Ron Paul: The Founders Didn´t Believe In Income Tax!

Here in the answer to the income tax...............the FAIRTAX.

What is the FairTax plan? The FairTax plan is a comprehensive proposal that replaces all federal income and payroll based taxes with an integrated approach including a progressive national retail sales tax, a prebate to ensure no American pays federal taxes on spending up to the poverty level, dollar-for-dollar federal revenue neutrality, and, through companion legislation, the repeal of the 16th Amendment. The FairTax Act (HR 25, S 13) is nonpartisan legislation. It abolishes all federal personal and corporate income taxes, gift, estate, capital gains, alternative minimum, Social Security, Medicare, and self-employment taxes and replaces them with one simple, visible, federal retail sales tax administered primarily by existing state sales tax authorities. The FairTax taxes us only on what we choose to spend on new goods or services, not on what we earn. The FairTax is a fair, efficient, transparent, and intelligent solution to the frustration and inequity of our current tax system.

www.fairtax.org...
If we were to replace the federal/state income tax with the fair tax we could create much more revenue. Think about all of those living and working here that do not pay income taxes. With the fairtax they would have no choice. Every time the bought something they would be paying their fair share. Look into it.

A lot of people get the entire amount of income tax they have taken out of their paychecks refunded back to them plus sometimes more! So they are not paying income tax.

I am single and do not see any refunds. It is hard to keep a roof over my head, keep a car so I can get to work, etc. on one income that is a bit over minimum wage. I don't make a lot per hour.

It is frustrating at tax refund time to see those who get all their money back be able to go get things that geez I only wish I could afford.

Originally posted by Quadrivium
Here in the answer to the income tax...............the FAIRTAX.

What is the FairTax plan? The FairTax plan is a comprehensive proposal that replaces all federal income and payroll based taxes with an integrated approach including a progressive national retail sales tax, a prebate to ensure no American pays federal taxes on spending up to the poverty level, dollar-for-dollar federal revenue neutrality, and, through companion legislation, the repeal of the 16th Amendment. The FairTax Act (HR 25, S 13) is nonpartisan legislation. It abolishes all federal personal and corporate income taxes, gift, estate, capital gains, alternative minimum, Social Security, Medicare, and self-employment taxes and replaces them with one simple, visible, federal retail sales tax administered primarily by existing state sales tax authorities. The FairTax taxes us only on what we choose to spend on new goods or services, not on what we earn. The FairTax is a fair, efficient, transparent, and intelligent solution to the frustration and inequity of our current tax system.

www.fairtax.org...
If we were to replace the federal/state income tax with the fair tax we could create much more revenue. Think about all of those living and working here that do not pay income taxes. With the fairtax they would have no choice. Every time the bought something they would be paying their fair share. Look into it.

The FairTax is not "fair", there's nothing fair about taxation.

reply to post by sharintexas


Gosh, I sound like a whiner...I can't stand a whiner!

How can you tax something where nothing is gained?

When you go to work, you are giving up your time and effort for a wage. You gain nothing.

How can that legally be taxed?

Originally posted by userid1

Originally posted by dazbog

Income tax was NEVER intended to be levied against " WAGES EARNED "
only the interest on unearned income.

"The Congress shall have power to lay and collect taxes on incomes, from whatever source derived, without apportionment among the several States, and without regard to any census or enumeration."
caselaw.lp.findlaw.com...

"...from whatever source derived..." seems to encompass wages earned to me.

Well , quite so now. Please note " never intended." You can thank the 16th Amendment. Prior to 1913 We paid ZERO tax on 'Wages Earned " Taxes were paid on interest earned but not wages.

ourdocuments.gov...

It's not income taxes that's keeping people poor.

It's the consumer society that people have been brainwashed into lock, stock and barrel.

I might add , from your source [Footnote 12] Brushaber v. Union Pac. R.R., 240 U.S. 1, 18 -19 (1916).

caselaw.lp.findlaw.com...

12 ''[T]he Sixteenth Amendment conferred no new power of taxation but simply prohibited the previous complete and plenary power of income taxation possessed by Congress from the beginning from being taken out of the category of indirect taxation to which it inherently belonged.''

The important part is the sixteen Amendment DID NOT confer new powers. Hence one must revert to the original intent. Consequently Ron Paul is correct.

The FairTax plan is the best tax plan for ANY country. I live in Canada, and would gladly vote for ANY politician that proposes such a thing.

It means that every single person pays the same. Illegal immigrants pay, corporations pay, the rich pay, the poor pay.

It encourages savings as you only pay tax on stuff you buy, not on money you save. It's a win-win-win for the Government, the poor, and all of those who think that there are too many tax dodgers everywhere.

reply to post by Rockdisjoint


Lol, your right.
But then again life aint fair sometimes.
Maybe it should be called the Fairer tax or Most fair tax.

Originally posted by babybunnies
The FairTax plan is the best tax plan for ANY country. I live in Canada, and would gladly vote for ANY politician that proposes such a thing.

It means that every single person pays the same. Illegal immigrants pay, corporations pay, the rich pay, the poor pay.

It encourages savings as you only pay tax on stuff you buy, not on money you save. It's a win-win-win for the Government, the poor, and all of those who think that there are too many tax dodgers everywhere.

My point exactly BB. If more people were to look into the fairtax I am sure they would support it.
Lets be honest. Taxation may not be fair but your still gonna have to pay. Why not set up a system that is fair to all?
Star for you.

reply to post by babybunnies


reply to post by Quadrivium


There is no simple, no just tax, we need to eliminate the IRS and the entire tax code with it. If theft is required for the government to operate, then it shouldn't operate.

reply to post by Rockdisjoint
well here in reality we know that we do need government for some things, a government for the people by the people (yes I know we don't have that now). The country is a lot bigger than it was before 1913 and of course the government will have to get funds from somewhere.
Like I said taxes are not fair but they could be applied in a more fair manner like the fairtax.

Originally posted by Quadrivium
reply to post by Rockdisjoint

 

well here in reality we know that we do need government for some things, a government for the people by the people (yes I know we don't have that now). The country is a lot bigger than it was before 1913 and of course the government will have to get funds from somewhere.
Like I said taxes are not fair but they could be applied in a more fair manner like the fairtax.

What things are the government needed for?

95% of what the federal government does is unnecessary.

Originally posted by Rockdisjoint

Originally posted by Quadrivium
Here in the answer to the income tax...............the FAIRTAX.

What is the FairTax plan? The FairTax plan is a comprehensive proposal that replaces all federal income and payroll based taxes with an integrated approach including a progressive national retail sales tax, a prebate to ensure no American pays federal taxes on spending up to the poverty level, dollar-for-dollar federal revenue neutrality, and, through companion legislation, the repeal of the 16th Amendment. The FairTax Act (HR 25, S 13) is nonpartisan legislation. It abolishes all federal personal and corporate income taxes, gift, estate, capital gains, alternative minimum, Social Security, Medicare, and self-employment taxes and replaces them with one simple, visible, federal retail sales tax administered primarily by existing state sales tax authorities. The FairTax taxes us only on what we choose to spend on new goods or services, not on what we earn. The FairTax is a fair, efficient, transparent, and intelligent solution to the frustration and inequity of our current tax system.

www.fairtax.org...
If we were to replace the federal/state income tax with the fair tax we could create much more revenue. Think about all of those living and working here that do not pay income taxes. With the fairtax they would have no choice. Every time the bought something they would be paying their fair share. Look into it.

The FairTax is not "fair", there's nothing fair about taxation.

There is a difference between "fair" and "necessary". Unfortunately taxes, because of government spending, are now necessary. But at least the Fair Tax is, indeed, the fairest way to do it. After we tax citizens fairly, then we can work on how to stop all taxes, which is by cutting spending. Baby steps.

/TOA

reply to post by The Old American


Very well stated TOA. I could not agree more.

Originally posted by Rockdisjoint

Originally posted by Quadrivium
reply to post by Rockdisjoint

 

well here in reality we know that we do need government for some things, a government for the people by the people (yes I know we don't have that now). The country is a lot bigger than it was before 1913 and of course the government will have to get funds from somewhere.
Like I said taxes are not fair but they could be applied in a more fair manner like the fairtax.

What things are the government needed for?

95% of what the federal government does is unnecessary.

edit on 15-5-2011 by Rockdisjoint because: (no reason given)

I agree, most of what they do, the majority of us do not want or need. But honestly there is no way for us to undo all of their wrongs in the blink of an eye. It will have to be undone piece by piece or else it will break up what's left of this great nation. The fairtax would be a very good start.

reply to post by The Old American


I understand what you're saying, but I don't think that would work. Lets say we did abolish the IRS and implement the "fairtheft", what would make the federal government change? It would still receive more than enough money to continue its illegal and unconstitutional ways. Or what if they decide 23% isn't enough to cover current expenditures? The sales tax will be increased, who will determine the correct percentage?

Originally posted by Quadrivium

Originally posted by Rockdisjoint

Originally posted by Quadrivium
reply to post by Rockdisjoint

 

well here in reality we know that we do need government for some things, a government for the people by the people (yes I know we don't have that now). The country is a lot bigger than it was before 1913 and of course the government will have to get funds from somewhere.
Like I said taxes are not fair but they could be applied in a more fair manner like the fairtax.

What things are the government needed for?

95% of what the federal government does is unnecessary.

edit on 15-5-2011 by Rockdisjoint because: (no reason given)

I agree, most of what they do, the majority of us do not want or need. But honestly there is no way for us to undo all of their wrongs in the blink of an eye. It will have to be undone piece by piece or else it will break up what's left of this great nation. The fairtax would be a very good start.

Mhm, I don't think it would be a "good start" at all. Trade is good for the economy by people buying and selling they are putting money back into the economy thus helping others out, why should people be penalized for a good deed? Just like with the income tax, why should people be penalized for working? They shouldn't.

Originally posted by Rockdisjoint

Originally posted by gorgi

Originally posted by Rockdisjoint
reply to post by gorgi

 

No not really, by taxing income you punish production and thereby protect the currently wealthy from competition. Essentially it means keeping the lid on capital accumulation so that the current owners of capital stay on top. The rich actually love high income taxation, because it's really taxes on the upper middle class and it suppresses upwards mobility in the group that is most likely to compete with them.

edit on 14-5-2011 by Rockdisjoint because: (no reason given)

The rich are not going to stop working or keeping their businesses open because of an income tax. The rich got pissed when FDR raised the taxes on them.

And income tax is different than taxation on other goods such as capital.

Sure they won't stop working, they won't even change their life style, they'll pass costs onto the poor. If you tax the poor, the rich will have to pay them higher wages and charge lower prices, income taxes help no one, but big government.

Interesting, I always thought supply and demand dictated prices, are you saying that in this world, supply and demand represent a false dynamic?

I am sure you will pretend that you did not read it but

If your assertion's are true

Why have prices increased as the the income tax rates have been sheered in favor of the rich???


Anyone care to tell me how eliminating minimum wage will raise the wage floor?