Celibacy, homosexuality not to blame for priest abuse.

reply to post by OmegaLogos


Unfortunately this type of behaviour exists throughout the globe, whether you Google 'childhood brides' for recent examples or when the first Americans expanded west, the guys, on occasion had a wife who was only12 years old. It was also a huge part of the Greek culture for boys to end up having an emotional/sexual relationship with their mentor/teacher/gladiator as well as other cultures around the globe. It was once an accepted part of the world culture and in places, for young girls, unfortunately it still is. In this day and age girls as young as 9 are still being taken and given by their families as wives to older men.

It is not so much a sickness as a weakness of an undisciplined individual in a position of responsibility and power over a youth within a culture that no longer tolerates such behaviours. As a society we no longer condone these relationships and the perpetrator we condemn while this unfortunately leaves a victim hood mentality within the child.

When you work in child services you see a lot of things you wish you didn't have to, especially in a multi cultural society. Yes its a sick world because so many cultures and individuals are still locked into a mentality of use and abuse rather than honouring the individual and respecting their freedoms. There needs to be a lot more nurturing rather than dominating and controlling. This behaviour is not isolated to priests... its fathers, brothers, cousins, uncles, the guy next door, etc.


Stress... give me a break!
The reason why priests do what they do is because they aren't allowed to express a natural sexual drive. The child is a convenient opportunity for them In their weakness they choose the young because they don't want to be judged and want to maintain their superiority over others and to be seen as pure of spirit. Its easier for them to manipulate a child because a kid is usually without judgements until s/he ventures into adult hood and begins to create a foundation of morals and ethics. A child trusts rather than judges the behaviour of an adult and priest know this.
Castration is not near enough punishment for guys who perpetuate their destructive emotional/sexual violation on any child.

reply to post by OmegaLogos


I would love to know how they determined that it's not celibacy that contributed greatly to this behavior. It's one thing to be celibate because one freely chooses to, but to make a commitment to it is stupid, to me. I don't know if celibacy is the reason, but I certainly don't think it's the stress of the 60s and 70s. What about those who have abused kids in the 80s, 90s and today?

Everyone has stress. How we deal with it is another thing. I think it's pretty crazy to think that stress and not celibacy and pedophilia is what leads to child molestation by the priesthood. I think they need to examine their testing parameters.

And the church continues to keep its nasty little secret as far hidden as possible:

Bishops were told to cooperate with police, but they were not required to report allegations to the authorities if local law did not require it.

If there's a God, I hope he brings his wrath down IN FULL on the Catholic Church for not exposing this to the light of day. Do they think they are fooling their God???

As a survivor of this type of abuse I am sick and tired of the constant need to justify these acts with reports et al.

These people are just sick.

Stop trying to justify and understand what they do.

Instead

After throwing this human trash away forever where they deserve, the emphasis should be placed on the victim and their needs.

Who cares what drives these perverts? They are a danger to your children and would destroy their innocence or even kill them in a heartbeat, just as they took mine away and nearly destroyed my life..

Concentrate on the care for the victims, ande the rapists of the world can just burn.. Who will miss them??

Well if that's the conclusion of this study then perhaps its the teachings themselves that are root cause of these dirtbag rapists. I'm no fan of the church, I view it is a crutch for people who cannot function on their own or lack the ability to understand direction in life. If you need it fine, but ultimately you will fall victim to the church for when it does not either meet your expectations or you see it in part for what it truly represents (in this case the rape of children).

I don't really care what any study reveals that is a wasted effort because it clouds the real problem. The issue is that there have been thousands of these cases with very little action taken. It would seem this study is a pathetic attempt to absolve the church of wrongdoing rather than address the issue. I've read so many outcomes where priests are basically re-assigned to other areas to downplay the severity & magnitude of the problem. The church is a hyprocrite to the highest degree spouting all its lies while it hides under a cloak of innocence in the name of god...ha. What's worse are the countless number of fools who believe them. If you abuse the trust of a child, specifically by phyiscal molestation or abuse, you should be put to death.

brill

Originally posted by TransJenny
As a survivor of this type of abuse I am sick and tired of the constant need to justify these acts with reports et al.

These people are just sick.

Stop trying to justify and understand what they do.

Instead

After throwing this human trash away forever where they deserve, the emphasis should be placed on the victim and their needs.

Who cares what drives these perverts? They are a danger to your children and would destroy their innocence or even kill them in a heartbeat, just as they took mine away and nearly destroyed my life..

Concentrate on the care for the victims, ande the rapists of the world can just burn.. Who will miss them??

Great post and I agree completely. Show this scum for what its worth ! Stop trying to justify their obvious inability to live and function amongst normal people.

brill

I read the report as a way to cover up the clear homosexual basis of the problem.

Plus, they get a bonus since they pander to the PC madness, hoping to get a pass.

Here's some numbers: 83% of abuse victims are MALE. 100% of priest-abusers are MALE. Further, the "pedophile" component is relatively small, since 78% of the victims are post-pubescent.

Logic here people. It's a homosexual issue.

JR

Originally posted by JR MacBeth
Here's some numbers: 83% of abuse victims are MALE.

Yeah, where did those numbers come from? (Not sure I wanna know)

I find it ironic that the same commision that founded these outragious results
IS
the same commision that covered this behavior for years !

.............. I am speechless that anyone would even take this study seriously!

Originally posted by OmegaLogos
Do you support this finding or not?

Could there be a conspiracy behind this reports findings?

If big oil funded a report about energy, I'd certainly be wary of possible bias in the report due to the source of funding.

Likewise, since this report was funded by bishops, I'm wary of possible bias. I think it would be less biased coming from a third party. For example, maybe they wanted the report to say celibacy wasn't an issue, because they don't want to relax celibacy restrictions. But what if celibacy really was an issue and the report only says it's not because it's biased? I don't know what the answer is, I'm just asking the question. Not that celibacy excuses what they did even if it is a contributing factor.

Pls Feel free to leave your own opinions but I caution members from straying off topic or focusing on each others issues instead of the topic. Thank you!

How did you know this was going to happen, are you psychic?

Originally posted by Anttyk47

Instead, researchers conclude priests were under stress, ill-prepared to deal with the social and sexual turmoil of the 1960s and '70s, and poorly monitored.

Pathetic excuses. Clearly a cover up. This makes me sick.

Originally posted by Benevolent Heretic

Originally posted by JR MacBeth
Here's some numbers: 83% of abuse victims are MALE.

Yeah, where did those numbers come from? (Not sure I wanna know)

We're looking at their report in this thread.

Seemed like an internal inconsistency, wouldn't you say?

Now, add to this another important factor, according to John Jay researchers, who find that this 80% figure of male victims, flys in the face of national statistics that show girls are three times more likely to be abused than boys.

My guess is that while homosexuality seems to be clearly a huge factor here, this report somehow wants to blunt the obvious implications of the numbers.

We might ask why, which is why I brought up political correctness. We could go further, and realize that the modern Catholic Church today seems to have mostly homosexual priests and bishops. There is ample evidence of a gay subculture that has dominated quite a few of their seminaries, such as Los Angeles Archbishop Mahoney's infamous "Pink Palace" (St. John's Seminary).

By the way, Mahoney is one of the most powerful of all American Bishops, lest we imagine invoking his name here is somehow irrelevant, when evaluating a report that he most certainly gave his imprimatur.

This speaks to motive. To me, it's clear they are attempting to downplay homosexuality when it comes to this issue. Again, why would that be?

Could it be because the majority of bishops are themselves homosexual?

I don't think we should too easily dismiss this possibility, considering the history of the past few decades.

It is generally accepted that Paul VI was a homosexual. As pope, he managed to install one sympathetic cardinal after another, almost single-handedly changing the leadership of the church to one of a more liberal orientation. This fact shouldn't be ignored considering what happened in this abuse scandal.

Is it politically correct to underscore the homosexual issue? Of course not, but it might still come closer to the truth. And to completely ignore it, would be a gross injustice to the victims.

JR

Originally posted by subby

Originally posted by Anttyk47

Instead, researchers conclude priests were under stress, ill-prepared to deal with the social and sexual turmoil of the 1960s and '70s, and poorly monitored.

Pathetic excuses. Clearly a cover up. This makes me sick.

Clearly a "We didn't find anything note worthy" thing. They just couldn't not report anything

It is laughable to say that studies like these aren't trying to make some excuse for the priest's behavior/actions. The main problem isn't about homosexuality or celibacy. The problem grew out of hand after the church refused to acknowledge the problem within ranks of the priests. So instead of one abuse allegation/situation per priest, they move the priest around after a situation comes to light, allowing the chain of abuse to grow and grow, often over a riculously long period of time. To me this does feel like an attempt at making an excuse.

Originally posted by TribeOfManyColours

Originally posted by steven704

Originally posted by THE_PROFESSIONAL
most child rapists and pedophiles are christians, they need to be sent to guantanamo bay just like all the terrorists.

Christians have nothing to do with this. those priest are obviously not faithful followers of GOD.
i've never agreed with the order and structure of the catholic church, but to say such a thing as you have is a flat out lie.

links or go home.

I believe that sick people who have difficulties finding their place in the real world, will join the church. Sickness does not disappear, when following god.

I agree with when you say sick people join the priesthood ... because this would at least mentally entail seeking the help or submitting to GOD.

..unless the pedophile joined the priesthood with the exact intentions of pedophilia

kid in a candystore mentality and intent.

A very close and long time friend of mine is a Jesuit. He became a priest after college... and we had discussed this several times over the yrs. He has an interesting idea concerning it. He feels that people who already have these tendencies ( and no, not all abuse is homosexual.. its the one that gets the press) seek professions which keep them in contact with their prey.. and provide an adequate cover. WHere else can one not "work", be taken care of, have a lot of free time, and maintain a very secure position of power with daily access to what he craves? Where else will it be shoved under the rug and settlements bankrolled.. and prison time almost never served? Where can you hand pick vulnerable victims due to having intimate knowledge concerning the kid, their family situation, and resources? Where else can you do all manner of heinous things yet be socially/spiritually absolved and enabled?
Nowhere but the priesthood.

I disagree with the findings of that research and most ask whether there is an agenda behind it.. It is known that suppressing sexual energy through celibacy leads to intense sexual fantasies which can lead to deviant and odd sexual behaviour. I was under the assumption that that was common sense knowledge.

The report also says only a small minority of abusive priests met the clinical definition of paedophiles.

Instead, researchers conclude priests were under stress, ill-prepared to deal with the social and sexual turmoil of the 1960s and '70s, and poorly monitored.

Sounds more like an excuse than a study. Likely a pre-determined outcome by hand selected individuals.

You have sex with a child, you are a pedophile. If having sex with children is not the definition, then what is I wonder. Absolute nonsense.

All of this is useless information anyway. Pedophile or not, they did the deed and the only thing that matters beyond that is that anyone who knew or committed the act is punished and kept away from children. What Faith they belonged to is also irrelevant. Only those involved matter.

Can't blame them though with so many Christian Haters falsely blaming the entire religion. Punish the guilty, move on and leave the innocent alone. Ignore the Haters and Bigot's. That is how I see this.

What truly troubles me the most is it would seem some Parents must have covered up.

reply to post by Skyfloating


I would think so as well. I think psychiatry has reached the level of absurdity.

Originally posted by OmegaLogos



Explanation: I bring this to ATS to discuss in depth.

Personal Disclosure: I welcome this report and I am I wondering what my fellow ATS members have to say on it.

Do you support this finding or not?

Could there be a conspiracy behind this reports findings?

Pls Feel free to leave your own opinions but I caution members from straying off topic or focusing on each others issues instead of the topic. Thank you!


www.abc.net.au
(visit the link for the full news article)

I don't support the findings because the report was conducted by the very same people that are being studied. To me this seems like it has an agenda, perhaps to save face for the church. Who knows. There is no difference in the mental health of a priest that does it or some random sicko that does it. They are both sick and dangerous and should be put out of their misery (as well as ours), much like a rabid dog.

i can say that as a straight male that was celibate, by choice, for the last three years(up until a couple months ago) i can attest that celibacy, in no way, affected my judgment regarding what is and isn't acceptable.