Hey Atheists, so I remember preexisting, POW!!!!

Atheism by itself does not preclude the existence of an after-life. Believing a Supreme Being does not exist does not equal believing an after-life does not exist. The two issues are really entirely separate.

By most peoples' definition, I'm an atheist. I do not believe in the literal truth of the Bible. I do not believe Jesus was the Son of God. I do not believe there is a Supreme Being in any sense that idea is normally described. I'm well beyond the "I don't really know" claim of the agnostic to believing there are serious logical issues with any such belief to the point hat I think "God" is just about impossible.

However, I believe there is ample evidence of re-incarnation, of there being higher plains than this one, and of human consciousness (call it a "soul" if you must) survives physical death. There is a real paranormal side to life and though I don't think any of this is particularly demonic, I'm fairly certain it exists.

The one article of faith I will admit to is that sciemce will eventually catch up with what I have just described, study it to the depth it deserves, and admit it as part of scientific reality. Only then will we move ahead constructively and figure out what this is all about.

Originally posted by dominicus
I dont mean to be an arrogant jerk or anything ......just saying.

A few years ago I had a memory of preexisting. It was clear as day. I was a unit of awareness, sexless, without the likes/dislikes/personality/programming of this earth, and I was discussing with 3 other Units of Awareness (Or "Souls" if you delightfully prefer that term) ...about being born on earth and some of the things that would be good for me to accomplish here.

It was absolutely crystal clear that this was a remembering and not some made up fantasy of the mind. Since then I have found that many people across the globe remember preexisting.

So at least for me, I know for sure there is an afterlife, since there was a prior-life. I know for sure 100% that I am not from here, this i not my home, and I'm simply passing thru.

It makes one wonder, who created these units of awareness the eventually take on flesh to come and live here.

Interesting times indeed!!!! Ha ha pow pow Pow!!!

Sounds like a brain malfunction. Ha ha pow pow POW!!?

See memory is a tricky thing, they can in fact erase memories with an electrical current, but I'm sure your version helps you make it through this mundane world.

Originally posted by dominicus
reply to post by Doublemint

 

If you are going to make people aware of how you believe why can they not make you aware of how they believe? debating is the art of thinking and it seems to have been lost by some people.

well if his is aimed at me then touche pussycat!!!

Atheist? Agnostic? Been there and done that. Having then explored different paths and ultimately having experienced that there is an Infinite Beingness ...it would be impossible to now go back to that prison of a subjective bias bubble.

Doubt and skepticism is cool ......until it imprisons you. Not saying that's u, just saying.

was it at you? no

so what would you lable yourself then? Doubt and skepticism of what? I'm confused by your post I'm not sure what you are telling me.

reply to post by Doublemint

so what would you lable yourself then? Doubt and skepticism of what? I'm confused by your post I'm not sure what you are telling me.

Why label myself ....... if I had to I would be beyond any label ....but I can never ever call myself an atheist or agnostic after having had experienced spiritual realities.

I think its interesting that I have at least learned one thing about atheists today. Many of you don't discount the possibility of an afterlife ....but a God ... "No way".....

And yet if we study near death experiences, pretty much all of them describe some sort of Infinite beingness of sort.

Still, at least for me ...to say an afterlife without God is similar to a fish without water ....I see it as impossible. Here on earth, at least we can trace these physical bodies back to our parents and geneological tree ...however in the after life as well, a soul or that consciousness that continues on would also itself have to have some source ......i.e. God

reply to post by dominicus

That's why I said "hey atheists" ...because "God" is the next logical question pertaining to preexistence.

By your own defintion of "logical", of course.

You deny the possibility that reincarnation or "prexistence" could occur without a deity? That's very telling.

Nice thread, S+F for attention.

reply to post by awake_and_aware

You deny the possibility that reincarnation or "prexistence" could occur without a deity? That's very telling.

Yes I do deny that possibility...... although instead of deity I would rather use the term "source".

Again ...we can track down the source of a physical body to the parents. However that "aspect" of a person that preexists or gets reincarnated ...what would its nonphysical source be?

Perhaps there could be nonphysical parents in the hereafter, however I'm sure we can trace all of that geaneology back to some original source .....its just logic/common sense

reply to post by dominicus


Memories are flawed and fallible. There's an entire area of study within the field of neuroscience which shows that. Memories are proof of nothing, they're flawed. Sure, they can point you in a direction which could lead you to appropriate testing and confirmation for a claim, but they're useless on their own.

...oh, and what does that have to do with atheism? The claim of a soul or some pre-existing component to consciousness has nothing to do with the claim of a deity.

I don't believe in deities, my disbelief in souls, pixies, and unicorns is entirely separate from that.

reply to post by madnessinmysoul

Memories are flawed and fallible. There's an entire area of study within the field of neuroscience which shows that. Memories are proof of nothing, they're flawed. Sure, they can point you in a direction which could lead you to appropriate testing and confirmation for a claim, but they're useless on their own.

Well then I'm glad that not "ALL" memories are flawed and fallible .....it would sure make court and witnesses alot more interesting and we'd have to entirely dismiss the jury system.

In my case, I can never deny the absolute clearity that I have preexisted and no for sure this does not apply to me. I remember I had a tuna sandwhich for lunch today and can provide my stomachs contents when they come out on the other end to science, which would confirm my memory of this event to be on par.

...oh, and what does that have to do with atheism? The claim of a soul or some pre-existing component to consciousness has nothing to do with the claim of a deity.

Why not?

I don't believe in deities, my disbelief in souls, pixies, and unicorns is entirely separate from that.

In the year 1,000 ...nobody believed in a combustible engine and the internet. Give it some time my friend, and then you;ll be shown a thing are two that go beyond the limits of what you know at this point in time

reply to post by dominicus


And what would happen to civilisation where the death rate exponentially outgrows the birth rate, would we would wait patiently in the waiting room, or do we come back as other animals?

reply to post by dominicus


Ok so special pleading, a non-sequitur, and a false comparison.

Witnesses have actually been shown to be a bad thing in cases, which is why DNA and other forensic evidence is becoming such a deal breaker these days. Juries weigh evidence, not memories.

I'd recommend you watch My Cousin Vinny as the film does a great job of addressing the fallibility of witnesses, something which is incredibly well documented in scientific literature.

You have yet to put forth a case that a pre-life requires a deity, so why should I acknowledge it? It's just a non-sequitur at this point.

And you have to back up your claims, not just go 'wait and see'.

reply to post by awake_and_aware

And what would happen to civilisation where the death rate exponentially outgrows the birth rate, would we would wait patiently in the waiting room, or do we come back as other animals?

I don't know ..... i remember the discussion of coming here, not wanting to come here because earth in my perspective was like a negative limited prison compared to the state of being pure awareness. Ultimately in the bigger picture I saw, is that I can have a positive effect on the whole, and eventually get to come back home ...where ever "home" is...

I don't remember being here before in another life. For me, 1 life here is enough and I wouldn't want to come back unless its to selflessly help others.
______________________________________
in response to madnessinmysoul:

Ok so special pleading, a non-sequitur, and a false comparison.

all concepts, all relative. why should any of these 3 matter in the grand scheme of things if none of us are really from here?

Witnesses have actually been shown to be a bad thing in cases, which is why DNA and other forensic evidence is becoming such a deal breaker these days. Juries weigh evidence, not memories.

but yet we still have and use the witness stand. Shame. Lets find the DNA, or source, of awareness itself and then I think we will be getting somewhere.

You have yet to put forth a case that a pre-life requires a deity, so why should I acknowledge it? It's just a non-sequitur at this point.

Yeah I forgot to mention in my pre-existence memory ...there was talk of God ......and it was seen as an infinite tapestry that involves all of existence.... not some dude with a beard on a cloud throwing lightning.

In preexistence .....things are seen as they are without being clouded by judgement, bias, religion, or atheism. Besides, I thought that nonbelief in God went hand in hand with nonbelief in afterlife/preexistence.

And you have to back up your claims, not just go 'wait and see'.

yea yea yeah ...when I was an atheist I would say this exact same line. Then One day somebody dared me to investigate for myself the source of thought, the source of 'I', the location of 'I' and many other ontological and philosophical endeavors instead of just saying "Show me the physical proof of this nonphysical entity" (sheesh paradox)

So investigating these things further, I stumbled upon an infinite being..... then finding others who have stumbled upon this as well.... what more do I need (for myself at least)

For you, nothing will satisfy you until you see for yourself. But to see for yourself would require you to suspend your positions/labels .........most wont give that up, so it leaves you with the skeptics lunch special.

Many people have vivid memories of being abducted by aliens.
Many people have memories of a "Past Life".
Many people have memories of unexplainable ghost encounters.
Many people have seen Hat Man, or even Slenderman.

The list could go on for a very long time. The fact is that the mind is a very weak tool for measuring reality. Memories can be fabricated unconsciously, or could be of an event that was made up by the mind at the time. And just because there's "No reason" you're mind would make it up doesn't mean it wouldn't.

I could give a whole list of personal experiences that I don't believe to be truthful, and I'd really be gullible to believe them all.

"This experience is proof for me." I'll accept. Even if I discourage making conclusions from faulty measuring tools(our brains), I do agree that it should have some merit. Just know that no one's gonna be convinced by an unprovable personal experience, if they were solid evidence of something being true, everything would be true.

reply to post by xxsomexpersonxx

Fair enough. Although when I examine myself as I reach for various memories throughout my life, it seems there some sort of databank or storage where I have them.

But the remembrance of preexistence came from somewhere much much deeper than mind, if that makes sense.

I don't discount the possibility of aliens, past lifes, and hat man/slender man ...could be extra-dimensional beings.

reply to post by dominicus


The point though, is that for every myth there is, there's people who've experienced it and have no doubt their experience was legitimate. Same holds true for every religion and people having religious experiences.

I'm not gonna tell you that you're memory is wrong, but that it shouldn't be absolute proof of anything. Even if it feels like it holds in some special place of you're mind, it may still be wrong.

Serious question, but did you form your believes after the event? Or did the event happen and "confirm" your beliefs?

reply to post by xxsomexpersonxx

Serious question, but did you form your believes after the event? Or did the event happen and "confirm" your beliefs?

I did not ever believe that preexistence was possible and if it would have been brought up prior to the the remembrance, I would have absolutely been a hardline skeptic about it. After the memory though, I cannot deny it.

reply to post by dominicus


...or that you're just mistaken. You're basically trying to make a reality claim without any possible verification, which is just irrational.

BTW, Slender Man was the creation of the Something Awful forums that sort of went of the chains. There is no evidence of a claim of this being prior to that thread.

Originally posted by awake_and_aware
reply to post by dominicus

 

And what would happen to civilisation where the death rate exponentially outgrows the birth rate, would we would wait patiently in the waiting room, or do we come back as other animals?

edit on 10/6/11 by awake_and_aware because: (no reason given)

Where does it say you have to come back?

Originally posted by madnessinmysoul
reply to post by dominicus

 

...or that you're just mistaken. You're basically trying to make a reality claim without any possible verification, which is just irrational.

How can you claim what is irrational for another human? Can you verify to me that you brushed your teeth today?

reply to post by Doublemint

Where does it say you have to come back?

I'm not saying that, infact - I DON'T believe we come back, or go to any magical sky kingdom or any eternal bliss.

Originally posted by awake_and_aware
reply to post by dominicus

 

And what would happen to civilisation where the death rate exponentially outgrows the birth rate, would we would wait patiently in the waiting room, or do we come back as other animals?

edit on 10/6/11 by awake_and_aware because: (no reason given)

So, what are you saying?