Am I my brain?

reply to post by caladonea


May I ask how you know this to be the case ???

I don't think that I am my brain. While I am not religious, I think that I do have a soul/spirit which is separate from the brain. As in, if my head was cryogenically frozen & put onto a new body a few hundred years from now I don't think that 'I' would be 'me'.

reply to post by Tayesin

They are self-aware even though they no longer have a body with a brain. Hence my reasoning.

You are 100% Correct....

LIFE can't Be Death. Nor can Death be LIFE they are "Opposites".

Others seem to want to believe the "Species" is somehow alive, but the reality is...

That LIFE Experiences both the "Species" and this "Universe" it interacts with. Not the other way around.

Awareness does NOT need a brain.

The Brain is only an "Interface" between LIFE and this particular experience.

An interesting statement From "The Gospel of Thomas" verse 56 Quote;

56. Jesus said,

“Whoever has come to understand the World
has found only a corpse,

and whoever has found a corpse,
is superior to the World.”

I love these kinds of questions... I have often thought this my self, and still debate internally what I think about it, but I believe we are not our brains. Our brains are our "reality translators" so to speak. I believe we are essentially, all the same person walking around talking, killing, helping, raping, loving each other. Our brains all develope uniquely based on our individual life experiences while growing up, so essentially you are me having gone through different life experiences which may account for why we may not all act the same way.

That's what I think anyways

reply to post by chr0naut

Karl Jung proposed that there was a "collective unconscious" that connected everyone's thoughts.

Hi, there, chr0naut. A lot of people misunderstood what Jung (his first name is spelled Carl, by the way) meant by the collective unconscious. Understandably – Jung was as much a mystic as he was a psychologist, and clearly had serious psychological issues of his own. The way he described his concept of the collective unconscious, he made it seem like something that actually exists in some paraphysical reality. His use of oceanic metaphors to refer to it didn’t help. But we must remember that Jung was trying to articulate a scientific concept, however mystical his own conception of it and the language that he used.

Understood in modern terms, the ‘collective unconscious’ is simply a name for that collection of instinctual drives and information-processing schemata that is common to our species. It is present in us all, and its presence explains not only why we all behave in the same human ways but also why we use the same symbols and patterns to represent and manipulate information. The oceanic metaphor is misleading: we are not individual souls swimming about in an ocean of symbols and archetypes; rather, we – each one of us individually – is an ocean, and they swim about inside our brains as patterns of information.

By the way, I must say I enjoy the combination of humour, intelligence and sang-froid in your posts.

reply to post by Tayesin


Well I can't say that you're wrong, because I don't know that. What I try to do is base my beliefs on my own experiences, and personally I have never had any experiences with the deceased, and for that reason, along with the absence of demonstrable proof, I continue to assume that spirits do not exist.

I simply cannot take it on faith. I am, however, open to all possibilities, and if you're willing to share any information that may give me the opportunity to personally experience what you have experienced, I'd appreciate it.

Also, just out of curiosity, do you know of any way that you might possibly be able to prove life after death? Surely there must be some clever way of devising an experiment that could provide scientific evidence of a spiritual existence.

reply to post by Epiphron


Here is perhaps an interesting thought.

You weren't here before (experiencing this world), so you must have been dead, or were you alive?
But now you are alive, so where did Your LIFE "Awareness" come from?

Many say that Something can't come from Nothing... That is Not to say, I adopt this belief.

We know the "Program" (in your Genes) for your Cellular Structure, came from both your Parents, but where did your LIFE "Awareness" come from ???

reply to post by Astyanax


Thanks Richard Dawkins.

theres a reason why Jung often mentioned those who say "Just the mind", or "just the psyche". You, like your likeminded hero Richard Dawkins, make a different assumption.

So, no one is misunderstanding Jung. We know - those who have studied his thought (a personal friend of mine happens to be a Jungian Psychologist) know full well what he intended by his use of the word 'collective unconscious" - that is, an transphysical realm of existence which the individual ego derives its essence from. ... OK? So, theres no 'misunderstanding". Theres only you arrogantly saying that whats really a misunderstanding, is us - Jung, and all those who believe in the existence of a metaphysical realm - believing we have the brain power to think that it exists.

The Metaphysical does exist. And to explain it? The ancient philosophers posited a prima materia responsible for matter, and an artificer responsible for form. This was often represented as the sky and the Earth. The former exists on its own, and likewise the latter; but the latters existence hinges on the former. Matter is simply a 'body' which provides expression in a unique dimension that form by itself cannot provide. Thus, form - the soul - penetrates matter and the two work together to bring about the living cosmos.

but.....i know you have probably ignored my post. Because in your obscene latin-knowing arrogance, you have committed yourself (and for the sake of your ego you will not transgress this conviction, im sure) to forever ignore me...because sometime awhile ao i said something that drove you biserk. Strange you say Jung had a mental problem.... when you clearly have a few yourself. (and to be fair, all people suffer from ego, and the delusions it can bring about).

reply to post by Epiphron

Indeed, it would be very simple. Many such tests have, in fact, been conducted.

The lack of a trustworthy positive response suggests that there is no life after death.

some times when i get lost in my self i feel like i am in a cockpit of sorts and the "view port" is my vision. when im at work or doing hard labor i sometimes go into "auto pilot" call it meditation or whatever but i sometimes feel like my brain works in ways i know nothing about. im not a smart person but the human brain is amazing. that much i know.

reply to post by dontreally

We know (a personal friend of mine happens to be a Jungian Psychologist) full well what Jung intended...

Yes, having a friend who knows about some subject automatically qualifies you as an expert in it yourself.

In your obscene latin-knowing arrogance, you have committed yourself (and for the sake of your ego you will not transgress this conviction, im sure) to forever ignore me...because sometime awhile ao i said something that drove you biserk. Strange you say Jung had a mental problem.... when you clearly have a few yourself. (and to be fair, all people suffer from ego, and the delusions it can bring about).

edit on 6-6-2011 by dontreally because: (no reason given)

I think you need to edit this bit again. Though I hope you keep ‘biserk’. It’s such a cool spelling.

reply to post by Astyanax



What you say is Correct, involving interpretation through the "Species"..

Just a thought here..

How do we test for something, which is Non-dimensional as perhaps LIFE "Awareness" is?

If LIFE has dimension, what is it's dimensional properties?

reply to post by The Matrix Traveller


Well, I don't think it's really that much of a stretch to believe that self awareness has its origins in the brain. Just as our ability to perceive color has a very specific center in the brain, it's possible that our ability to perceive ourselves as individual beings could very well have a center in the brain.

If we look at consciousness from an evolutionary standpoint, it seems like it's just another survival adaptation. How else could you explain how some lesser evolved animals have no ability to conceive of themselves but some more complex species do have the ability to be aware of themselves. Apes and dolphins have an awareness of self as well, so how do you explain why some animals are aware and some aren't?

reply to post by Epiphron

Don't misunderstand me as I am interested in your thoughts.

Well, I don't think it's really that much of a stretch to believe that self awareness has its origins in the brain. Just as our ability to perceive color has a very specific center in the brain, it's possible that our ability to perceive ourselves as individual beings could very well have a center in the brain.

Scientifically the origin of awareness in the Brain has yet to be discovered and there are different theories regarding this.

One theory suggests Awareness may be swarm like or collective in nature but this has NOT been proven, nor have any of the other theories so they remain as just that... Theory.

But how is Awareness non-dimensional, produced from something Dimensional and material.

How do Electrochemical signals produce Awareness?

If they did in fact we would be able to reproduce Awareness and the fact is we Can’t.

The Real you is "Aware" of your Body and Environment, but your body isn't Aware of anything. nor is your body aware of your Entity.

If we look at consciousness from an evolutionary standpoint, it seems like it's just another survival adaptation. How else could you explain how some lesser evolved animals have no ability to conceive of themselves but some more complex species do have the ability to be aware of themselves. Apes and dolphins have an awareness of self as well, so how do you explain why some animals are aware and some aren't?

Well I agree with you on this to a certain point, but remember we can only examine other animals (my/your body being one of the Species) according to our rules and understanding or perhaps our lack of understanding.

Originally posted by Epiphron
reply to post by Tayesin

 

Well I can't say that you're wrong, because I don't know that. What I try to do is base my beliefs on my own experiences, and personally I have never had any experiences with the deceased, and for that reason, along with the absence of demonstrable proof, I continue to assume that spirits do not exist.

I simply cannot take it on faith. I am, however, open to all possibilities, and if you're willing to share any information that may give me the opportunity to personally experience what you have experienced, I'd appreciate it.

Also, just out of curiosity, do you know of any way that you might possibly be able to prove life after death? Surely there must be some clever way of devising an experiment that could provide scientific evidence of a spiritual existence.

Firstly, thank you for a well mannered and thoughtful response

I understand the difficulty you mentioned and would not wish anyone to simply Believe what I say... although for some it will resonate with them, for some it will rub against their Beliefs, for some it will be a perfectly timed message, etc.

What makes it that much more difficult is the huge numbers of fakers, takers and users in the fields I "work" in.. all of who give what we do a bad reputation as new-agey mumbo-jumbo. I have to say here that I am opposed to all who do so, equally as much as I am opposed to the new-age industry in general.... it has gone the same route as other human endeavours towards greed, ego and control.

Other than practicing/experimenting with the free beginner's methods shared on my website.. I have no way of assisting you to your own experiences... unless you live in Queensland (Oz) and are willing to travel for a day meeting.

For each of us the path has variations that are particular to us, so what works well for many people as a starting point doesn't necessarily work for all people. I found over the years that many men have difficulty with it, due mainly to our attachment to Logical processes and our indoctrinated need as males to be in control of things. It sounds silly I know.

I've often wondered how one would go about designing an experiment to do as you asked. But I can't find a way for us to scientifically validate something science as yet has no way of quantifying let alone perceiving.

We can have a person participate in simple experiments which do illustrate to them how they are a powerful being that can effect physical things in the physical world (some call it using Chi energy), how their thoughts create their Feelings and how that effects their subtle energy field. I do not know if instrumentation of any sort are able to record these response.

Although doing these exercises while being scanned for brain activity may show some initially interesting things to follow up. And that's about where any scientific understanding I have ends.

reply to post by The Matrix Traveller

What you say is Correct, involving interpretation through the "Species".

Thank you for the endorsement, although I’m afraid you lost me with the word ‘species’.

How do we test for something, which is Non-dimensional as perhaps LIFE "Awareness" is?

We cannot verify the existence of any hypothesized substance that lacks physical properties. So if you think has life has no dimensions, let’s hope it has some other physical properties at least, eh?

If LIFE has dimension, what is it's dimensional properties?

I suspect that you, in your unique and inimitable way, are asking what sort of test would prove life after death. The most convenient one is a message from the Other Side, containing information known only to the deceased but independently verifiable by others. For example, the location and contents of a time capsule secretly buried by the deceased during her lifetime. Would you like to try the experiment? Bury something now, and when you’re dead, send me a message so that I can dig it up and prove you’re still alive somewhere in the Matrix.

reply to post by rudeboyrave




i was recently thinking about the brain and i.

it definitely does things i have no control over.

i can listen to something and it will tell me what it is, it has all the storage.


i can run a dialogue but it might listen or not.

it gives me answers without me doing anything, sometimes.

what i want to do and what it wants to do, sometimes gets crazy.

but who am i? i want a whole choc death cheesecake to eat or am i let's skip that and put on a good movie with

some carrot sticks and blu cheese dressing, compromise.

does it hear things i can't? shhhhhhh! what was that?

does it see things i can't? what was that!?

we have to work together, disconnect results in real problems.

me; it hurts when i do this?
brain; don't do that!
me; have to!


heny youngman?


one thing about your op, you'll never be alone! i hope.

reply to post by Epiphron

If we look at consciousness from an evolutionary standpoint, it seems like it's just another survival adaptation. How else could you explain how some lesser evolved animals have no ability to conceive of themselves but some more complex species do have the ability to be aware of themselves. Apes and dolphins have an awareness of self as well, so how do you explain why some animals are aware and some aren't?

How do we know which specie is more advance than another? Do we determine advance based on what really?

Physically speaking, some species can be regarded as more advanced, and much older than us. For example Bees have a perfect society. Alligator are way more older than us as species, or dragon flies. Elephants have way bigger brain...

So first we need to establish how we define a specie being more advanced than another?

I hope this can help:

theypi.net...

His name is Prem Rawat:

www.wopg.org...

www.wopg.org...

-----

www.wopg.org...

After having looked into this topic myself for some time on my journey the answer I can give is as follows.

When you mean by "being inside your brain" that the "I " is an effect of brain activity - then no, this is not even remotely correct. This is what current science wants you to believe. This believe leads away from your true purpose as it overrates the importance of the physical reality we "seem" to live in currently.

As far as my understanding goes you have to regard your body as an AVATAR that is being controlled by "your" consciousness. Your consciousness is really all that you are. The brain is - like is has already been stated here - only a receiver of information. And it is currently tuned receiving data of this physical reality. But you should look at physical reality mainly as being one of and infinte number of channels. The problem is however that we can't simply switch the channel at will when we want to. At least currently the majority of us can't. This may change one day.
The purely materialistic point of view is misleading and thinking that physical reality is all there is is nothing more than a religion that was drilled into your belief system from day one. TPTB benefits from us not knowing what we really are.

So where did your "I" ultimately come from? I believe that there was "once" (well time doesn't exists for the consciousness really - but that's a different story) only ONE consciousness. This consciousness was all there is. There was NOTHING else then this lonely consciousness. No physical world. No space. No time. Nothing. So even this "everything there is" consciousness did NOT know where it came from and what its purpose is. Therefore it decided to do something. And it began to create everything that is - all realities which are possible or even impossible. Every variant of each and every thing that ever could be or exist. The consciousness then split itself into multiple "I"s in order to explore what is has just created. One of this pieces is your "I". Another one is mine. We all come from the same source. So after all - consciousness explores itself and its creation really. But the individual "I"s are very limited in what they can perceive - this is by design in order to experience every "I" to the fullest possible extent like it is some sort of adventure Limitation shall be seen as a gift - not as a burden.

Another interpretation approach which I begin to look into recently is to see our life here on earth as some sort of dream. It's not like the dreams you are used to when you go sleeping. This dream here in the physical reality has much more presence and feels much more "real". But it is not. We will awake from THIS dream when we die at the end of our life. This leads to another question: how many "dream levels" are there? So we know we can dream in this dream. But how many levels do exist on top of that? Or in other words: how often do you need to "awake" before you reach the root of this dreaming?

I think this verse from an old children's song is pretty impressive and says it all:
"Row, row, row your boat,
Gently down the stream.
Merrily, merrily, merrily, merrily,
Life is but a dream."

Hope I could help.
It's a pretty important question in fact! Maybe at the "end" of the journey when we reach something like a "god consciousness" we will not even find an answer for "Why do I exist?" - as the only consciousness there is does not know either. Then everything begins again. It's an endless loop and hell I would like to know which iteration this is


Cheers

---

Edit to add:

If you want find out more about what our reality is potentially like I would recommend you this lecture by Thomas Campbell:



Link: www.youtube.com...

And you might also have a look at his website:
www.my-big-toe.com...

If you really want to dive into this topic this man is just brilliant and eye opening.