Swastikas in Northern Ireland Parliament

So the other day i was half watching Sky News, when our PM David Cameron popped up, making a speech inside Stormont, the Irish Parliament, while visiting Northern Ireland.

I have to admit, i wasn't really interetsed in what he had to say, but suddenly i noticed the wooden decoration that appears to go all round the wall of the debating chamber, and i believe is also reperated on the carpet in the centre of the chamber (missed taking a pic of it, sorry!).

It's unashamedly, a stylized Swastika, no mistake about it! This doen't happen by accident - you either base your design on a Swastika or you don't (most people tend not to nowadays! :LOL: )


[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/1390cf0aefd1.jpg[/atsimg]

[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/3898befc25ca.jpg[/atsimg]

I can't believe someone let this slip through the net, especially in a parliament as delicate as Northern Ireland.

You don't see much obvius Swastika useage in this day and age - apart maybe in India where it has different connotations. Never thought i would see such an obvious useage in the UK.

Does anyone else have any RECENT examples of sylized Swastikas being used, or this this a rarity?

Oh good lord..........

You have to be kidding me right? Can we please NOT do this.............MODS!

Hmmmm NOW that explains sooooo much!

I live in Northern Ireland... And I feel so stupid for not seeing I'm residing in a country full of bigots!!

Figures.

Just for the record... Thats sarcasm

Blueorb, please spend some minutes searching for antique border elements, and ornaments.
Greece and Roman (the cradle of the european culture)

Then come back and please close this thread, thanks a lot.

ohh noes! It's not swastika it's classic snake game.

So now we know where the Nazis emigrated to after the war?
No wonder the Irish bombed London and assassinated Mount Batten?
My eyes are not the best ...but if its here on ATS ....it must be true?
The thread title sure caught my attention though, ter be sure

Good, it is an old symbol and should be used in its original form. If you associate it with a certain political group you should not, it is a spiritual/religous symbol. So bring back the swastika and remove the political association with it. Take it back, say no you cannot use this for hate it is for luck. If we start putting pink swastikas everywhere with the words it means under it, hate groups will not use it anymore. We will have removed the power in it for them. By being offended and making a fuss about it you are doing exactly what they want, letting a symbol cause fear, hatred, or ill feelings. Most of the real hate mongers/genocidal problems do not ever brand themselves like this or say how they feel, they hide in plain sight disseminating hate covertly.

Originally posted by svetlana84
Blueorb, please spend some minutes searching for antique border elements, and ornaments.
Greece and Roman (the cradle of the european culture)

Then come back and please close this thread, thanks a lot.

Research the Swastika and its original origins (the OP too) then come back to the thread.

The most important questions that I assume hasn't been asked, is when was the parliament made or remodeled?

reply to post by boncho

The need for a separate parliament building for Northern Ireland emerged with the creation of the Northern Ireland home rule region in the Government of Ireland Act, 1920. Pending the construction of the new building parliament met in two locations, in Belfast City Hall, where the state opening of the first parliament by King George V took place in on 21 June 1921, and in the nearby Presbyterian Church in Ireland's Assembly's College. In 1922, preparatory work on the chosen site, east of Belfast, began. The original plans for a large domed building with two subsidiary side buildings, housing all three branches of government - legislative, executive and judicial - gave rise to the plural in the official title still used today.

1


I remember the OP saying Northern Ireland, we are speaking about Ireland's parliament bulding?

Food for thought:

The swastika (from Sanskrit svástika) is an equilateral cross with its arms bent at right angles, in either right-facing (卐) form or its mirrored left-facing (卍) form. Archaeological evidence of swastika-shaped ornaments dates from the Neolithic period and was first found in the Indus Valley Civilization of the Indian Subcontinent. The swastika (gammadion, "fylfot") symbol became a popular symbol of luck in the Western world in the early 20th century. Although the Nazi Party adopted the symbol in the 1920s, it continued in use in Western countries with its original meaning until the Nazi association became dominant in the 1930s.

Western use of the Swastika

You have way too much free time.

Try reading a book

reply to post by boncho


So in other words, yes, this thread is the epitome of ignorance.

You can substitute stupidity or a host of other words in there if you wish.

reply to post by boncho


Boncho, i am very aware of the sun wheel, its origin and its original meaning. And of course i find it very very sad
that it was perverted in such a way by the nazis.

I actually even know a guy who was arrested at a german airport for wearing some trousers from thailand which featured tiniy buddha statues who are traditionally wearing the sun wheel on their chest.
The reason for the arrest was that wearing nazi insignias is forbidden in germany. Which is good.
But then again this was not a nazi symbol, it was counter clock wise and if you'd seen the guy and the pants it was quite obvious he has nothing to do with nazism. On the other hand i can understand people who get offended. (The woman who accused him came from Israel)

But the border ornaments in the Irish parliament are neither sun wheels or swastikas. It's just antique, roman or greece ornaments.

Another note; yesterday I thought this is such a silly thread. But now i think it's maybe not that silly, it's about educating people and denying ignorance.

Peace.

For the record, this thread was supposed to be about the wiseness of using stylized swastikas in a parliament building.

I don't believe i have suggested anywhere that NI is run by Nazis, or that there is any Nazi link deliberately inferred in the use of the swastika in the design of the debating chamber at Stormont.

I am more than aware of the history of the symbol, and thanks, i don't need to read a book and don't have too much time on my hands.

As for this thread being "silly", if you would like me to trawl through your posts and comment on what's silly or not, then maybe i should do it. But i don't - i just ignore them and move on without comment.

Please note the last line of my first post - i am asking if the usage is common nowadays or not, given the more recent use of the Swastika and it's unfortunate connotations since WWII.

This thread is not a representation if Ignorance in any way, but some of the comments most certainly are. If you haven't got anything constructive (either to add or to say), then don't bother replying - find something better to do.

Maybe i should have started a thread about dodgy birth certificates or badly filmed lights in the sky - would that have been better, and less ignorant?

Cannot tell if trolling...... or just very stupid.....

Originally posted by Spinster
Cannot tell if trolling...... or just very stupid.....

Well I think it is safe to say there is a strong correlation between the two, so possibly both!

OP I thought your pictures of the little swastikas were nice. I don't think the Irish Parliament intended to display swastikas in the design but if that is what you see then your perception is that they have.

reply to post by BlueOrb

For the record, this thread was supposed to be about the wiseness of using stylized swastikas in a parliament building.

It was already shown in this thread that the parliament building was built before Swastika popularity took off with the Third Reich. So what did you want them to do then, go back in time and change it?

Just because you think a Swastika is bad, (or something that looks like one is) it does not mean it is.

Re-Read this post please

reply to post by boncho


hansard.millbanksystems.com...

See this link. Work to the debating chamber in Stormont was done in 1997, and not decades ago before the Nazification of the Swastika.

You seem to want to put this thread down no matter what. I have no need to re-read my own post, as i know full well what i meant.

What may be more relevant, and true, as opposed to the OP's innocent design, is the use of the Fascist symbol in the US Congress. This is the same symbol as Mussolini's Party. This was also on the back of the US Dime coin.

Personally, it doesn't bother me, as I like true Fascism, though the US is not Fascist in any way I can see based on the platform of True Fascism.

Oirish Buddists?

we should take back the swastika. no really. the image has such negative associations, those bastards stole it for their own disgusting uses