "And of the two Cherubims of glory shadowing the Mercyseat, we cannot now (then) speak particularly."
And regarding the significance of the Ark of the Covenant, it was purposely veiled to protect its mystery as directed in Exodus 26: 31-34, and which signification is denoted in Exodus 25: 16-22, Zechariah 4, Acts 3: 20-21 and Matthew 21: 1-9: for you were told in Matthew 21, "Tell this to the daughter (offspring) of Zion, and say, Behold, your King is coming to you: he is just, and having salvation; meek, and riding upon an ass (the first manifestation), and upon a colt the foal of an ass (the Last: both times bearing the burden of proof: for the enlightenment of the cross is its signification; not the wooden cross, but the act: for the cross overcomes and unites the four beasts, igniting their assemblies with the light of life)"; and thus John 12: 28, "I have both glorified it, and will glorify it again."
Having been contaminated by the counterfeit spirit, it is necessary to restore you back to perfection, and part of this restoration is to have love written into you, the Inner True Mind: for it is a deficiency that arose out of Sofia’s insolence, and propagated by the offspring of that insolence, the counterfeit spirit. As you were told, Moses described the righteousness which is of the law this way, He who does the things contained in the law lives by them; but the righteousness which is of faith states, The word/law is within you.
Love is that which is within: and its restoration comes through experiencing its dynamics in the law which governs the experience; hence, "Till heaven and earth pass, not one jot or one tittle shall in any way pass from the law, till all be fulfilled": the law governs the experience, and its signification governs the soul.
An example of its signification was given in Jesus, who manifested the first great commandment of the law; and also taught you the second great commandment in the parable of the Good Samaritan, and in that which he said to you, "Love your neighbor as yourself, love your enemies, do good to them that hate you, bless them that curse you, pray for them which despitefully use you, to him that smites you on one check turn to him the other, he that takes your cloak allow also to have your coat, give to everyone that asks without seeking a return: as you would want done unto you, do also unto others: for in so doing, the law/love permeates your being."
Attempting to abide in the law without embodying its essence is hopeless: for the essence of the law is exercised from within, and its manifestation is perceived without; and its dynamics both dictates and affects the glory of the world to come. Without embodying true love, it is impossible to abide in the law: for though your conscience responds to every thought and action, guiding you to truth, you are still susceptible to guile and its tendencies; for your sensibility was covered with insensibility.
This is why it is necessary for you to embody the essence of the law: for it uncovers your insensibility and restores your sensibility, which you will need; for once you have been perfected, you, the True Mind, shall dictate the functions and abilities of the primate through which you shall experience life in all purity and wholesome bliss infinitely in the book/story of Life; and in that you are part of a whole, it is necessary to discern how to co-exist in harmony.
As Hebrews 8 denotes, "We have a high priest who is set on the right hand of the throne of the Majesty in the heavens: (and if it were possible for you to see the technology of the soul you would understand this); a minister of the sanctuary, and of the true tabernacle, (the soul), which the Lord pitched, and not man. For every high priest is ordained to offer gifts and sacrifices: wherefore it is necessary that this man have somewhat also to offer.
The priests on earth who serve unto the example and shadow of heavenly things offer gifts (sacrifices) according to the law, even as Moses also was admonished of God to make the things pertaining to the tabernacle according to the pattern he was shown. But he that is set at the right hand of Majesty has obtained a more excellent ministry, by how much also he is the mediator of a better covenant. For if that first covenant had been faultless, then there would not be a need for a second. For finding fault with the first, he said, Behold, the days come, (not, The day comes; but, The days), when I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel (in Jesus) and with the house of Judah (in the Last): for I will put my laws into their mind, and write them in their hearts, that they will need no one to teach them anymore; they shall all know me, from the least to the greatest."
And thus you are told: "When you come to know yourself, then you will become known, and you will realize that it is you who are the Sons of the Living Father. If you will not know yourself, you dwell in poverty; and it is you who are that poverty": for the flesh you deem precious and cater to is a poverty/vanity that is not worth the magnificence you are. In awakening to who you are, you recognize the importance of your mate; for which you were told, "When you make the two into one, and make the inside like the outside and the above like the below: that is, to make the male and the female into a single one, so that you are not two separate eccentric entities, but both become a living male spirit: (in the similitude of the Father, not the eccentricity of Sophia), then you will enter the kingdom."
The love that causes fusion eliminates eccentricity and generates a powerful incorruptibly enlightening force: of which Isaiah stated, "The light of the moon shall be as the light of the sun, and the light of the sun shall be sevenfold, as the light of seven days, in the day that the LORD binds up the breach of his people." But when eccentrically you divide yourselves into individuals/halves, you each become selfish and lifeless idols of darkness.
This darkness of the despicable spirit rules over man, hence, intoxicated, they dividedly wallow in vanity, which was introduced to them by the angels of the Chief ruler through the female, with which she rules the male today. And do not be decieved, the world is what it is today because the male has been snared in the allure of the female, and hence she rules him; and his subjection to vanity is mainly for the benefit of the female whom he ever seeks to please, otherwise he could care less; but as you were told she must correct her deficiency: and this can only be done through the male spirit. So in being subject to her, you are not doing your part.
As is written, "I took my place in the midst of the world/experience, and I appeared to them in flesh. I found all of them intoxicated (with vanity); I found none of them thirsty (seeking the true water of life). And my soul became afflicted for the sons of men, because their minds have been blinded, (for the man’s sensibility was covered with insensibility), such that they do not have sight: for empty they came into the world, and empty too they seek to leave the world. But for the moment they are intoxicated; when they shake off the wine, then they will repent."
To be continued...
Peace be with you!!!
edit on 2-7-2011 by Olise because: (no reason given)
edit on 2-7-2011 by Olise because: (no reason
given)
your being sexist against women in your post i have quoted from below.
just read through the 3 quoted sections below to see.
just read through the 3 quoted sections below to see.
Originally posted by Olise
Having been contaminated by the counterfeit spirit, it is necessary to restore you back to perfection, and part of this restoration is to have love written into you, the Inner True Mind: for it is a deficiency that arose out of Sofia’s insolence, and propagated by the offspring of that insolence, the counterfeit spirit.
"When you make the two into one, and make the inside like the outside and the above like the below: that is, to make the male and the female into a single one, so that you are not two separate eccentric entities, but both become a living male spirit: (in the similitude of the Father, not the eccentricity of Sophia), then you will enter the kingdom."
This darkness of the despicable spirit rules over man, hence, intoxicated, they dividedly wallow in vanity, which was introduced to them by the angels of the Chief ruler through the female, with which she rules the male today. And do not be decieved, the world is what it is today because the male has been snared in the allure of the female, and hence she rules him; and his subjection to vanity is mainly for the benefit of the female whom he ever seeks to please, otherwise he could care less; but as you were told she must correct her deficiency: and this can only be done through the male spirit. So in being subject to her, you are not doing your part.
edit on 2-7-2011 by Olise because: (no reason given)edit on 2-7-2011 by Olise because: (no reason given)
Originally posted by ThePunisher
your being sexist against women in your post i have quoted from below.
just read through the 3 quoted sections below to see.
Originally posted by Olise
Having been contaminated by the counterfeit spirit, it is necessary to restore you back to perfection, and part of this restoration is to have love written into you, the Inner True Mind: for it is a deficiency that arose out of Sofia’s insolence, and propagated by the offspring of that insolence, the counterfeit spirit.
"When you make the two into one, and make the inside like the outside and the above like the below: that is, to make the male and the female into a single one, so that you are not two separate eccentric entities, but both become a living male spirit: (in the similitude of the Father, not the eccentricity of Sophia), then you will enter the kingdom."
This darkness of the despicable spirit rules over man, hence, intoxicated, they dividedly wallow in vanity, which was introduced to them by the angels of the Chief ruler through the female, with which she rules the male today. And do not be decieved, the world is what it is today because the male has been snared in the allure of the female, and hence she rules him; and his subjection to vanity is mainly for the benefit of the female whom he ever seeks to please, otherwise he could care less; but as you were told she must correct her deficiency: and this can only be done through the male spirit. So in being subject to her, you are not doing your part.
edit on 2-7-2011 by Olise because: (no reason given)edit on 2-7-2011 by Olise because: (no reason given)
Beloved Punisher, why does the truth bother you? If I am being sexist, then the Word of God is sexist; therefore are you suggesting that God is sexist? Why does this bother you that much? Of all that is written, all you got out of it is me being sexist? Does the rest of it mean anything to you at all?
If deficiency came through what Sophia did, and this deficiency requires correction, and this is being pointed out so her partitioned souls might recognize that which must be corrected, why does this bother you? Would it have been different if the deficiency came through a male spirit? It has nothing to do with the fact that Sophia is female; it has everything to do with the fact that there is a deficiency, and the way by which it came is being pointed out so that it can be corrected: for if you do not know the root of a problem, how can you understand what needs to be done to solve it?
Did you not read through the second line of what you copied and pasted of my quote...
:
Originally posted by ThePunisher
Originally posted by Olise
"When you make the two into one, and make the inside like the outside and the above like the below: that is, to make the male and the female into a single one, so that you are not two separate eccentric entities, but both become a living male spirit: (in the similitude of the Father, not the eccentricity of Sophia), then you will enter the kingdom."
edit on 2-7-2011 by Olise because: (no reason given)edit on 2-7-2011 by Olise because: (no reason given)
to make the male and the female into ONE! Without both genders there is no whole. If something is wrong with the arm it affects the body as a whole: in essence, when one member of the body is hurting it affects the entire body, and other members of that body do what they can to help heal that deficiency: they will not turn their backs on the member, saying to it, "Oh you are alright, there's nothing wrong with you": for then you are lying to it; and if that member denies the fact that it is hurting, and does not get treated, is it not weakening the rest of the body, making it susceptible to death?
Power, without understanding its potency, can be used wrongly, leading to death: and this is what happened to Sophia; and in recognizing this, she repented, seeking to put right her deficiency, which was inherited by her partitioned souls; but until the rest of her partitioned souls recognize this and submit to correction, this deficiency will remain.
There is no diplomacy in the Word of God; that which is, is; and that which shall be, becomes! When one gets used to darkness, they do not welcome light: for the light reveals their deficiency; but without perceiving your deficiency, and understandiing how to correct it, how would you become whole again? As you are told in Proverbs 13, "He that spares the rod (being diplomatic) hates his son (they that need correcting); but he that loves his son chastens him"; and again, "The way which might seem right/diplomatic to man leads to death." And this is why the abomination of same-sex/gender-union, for which Sodom was destroyed, is prevelant today.
Start from the beginning of the thread, that you might comprehend what is being said: for if you walk into the middle of something, you will not have enough information to make a righteous judgment.
Peace be with you Punisher!!!
reply to post by Olise
Hey Olise
Peter is the rock, with which Jesus was to build his church, as it states in Matthew 16:18, “And I tell you that you are Peter, and on this rock I will build my church, and the gates of Hades will not overcome it”. Peter laid the foundation stones of the faith, by preaching to the Jews and the Gentiles. In the passage you quoted, Jesus also mentions that Peter would be an offense to men, because of what he was going to preach, which is why he was martyred.
Absolutely, I agree…
So you believe Christ’s return, is to come in the form of a man, but that what people have been told is different; and by different, I can only assume you mean that what has already been prophesied about Christ’s return in the 4 gospels and in the books of Daniel etc somehow don’t exactly line up accurately, with what is written in the Apocrypha of John…
I still haven’t gotten around to reading all of it…so can you be a bit more specific…?
Sure, glad we cleared that one up lol it is not the congregation’s fault that books in the past were rejected…The thing is, the early form of what we today call Christianity, didn’t have the knowledge of the secret Gnostic traditions; So it’s fairly understandable that the Jewish people and early Christians would try to formulate their own faith and religious understanding, based on what they had heard or read from Jesus teachings.
IYO…Why do you think the Apocrypha of John, was disallowed by the early church leaders?
Well, the Gnostic Christians clearly saw the Apocrypha of John as important, because it was placed at the forefront, of all their texts.
Jesus has already fulfilled the law i.e. the (10) commandments, as was prophesied by the prophets.
You seem to be hinting towards the idea, that when Jesus returns, he will be a sacrifice again!…is this what you are suggesting…?
No offence, but you seem to be reading a lot of meanings into things, which IMO just aren’t there…For example “If Jesus had given you rest (meaning, fulfilled all things)” The context of that Hebrews 4 verse, is about the Sabbath, and that is what the word “rest” is referring to in that chapter…
There is also some debate as to whether the name Jesus in that verse, is meant instead to be Joshua…
And here, you appear to be saying that Jesus 2nd sacrifice, will be for the Iniquities/transgressions we have done against each other…
Is this what you are suggesting!!!?
Peace be with you Olise
- JC
Hey Olise
Originally posted by Olise
Now regarding the Christians rejecting the Christ, I mentioned the scriptures in my earlier responses to you; but here again are a couple of mysteries: in Matthew 26, Peter, signifying the Church, said to Jesus, "Though ALL men shall be offended because of you, yet will I (the Church) never be offended." And Jesus said to him, "I assure you this, Before the cock crow (before the dawn of the new age), you shall deny me THREE times."
Peter is the rock, with which Jesus was to build his church, as it states in Matthew 16:18, “And I tell you that you are Peter, and on this rock I will build my church, and the gates of Hades will not overcome it”. Peter laid the foundation stones of the faith, by preaching to the Jews and the Gentiles. In the passage you quoted, Jesus also mentions that Peter would be an offense to men, because of what he was going to preach, which is why he was martyred.
Originally posted by Olise
And yes, as you said, 'The Christians did accept Jesus for what they knew of him, but the Jews rejected him completely'; but know that not all the Jews rejected him: many followed and believed him, including his disciples.
Absolutely, I agree…
Originally posted by Olise
…the Jews stumbled at the Word because they could not make sense of what he was saying; and the Christians shall be offended because for one, the are not expecting Christ to come in the form of man, and two they have been conditioned to believe a certain way, yet they are being told something different.
So you believe Christ’s return, is to come in the form of a man, but that what people have been told is different; and by different, I can only assume you mean that what has already been prophesied about Christ’s return in the 4 gospels and in the books of Daniel etc somehow don’t exactly line up accurately, with what is written in the Apocrypha of John…
I still haven’t gotten around to reading all of it…so can you be a bit more specific…?
Originally posted by Olise
And understand, it is not the congregation we are talking about, but the "builders of the kingdom", the priests, preachers etc: the leaders of the Church who disallowed the congregation from receiving the Word; just like it was at the time of Jesus on earth.
Sure, glad we cleared that one up lol it is not the congregation’s fault that books in the past were rejected…The thing is, the early form of what we today call Christianity, didn’t have the knowledge of the secret Gnostic traditions; So it’s fairly understandable that the Jewish people and early Christians would try to formulate their own faith and religious understanding, based on what they had heard or read from Jesus teachings.
Originally posted by Olise
The Jews did not put together the canonical Bible, the Christian Church put it together, deciding within themselves what books should and should not be included. The Jews rejected the Word spoken in person and rejected the person as well, thereby rejecting the Rock of their Salvation and the Father who sent him. But the Word which the glorified Son committed to John to deliver was disallowed by the leaders of the Church.
IYO…Why do you think the Apocrypha of John, was disallowed by the early church leaders?
Originally posted by Olise
In the Gospel of Thomas, Jesus said, "Have you found the beginning, that you seek the end?" And again, to the teacher who sought to teach him Greek, "First explain the Alpha (Beginning) to me and then I will explain the Beta to you." So you see, if the Word that reveals the beginning were not important, it would not have been revealed the way it was, and the caution specified at the end of it would not have been spoken. In was necessary that the congregation understood these things; for in that they lack this knowledge, Christianity is what it is today. And the Book of Revelation reveals its current state of being.
Well, the Gnostic Christians clearly saw the Apocrypha of John as important, because it was placed at the forefront, of all their texts.
Originally posted by Olise
Jesus said, "Till heaven and earth pass, not one jot or one tittle shall in any way pass from the law, till all be fulfilled." The Ten Commandmnets are made up of two great commandments: the first was fulfilled in Jesus; and the last he left you with, see John 13: 34&35 and 15: 12 & 17; and this has not been kept either.
Jesus has already fulfilled the law i.e. the (10) commandments, as was prophesied by the prophets.
Originally posted by Olise
…The commandments came on TWO STONES of TESTIMONY; and at which time TWO SACRIFICIAL LAMB OFFERINGS was also ordered; and hence also the Ark of the Covenant has TWO CHERUBIMS of Glory shadowing it on EACH END, regarding the MATTER of the commandments.
The first was fulfilled in Jesus, exemplified in the first sacrificial offering; but the last is yet to be fulfilled: hence Hebrews 4 tells you, "If Jesus had given you rest (meaning, fulfilled all things), then would he not afterward have spoken of another day.
You seem to be hinting towards the idea, that when Jesus returns, he will be a sacrifice again!…is this what you are suggesting…?
No offence, but you seem to be reading a lot of meanings into things, which IMO just aren’t there…For example “If Jesus had given you rest (meaning, fulfilled all things)” The context of that Hebrews 4 verse, is about the Sabbath, and that is what the word “rest” is referring to in that chapter…
There is also some debate as to whether the name Jesus in that verse, is meant instead to be Joshua…
Originally posted by Olise
There remains therefore a rest (another fulfillment) to the people of God." And chapter 2 tells you, "We are yet to SEE all that has put put under him to fulfill; though we have SEEN Jesus." And again, Acts 3 tells you, "He shall send again Jesus, which before was preached unto you: whom the heaven must receive until the times of restitution (restoration) of all things (see Matthew 17: 11), which God had spoken by the mouth of all his holy prophets since the world began (see Daniel 9: 24, Isaiah 53: 11 and Zechariah 6: 12 - 13: there are two different things, Sin and Iniquity: the first great commandment regards Sin against God, and the second regards Iniquities/transgressions against each other)."…
And here, you appear to be saying that Jesus 2nd sacrifice, will be for the Iniquities/transgressions we have done against each other…
Is this what you are suggesting!!!?
Peace be with you Olise
- JC
Originally posted by Joecroft
reply to post by Olise
Originally posted by Olise
Now regarding the Christians rejecting the Christ, I mentioned the scriptures in my earlier responses to you; but here again are a couple of mysteries: in Matthew 26, Peter, signifying the Church, said to Jesus, "Though ALL men shall be offended because of you, yet will I (the Church) never be offended." And Jesus said to him, "I assure you this, Before the cock crow (before the dawn of the new age), you shall deny me THREE times."
Peter is the rock, with which Jesus was to build his church, as it states in Matthew 16:18, “And I tell you that you are Peter, and on this rock I will build my church, and the gates of Hades will not overcome it”. Peter laid the foundation stones of the faith, by preaching to the Jews and the Gentiles. In the passage you quoted, Jesus also mentions that Peter would be an offense to men, because of what he was going to preach, which is why he was martyred.
Hello Joe,
To start with, you question me regarding things contained in the thread, which you have not finished reading: first read through the thread, that you may understand what is being said, then things will become clearer for you to understand. The questions you ask are based on the knowledge you have regarding heavenly matters; if you do not read through the entire thread, discerning the mysteries, how would any of it make sense? You will still base your arguments of what you know; not what I am saying. You would have to set all that you know aside, and clear your mind; (first empty the refridgerator); and then you can discern what I am saying.
As Paul said in 1st Corinthians 8, "If anyone thinks he knows anything, he knows nothing yet as he ought to know." A seeking mind finds: for it relinquishes all prior prejudiced knowledge of that which it seeks knowledge of; but if it holds on to any part of that prejudice, it can never fully learn that which it ought to learn.
Having said this, I will tell you that there is no where in Matthew 26 where Jesus told Peter that people will be offended by him (Peter) for the word he (Peter) will speak; Jesus told the disciples on two different occassions that they will be hated for his (Jesus) name's sake, and that they shall be delivered up to be afflicted.
I started by saying, "Here again are a couple of MYSTRERIES", then I presented Denying Christ THREE TIMES; you did not bother seeking the meaning to the mystery: instead you proceeded to tell me about Peter being the stone upon which the Christian Church is built. I know Peter was the first Pope; that has nothing to do with what I am telling you. At this point it is necessary for you to seek it out for yourself: for it does not matter what I say to you, you can only find it out when you sincerely seek it from within; then the Holy Spirit reveals it to you.
Originally posted by Joecroft
reply to post by Olise
Originally posted by Olise
…the Jews stumbled at the Word because they could not make sense of what he was saying; and the Christians shall be offended because for one, the are not expecting Christ to come in the form of man, and two they have been conditioned to believe a certain way, yet they are being told something different.
So you believe Christ’s return, is to come in the form of a man, but that what people have been told is different; and by different, I can only assume you mean that what has already been prophesied about Christ’s return in the 4 gospels and in the books of Daniel etc somehow don’t exactly line up accurately, with what is written in the Apocrypha of John…
I still haven’t gotten around to reading all of it…so can you be a bit more specific…?
No, I did not say that the Apocryphon of John contradicts that which was written in the 4 Gospels; I started by quoting that which was written, "First explain to me the Alpha, and then I will explain the Beta to you". There is a reason for that: without understanding the beginning, how would an exploration make any sense, let alone find its end? To understand anything, you must first start at its beginning, and learn of it through to its end.
Its not what people have been told; its what they have been conditioned to believe! Where in the scriptures does it say Christ will come back as Spirit? And do not say Acts 1: 11: for that clearly affirms to you what I am saying: the disciples saw him in flesh, before his ascension; and they were told, "This same Jesus, which is taken up from you into heaven, shall so come in LIKE MANNER/flesh as you have seen him go into heaven."
If he were to come as Spirit, how will man see him, lol? And if man can't see him, to what benefit will his return be? Does the scriptures not say he shall come to restore all things? It tells you that the mysteries are hidden for a reason: that the word of God should be fulfilled; hence it is foolishness to the Gentiles: for as you were told in 1st Corinthians 2, "For if they had known the mysteries, they would no have crucified the Lord of glory." Why do you think he shall be a stumblingblock and rock of offence? Analyze this! For as you were told in Luke 17: 24, "As the lightning enlightens the East, so shall it also enlighten the West: discern also Isaiah 52: 15.
Hebrews 9 tells you, "Of the TWO Cherubims of GLORY, we cannot now (then) speak particularly", and again in 5, "Of whom we have many things to say, and hard to be uttered, seeing you are dull of hearing." Of which Jesus said in John 16, "I have yet many things to SAY to you, but you cannot BEAR them now: howbeit when he, the Spirit of truth, is come, he will GUIDE you into all truth: for he shall not SPEAK of himself; but whatsoever he shall HEAR, that shall he SPEAK: and he will SHOW you things to come." For the Word to be SPOKEN; and for man to HEAR and SEE, these things have to be done through a primate: else how would it benefit man?
Originally posted by Joecroft
reply to post by Olise
Originally posted by Olise
And understand, it is not the congregation we are talking about, but the "builders of the kingdom", the priests, preachers etc: the leaders of the Church who disallowed the congregation from receiving the Word; just like it was at the time of Jesus on earth.
Sure, glad we cleared that one up lol it is not the congregation’s fault that books in the past were rejected…The thing is, the early form of what we today call Christianity, didn’t have the knowledge of the secret Gnostic traditions; So it’s fairly understandable that the Jewish people and early Christians would try to formulate their own faith and religious understanding, based on what they had heard or read from Jesus teachings.
Originally posted by Olise
The Jews did not put together the canonical Bible, the Christian Church put it together, deciding within themselves what books should and should not be included. The Jews rejected the Word spoken in person and rejected the person as well, thereby rejecting the Rock of their Salvation and the Father who sent him. But the Word which the glorified Son committed to John to deliver was disallowed by the leaders of the Church.
IYO…Why do you think the Apocrypha of John, was disallowed by the early church leaders?
Originally posted by Olise
In the Gospel of Thomas, Jesus said, "Have you found the beginning, that you seek the end?" And again, to the teacher who sought to teach him Greek, "First explain the Alpha (Beginning) to me and then I will explain the Beta to you." So you see, if the Word that reveals the beginning were not important, it would not have been revealed the way it was, and the caution specified at the end of it would not have been spoken. In was necessary that the congregation understood these things; for in that they lack this knowledge, Christianity is what it is today. And the Book of Revelation reveals its current state of being.
Well, the Gnostic Christians clearly saw the Apocrypha of John as important, because it was placed at the forefront, of all their texts.
To start with, why would the Jewish people and early Christians try to formulate their own faith and religious understanding, based on what they had heard or read from Jesus teachings? As it is written, "Their eyes have been closed, and their ears have been shut, and their hearts hardened"; and again, "The man's sensibility was covered with insensibility": but by whom and why? This is why it is necessary for you to read through the Apocryphon of John: in essence, start at the beginning of this thread and read (study) through to where we currently are, and continue on to the end. For as you noticed, the Gnostics saw the importance!
Originally posted by Joecroft
reply to post by Olise
Originally posted by Olise
Jesus said, "Till heaven and earth pass, not one jot or one tittle shall in any way pass from the law, till all be fulfilled." The Ten Commandmnets are made up of two great commandments: the first was fulfilled in Jesus; and the last he left you with, see John 13: 34&35 and 15: 12 & 17; and this has not been kept either.
Jesus has already fulfilled the law i.e. the (10) commandments, as was prophesied by the prophets.
Really? And if so, why did he leave you with the last great commandment? And why does Hebrews 4 state, "If Jesus had given them rest, then would he not have spoken of another day"? In essence, if all the commandments have been fulfilled, why are you yet confounded in the primate, instead of having entered your Sabath/perfection? Have you never wondered why the commandments came on two STONES of Testimony? And why there are TWO Cherubims of Glory shadowing the Mercyseat? And why the Jews yet await the Messiah? For as Paul stated to you in Romans 11, "If the casting away of the Jews be the reconciliation of the world, what shall the receiving (regrafting) of them be, but eternal life (rest, sabath, perfection)?"
As Paul further stated, "Have the Jews stumbled (on the Stone) that they should fall? God forbid: but rather through their fall salvation is to come unto the Gentiles, for to provoke the Jews to jealousy." And as the Jews stumbled on the Stone in Jesus, so also shall the Christians be offended by the Rock in the Last: for it is foolishness to them that Christ should be crucified again, this time for peace, since that which was committed to their trust even they could not keep (hence John 21: 18); for in this the Jews are grafted/reconciled back in to the body, making it whole: for NOT one member of the body will be cast out.
And regarding transposing the name Jesus in place of Joshua, discern Zechariah 3, and think who Joshua signifies. And to further understand the coming of the Son of man, discern also Zechariah 4.
Peace be with you Joe!!!
edit on 4-7-2011 by Olise because: (no reason given)
edit on 4-7-2011 by Olise because: (no reason
given)
edit on 4-7-2011 by Olise because: (no reason given)
reply to post by Olise
Hi Olise
Yes you are right, I made a slight mistake… Jesus did not say in that particular passage, that people would be offended by him (Peter) or his words…
But having said that, you still appear to be reading too much into the verses…
Here’s the verse below…
Matthew 26:33-34
Jesus is talking about Peter’s future denial, after Jesus was handed over to the Romans; I don’t see any mystery here…
Well, I did look through the verses you quoted, as being in connection to the “Denying Christ THREE TIMES” mystery; but not only do I not see any mystery, I don’t know what mystery you are alluding too…
I never mentioned that there was a contradiction and I wasn’t accusing you of saying that either; You said “they (Christians) would not know what to expect” and so I replied by saying “I can only assume etc…that somehow they (4 Gospels) don’t exactly line up accurately, with what is written in the Apocrypha of John”
Yes I was assuming and asking at the same time, because I haven’t read the whole Apocrypha of John. But asking if something doesn’t exactly line up without knowing the text, and saying something is a contradiction, are two completely different things…
Nowhere I’m aware of.
Yes, I agree
He is a stumbling block, because people find it difficult to believe in him…
Well, as you have already mentioned in one of your earlier posts, not all Jewish people rejected Jesus at that time period. And to answer your question above, they tried, because they believed in him (Jesus)
I will try to read through all of the Apocrypha of John before I make any more replies…
I don’t see it as Jesus leaving us with the last commandment, as you do.
I see it as Jesus teaching us about that last commandment, just as he taught us about all the other commandments, which IMO is how he fulfilled them…
The only answer I can give right now is that eternal life takes place in a person’s spirit/soul, and not in the flesh.
To be honest, I haven’t given it much thought…the laws are now written on people’s hearts…
I’m not sure, maybe decoration for protection?
The Jews (non believers) are waiting for a Messiah because they have rejected Jesus.
Coming to a belief in Jesus, would be a good start…
Peace be with you Olise
- JC
Hi Olise
Originally posted by Olise
Having said this, I will tell you that there is no where in Matthew 26 where Jesus told Peter that people will be offended by him (Peter) for the word he (Peter) will speak; Jesus told the disciples on two different occassions that they will be hated for his (Jesus) name's sake, and that they shall be delivered up to be afflicted.
Yes you are right, I made a slight mistake… Jesus did not say in that particular passage, that people would be offended by him (Peter) or his words…
But having said that, you still appear to be reading too much into the verses…
Here’s the verse below…
Matthew 26:33-34
Peter answered and said unto him, Though all men shall be offended because of thee, yet will I never be offended.
Jesus said unto him, Verily I say unto thee, That this night, before the cock crow, thou shalt deny me thrice.
Jesus is talking about Peter’s future denial, after Jesus was handed over to the Romans; I don’t see any mystery here…
Originally posted by Olise
I started by saying, "Here again are a couple of MYSTRERIES", then I presented Denying Christ THREE TIMES; you did not bother seeking the meaning to the mystery:
Well, I did look through the verses you quoted, as being in connection to the “Denying Christ THREE TIMES” mystery; but not only do I not see any mystery, I don’t know what mystery you are alluding too…
Originally posted by Olise
No, I did not say that the Apocryphon of John contradicts that which was written in the 4 Gospels;
I never mentioned that there was a contradiction and I wasn’t accusing you of saying that either; You said “they (Christians) would not know what to expect” and so I replied by saying “I can only assume etc…that somehow they (4 Gospels) don’t exactly line up accurately, with what is written in the Apocrypha of John”
Yes I was assuming and asking at the same time, because I haven’t read the whole Apocrypha of John. But asking if something doesn’t exactly line up without knowing the text, and saying something is a contradiction, are two completely different things…
Originally posted by Olise
Its not what people have been told; its what they have been conditioned to believe! Where in the scriptures does it say Christ will come back as Spirit?
Nowhere I’m aware of.
Originally posted by Olise
And do not say Acts 1: 11: for that clearly affirms to you what I am saying: the disciples saw him in flesh, before his ascension; and they were told, "This same Jesus, which is taken up from you into heaven, shall so come in LIKE MANNER/flesh as you have seen him go into heaven."
Yes, I agree
Originally posted by Olise
It tells you that the mysteries are hidden for a reason: that the word of God should be fulfilled; hence it is foolishness to the Gentiles: for as you were told in 1st Corinthians 2, "For if they had known the mysteries, they would no have crucified the Lord of glory." Why do you think he shall be a stumblingblock and rock of offence?
He is a stumbling block, because people find it difficult to believe in him…
Originally posted by Olise
To start with, why would the Jewish people and early Christians try to formulate their own faith and religious understanding, based on what they had heard or read from Jesus teachings? As it is written, "Their eyes have been closed, and their ears have been shut, and their hearts hardened";
Well, as you have already mentioned in one of your earlier posts, not all Jewish people rejected Jesus at that time period. And to answer your question above, they tried, because they believed in him (Jesus)
Originally posted by Olise
and again, "The man's sensibility was covered with insensibility": but by whom and why? This is why it is necessary for you to read through the Apocryphon of John: in essence, start at the beginning of this thread and read (study) through to where we currently are, and continue on to the end. For as you noticed, the Gnostics saw the importance!
I will try to read through all of the Apocrypha of John before I make any more replies…
Originally posted by Olise
Really? And if so, why did he leave you with the last great commandment?
I don’t see it as Jesus leaving us with the last commandment, as you do.
I see it as Jesus teaching us about that last commandment, just as he taught us about all the other commandments, which IMO is how he fulfilled them…
Originally posted by Olise
And why does Hebrews 4 state, "If Jesus had given them rest, then would he not have spoken of another day"? In essence, if all the commandments have been fulfilled, why are you yet confounded in the primate, instead of having entered your Sabath/perfection?
The only answer I can give right now is that eternal life takes place in a person’s spirit/soul, and not in the flesh.
Originally posted by Olise
Have you never wondered why the commandments came on two STONES of Testimony?
To be honest, I haven’t given it much thought…the laws are now written on people’s hearts…
Originally posted by Olise
And why there are TWO Cherubims of Glory shadowing the Mercyseat?
I’m not sure, maybe decoration for protection?
Originally posted by Olise
And why the Jews yet await the Messiah?
The Jews (non believers) are waiting for a Messiah because they have rejected Jesus.
Originally posted by Olise
For as Paul stated to you in Romans 11, "If the casting away of the Jews be the reconciliation of the world, what shall the receiving (regrafting) of them be, but eternal life (rest, sabath, perfection)?"
Coming to a belief in Jesus, would be a good start…
Peace be with you Olise
- JC
Originally posted by Joecroft
reply to post by Olise
But having said that, you still appear to be reading too much into the verses…
Here’s the verse below…
Matthew 26:33-34
Peter answered and said unto him, Though all men shall be offended because of thee, yet will I never be offended.
Jesus said unto him, Verily I say unto thee, That this night, before the cock crow, thou shalt deny me thrice.
Jesus is talking about Peter’s future denial, after Jesus was handed over to the Romans; I don’t see any mystery here…
Originally posted by Olise
I started by saying, "Here again are a couple of MYSTRERIES", then I presented Denying Christ THREE TIMES; you did not bother seeking the meaning to the mystery:
Well, I did look through the verses you quoted, as being in connection to the “Denying Christ THREE TIMES” mystery; but not only do I not see any mystery, I don’t know what mystery you are alluding too…
Hello Joe,
I will start with what Paul said in Collosians 1, "The mystery which has been HID from ages and from generations"; and in chapter 4, "That God would open unto us a door, to speak the mystery of Christ": so as you can see, until God reveals it to you, you cannot see that there is a mystery embeded anywhere, hence you do not see it - yet; but it shall be revealed to you, as also unto all, having been called of God.
Solomon said in Ecclesiastes 9 (when you have the time, read all of it), "All things come alike to everyone, unless God unveils wisdom to you": for you are told in John, "The Spirit of Truth, whom the world cannot receive, because it cannot SEE him, (in that he is being hosted by the Anointed one, a primate, just like Jesus the Carpenter was), when he shall come, he will guide you unto ALL truth". As Jesus said in the Gospel of Thomas to his disciples, "I shall give you what no eye has seen and what no ear has heard and what no hand has touched and what has never occurred to the human mind." The Word of God comes through a primate to the Species; even as God manifests himself as a teacher of righteousness through a primate to the Species.
Having said that, let us address the "Denying three times": Jesus told you, "I am the Way, the Truth, and the Life/Light"; and you were told in John 1, "In him was Life; and the life was the Light of men/soul; and the Light shines in darkness (the experience), and the darkness does not comprehend it"; he is the Light of the Soul, of the Inner True Mind, of which is the experience; and in that the primate knows and learns nothing, it is the Inner True Mind that learns through experiences generated in the primatial realm, which also is within the Soul.
The Way was denied in Jesus, the Truth shall be denied in the Last: in denying both you deny the Light of Life; yet so shall the Light/Life be denied again: see Revelation 13 and 14. For in this the work of God is being fulfilled: of which Paul said in 1st Corinthians, "God chose the things that seem foolish to the world to confound the wise: that no flesh should glory in his presence". Salvation is not something you earn: it is the work of God.
Originally posted by Joecroft
reply to post by Olise
Originally posted by Olise
It tells you that the mysteries are hidden for a reason: that the word of God should be fulfilled; hence it is foolishness to the Gentiles: for as you were told in 1st Corinthians 2, "For if they had known the mysteries, they would no have crucified the Lord of glory." Why do you think he shall be a stumblingblock and rock of offence?
He is a stumbling block, because people find it difficult to believe in him…
Originally posted by Olise
To start with, why would the Jewish people and early Christians try to formulate their own faith and religious understanding, based on what they had heard or read from Jesus teachings? As it is written, "Their eyes have been closed, and their ears have been shut, and their hearts hardened";
Well, as you have already mentioned in one of your earlier posts, not all Jewish people rejected Jesus at that time period. And to answer your question above, they tried, because they believed in him (Jesus)
They did not and do not believe in Jesus; they are conditioned that way; and conditioning comes through fear; hence they preach condemnation to those who do not believe in Jesus: for they are ignorant of his Light, that which he signifies, as they only know the flesh, hence John 2: 24-25 and 8: 38-44. As you said above, "He is a stumblingblock because people find it difficult to believe in him..."; they find it difficult becasue they do not understand his Word: you cannot believe something you do not understand; and hence the second great commandment is yet unfulfilled. The first great commandment was fulfilled in Jesus, but not the second.
Understand this, Jesus did not die to appease God on man's behalf: his sacrifice was an example for man to learn the first great commandment, which man is yet to comprehend, hence man cannot yet keep the second great commandment; thus the second scarificial offering is not no appease God or man, but to exemplify the second great commandment, in that man is yet to comprehend and accept the Truth. Without understanding the signification of the Cross, you cannot understand the sacrificial offering of Christ: Jesus did not die on the cross to for your sins; he made an example of true love by sacrificing the flesh (see John 6: 63, 1st Corinthians 15: 50 and Galatians 5: 24), that you might understand the corpse that is flesh and the life that you are.
And know this, in understanding the worthlessness of flesh, you are able to sacrifice it for another, knowing that you transcend death, being life itself; but until you understand this, and understand that your neighbor is ONE with you, how would you be able to give your life for them: for the fear of death which you have been conditioned to fear will prevent that, even though you recognize that every flesh must revert to its true nature, death.
As you were told in the Gospel of Thomas, "Whoever has come to understand the world has found (only) a corpse, and whoever has found a corpse is superior to the world"; and again, "He who has recognized the world has found the body, but he who has found the body is superior to the world."
Originally posted by Joecroft
reply to post by Olise
Originally posted by Olise
Really? And if so, why did he leave you with the last great commandment?
I don’t see it as Jesus leaving us with the last commandment, as you do.
I see it as Jesus teaching us about that last commandment, just as he taught us about all the other commandments, which IMO is how he fulfilled them…
Originally posted by Olise
And why does Hebrews 4 state, "If Jesus had given them rest, then would he not have spoken of another day"? In essence, if all the commandments have been fulfilled, why are you yet confounded in the primate, instead of having entered your Sabath/perfection?
The only answer I can give right now is that eternal life takes place in a person’s spirit/soul, and not in the flesh.
Jesus did not fulfill the law by teaching it to you: he fulfilled the first great commandment by exemplifying it for you to understand; and hence it is written in John 15, "If you keep my commandments, you shall abide in my love; even as I have kept my Father's commandments (which is the first great commandment), and abide in his love": for God is glorified in his Son; even as Christ shall be glorified in you. It is written in Matthew 22, A Pharisee had asked Jesus what the great commandment in the law is, and he answered, "You shall love the Lord your God with all your, and with all your soul, and with all your mind" this is the first and great commandment; and the second is like unto it, You shall love your neighbor AS yourself (for you are one and the same): on these two commandments hang ALL the LAW and the PROPHETS."
Jesus fulfilled the first great commandment: for only he can fulfill that commandment, being the Only-begotten of the Father: hence John 17, "Father, the hour is come; glorify your Son, that your Son also may glorify you"; but you are of him, Christ, hence he told you, "This is my commandment to you, That you love one another, as I have loved you: for greater LOVE has no man than this, that a man lay down his life for his friends"; hence he prayed to the Father, "That the ALL may be ONE; as you, Father, are in me, and I in you, that they also may be ONE in us." Hence the Father committed judgment unto the Son, as the world is the body of Christ: for in that man cannot keep the second great commandment, an example of this shall be given, to fulfill it; and only then shall man come to understand the second great commandment and its fulfillment.
Yes, eternal life takes place in the soul, not in the flesh; but the law still has to be written into the Inner True Mind before you can enter perfection: and the only way this law can be written into the Inner True Mind is for it to experience this in the primate, which is the experience through which the Inner True Mind learns; and in that the primate knows nothing, the example has to come from the Son of Man, that the Inner True Mind might learn.
Originally posted by Joecroft
reply to post by Olise
Originally posted by Olise
And why there are TWO Cherubims of Glory shadowing the Mercyseat?
I’m not sure, maybe decoration for protection?
Lol, that's a good one Joe: not laughing at you, but at the thought...
They are called Cherubims of Glory because they are the two manifestations of God: to glorify God and to glorify Christ; hence they are referred to in Zechariah 4 as "The two anointed ones, or Sons of oil that stand by the Lord of the whole earth". For they are the mystery signified in this word: "The hands of Zerub-babel laid the foundation, his hands shall also finish it: for its not by might, nor by power, but by my spirit, says the Lord of HOSTS."
For Moses was told, Exodus 25, "You shall make two cherubims of gold, of BEATEN work, in the TWO ENDS of the MERCYSEAT; of the MATTER of the mercyseat (the Ten Commandments: the two great commandments) shall you make the two cherubims on each end (the Fits and the Last); and you shall put in the Ark the TESTIMONY that I shall give. And there will I meet with you, and I will commune with you from above the mercyseat, from between the TWO Cherubims which are upon the Ark of the TESTIMONY."
And in Exodus 29, "You shall offer TWO lambs: one in the morning, and the other in the evening; and they shall be offered at the DOOR (serve as the door) of the tabernacle of the congregation before the Lord: where I will meet you, to speak there unto you. And there I will meet with the children of Israel (the princes of God: the converted: for all shall be converted into Israel), and the tabernacle (Israel) shall be sanctified by my glory."
Peace be with you Joe: you are love!!!
reply to post by Olise
Hi Olise
Looks like I will just have to wait for the mystery to be unveiled to me. But seeing as the “Denying Christ THREE TIMES” mystery that you mentioned, is tied into the second sacrifice of Jesus, which is in turn connected to this idea of the second great commandment that still needs to be fulfilled; then bearing those things in mind, I will only address why I think the second great commandment has already been fulfilled.
What if people believe Jesus sacrifice was to appease God and also understand that it exemplifies the first great commandment…
And what if there are those who only believe Jesus sacrifice exemplified the first great commandment and was not a sacrifice to appease God…
My point is, that if man can comprehend Jesus sacrifice regarding the first great commandment, then he will also understand why it exemplifies the second great commandment.
Like Jesus said “No greater Love hath a man than to lay down his life for his friends”. Jesus sacrifice not only teaches us about Gods love for us, but also about how we should treat each other. Remember that on those 2 great commandments, hang all the other laws. Jesus teaches and brings a better understanding on all of the Ten Commandments throughout his ministry, in just about everything he said and did.
No one has ever told me that before!!!
Yes, I am already aware of what you have written above. And in case you don’t believe me, you can find my post, explaining how I see it here…And remember, you cannot change the dates on your past posts…
This is just the thing, when I received the Holy Spirit, I became aware that everything was one with me, and when a person realizes this, he also comes to know why it is important to keep the second great commandment, as well as the first. Think about it…
First of all, you will be surprised at what I understand..
Your reasoning is that it is one way (showing Physically), but that it cannot also be another (teachings spoken). Jesus not only exemplified the Laws in his very actions, but also throughout his message that he teaches through his spoken words.
And know this, lol even the greatest master, is aware that he can learn something from the student, that’s what makes him great.
I agree, I couldn’t have put it better myself…
An example has already been given by Jesus life and teachings and by his example which IMO covers both of the Great commandments. Knowing you are one with the Father covers the first great commandment and knowing that everyone else is a part of God also, covers the second great commandment…
LOL
I meant that as a joke, so it’s ok to laugh…
May the grace of God be with you Olise…
- JC
Hi Olise
Originally posted by Olise
Hello Joe,
I will start with what Paul said in Collosians 1, "The mystery which has been HID from ages and from generations"; and in chapter 4, "That God would open unto us a door, to speak the mystery of Christ": so as you can see, until God reveals it to you, you cannot see that there is a mystery embeded anywhere, hence you do not see it - yet; but it shall be revealed to you, as also unto all, having been called of God.
Looks like I will just have to wait for the mystery to be unveiled to me. But seeing as the “Denying Christ THREE TIMES” mystery that you mentioned, is tied into the second sacrifice of Jesus, which is in turn connected to this idea of the second great commandment that still needs to be fulfilled; then bearing those things in mind, I will only address why I think the second great commandment has already been fulfilled.
Originally posted by Olise
Understand this, Jesus did not die to appease God on man's behalf: his sacrifice was an example for man to learn the first great commandment, which man is yet to comprehend, hence man cannot yet keep the second great commandment;
What if people believe Jesus sacrifice was to appease God and also understand that it exemplifies the first great commandment…
And what if there are those who only believe Jesus sacrifice exemplified the first great commandment and was not a sacrifice to appease God…
My point is, that if man can comprehend Jesus sacrifice regarding the first great commandment, then he will also understand why it exemplifies the second great commandment.
Like Jesus said “No greater Love hath a man than to lay down his life for his friends”. Jesus sacrifice not only teaches us about Gods love for us, but also about how we should treat each other. Remember that on those 2 great commandments, hang all the other laws. Jesus teaches and brings a better understanding on all of the Ten Commandments throughout his ministry, in just about everything he said and did.
Originally posted by Olise
…thus the second scarificial offering is not no appease God or man, but to exemplify the second great commandment, in that man is yet to comprehend and accept the Truth. Without understanding the signification of the Cross, you cannot understand the sacrificial offering of Christ: Jesus did not die on the cross to for your sins; he made an example of true love by sacrificing the flesh (see John 6: 63, 1st Corinthians 15: 50 and Galatians 5: 24), that you might understand the corpse that is flesh and the life that you are.
No one has ever told me that before!!!
Yes, I am already aware of what you have written above. And in case you don’t believe me, you can find my post, explaining how I see it here…And remember, you cannot change the dates on your past posts…
Originally posted by Olise
And know this, in understanding the worthlessness of flesh, you are able to sacrifice it for another, knowing that you transcend death, being life itself; but until you understand this, and understand that your neighbor is ONE with you, how would you be able to give your life for them: for the fear of death which you have been conditioned to fear will prevent that, even though you recognize that every flesh must revert to its true nature, death.
This is just the thing, when I received the Holy Spirit, I became aware that everything was one with me, and when a person realizes this, he also comes to know why it is important to keep the second great commandment, as well as the first. Think about it…
Originally posted by Joecroft
I don’t see it as Jesus leaving us with the last commandment, as you do.
I see it as Jesus teaching us about that last commandment, just as he taught us about all the other commandments, which IMO is how he fulfilled them…
Originally posted by Olise
Jesus did not fulfill the law by teaching it to you: he fulfilled the first great commandment by exemplifying it for you to understand;
First of all, you will be surprised at what I understand..
Your reasoning is that it is one way (showing Physically), but that it cannot also be another (teachings spoken). Jesus not only exemplified the Laws in his very actions, but also throughout his message that he teaches through his spoken words.
And know this, lol even the greatest master, is aware that he can learn something from the student, that’s what makes him great.
Originally posted by Olise
It is written in Matthew 22, A Pharisee had asked Jesus what the great commandment in the law is, and he answered, "You shall love the Lord your God with all your, and with all your soul, and with all your mind" this is the first and great commandment; and the second is like unto it, You shall love your neighbor AS yourself (for you are one and the same): on these two commandments hang ALL the LAW and the PROPHETS."
I agree, I couldn’t have put it better myself…
Originally posted by Olise
Hence the Father committed judgment unto the Son, as the world is the body of Christ: for in that man cannot keep the second great commandment, an example of this shall be given, to fulfill it; and only then shall man come to understand the second great commandment and its fulfillment.
An example has already been given by Jesus life and teachings and by his example which IMO covers both of the Great commandments. Knowing you are one with the Father covers the first great commandment and knowing that everyone else is a part of God also, covers the second great commandment…
Originally posted by Joecroft
I’m not sure, maybe decoration for protection?
Originally posted by Olise
Lol, that's a good one Joe: not laughing at you, but at the thought...
LOL
I meant that as a joke, so it’s ok to laugh…
May the grace of God be with you Olise…
- JC
Originally posted by Joecroft
reply to post by Olise
Originally posted by Olise
Lol, that's a good one Joe: not laughing at you, but at the thought...
LOL
I meant that as a joke, so it’s ok to laugh…
May the grace of God be with you Olise…
Originally posted by Joecroft
reply to post by Olise
An example has already been given by Jesus life and teachings and by his example which IMO covers both of the Great commandments. Knowing you are one with the Father covers the first great commandment and knowing that everyone else is a part of God also, covers the second great commandment…
Beloved Joe,
To start with, THANKS for the good wish. And secondly, Lol, ofcourse its ok to laugh; when I wish you peace, it is because I seek peace between us in our discussion: and laughing sets everything at ease. The seeking mind is ever open to learning; and as long as one is in the experience (the world), he is ever learning, being the Inner True Mind which only knows that which is being written into it. And do not take the things I say as being directed to you personally, given your statement about how much you do know; its a generalization of sorts. And yes, even Jesus learned along the way, see Hebrews 5: 8, for one; and also Matthew 15: 22 - 28.
Now having said that, I will lead you to remember that even while Jesus was on earth, there were those who understood the law and how to keep it through love; hence Jesus said in Matthew 15, "I have not come to save the just, but the lost sheep of the house of Israel." And remember, "As the lightening enlightens the east, so shall it also enlighten the West." For which it is made known in the scriptures, he did not come for the Gentiles at the first (see Matthew 10: 5&6), but for the Jews; but the next coming is unto the Gentiles (see Romans 1: 16, 2: 9&10 and 11: 25, and Colosians 1: 27). For though the people might have heard his teachings, they do not abide in it: its not what you learn theoretically, its what you learn experiencially.
As Paul stated in Romans 2, "It is not the hearers of the law that are just before God, but the DOERS of the law shall be justified. For when the Gentiles, which have not the law, DO by nature the things contained iin the law, these, having not the law, are a law unto themselves: which show the work of the law written in their hearts, their conscience also bearing witness (witnessing with them), and their thoughts either accusing or excusing one another." And as James said, (James 1), "If you claim to be religious, and yet your actions are contrary, you decieve yourself, and your religion therefore is vain."
And as 1st John states, "Little children, (being yet infants in the Word), let no man deceive you: he that does righteousnes is righteous. He that commits sin is of the devil, (and since all are sinners, all are of the devil): for the devil sins from the begining (read through the Secret texts revealed to John, which I posted on this thread). For this purpose the Son of God was manifested, that he might destroy the works of the devil (which the devil has wrought in mankind). Whosoever is born of God does not commit sin, (and the Only-begotten Light is he that is born of God): for his seed remains iin him: he cannot sin because he is born of God."
Now this next verse explains the two great commandments, "In this the children of God are manifest (remember, the reason for manifestation is for others to see and learn from it), and the children of the devil: Whosoever does not do righteousness is not of God (covering the first great commandment: see Psalm 85: 10-13 and Hebrews 7: 2; and it is important to discern the scriptures I mention), neither he that does not love his brother (the second)." And further down, "So my little children, let us not LOVE in word, neither in tongue; but in deed and in truth."
So it is not that men have not heard the teachings of Jesus; it is that they do not keep it; and this is because it has not been written into their heart (Inner True Mind): and this can only be done through experiencing the fulfillment of such a law. You probably did not get what I said in my response to you yesterday, "Only the begotten Son of God can fulfill the first great commandment: for it deals with the Father; and hence the Father was glorified in him.
The second great commandmnet can only be fulfilled through the anointed one in whom is the Spirit of Truth, of whom Jesus spoke in John 16: 12-15 and Matthew 17: 11; and as also denoted in Acts 3; 20&21. Hence it is written in Hosea 6, "For the Lord shall come to us as the latter and the former rain unto the earth"; of which Joel 2: 23 clarifies, (Teachers of righteousness, according to righteousness); see also James 5: 7. And once again, this is the reason why Zechariah 4 speaks of the Two Sons of oil, Anointed Ones: anointed to bear the Spirit: for as you were told in Acts 13: 23 and Psalm 132: 11, Jesus the primate/Carpenter came of the SEED of David, not Mary who was simply the matrix, which the Church contradicts today, generating confusion within the body of Christ.
Peace be with you Joe!!
In continuation:
As I mentioned earlier, there are two ends to all things: a top and a bottom, negative and positive, matter and anti-matter, male and female: opposites of the same genes; they both have their inherent purposes: both complementing and completing each other, as a whole, as one is of the other; and they both, being opposites of each other, cannot replace each other: for it takes both opposites to make a complete whole. Two females or two males do not make a whole: this confusion at the beginning is what led to man’s demise.
As it is in all things, there is a common interest between both ends, which serves as a mediator between both ends, justifying each end’s worth and commitment to its purpose, which mediator they are both proud to showcase, protect, nurture and sacrifice for; even as a father and a mother work together to protect their offspring, regardless of the differences between both. Two fathers cannot engender offspring, neither can two mothers: it takes the father sowing the seed in the matrix of the mother to engender offspring.
Therefore the mediator is the substance within and between both ends/faces; and though the True Mind has two ends/faces, the Inner True Mind is protected within the Soul/Matrix, and thus is the mediator between both; this mediator therefore is the Son of man, the substance of both: he is the mediator between the Creator and the Experience; sought of like the substance between matter and anti-matter that keeps both ends from annihilating each other: hence he is referred to as The Savior of Creation: for he is the buffer between the True Mind and its Soul, the substance of the True Mind engendered in the Soul, precious to both: the reason why creation became.
There is nurturing and schooling going on in the experience, with actors as examples on both ends of the spectrum, as written into the program, benefiting the offspring of the True Mind and its Soul; and thus it is written in Hebrews 7, "There is a hope set before man, which hope we have as an anchor of the soul, both sure and steadfast, which hope is the entering into that which is veiled; which place the forerunner (of the program) has entered for us, which is Jesus."
You have no control over the story to change the course of your character, as you must go through the cycle to be restored to perfection: you have to live the story till your character comes to an end, at which time you return to the Father: thus Psalm 139: 18; and what you suppose is a choice you made is part of the story, part of your refinement: (see Romans 7: 15 - 25): for having been corrupted, you must experience the dynamics of good and evil to understand the difference and know which one manifests life.
The Only-begotten Light of the Father manifests the Way for you; the counterfeit spirit seeks to lead you astray, confounding you: you experience both realms, suffering through transforming travails, to understand the True Way which the Light manifests that leads to Life; hence you were told, "I am the Light that reveals the Way, the Truth and the Life: no one knows the way to the Father except I manifest it." Truth is as incontrovertible as Light: malice may attack it and conceit may deride it, but in its manifestation it humbles malice and disconcerts ego, transforming ignorance into light, manifesting divine intelligence.
When you lose your ego and are not ashamed of your nakedness (ignorance), even as a child, then you will take on the image of the Son of Life, and you will not be afraid. For ego says, “I know everything”: this is the counterfeit spirit that has covered your mind, standing between you and your magnificence, and between you and the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, seeking to prevent you from perceiving the truth. And this spirit is that which rules the church/religiosity: yet its light is a corrupted light, having been mixed with darkness, seeking to confuse you of the True Light of Life. You are of the kingdom: from the kingdom did you come and to the kingdom shall you return; and the glory of the kingdom shall you bear: but you must first be clothed with perfection.
The perfecting of life is a seven step refining process, a mystery signified in Enoch, the seventh from Adam, who did not see death: for he walked with God, and was translated; and it is embedded in the pattern of the throne of God which Solomon built, denoted in 2nd Chronicles 9, which I covered earlier; and signified in 2nd Kings 5: 14, Job 5: 19 and Matthew 18: 22. He that seeks the knowledge of these things shall find it. Understand this, the primate, as is the experience, recycles; but the magnificent spirit that simulates life in the experience along with its body, the soul, are immortal: it is them that are being refined in the process to take on (to be clothed with) an incorruptible glory that can never be destroyed.
To be continued; and next shall be the second revelation to John, known as The Book of Revelation...
Peace be with you!!!
As I mentioned earlier, there are two ends to all things: a top and a bottom, negative and positive, matter and anti-matter, male and female: opposites of the same genes; they both have their inherent purposes: both complementing and completing each other, as a whole, as one is of the other; and they both, being opposites of each other, cannot replace each other: for it takes both opposites to make a complete whole. Two females or two males do not make a whole: this confusion at the beginning is what led to man’s demise.
As it is in all things, there is a common interest between both ends, which serves as a mediator between both ends, justifying each end’s worth and commitment to its purpose, which mediator they are both proud to showcase, protect, nurture and sacrifice for; even as a father and a mother work together to protect their offspring, regardless of the differences between both. Two fathers cannot engender offspring, neither can two mothers: it takes the father sowing the seed in the matrix of the mother to engender offspring.
Therefore the mediator is the substance within and between both ends/faces; and though the True Mind has two ends/faces, the Inner True Mind is protected within the Soul/Matrix, and thus is the mediator between both; this mediator therefore is the Son of man, the substance of both: he is the mediator between the Creator and the Experience; sought of like the substance between matter and anti-matter that keeps both ends from annihilating each other: hence he is referred to as The Savior of Creation: for he is the buffer between the True Mind and its Soul, the substance of the True Mind engendered in the Soul, precious to both: the reason why creation became.
There is nurturing and schooling going on in the experience, with actors as examples on both ends of the spectrum, as written into the program, benefiting the offspring of the True Mind and its Soul; and thus it is written in Hebrews 7, "There is a hope set before man, which hope we have as an anchor of the soul, both sure and steadfast, which hope is the entering into that which is veiled; which place the forerunner (of the program) has entered for us, which is Jesus."
You have no control over the story to change the course of your character, as you must go through the cycle to be restored to perfection: you have to live the story till your character comes to an end, at which time you return to the Father: thus Psalm 139: 18; and what you suppose is a choice you made is part of the story, part of your refinement: (see Romans 7: 15 - 25): for having been corrupted, you must experience the dynamics of good and evil to understand the difference and know which one manifests life.
The Only-begotten Light of the Father manifests the Way for you; the counterfeit spirit seeks to lead you astray, confounding you: you experience both realms, suffering through transforming travails, to understand the True Way which the Light manifests that leads to Life; hence you were told, "I am the Light that reveals the Way, the Truth and the Life: no one knows the way to the Father except I manifest it." Truth is as incontrovertible as Light: malice may attack it and conceit may deride it, but in its manifestation it humbles malice and disconcerts ego, transforming ignorance into light, manifesting divine intelligence.
When you lose your ego and are not ashamed of your nakedness (ignorance), even as a child, then you will take on the image of the Son of Life, and you will not be afraid. For ego says, “I know everything”: this is the counterfeit spirit that has covered your mind, standing between you and your magnificence, and between you and the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, seeking to prevent you from perceiving the truth. And this spirit is that which rules the church/religiosity: yet its light is a corrupted light, having been mixed with darkness, seeking to confuse you of the True Light of Life. You are of the kingdom: from the kingdom did you come and to the kingdom shall you return; and the glory of the kingdom shall you bear: but you must first be clothed with perfection.
The perfecting of life is a seven step refining process, a mystery signified in Enoch, the seventh from Adam, who did not see death: for he walked with God, and was translated; and it is embedded in the pattern of the throne of God which Solomon built, denoted in 2nd Chronicles 9, which I covered earlier; and signified in 2nd Kings 5: 14, Job 5: 19 and Matthew 18: 22. He that seeks the knowledge of these things shall find it. Understand this, the primate, as is the experience, recycles; but the magnificent spirit that simulates life in the experience along with its body, the soul, are immortal: it is them that are being refined in the process to take on (to be clothed with) an incorruptible glory that can never be destroyed.
To be continued; and next shall be the second revelation to John, known as The Book of Revelation...
Peace be with you!!!
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