can illegal aliens vote?

may seem like a relatively simple question.
our instinctual answer is to say 'no', but what is the actual truth regarding this issue?
to be honest, most of the info i am about to present is a bit dated. there is very little recent info to be had, so if you know of any, either side of the coin, please post it.

Illegal Immigrants Are Voting in American Elections

Hans A. von Spakovsky served as a member of the Federal Election Commission for two years. Before that, he was Counsel to the Assistant Attorney General for Civil Rights at the U.S. Department of Justice, where he specialized in voting and election issues. He also served as a county election official in Georgia for five years as a member of the Fulton County Board of Registration and Elections.

long, well researched article.

In 2005, the U.S. Government Accountability Office found that up to 3 percent of the 30,000 individuals called for jury duty from voter registration rolls over a two-year period in just one U.S. district court were not U.S. citizens. While that may not seem like many, just 3 percent of registered voters would have been more than enough to provide the winning presiden­tial vote margin in Florida in 2000. Indeed, the Cen­sus Bureau estimates that there are over a million illegal aliens in Florida, and the U.S. Department of Justice (DOJ) has prosecuted more non-citizen voting cases in Florida than in any other state. Florida is not unique. Thousands of non-citizens are registered to vote in some states, and tens if not hundreds of thousands in total may be present on the voter rolls nationwide. These numbers are significant: Local elections are often decided by only a handful of votes, and even national elections have likely been within the margin of the number of non-citizens ille­gally registered to vote. Yet there is no reliable method to determine the number of non-citizens registered or actually voting because most laws to ensure that only citizens vote are ignored, are inadequate, or are systematically undermined by government officials. Those who ignore the implications of non-citizen registration and voting either are willfully blind to the problem or may actually favor this form of illegal voting.

source

Statement from Governor Jan Brewer and Secretary of State Ken Bennett October 26, 2010 Ruling by U.S. 9th Circuit Court of Appeals Opens Door to Voter Registration Fraud PHOENIX – "The Ninth Circuit Court Appeals has struck down a simple, common sense protection approved by Arizona voters requiring that all individuals provide evidence of U.S. citizenship prior to registering to vote. This decision is an outrage and a slap in the face to all Arizonans who care about the integrity of their elections. “Arizona voters approved this critical election-security requirement in 2004. We have been vigorously defending its constitutionality and the will of Arizona voters. This law has previously been upheld at every level and by every court, including the 9th Circuit, despite numerous lawsuits and challenges filed by activist groups. “Today’s decision should not impact the election on Tuesday, but could impact our registration requirements and the integrity of local elections being conducted beginning as early as this spring, as well as statewide elections in 2012. “That simply cannot be tolerated. Arizona voters have made their will crystal clear – non-citizens do not have the right to vote. We will continue to pursue any and all legal remedies to prevent fraudulent voter registration in the State of Arizona, as well as the right of our state citizens to craft appropriate protections.”

source

Non-Citizen Voting in Federal Elections In 1996, Congress enacted the Illegal Immigration Reform and Immigrant Responsibility Act, making it a federal crime for non-citizens to vote in any federal election (or state election, unless authorized by state law). As a penalty, ineligible non-citizens who knowingly vote may be deported. Additionally, a non-citizen who falsely claims to be a United States citizen is in violation of this law. However, there are many documented reports of non-citizen voting,1 2 and there is no evidence of prosecution of the aliens for their action. With nearly 19 million foreign-born residents who are not U.S. citizens in the country in the 2000 Census and an estimated 9-11 million illegal residents (many of them not also counted in the Census), the potential is enormous for non-citizens to affect the outcome of elections.

source

so, even if you are pro-open borders and illegal immigrant, does this seem right?
is this a problem that should be addressed?

understanding that we face the same problem with boatloads of asylum seekers arriving in australia illegally, I believe it's like leaving a chicken coup open late at night knowing there is a fox prowling about. Illegal immigrants should not be allowed to vote, allowed medical care, a chance for education or even an ability to rent or buy a home. If they are seeking asylum they should go through the proper channels. I am not saying refugees or any other people should not be allowed to enter the country, but saying it shouldn't be done in an illegal discourse.

No they cant vote or get back taxes paid through withholding.

yeah they can and do

how do you think harry reid got elected? hmmmmmmmm.

Originally posted by neo96
yeah they can and do

how do you think harry reid got elected? hmmmmmmmm.

citations or hearsay

I tell you what, if I lived in Massachusetts, I'd try to vote ten times. I don't know if they'd let me or not, but I'd try to. Yeah, that's right, I'd cheat to keep these bastards out. I would. 'Cause that's exactly what they are.

-MSNBC's Ed Shultz on voting out Massachusetts conservatives

Illegals vote here in Massachusetts. Anybody can vote here; legal immigrants, tourists, teenagers, anybody. Massachusetts doesn't require an ID at the polls.

But not only do Illegal immigrants vote in our elections, we pay for them to vote in their home-country's elections. Since in many countries in south America, voting is mandatory for citizens.

FRAMINGHAM — Brazilians living in New England will be coming to Framingham High School Sunday to vote in their country’s presidential election. Traffic has been backed up for about a mile approaching Framingham High School as Brazilians from all over New England are casting compulsory votes for their home country's president today.

According to the Brazilian Workers Party, which organizes voting throughout the country, the polling place at the high school should be collecting nearly 12,000 votes from people registered to vote in Brazil living in Massachusetts, Maine, New Hampshire, Rhode Island and Vermont. In total there are about 60,000 registered Brazilian voters living in the U.S., said a press release.

"Voting is the way you show you are really Brazilian still," said Webster's Rodolpho Moraes shortly after arriving at the school yesterday. "It's bringing me close to my home country."

www.wickedlocal.com...
VIDEO
www.boston.com...

Originally posted by spyder550
No they cant vote or get back taxes paid through withholding.

There's a difference between legally speaking "no they can't" and realistically speaking "no they can't."

Legally speaking I "can't" buy a kilo or coke break it into crack and sell it on the corner.

Does that mean realistically I cant?

You can realistically vote just about anywhere you want in America. Just show up, same day register with any number of made up forms/utility bills/lease agreements, vote and leave.

It happens all the time.

There really isnt anybody checking. In 20 years of voting in different towns I've never been asked for a photo ID. Nobody is going to go back and make sure your fraudulent paperwork is genuine.

To believe that in any election there isnt one person voting who legally shouldnt be voting is absurdly naive.

reply to post by rubbertramp


Doesn't surprise me one bit.. Most illegals have some form of stollen identity, or forged US documents like BC's, SS cards etc.. many even have licenses.

From my understanding Illegals can legally vote in all but Federal elections, but if your registered and all you need to do is bring a BC .. since most have them, it's logical many could vote.

Originally posted by METACOMET


Illegals vote here in Massachusetts. Anybody can vote here; legal immigrants, tourists, teenagers, anybody. Massachusetts doesn't require an ID at the polls.

Most states don't require ID at the polls (which I think is ridiculous).

However, you are required to be registered in order to vote, and you must, according to Massachusetts state law, be a US citizen in order to register.

Only a person who is:

a US citizen, and
a resident of Massachusetts, and
18 years old on or before election day (must still meet registration deadlines set forth below)

source

I'm not exactly sure how an illegal immigrant would manage to register, but I won't say it's impossible. However the amount of time and energy it would take to properly falsify records puts it out of reach for most people. To suggest that illegal immigrants have a significant impact on voting might be a stretch.

However, I would definitely agree that more regulations need to be put in place to ensure that only valid, registered voters who are US Citizens can cast a ballot in any election.

reply to post by Rockpuck

From my understanding Illegals can legally vote in all but Federal elections

i don't think this is correct. i'll have to look into it further, but maybe there are certain areas/states where they are allowed.

Reply to post by drwizardphd

You can make up a bogus lease agreement and a couple of utility bills at the public library in ten minutes.

While you're there ask for a windowed envelope. They'll give you one. And that's your proof of residency for registration.

It really isn't that hard.

Subsequently you can leap from there to a path of full fledged fake identification.

The only thing that will stop you is human checking that you're being honest. Usually doesn't happen until it's too late to stop you if it happens at all.


Posted Via ATS Mobile: m.abovetopsecret.com

reply to post by drwizardphd

To suggest that illegal immigrants have a significant impact on voting might be a stretch.

no one is suggesting this.
the stuff i linked to in the op all said otherwise for the most part.

here in new mexico, it is simple for an illegal to obtain a drivers license.

to register to vote, this is the requirements.

Requirements There are a few basic requirements you must meet in order to be eligible to vote in the United States and to register in New Mexico: You must be 18 years old. You must be a legal resident of the United States. You must be a legal resident of New Mexico. If you have been convicted of a felony, you must have had your civil rights restored. You must not have been judged mentally unfit.

in other words, obtain a license and residence, and one can vote by simply lying about legality.
i'm not saying lots do, just that if they want it is easy.

Originally posted by rubbertramp


in other words, obtain a license and residence, and one can vote by simply lying about legality.
i'm not saying lots do, just that if they want it is easy.

Fair enough, the more I read into it the more I realize that this is a serious problem.

Here in Florida, any time you vote on anything you need to provide a valid photo ID. I was shocked to find out that there are only 7 other states with laws like this in the country, and in most states you simply have to sign and 'pledge' that you are telling the truth about your identity.

This sort of lax policy would not be acceptable if you wanted to buy a beer or rent a car, so why is it acceptable for our voting system? Obviously some sort of reform is in order.

First off it matters not since the only votes that count are that of the electoral collage; second voting in itself is a crime against the true Republic, read more here on that topic: www.pacinlaw.org... treason by design

Then come to my thread to get the education the system has denied you all these years.

www.abovetopsecret.com...

reply to post by drwizardphd

Here in Florida, any time you vote on anything you need to provide a valid photo ID.

yet, with false documentation that is not a problem.

this may interest you.

It’s apparent that President Obama considers Americans, who want to enforce illegal immigration laws in America, to be the enemy. Even more revealing is the fact that with so much riding on the elections next week, Obama decided to take the time to speak to people who shouldn’t be voting — legal and illegal immigrants. But the dirty little secret is there exists an enormous amount of proof that illegal aliens are being registered to vote and they’re being registered as Democrats. And our political leaders know it. “The U.S. Census Bureau reports that 28.2 percent of Hispanic voters in the 2008 election were immigrants,” according to Steven Camarota of Center for Immigration Studies Whistleblower J. Christian Adams, who testified before a Commission of Civil Rights committee regarding voter intimidation by the New Black Panthers, dropped a bomb on his former employers at the Department of Justice. According to Adams, a Deputy Attorney General refused to investigate allegations of illegal voting during the last presidential election.

source, more inside

"can illegal aliens vote?"
I guess it depends on what planet they are from.

I'm here legally and I can't vote.

You see, this is what i mean when I say illegals seem to be getting ahead of the line on everything. And all the bleeding heart morons out there are letting it happen because they can lock in votes and disenfranchise others.

Short answer is no. Barring that a state does not infringe upon a voter in regards to the 14th, 15th, 19th 23rd (if you live in D.C), and 26th Amendments of the Constitution, it is up to that state to determine eligibility based on each the laws in regard to voting eligibility.

I believe there are no states at this moment that have eligibility to register to vote unless they are a citizen of the United States of America. However, some states are more lenient and loose on their definition of a citizen and the required proof to present while registering. Ultimately this has led to battles in states that wish to have identification presented when registering.

The Supreme Court of the United States has ruled that there is no federal constitutional right to vote, but that doesn't mean that an individual state has not declared it such a right nor does it bar the individual from declaring such a right. (See the 10th and 9th Amendments of the Constitution)

Depending largely on the scope we are discussing, the rules, regulations and requirements are much different. A local town has the most latitude in their eligibility requirements (but must still not disagree or disparage a voter based on the Constitutionally protected aspects). In say the voting of Electors, that is dependent upon the State in which you live.

This also has been upheld by the Supreme Court that the States themselves are given sole power in the manner in which they elect electors. The manner in which a particular state legislature may or may not be the most democratic in the sense of "the People", but it is done so either by popular vote or by some other means as prescribed by said state's legislature.

I will continue to scour though to see if any state does not define that only a citizen of that state can register to vote; thus granting access to the ballot box.

reply to post by drwizardphd

I'm not exactly sure how an illegal immigrant would manage to register, but I won't say it's impossible.

Since you are not required to show any ID at the polls, not being registered is a non issue. My point is you don't have to be registered to vote.

For instance, if I was ineligible to vote, all I would have to do is use a registered voters name or address. That happens all the time.

It's like being required to have a ticket to go to the concert, but they don't check for tickets at the entrance.

Originally posted by Rockpuck
From my understanding Illegals can legally vote in all but Federal elections

There are no "federal elections". There are elections for Federal officers (Senators, representatives, etc for the Federal level), but they are all State held elections.

Each state is given discretion on to how they determine eligibility to vote. The only guidelines they must follow is those presented in the various amendments of the Constitution itself. 14,15,19,23,24/25 I believe. Those give no indication of a right to vote, but rather that states cannot bar someone based on religion, color, race, sex, creed and 18+.