Who really....really wrote the Bible?

This has confused me for years.

Apparently it was written 60 years ofter the death of Jesus Of Nazereth.

Now.
If the desciples were the same age as Jesus, at his death. they would have been 93years old.....

ok.
Now if they had been writing about their experiences duting the 60 year time frame, I could sort of understand.
However.
most of them could not read or write...apparently.

So.
If this was the case, they asked these old, old men...and women, I presume, to dictate their experience with Jesus.


I know a few octagians who could recall their life, but not to the extent of the bible.


Call me a cynic, but hell, 2 + 2 is 4, ain't it

Humans wrote it down, but the Bible came from God. Before you all start jumping on the anti-God parade, the whole idea of God is too complex for a human mind to make up. A man once said "If God doesn't exists, there would be no need to invent him"

Originally posted by infinite
Humans wrote it down, but the Bible came from God. Before you all start jumping on the anti-God parade,

WOW! Ouch! I think this poster can post whatever....this is the site to do just that! Do you have proof that the bible came from god? NO you don't...just a belief....this poster has made some good valid questions! While were at it, what is all the "free will" stuff? How is it "free will" if your told what to do and not to do......or else!?



[edit on 8/1/2004 by LadyV]

Even if they hadnt been writing down their experiences before they got really old.. Isnt it entirely possible that God blessed them with old age and good memory, to serve his will.

He did it for Moses and others.. Why not do it for the disciples.

Originally posted by LadyV
While were at it, what is all the "free will" stuff? How is it "free will" if your told what to do and not to do......or else!?

If you are referring to the free will that God gave mankind..

We can CHOOSE to do whatever we want, but God warns us that if we do the wrong thing, there will be consequences.
We can still do it if we want, but we must put up with whatever happens as a result.

Originally posted by shidge.
Even if they hadnt been writing down their experiences before they got really old.. Isnt it entirely possible that God blessed them with old age and good memory, to serve his will.

He did it for Moses and others.. Why not do it for the disciples.

All depends on your belief structure.......there is no more proof of any of this, than there is UFOs...........as a matter of fact, there is more proof of UFOs than there is this.....except that you are taught to believe this from infancy, so it is fact, to most people.

Isnt it entirely possible that God blessed them with old age and good memory, to serve his will.

Well, we are told that Moses and some of his kin lived to be over 900 years old. There is a forum here asking about time.
Either the age thing is exagerated or time, as we know it has changed.

Even if they hadnt been writing down their experiences before they got really old.. Isnt it entirely possible that God blessed them with old age and good memory, to serve his will.

This, although possible, seems totally incredible. Why, for the love of God would Jesus have to go through all his suffering, and some of his desciples then get long live and superb memories.

I don't wan't to attack any religion of faiths here, but it seems that indoctination can be destructive to logical thought

Originally posted by LadyV
there is more proof of UFOs than there is this

Is there
pffftt...please your making me laugh
There is no evidence to suggest intelligent life from another planet is visting earth. But anyways, this isn't the Alien/UFO section.

As for "free will", its more of a helpful way on how to live a good life in the eyes of God, your not forced to. Hell, i believe in God, but i no for a fact that im probably going to hell for a lot of things. If you don't live the way God wants you go to hell, as we are told, but your given the choice not forced. Its not "you shall follow God or be hit with a lighten bolt"

Originally posted by shidge.
Even if they hadnt been writing down their experiences before they got really old.. Isnt it entirely possible that God blessed them with old age and good memory, to serve his will.

He did it for Moses and others.. Why not do it for the disciples.

Abraham - in his old age he takes his son out for a walk. He attempts to kill him 'for God's glory', but then at the last minute sees an animal that he will kill on the altar instead of his son. I bet when they got home from their 'walk', and his wife heard what happened, she sent him off to boarding school. Abraham had dementia, or was having hallucinations. He was a prayerful man, and well intentioned, but still ....

St. John. Wrote the Apocolypse. He was old. In excile. Had a stressful life. Saw his friends all murdered. He was boiled in oil and survived. Was the Apocolypse really visions of the future, or just stress induced dreams on an old guy with dementia and stress syndrom.

I guess it's a matter of faith. I used to believe these two were holy men, and perhaps they were. But I also think they had very human illness's towards the ends of their lives.

Originally posted by infinite

Originally posted by LadyV
there is more proof of UFOs than there is this

Is there

pffftt...please your making me laugh

There is no evidence to suggest intelligent life from another planet is visting earth. But anyways, this isn't the Alien/UFO section.

Laugh on.....I disagree as would many here most likely! I also do not understand in any way, shape, or form all this, "he had to suffer our sins" nonsense! Why? for what reason? Same with the sacrificing of animals....why? To me a God can absolutely anything...can do all with just a thought...why should someone die and suffer for sense....it makes no sense at all...what would one have to kill something to a higher being....

Originally posted by infinite
A man once said "If God doesn't exists, there would be no need to invent him"

Ah yes, essentially the Ontological argument:
(1) I define God to be X.
(2) Since I can conceive of X, X must exist.
(3) Therefore, God exists.

Easily the weakest of the arguments used to prove the existence of God.

We will never know who first physically wrote the books in the Bible, most likely many of the stories were passed down orally through several generations before being written down. I think of greater concern is the number of translations and revisions the Bible has gone through to reach its current state. We have seen a number of corrections in recent years based on new translations, which indicates that the original translators weren't very well inspired by God to do proper translations. So how are we to believe that the original writers were inspired by God to write the proper words?

Originally posted by LadyV
Laugh on.....I disagree

as would many here most likely! I also do not understand in any way, shape, or form all this, "he had to suffer our sins" nonsense!

It goes back to Adam and Eve, the whole eating from the wrong tree business. We sinned big time there, pissed God of alot and alot more afterwards aswell.

Originally posted by LadyV
Do you have proof that the bible came from god? NO you don't...just a belief....this poster has made some good valid questions!

If you believe in any religion you need to have faith. The Wiccan religion requires just as much faith as the Christian religion.

The Bible does not claim that it was sent down from god in its entirety. Instead, it claims to be written by both God and men, and written in a way that perfectly says whatever God wanted it to say. So the bible says what God intended.

2 Peter 1:19-21

Prophecy of Scripture

And we have the word of the prophets made more certain, and you will do well to pay attention to it, as to a light shining in a dark place, until the day dawns and the morning star rises in your hearts. Above all, you must understand that no prophecy of Scripture came about by the prophet's own interpretation. For prophecy never had its origin in the will of man, but men spoke from God as they were carried along by the Holy Spirit.

bible.gospelcom.net...

Which books?

The ones voted in or the ones voted out?


The bible was patched togather from dozens of different sources some were kept some were altered to fit the dogma of the time and some were droped.

It was put togather by commitee and has dozens of aurthers

Originally posted by infinite

It goes back to Adam and Eve, the whole eating from the wrong tree business. We sinned big time there, pissed God of alot and alot more afterwards aswell.

But being all knowing did he not create us to do just this?

Or was our actions a suprise?

You cannot have a fixed destiny from an all-powerful being and freewill at the same time, how could he know the future if we are free to change it?

How can we have freewill if our actions have been mapped out millions of years ago? whoops I forgot the universe is only 6000 years old

[edit on 1-8-2004 by Amuk]

Originally posted by infinite



It goes back to Adam and Eve, the whole eating from the wrong tree business. We sinned big time there, pissed God of alot and alot more afterwards aswell.

Still doesn't add up at all....A God knows all....A God would of known from the creation what was going to happen!

I did not post this to prove or disprove the existance of God. However, since this was posed, I want to query the fact that we are made in the image of God.

If this was the case, that means that God is us and we are God.

I hope it does not mean physically,'cause I've seen some pretty ugly human beings..

Seriously, if you check up, you can find out who the "real" writers of the bible are, and how their ancestors are still rewritng the "good book" today.

"Do unto others as you will have them do unto you"

Infinte

The trouble with using verses to prove the bible is you are using the words of a book to prove itself.

You could say the same about the letters to penthouse.....LOL

The bottom line is faith, you believe and I dont, neither of us can prove a thing

I think of greater concern is the number of translations and revisions the Bible has gone through to reach its current state. We have seen a number of corrections in recent years based on new translations, which indicates that the original translators weren't very well inspired by God to do proper translations. So how are we to believe that the original writers were inspired by God to write the proper words?

Yes, take the would "heaven"
the Old Testament �heaven� is translated from other words only five times in the following verses:
Psalms 68:4 it is translated from the Hebrew, arabah, � the desert �
77:18 the word is galgal, Hebrew for � wheel or whirlwind '
89:6 & 37 where it is translated from the word shachaq, Hebrew for � powder or thin vapor �.
Isaiah 5:30 heaven is translated from ariyph, Hebrew for � the sky �

The New Testament defines �heaven� from the Greek word �ouranos� meaning �the sky� in all but 7 instances :
Philippians 2:10 Greek epouranos, � above the sky, celestial �
Revelation 8:13, 14:6, 19:1, 11, 14, and 17 from the Greek word mesouranema, meaning mid-sky

The infrequency of the word �sky� in the Bible must also be looked at in the overall study of this concept. The words sky or skies only appear 11 times in all 66 books. The words for things that normally appear in the sky such as clouds, stars, whirlwinds, storms, lightning, birds, rain, hail and wind appear over 600 times. Heaven is the word the translators of the King James Bible in the early 1600's purposefully translated into the original words biblical authors used for the physical sky and not some ethereal plane. The King James Bible was translated for King James of England who lived in a royal castle, surrounded by royal people, all speaking a royal language; a very proper form of court English.The Court English employed entirely different words to describe things, thus,confusing the commoners as to the meaning of certain words. You was thee, raiment was clothing and sky was heaven. Therefore, in all but the above noted instances, the word heaven should be read as sky. Heaven is the sky and sky fits in every instance. Heaven is not the place with the 'pearly gates' or the 'streets of gold ' as the pulpit would have you believe. That is the new Jerusalem and is described in Revelation. Heaven is not said to be a reward for paying your tithes or a final destination for certain church members. Heaven is where God flies, the same place the birds fly. Heaven is where God lives because that is where his throne is and his throne flies. And if any more proof is needed just consider the inheritance of the beatitudes. "The meek shall inherit the Earth", not heaven. The heaven of the pulpit is a simplistic, human conceptualization not a Biblically based reality.

King James
Inspired by God or Greed?

If one can grasp the reality of the Bible's historical setting, then there is only one more hurdle to conquer. Although the term "dumbing-down" did not exist in the early 17th century, that is exactly the intent of King James when he undertook the project of translating the Bible and it was the inevitable result of that work. This infamous King of England cast a veil over the treasures in this ancient writing. The language he chose was not the common English of the day, but the obscure language of the royal court he commanded. He chose a language not only foreign to the common people, but one so simplistic that it was totally inadequate to properly render the languages it replaced. The competence of the translators was really of little importance considering the true agenda of this despotic, authoritarian and repressive monarch. He had only two goals. One was his desire to be a god-king by affirming the "divine right of kings" and the other was to eliminate the access of the common people to these works. To accomplish this end, he gave his hand picked supervisor of the project, the Bishop of London, strict dogmatic instruction and gave final approval to the book that bears his name. Had it not been what he wanted, it would never have been published. The result is a language nobody understands, numerous purposeful mistranslations and so many words added or deleted, the toll is incalculable. The fruit of his labor has held fast over four centuries. In the world of Bible-based religions, there are more denominations than books in the Bible, more sub-denominations than chapters and more pastoral schisms than verses.

Originally posted by Amuk
The bottom line is faith, you believe and I dont, neither of us can prove a thing

Exactly Amuk,
You either have faith or you don't. Simple.