Russian and Ukrain Medics in Libya - Open Appeal to UN to Stop The Genocide.

Originally posted by firepilot
The French use US missiles on their ships? I bet thats sure news to them.

Oops sorry
that was classified

These Russian and Ukraine doctors never bothered to voice their concern for the civilians in Misrata and other eastern Libyan cities that were being shelled by Gadhafi. It was those attacks on civilians that led to the creation of the no-fly zone in the first place.

Russia has made it clear they were on Gadhafi's side, and this looks like propaganda on their part.

Gadhafi turned his military loose on the protestors. Instead of the military allowing the protesters to be heard, like the Egyptian military allowed protesters to be heard in their country, Gadhafi began slaughtering them. He's nothing more than a megalomaniac and convicted terrorist bomber. He made his bed now let him lie in it.

Genocide ?

The whole situation is wrong and the assassination attempts really bother me, but don't call it a genocide. The resistance would be better served pointing out the hypocrisy of declaring this an aid mission with all the atrocities happening in africa that go unnoticed

Originally posted by CasiusIgnoranze
It's Iraq all over again...

Yea, new intelligence says Iraq buried their WMD's in Libya. . .

Originally posted by BiGGz
Yea, new intelligence says Iraq buried their WMD's in Libya. . .

lmao

I'm gonna have to call horse pucky on that .....
for that to occur, they would have to pass through
Jordan and Eqypt, 2 whole countries unnoticed
by US Satellite imaging.

a snow ball would last longer in hell than
WMD's on their way to Libya.

Not to mention, they would have to pass
within sniffing distance of Israel's border.

I bet that intel came from the same source
that said OBL was in Abbottabad.

Originally posted by projectvxn
reply to post by teapot

 

I am suggesting they are blowing this out of proportion.

Bombings kill people. But genocide requires a concerted effort.

This is not genocide.

What if it was your daughter or mother killed in a bombing? What would you call it?

Your opinion is completely valueless. ZERO Value. You have no insight. You look like an 18 year who thinks we are talking about a football score or someone's run in Halo. Why don't you fly your family out to Libya and figure out if it's genocide or not.. Or if using the term is overreacting. What a fool.

reply to post by wcitizen


If this was truly a Russian letter it would have been published by a news agency not some no name web-site. Second, this is not a genocide but an unfair unilateral military campaign. We can't just go invade other nations because we think they are running their country the wrong way, in fact that doesn't make sense unless you want to instill a dictator tactic worldwide.

Yes, the UN is the dictator of the world. The simple thought here is that you can't control sovereign nation so you invade it and change the leadership. You want control of the world and parade it as betterment for the entire region but some of us know that we are overthrowing a regime based on the actions of a selected few in that region.

That is like 30,000 rioting in America constitute a change in the president, it doesn't really make sense.

Riiight. I find it extremely odd that these alleged 'medics' would use Pravda to put their open letter to the UN. They're even asking readers to pass it on to news agencies and human rights organisations. Sending it themselves? Inconceivable! Let's go to Pravda with it fellas!

"Privyet my drookies, I’m so fed up with all of this genocide in this country I am actually in; Liberia or something like that I think. It’s all about NATO trying to get the Liberian oil and helping the terrorists and we know all about this because we're medics."

"We could write a letter and send it to the UN and some politicians or diplomats. As proof that we sent it, we could also send the letter to prominent, credible news agencies because this is a big deal and almost any news agency would jump on this story. We could mention what Gaddafi's forces are doing as well maybe?"

"Seriously terrible ideas there, you're a complete and utter mong. Let's not actually sent it to anyone, but get Pravda to post an open letter on our behalf."

"What's Pravda? I think my idea was better but I've lost interest now anyway."

Originally posted by Blackmarketeer
Russia has made it clear they were on Gadhafi's side, and this looks like propaganda on their part.

Libya is a secular, Islamic socialism. Gadhafi's Green Books spell it out.

Gadhafi turned his military loose on the protestors. Instead of the military allowing the protesters to be heard, like the Egyptian military allowed protesters to be heard in their country, Gadhafi began slaughtering them. He's nothing more than a megalomaniac and convicted terrorist bomber. He made his bed now let him lie in it.

He is an ideologue, a benevolent tyrant. He has his vision and his plan for Libya that he rigourously pursues and ruthlessly oppresses any dissent.

reply to post by Soshh


You think Pravda invented the medic's letter?

I think murder is sick no matter who is doing it but let's face it, the russians are no better than the US, they have done their fair share of murder/killing of their own people and others. Oh, did they manage to change? Aren't they into that type of thing anymore? What would happen if people tried to do this in russia exactly? Speak out against the goverment never mind...

I think this is propganda but I still think we shouldn't be in Libya. There is nothing you can do for a situation like that. If you left libya alone, they would die and if you go in, they would die. Lose lose situation.

but it's quite ironic that russia passes judgement over this.

Personally I believe the PTB are aiming at Genocide, no matter what you may think the definition may be or any way you care to twist it.
I think it is unwise to aid either side in a "revolution" it builds bad blood.
I have no problem with housing and protecting refugees however, they are non combatants, but where can the folks of Libya flee to?
The rest of their region is crap.
I did not like the idea of the no fly zone as I knew it would turn into this war we have now.
I'm sure there are no more planes in Libya by now so why not pull out and keep the air clear?
But we continue to drop bombs and throw missiles.

Originally posted by g146541
I have no problem with housing and protecting refugees however, they are non combatants, but where can the folks of Libya flee to?
The rest of their region is crap.

In response to Tunisia's 'Arab Spring', many young Tunisian men fled across the Med. France proposed closing her border with Italy.

Originally posted by Exforcesuk
reply to post by wcitizen

 

to steal and control their oil....again.

I have been led to believe that Godaffi wanted to trade oil for gold and stop using the dollar and the euro ! Hence Americas invasion to save their dollar.

Either way an unjustified invasion that needs stopping.

You are correct sir! I believe, they went
as far as to punch some gold pieces.
But I am not 100% sure, I'll check.

I see people being sceptical of Pravda, and rightfully so evident by its one sided reporting since early soviet times, however one can be no more sceptical of pravda than of our own news networks as they both operate a propaganda model which stick to the party line on important issues such as this - nothing you hear will be the raw truth as media source information in this field is largely supplied by military personnel / government personnel who aren't going to dissent with their findings, putting themselves at risk.

However, in issues of past US/NATO sponsored/direct genocide Pravda have often reported truths that NATO press blacks out (obviously to discredit the other side, but still truths non the less) and it seems this may be another instance as such. I am certain that this war (although in reality a small african nation versus a combination of the largest military powers in the world can hardly be considered a war in the truest sense) will include the indiscriminate bombing of civ targets as its a sure fire way to destabilise the infrastructure of the country by casting it into third world status and decimating its population that could be cause for popular resistance when the US/NATO puppet government is inevitably installed.

Often indirect deaths are overlooked - the complete obliteration of agriculture, irrigation and power result in genocide that is not directly attributable to the attacking nation and thus can easily be avoided in the press, for example the hundreds of thousands that have starved to death in iraq/afghanistan and as far back as vietnam/laos/cambodia as humanitarian aid is often restricted with the poor excuse of it hurting the dictator, when really it strengthens them as their people become more dependent on said ruler for survival.

A good analogy i read of NATO foreign policy was that it is similar to a hijacker taking a schoolbus full of children hostage, yet to catch the hijacker we blow up the entire bus and kill all the children in the process, who ultimately had nothing to do with it in the first place. I disagree entirely with the notion of 'get over it, people die in war' - I wonder if they would say the same thing to the face of the mother who's child had been blown up or husband. But of course an effective propaganda model combined with a desensitised mind (in respects to violence and empathy) would produce such a response to INNOCENT deaths.

One might say 'but ghadaffi had to be removed', however i fail to see the logic in blowing the country's infrastructure into disrepair (which will cause a humanitarian crisis) and killing its civilians in the process will better the situation, in fact i believe it only makes a bad situation worse. It seems similar to saddam when people were crying for him to be removed, yet now the general sentiment is the iraq war was a terrible mistake - skip forward 5/10 years and see what people are saying about this outside the heat of the moment and a propaganda model media frenzy. Just my take anyway.

Originally posted by teapot

Originally posted by Blackmarketeer
Russia has made it clear they were on Gadhafi's side, and this looks like propaganda on their part.

Libya is a secular, Islamic socialism. Gadhafi's Green Books spell it out.

Gadhafi turned his military loose on the protestors. Instead of the military allowing the protesters to be heard, like the Egyptian military allowed protesters to be heard in their country, Gadhafi began slaughtering them. He's nothing more than a megalomaniac and convicted terrorist bomber. He made his bed now let him lie in it.

He is an ideologue, a benevolent tyrant. He has his vision and his plan for Libya that he rigourously pursues and ruthlessly oppresses any dissent.

edit on 29/5/2011 by teapot because: edit

None of that matters. Where was the UN during the G20 where protesters were crushed by a democratic government?

I am all for peaceful protests but our leaders are hypocrites for turning their goons loose on peaceful protests and turning their goons on other countries who turn their goons loose on innocent protesters. And the only reason people are angry against Gaddhafi is because the media made him seem like a monster because he lives and believes something more different than you or I.

A great tactician and strategist once said "All war is based on deception", no matter what country. You won't go to war if your president says Congress and I discussed this matter and we don't like Gaddhafi so we are invading him at your expense.

Originally posted by syrinx high priest
Genocide ?

The whole situation is wrong and the assassination attempts really bother me, but don't call it a genocide. The resistance would be better served pointing out the hypocrisy of declaring this an aid mission with all the atrocities happening in africa that go unnoticed

How many real details do you have of what's really happening in Libya? Please give your sources, because these medics are actually there, working, treating the injured, and seeing what is going on.

There have been veterans of Iraq who have stated on camera that they were told to kill civilians indiscriminately.
How many innocent people have to be killed, in your opinion, before it's considered genocide?

Originally posted by Equinox99
reply to post by wcitizen

 

If this was truly a Russian letter it would have been published by a news agency not some no name web-site. Second, this is not a genocide but an unfair unilateral military campaign. We can't just go invade other nations because we think they are running their country the wrong way, in fact that doesn't make sense unless you want to instill a dictator tactic worldwide.

Yes, the UN is the dictator of the world. The simple thought here is that you can't control sovereign nation so you invade it and change the leadership. You want control of the world and parade it as betterment for the entire region but some of us know that we are overthrowing a regime based on the actions of a selected few in that region.

That is like 30,000 rioting in America constitute a change in the president, it doesn't really make sense.

Did you actually read what it said on that website? It was published by Pravda - a Russian media outlet.

How do you know they aren't deliberately or indiscriminately killing civilians? What proof do you have?

Originally posted by David291
I think murder is sick no matter who is doing it but let's face it, the russians are no better than the US, they have done their fair share of murder/killing of their own people and others. Oh, did they manage to change? Aren't they into that type of thing anymore?

What would happen if people tried to do this in russia exactly? Speak out against the goverment never mind...

I think this is propganda but I still think we shouldn't be in Libya. There is nothing you can do for a situation like that. If you left libya alone, they would die and if you go in, they would die. Lose lose situation.

but it's quite ironic that russia passes judgement over this.

So, because the medics are Russian you're discrediting them? So, would you agree to discredit any American who speaks out against war because, well they are American and America commits atrocities too? Your argument is absurd.

reply to post by Equinox99


Where the G20 protesters shot at? No they weren't. What did happen is those "peaceful" protests turned into riots and vandalism where business that had nothing to do with the G20 meeting were damaged. Next time get your facts straight.