How To Use Bitcoin – The Most Important Creation In The History Of Man

Originally posted by mnemeth1
The market I see is a an electronic currency that has value.

what happens when there's a blackout? if the internet goes down?

A few years back we had a blackout in the Northeast that lasted days. I'd love to see how someone with no electricity can buy anything with an electronic currency.

Of course I'm skepitcal of a currency created by running a program. I've asked the question more than once now so I'll ask it again, has anyone tried selling their bitcoins? Not using them for a purchase but selling them for useable currency?

Can any of you bitcoin miners/users provide links to sites that accept bitcoins? I'd like to see where you can spend these things since, I'm guessing, trading them in for dollars is not as easy as y'all are claiming.

reply to post by Crakeur


I sold my friend 3 bitcoins the other day. Of course I bought some bitcoins from a guy on the bitcoin forums so obviously he got real money from the transaction.

There are lots of sites that are popping up that are bitcoin based. Here's one selling coffee. bitbrew.net...

I dabble in the adult industry affiliate programs for extra cash sometimes, and one of their main forum sites there is alot of discussion about bitcoins. Lots of skeptics and lots of people who are embracing it.

I think its a great idea, I think the key is to spend your bitcoins instead of hoarding them and trying to get US dollar rich.

reply to post by Crakeur

what happens when there's a blackout? if the internet goes down?

A few years back we had a blackout in the Northeast that lasted days. I'd love to see how someone with no electricity can buy anything with an electronic currency.

Same thing that happens to any currency or your paypal etc; you cannot make transactions over the internet or other networks if they are not up and running. Bitcoins are like cash you can store them on a thumb drive if necassary so its not like you lose them if the power goes out. When it comes back up your fine. How many times has the internet gone down since it's advent? As far as I know none. If the power goes out permanently well then all currencies will collapse except gold and silver and we will have a lot bigger problems.

Originally posted by hawkiye
you cannot make transactions over the internet or other networks if they are not up and running.

and, since there will always be brick and mortar establishments selling goods and services, there is no way the bitcoin will ever replace anything.

Originally posted by hawkiye
How many times has the internet gone down since it's advent? As far as I know none..

the entire internet has not gone down here but there's been talk of a kill switch and there are always possibilities of terrorism or gov't intervention to halt web traffic. Also, while the internet, as a whole, doesn't go down, I've personally experienced weeks long outtages thanks to line issues here in NYC. To give you an idea as to how crippling that is, When it happened, I could not electronically file returns, could not obtain specific codes for per return pricing filing and, if my software were cloud based, which is what the company is pushing us to switch to, I'd have been completely useless for those weeks.

So, if I am in need of something and I cannot access my verizon or time warner or whatever internet, I'm screwed

Thanks for the heads up on the currency.

It is interesting. That Bitcoin ( after some research ) has doubled in price in a very short time. We are now looking at around $10.00 / 1 Bitcoin Unit.

The part I haven't really figured out yet is how you "farm" for money? I do not understand this concept.. But I believe I will be making my own personal wallet. Not only do I see myself using the currency to purchase things but maybe I will put 100 extra dollars into it and see what happens with the perceived value of this money.

I also like that you need to have a TOR client to open. Although after some reading it doesn't sound like it is 100% anonymous, but very close. I also do not see LEO's going after receivers of product from these sites. I am sure though that there are already plans in the works to go after sellers ( if not already ).

If you come across any more pertinent information revolving around these subjects make sure and post.

reply to post by 11andrew34

What I'm saying is, when you consider the real limits of knowledge being what they are, you can never be too sure about the origin of these things..

Actually you can be sure about these things because Bitcoin is an open source project.

I can look at all the source code, I can see all the coders comments, I can see the blog posts of the people who worked on the project, I can see the posts by the merchants who are accepting the currency, etc.. etc.. etc..

There is nothing secret about Bitcoin - unlike our private Federal Reserve system.

Originally posted by Crakeur

Originally posted by mnemeth1
The market I see is a an electronic currency that has value.

what happens when there's a blackout? if the internet goes down?

A few years back we had a blackout in the Northeast that lasted days. I'd love to see how someone with no electricity can buy anything with an electronic currency.

Of course I'm skepitcal of a currency created by running a program. I've asked the question more than once now so I'll ask it again, has anyone tried selling their bitcoins? Not using them for a purchase but selling them for useable currency?

While this is a new idea here on ATS, it's actually NOT a new idea on Internet and has been tried thousands of times since the 1990's when I became a moderator on a business board. The more successful ones are listed on this Wikipedia article

You're right about the problems of special exchange. All of them charge for the service, and the issue will be your trying to get anything of real value for the item. Very few merchants will accept the system (it will then cost them to get the money converted back to dollars)... and only the "bank" is getting rich. Some of them attempted to bill it as a "game."

The usual structure is a generic Ponzi, with folks early in the market being able to do transactions easily, and then as the recruits come is, the money gets harder and harder to remove. Don't know that it will happen with this, but as was said there's a LOT that goes wrong with it.

You'd do better to barter.

reply to post by Byrd


Bitcoin is not a Ponzi, and if you bothered to listen to the Reason magazine video in which an economics professor reviews the currency you'd know that.

If it was a Ponzi, I'm sure the good professor wouldn't have staked his reputation on promoting it.

Claiming early adopters who are promoting bitcoin are simply promoting a Ponzi is like claiming the people who were promoting Apple's IPO were promoting a ponzi.

Such claims are ridiculous.

Bitcoin is the equivalent of people digging up gold nuggets out of the ground and then trading them as a currency. Clearly those who dig up the gold first get the most benefit. Eventually though, that benefit becomes evenly distributed as the currency gains wider acceptance.

reply to post by Byrd


I think it's more akin to a pyramid scheme than a ponzi.

Pyramid definition:
A pyramid scheme is a non-sustainable business model that involves promising participants payment, services or ideals, primarily for enrolling other people into the scheme or training them to take part, rather than supplying any real investment or sale of products or services to the public

The way bitcoins works is that you mine the coins by letting a computer run some algorithm. In return, you will get bitcoins. Sounds a lot like the description above, no?

another nice quote:

A pyramid scheme is bound to collapse much faster because it requires exponential increases in participants to sustain it

I'm not saying this will collapse but this quote explains the need ever increasing participants as has been pointed out by several members in the thread. The more people that use it the more the coins are worth etc.


ponzi explanation:
en.wikipedia.org...

pyramid explanation:
en.wikipedia.org...

reply to post by Crakeur


All this reminds me of when I was in Recording Engineering school, and it was right when Digital was starting to come into the picture. Most of my teachers hated it and preached against it. They said we should all stick to 2 inch reel to reel tape and so on. Little did they know how digital would revolutionize the recording and promotion world.

I think its natural for people to put their guard up when something totally out of the box comes around. At first I didn't pay this no attention (back in January) but then as I researched it ,I realize how powerful this idea can really be.

I bought 50 of them and I have a business Idea that I will be starting ASAP. I think people get so caught up in the mining aspect that the actual currency aspect goes out the window.

reply to post by Crakeur


Let's say someone decides to flat out buy the market. Then control lets say a large percentage. If there is a limit, then I am not seeing the connection to demise if this resource ( bitcoins ) can be controlled by this entity while still creating a demand by slowly selling them off. Perhaps they would do this in large chunks actually. Almost like its own little drug trade ecosystem. Buying large amounts, breaking them off into 10 groups lets say of 1 million coins each and then getting *into* the market from those main new 10 dealers of coin.

Of course like anything else there is opportunity cost. Why invest in 100 bitcoins when you can purchase 20 shares of xyz corp.

Unlike most things, I think it gets better as the word gets out. As long as it can remain private without .gov intervention. That is the real wild card, IMO. And that could also be why BCoin's are highly valued currently. Get all the underground stuff you can before the IRS deems they have lost enough tax revenue to make a real attempt at taking it down.

I am guessing if the .gov really wanted to they could set up fake names, take the cash, then never send anything. Ratings for sellers would drop on Silk Road and people would become sketchy as to what sellers are legit or not. Basically just ruining things for everyone until the next little private venture pops up. Inevitably, this little chain of events may continue -> infinity until we have real drug reform in this country.

reply to post by Crakeur

The way bitcoins works is that you mine the coins by letting a computer run some algorithm. In return, you will get bitcoins. Sounds a lot like the description above, no?

Sort of like running a printing press and you get FRN's However with FRN's Only one entity has the printing press and if you create your own they will come jail you or kill you if necassary.

Also Bitcoins can't be inflated like FRN's I could be wrong but the way they work seems to me they would drive prices of goods and services down slowly as they can be fractionalized and prices always adjust to the amount of currency in circulation.

Originally posted by hawkiye
reply to post by Crakeur

 

The way bitcoins works is that you mine the coins by letting a computer run some algorithm. In return, you will get bitcoins. Sounds a lot like the description above, no?

Sort of like running a printing press and you get FRN's

However with FRN's Only one entity has the printing press and if you create your own they will come jail you or kill you if necassary.

Also Bitcoins can't be inflated like FRN's I could be wrong but the way they work seems to me they would drive prices of goods and services down slowly as they can be fractionalized and prices always adjust to the amount of currency in circulation.

edit on 3-6-2011 by hawkiye because: (no reason given)

That is exactly correct Hawkeye.

People have been fooled into believing that inflation is necessary for an economy to function properly - this is a flat out lie told by Keynesian economists.

Deflation of a currency is entirely normal and healthy IF the currency used is not fractionally reserved. In a normal economy using a currency that can not be artificially inflated by means of fractional reserve banking, the natural tendency of things is to become less expensive over time.

This is because as the economy becomes more productive, the number of goods produced in relation to the amount of currency in circulation increases.

When there are more goods but the money supply stays the same, the currency deflates. In other words, less money buys more stuff.

This is what will occur with Bitcoins.

reply to post by mnemeth1


Is that you stirring things up on the daily paul? lol

Originally posted by mayabong
reply to post by mnemeth1

 

Is that you stirring things up on the daily paul? lol

Yeah, your's truly haha.

Just a quick update on the bitcoin currently trading at ~$17.00

The bitcoin is in full frenzy and you can profit from this new cyptocurrency if you have very basic computer skills. My computer is now currently making about $50 every day from mining bitcoin, could you use a extra fifty bucks a day?

I commend the many on this forum who educate people in terms of being prepared in the event of various SHTF situations (BOBs, longterm store-able foods, weapons, etc) but I URGE YOU ALL to protect yourselves by either simply investing in a few of these coins or even better - consider mining them yourselves. This is the closest you will ever get to actually having a tree which grows free money!!

Don't like the way the FED prints money out of thin air? Now YOU can control the creation of currency. So how do you spend them? Just a few of the MANY places:

Bitcoin Deals www.btcdeals.com...

BitcoinClassified www.bitcoinclassifieds.net...

Bitcoin Biddingpool www.biddingpond.com...

BitMunchies bitmunchies.com...

But if you prefer to exchange you bitcoins for filthy FRNs you can as well:

mt Gox: mtgox.com...


~Cheers!

How can Brits buy these? The only links I can find on the bitcoin mt gox website are for purchasing Bitcoins in USD.
Thanks

EDIT: It's okay I've figured it out, I think

reply to post by enzomatica


You must have a serious computer if you're making 50 btc a day these days... come on na .

EDIT: sorry, I didn't see that you said $50 USD. Sorry!

Are you using a pool? which one? what mining program?
Peace
Mike

reply to post by mayabong


I'm running Phoenix 1.4 miner, and currently contribute my hashing power to deepbit or the BTCGuild pool (mostly deepbit). The fees are higher at deepbit but the pool finds blocks at a faster rate than the others as it has the most hashing power at the moment. I did switch pools for a short time when deepbit approached the critical 50% threshold of the total network in early may, this was caused by another pool going down for a few hours. We see just in the last few days more pools being spun up, which will add more choices of where to mine while adding more stability to the network itself. The power of the bitcoin network in terms of hashing power is set to eclipse the worlds largest supercomputer very soon now.

The next big thing however IMHO will be distributed _javascript mining using the combined power of users CPUs to any website. As an alternative to ads (sorry Google) any website with decent traffic can monetize it's presence by simply having each visitor to the site contribute their unused processing power to the task of mining bitcoin, with the site owner keeping the coins. This opens up mining to the average computer user, no high end graphics card(s) or special knowledge needed. Please see bitp.it... as an example. Imagine if a site such as ATS were to do this, the amount of money generated would be tremendous. I can imagine specific charity or cause sites springing up (mining to save the whales, mine bitcoins for Ron Paul etc.) Will, in the future, politicians or activists be judged by the combined hashing power of their followers? Only time will tell.....

~Cheers

Originally posted by Crakeur

Originally posted by mnemeth1
The market I see is a an electronic currency that has value.

A few years back we had a blackout in the Northeast... ...trading them in for dollars is not as easy as y'all are claiming.

Are you sure you live in the northeast/NYC? Never heard a Caucasian fella say "y'all" up there.