It looks like you're using an Ad Blocker.

Please white-list or disable AboveTopSecret.com in your ad-blocking tool.

Thank you.

 

Some features of ATS will be disabled while you continue to use an ad-blocker.

 

My entire paranormal experience and Dream interpreter help?

page: 1
3
<<   2 >>

log in

join
share:

posted on Apr, 20 2011 @ 12:57 PM
link   
Since I am sick in bed with a bad cold I will take the time to type up my experience with ghosts and other paranormal stuff. Bare with me, I am on some cold medicine and may ramble a bit.

I lived in a haunted house for about 12 years. The house was really old and did not have a bathroom in it so one had to be built in.
My first experience I remember my mom put me upstairs to go to bed. I sat up in bed for a while just feeling scared for no reason and then eventually I left the room and sat at the bottom of the stairs. There was a wall there so my parents could not see me and still thought I was in bed. I remember looking at the top of the stairs and seeing someone standing there looking at me. It was very strange. It was a mans body with an animals head. I was so scared I really couldn't do anything but stare. Eventually I just took off and found my parents and told them what I saw, but they were too messed up to really take me seriously.

When I was a teenager and finally had my own room, I was given the room that had the door to the stairway leading to the attic. I would often hear footsteps on those stairs, all different hours of the day. I wasn't scared though, I would actually talk to whatever the hell it was saying "Please stop and go away you're bothering me" which is what I was told to do. I don't really know if it helped, but it made me feel better.

I've woken up to see someone standing by my bed once. They were not looking at me. I was not really scared for some reason.

One very specific memory that did scare me, was the time something flew across my room. Something hanging on one wall flew all the way across the room and hit the other wall. Directly in front of me. It was so fast I couldn't see it in the air, yet such a loud impact that you were sure thats how it got there as opposed to just disappearing. The object was a small 4x4 piece of clear plastic that I carved for my printing class.

Moving on...

My grandmother passed away 2 years ago. She was very dear to me. When she died, I would definitely say I was/am traumatized. I was the one who found her. For two weeks I didn't get much sleep because I was so scared and I don't know why. I've never had someone I loved die... never saw a dead body.. that is my guess. Two weeks after her death, for the first time I layed down for bed and fell asleep without a horrible thought or image in my head.. I didn't even think about my grandmother at all. Yet, there she was in my dream. This dream was VERY special... It was very different from my dreams. It was very vivid down to the very feel of breeze.

Here is my dream:

I'm standing on lawn, during the day, next to my mother. We're out by the mail box and there are several bags of trash in front of us. We say "what are we going to do with all of this?". Right away a red car pulls up and my grandmother gets out of the passenger seat. I don't know who is driving. My grandmother looks a little younger, not much though. She is carry mail in her hand. She walks up to my mother and hands her something that I don't know... then she turns to me and says "I only have one thing for ya" and she points at the sky right behind me with a smile on her face that expressed a happiness that I have truly never seen or witnessed before. I couldn't draw this facial expression and it has never been captured in a photograph. I'm telling you, this was not a happiness that anyone on this planet has experienced. I don't know how else to put it. I feel privileged to have ever witnessed this facial expression. Anyway, as i start to turn my head to look behind me i notice the gorgeous clear blue sky and the tips of the trees blowing in the light wind... and then I wake up. To this day I have no idea what she wanted to show me or what the one thing she had for me was.... but believe me or not, that was her and we were somewhere else. It wasn't just a mere dream I had because I was traumatized and missing her. I just want to know if anyone knows what I am talking about with this experience.

I went years without really experiencing anything paranormal. So much so that I almost forgot about my experiences. Recently I moved to PA and started working in a very old church. I mean this church is ancient. I worked there for a year and only one day did I really have a strange experience, but it was literally all day. I kept seeing different people that I knew were not there. One sitting at a table, one in the door way. Old fashion people. They were not there long.. but they were looking at me. I felt them looking at me before I saw them, actually.


I feel that, yes, there is something after death. It may not be what we're expecting but it's something.

Thoughts? Comments?



posted on Apr, 20 2011 @ 01:04 PM
link   
Can you recall what animal the man's head was?



posted on Apr, 20 2011 @ 01:21 PM
link   

Originally posted by Elvenhart
Can you recall what animal the man's head was?


Not really, I can still see it but I cant.

I want to say a mix of a dog, goat, bear. haha listen to me, i sound crazy

anyways it was clearly something that wasn't suppose to look friendly although he was standing there and only watching me not doing anything mean or saying anything.



posted on Apr, 20 2011 @ 02:02 PM
link   
reply to post by itaii
 


You have a gift I feel, being able to expirience these things is something remarkable in my opinion.

My mother always tells me when we dream of passed relatives it's a way of them telling us not to forget them; Do you still talk to your grandmother? If not that may be why she was in your dream, she wanted you to know that she is still with you, and her pointing to the beautiful blue sky, she may have wanted you to know (if you are religious) that she is living still happily in the heavens, which will explain her priceless expression.

Like I said before what you have is a girft, don't take it as a curse; I sometimes wish I could expirience things of this nature, I have just not as frequent as you, so it appears.

Our lives now are only temporary, the real life begins when we "pass"

S&F

keep on treking itaii
edit on 20-4-2011 by EL1A5 because: (no reason given)



posted on Apr, 20 2011 @ 02:09 PM
link   
reply to post by EL1A5
 


Thank you for your comment


I do talk to her, when I am in trouble and I need help.



posted on Apr, 20 2011 @ 02:12 PM
link   
It seems to me that when your personal energy is low, (sick, sad, stressed, etc) that you experience things. I know of other people like this, you're not alone.

Now your first experience of the man with the animal's head.. were you seeing clearly? Perhaps your perception was distorted? Did he always look like that when you saw him?
If he always looked like that I think a number of things.. #1) he was trying to scare you, sometimes things not-of-this-earth feed off energy, some positive, some negative, perhaps he needed you to be scared because of the energy. #2) Egyptian gods were known to have animal heads and human bodies, perhaps it was just what you saw.

When we are teenagers, we're 'out of whack' so to speak, body changes and hormonal levels are off balance during this time. Poltergeist activity has substantial evidence to suggest that it could be linked to the psychokenetic energy of a teen. in articles like this:


Adolescents (many anyway) are known for being emotionally high strung - but one does not need a troubled teen in the house to experience poltergeist activity. Whereas it's true that poltergeist phenomena seem to thrive in an emotionally charged environment,
Everything is spirit in some sense. Quantum physics has proven that all matter is trapped energy - hence spirit. Spirit manifestations tend to emanate from the mind - someone's mind, be it the mind of God, a teen, a toddler or any sentient being embodied or disembodied ... perhaps even animals.

According to the Wikipedia, the jury really is still out...


In parapsychology, Nandor Fodor proposed that poltergeist disturbances were caused by human agents suffering from some form of emotional stress or tension. William G. Roll studied 116 different poltergeist cases and found that the agents were often children or teenagers, and supposed that recurrent neuronal discharges resulting in epileptic symptoms may cause recurrent spontaneous psychokinesis (RSPK), which would affect the person's surroundings.[2][4][5][6][7] The case of the Rosenheim Poltergeist, where none of the disturbances could be explained via physical means, was suggested to be caused by psychokinetic forces.

But it really is worth looking into.

Now onto dream interpretation. In the case of the dream where you are standing in the lawn, the trash could indicate the "excess baggage" you had emotionally. It indicated unresolved issues, seeing your grandmother pull up leads me to think it was baggage involving her. The red car indicated feeling, or passion. I don't know you personally but it would seem that you were rather close to your grandmother. The letters may indicate that your grandmother's passing was unexpected news for your mother. The sky is a spiritual indication.. some say an indicator of a collective consciousness. It likely means that your grandmother wanted you to know that she was spiritually fulfilled, hence the look about her... but since she said that she had something for you and pointed to the sky, I would think that she was trying to get you to reevaluate your idea of spirituality.

Most natives believe that dreams are messages/lessons given to us by out ancestors. They take them seriously, and I think you should think about some of the deeper meaning of this dream. I don't know you personally so it's really up to you to decide what message your grandmother was trying to convey. I hope this helps

Good Luck and get better soon!



posted on Apr, 20 2011 @ 02:13 PM
link   

Originally posted by itaii
It wasn't just a mere dream I had because I was traumatized and missing her. I just want to know if anyone knows what I am talking about with this experience.

You know, some people say that when we start dreaming, we project some part of our mind/soul/energy body into the (lower) Astral Planes, the place where all the "angels," "demons," "enlightened beings," but also the souls of deceased human beings reside.

Maybe, your grandma came to visit you in your dream.
Maybe, the mere one thing she had for you was the feeling of pure happiness, love and light? I think that, even though you believe you missed what she had to share with you, you already received it.

Would be interesting to know if your mother, who was part of your dream, made a similar experience with your grandmother in one of here dreams.

Alternatively, it is also possible that your grandma was just a thought-form of your subconscious. Thought-forms are another entity that you will most likely meet in the Astral.


from this thread www.abovetopsecret.com...
Entities you might meet in the astral
The first type of entity in the astral is of course humans (well their astral bodies at least). The second type is the formally human.. in other words ghosts. The next type are the elementals. entity's consisting of pure forms of the four element. The elementals are: sylphs - air salamanders - fire gnomes - earth nymphs or undines - water. The Devas - Are the angels, ascended masters, perfected humans, enlightened ones, gods and goddesses they go by many names depending on the culture. The next group are the artificial entities. Thought-forms formed unconsciously.



posted on Apr, 20 2011 @ 02:14 PM
link   
reply to post by itaii
 


I'd like to point out that many psychopomps, that is, figures who act as guides to the deceased (Muut in Native American cultures, and the Grim Reaper in our own) and direct them to the afterlife have been depicted with animal heads. Muut specifically was a man with the head of an owl.

Looking at various possibilities, it could have been a half-awake dream. It also could have been a spirit taking on the form it wanted to. How close was this particular experience to your grandmother's death?



posted on Apr, 20 2011 @ 06:52 PM
link   
reply to post by Invariance
 


Thank you for all the the helpful information invariance! I could not get a feeling as to what the animal-headed man's intentions were. He did not have the egyptian god feel, though that was very good to bring up as a possibility.

I was seeing him fairly clearly and he only appeared to me once. I lived in that house for 12 years and only saw that specific figure once when I was really young.

As for my dream, I did think that what she had for me was spiritual or simply closure. But then I thought that maybe that wasn't the message. I feel like when I know, I'll know. Like, I'll actually feel it... but I could just be putting that into my head and missing the entire point.

As I am half sioux indian, I am aware of the traditions and beliefs of the general native americans. I've always found it fascinating how in-tune they are with nature and the dead.



posted on Apr, 20 2011 @ 06:58 PM
link   
reply to post by SunLightyear
 


Sunlight, I would like to think that I got what she was trying to tell me or share with me. I would like to feel like I did, also. Unfortunately, my mother and my uncle wanted a visit from her terribly but never recieved one. It was only me that she visited, until a year later when one of my other uncles saw her at the foot of his bed, months before he died.

No one has had a dream.
I have since had dreams of her but they were definitely just dreams and nothing like this particular encounter.

It felt like I was somewhere else.. the astral. But I've never been there so I don't know if I definitely was. It felt like a place she had made up and brought me to, to deliver the message.... that I sadly didn't understand.



posted on Apr, 20 2011 @ 07:03 PM
link   
reply to post by Elvenhart
 


I am half sioux indian and it would make sense for me to see this native american grim reaper, except this was well over 10 years before my grandmother death.

Although I will bring up, also, that my grandmother did not sleep for about 3 months before her death. I wouldn't call it sleep at least. She nodded out for a period of 10 minutes at a time and awoke screaming at HER mother, who was obviously dead. Everyday I would see her do this... nod off, quickly wake up yelling NO MOM! and then awake for 15 minutes, then repeat.

I believe her mother came to take her away. I believe that someone does come to you when you are about to die, so that you're not alone.

PS: sorry for my rambling, im all hyped up in dayquil and stuck in bed.



posted on Apr, 20 2011 @ 07:12 PM
link   
reply to post by itaii
 


It could easily be genetic then, too. Don't quote this as actual scientific prove, but I believe that some abilities and traits are passed on through heritage. My mom is pretty skilled writer, and I have some of that ability. Paranormal wise, I'm a natural empath. To drag away from me coming across as self-absorbed, and to pound in the point, the ability to talk to your grandmother through dreams may be an ingrained genetic trait you may have adopted through her via the parent who's side she belongs to.

That being said, I have a couple more questions. Which side is the Sioux blood coming from, and have you ever talked with the parent of that side about stuff like this? You'd be surprised to find out what ability they may have.



posted on Apr, 20 2011 @ 07:43 PM
link   
reply to post by Elvenhart
 

Well, my father is sioux indian and his family is on reservations.

The grandmother that passed away was on my mothers side is german and she did not believe in spirits, unfortunately. Although she has told me one very scary encounter she had in the house I grew up in... I will tell you but it is completely out there and might make me look like a liar or a weirdo...

My grandmother was sitting at the kitchen table across from my aunt... a figure came out of the ceiling and hovered over my aunts head. It took the shape of my mother (her daughter) and had "grey eyes". My grandmother said the figures mouth wasnt moving but it told her it was going to kill her. Of course that was YEARS before she actually died so I doubt it had anything to do with her death....

anyways, my aunt had to shake her out of her panic attack and even after witnessing that, she swore ghosts weren't real. lol crazy huh?

so obviously the house I lived in was haunted.. so maybe I don't have special abilities?? I don't know.



posted on Apr, 20 2011 @ 07:48 PM
link   

Originally posted by itaii
reply to post by Elvenhart
 


My grandmother was sitting at the kitchen table across from my aunt... a figure came out of the ceiling and hovered over my aunts head. It took the shape of my mother (her daughter) and had "grey eyes". My grandmother said the figures mouth wasnt moving but it told her it was going to kill her. Of course that was YEARS before she actually died so I doubt it had anything to do with her death....


Heavens, that sounds demonic almost. Hm, with your grandmother having so many experiences, she may have been sensitive to spirits. That may have passed on to you.

Sorry, I didn't analyze the dream though. I'm not very good at dream analysis. I do think it was probably a sign not to worry or grieve her at the time, because she achieved happiness. :]
edit on 20-4-2011 by Elvenhart because: (no reason given)



posted on Apr, 20 2011 @ 08:02 PM
link   
reply to post by Elvenhart
 


yeaaa.. I know it sounds pretty bad. I've been a little embarrassed to talk about that with anyone. Not many people I know are very open to the idea.

Thank you for trying to figure out the dream. Im sure she did achieve happiness, cancer took everything that she enjoyed from her and she had to live that way for a year.
edit on 20-4-2011 by itaii because: (no reason given)



posted on Apr, 20 2011 @ 11:07 PM
link   
In a world so full of uncertainty, I wouldn't rule anything out. My granny always said "Go with your gut, girl" .. It's advice that's never steered me wrong. At some point in the future everything will make sense, but for now take what meaning you can..



posted on Apr, 21 2011 @ 12:04 AM
link   
This will be the third time on the forums that we have made contact, but I'm not stalking you, I swear!



Your story sounds like many others I have heard since I began investigating the paranormal. I'd like to address your entire post, so this might get rather lengthy. Buckle up, sit down, light a cig (if that's your thing), get a hot cup of coffee or tea, and hang on.



I lived in a haunted house for about 12 years. The house was really old and did not have a bathroom in it so one had to be built in.
My first experience I remember my mom put me upstairs to go to bed. I sat up in bed for a while just feeling scared for no reason and then eventually I left the room and sat at the bottom of the stairs. There was a wall there so my parents could not see me and still thought I was in bed. I remember looking at the top of the stairs and seeing someone standing there looking at me. It was very strange. It was a mans body with an animals head. I was so scared I really couldn't do anything but stare. Eventually I just took off and found my parents and told them what I saw, but they were too messed up to really take me seriously.


After reading some of the responses from others, I am still not certain of what you might have seen. The first thing that came to my mind was something Egyptian related, but you already addressed that issue. Honestly, outside of an Egyptian figure related response, I have absolutely no clue what you might have seen. I have never encountered something like this in my investigations.


When I was a teenager and finally had my own room, I was given the room that had the door to the stairway leading to the attic. I would often hear footsteps on those stairs, all different hours of the day. I wasn't scared though, I would actually talk to whatever the hell it was saying "Please stop and go away you're bothering me" which is what I was told to do. I don't really know if it helped, but it made me feel better.


Old houses creak, but I also lived in a very paranormally charged house while I was in grad school. The same time every night there were footsteps up and down the attic stairs. The cat would go nuts, and I would get fed up. I finally brought my team in (and we had just assembled as a paranormal investigation firm), set up some cameras, recorders, etc., and tried to get some evidence. We never got anything on video, but the footsteps were clearly heard on the tape recordings. After "reasoning" with the spirit in this house, the footsteps stopped. I never did figure out who it was that was haunting that house.


I've woken up to see someone standing by my bed once. They were not looking at me. I was not really scared for some reason.


This has also happened to me in the past, and I also never felt any fear. I always attributed it to deceased relatives/spirit guides stopping in to check up on me. This phenomena started when I was around three to four years old and continued until I finished undergrad. It could have been just someone checking up on you.


One very specific memory that did scare me, was the time something flew across my room. Something hanging on one wall flew all the way across the room and hit the other wall. Directly in front of me. It was so fast I couldn't see it in the air, yet such a loud impact that you were sure thats how it got there as opposed to just disappearing. The object was a small 4x4 piece of clear plastic that I carved for my printing class.


This right here. I wanted to touch on this particular subject because I've read up on TK/poltergeist phenomena centered around young girls. Another poster gave you a lot of good info on the subject, and many of the things they posted are the things that I have read about. Something about hormonal changes in certain young women can cause limited bouts of telekinesis, all projected from the subconscious mind, of course. I've never had the luck to see something like this live, but I remember watching an Unsolved Mysteries show that talked about this young girl who was in a foster home. When she came into the home, the incidents started. They paranormal researchers that were eventually called in got, on camera and video, a blanket flying at the girl from the other end of the room, and a phone receiver coming off the hook and nailing the girl in the forehead. Apparently a few years after that incident, everything stopped, and as far as I know nothing happened ever again. The human mind/body can do some amazing things, and it wouldn't surprise me in the least if you were going through the exact same thing.




Here is my dream:

I'm standing on lawn, during the day, next to my mother. We're out by the mail box and there are several bags of trash in front of us. We say "what are we going to do with all of this?". Right away a red car pulls up and my grandmother gets out of the passenger seat. I don't know who is driving. My grandmother looks a little younger, not much though. She is carry mail in her hand. She walks up to my mother and hands her something that I don't know... then she turns to me and says "I only have one thing for ya" and she points at the sky right behind me with a smile on her face that expressed a happiness that I have truly never seen or witnessed before. I couldn't draw this facial expression and it has never been captured in a photograph. I'm telling you, this was not a happiness that anyone on this planet has experienced. I don't know how else to put it. I feel privileged to have ever witnessed this facial expression. Anyway, as i start to turn my head to look behind me i notice the gorgeous clear blue sky and the tips of the trees blowing in the light wind... and then I wake up. To this day I have no idea what she wanted to show me or what the one thing she had for me was.... but believe me or not, that was her and we were somewhere else. It wasn't just a mere dream I had because I was traumatized and missing her. I just want to know if anyone knows what I am talking about with this experience.


This dream brought a little tear to my eye, because it is very similar to the one I had when my grandmother passed. She was the family matriarch, a very gifted sensitive, and a very loving woman. For the first month or so after she passed, she would visit me on average three times a week. Always the same thing: she'd sit down at the foot of my bed (and I could feel her weight), smile at me, stand up and touch my forehead, and then walk toward the door, at which time she promptly faded away. It stopped happening, and then I had one last dream where I was in her living room and she was playing a hymn at her electric church organ. We had a conversation, about what I don't remember, but when I woke up the next day, I felt so refreshed. This was the day that my own "gifts" were fully awakened, and they haven't gone away since. Invariance did a fine job of interpreting your dream, almost exactly the way I would have, so I don't think I need to analyze further. What I will say, however, is that the dreamscape is sometimes the place where our deceased relatives will meet with us, in an effort to not scare the ever living snot out of us by appearing in full-bodied apparition form. I honestly think she was saying to let go of the pain, remember the good times, and to keep her memory in your heart. I'm sure you are doing all of those things though.



I went years without really experiencing anything paranormal. So much so that I almost forgot about my experiences. Recently I moved to PA and started working in a very old church. I mean this church is ancient. I worked there for a year and only one day did I really have a strange experience, but it was literally all day. I kept seeing different people that I knew were not there. One sitting at a table, one in the door way. Old fashion people. They were not there long.. but they were looking at me. I felt them looking at me before I saw them, actually.


Seeing incorporeal people in old places is not an abnormal occurrence in my opinion. Many very old buildings can absorb (according to some theories) the essence of people that had been there before. The castle ghosts of England, Scotland, and Ireland are all perfect examples. They may have been "looking" at you, but I have a feeling that they were just imprints from a time gone by.

The very act of seeing them tells me that at least, in some way, you have a bit of a "gift" yourself. Many people do have a sensitivity to the things that many cannot see with their own two eyes, and while I have still not come up with any conclusions about that, it's interesting to say the least. I'm still trying to explain my own gifts and make some sense of them. I've had to learn everything I know on my own, and with some help from some very close spiritual mentors. While these things run in my family, I am the strongest with these gifts by far. If anything else, you have a very neat little "trick" that you can use any way you choose. I personally wouldn't recommend actively seeking out things to "see" but that's just from my own personal experiences.



I feel that, yes, there is something after death. It may not be what we're expecting but it's something.


Yup. Life is only one step in a much larger journey. As I tell many of my friends time and time again, death is the next great adventure.


Thanks for posting your experiences! I found them all very fascinating!






Peace be with you.

-truthseeker



posted on Apr, 21 2011 @ 01:45 AM
link   
reply to post by itaii
 


To me it would seem as if your grandmother was pointing to a place beyond this reality. I had a profound experience once while meditating, that may be similar to the happiness you saw in your grandmother. The best way for me to explain my meditation was that i was shown the way and allowed to enter or merge with, for the lack of better words, everything. It was just the most intense pure light I could have sensed and it felt like I had gone home from a long vacation or had gotten to where i belong. Sorry for the rant. Hope I could help.



posted on Apr, 21 2011 @ 02:41 AM
link   
I think you are right on to treasure the dream of your Grandmother and see happiness in it rather than sadness

I lost my younger sister about 7 years ago, she was 18. The circumstances around her death were sketchy and unpleasant. It was the worst experience I or my family have ever had to endure. 2 days after she died I went to bed as normal and think I fell right to sleep from emotional exhaustion. In my 'dream' My sister was knocking on my door but she didnt look exactly like herself, she had a sinister look that caught me off guard and the shape of her head was not quite right. She kept trying to coax me to come with her or to let her in. For some reason I adamantly refused both. I remember feeling this pain with each word I spoke not agreeing to in some way be with her but I knew I just couldn't. This replayed several times each being in a different neighborhood. All were dark and dirty like really bad slums. Then I don't remember what I said to her but she accepted that I wouldn't do what she wanted and didn;t want to see her. I rememberd crying and wishing that I could just hold her and be ok. Then she, looking strange. smiled at me and said "ok sissy" just like normal and smiled at me then walked away.
The next thing I remember I was laying on my bed in my childhood bedroom and she walked in looking totally normal, like herself and I grabbed my pilloiw and laid down on the floor next to her and we just talked as if everything was normal again.

When I woke up the next morning I had an overwealming feeling of peace and happiness but I was on the floor in front of my dresser across the room as it was in my old bedroom with my pillow but a different pillowcase was on it, it was an old one my sister made in home ec and given me for christmas the last year she was at home. My husband was a little weirded out because I had always been the soundest , hardest sleeeping person around. Never in my life have I had any episodes of sleepwalking, talking or anything of the sort. But he said I was talking all night, crying and getting up.

Since then I have not had a full night's sleep but a handfull of times. I can't stay asleep. BUT I regularly have dreams in which my sister is just hanging out with me at my house and we talk and talk and it's like another reality but so peaceful and happy. We even say our loving good byes before I wake up and she welcomes me back as if I'd gone to the bathroom or something.

I don't know if I'm really just dreaming it or if she is visiting me. Anyway, I look forward to and feel so happy after I see her at night. I also see my Grandpa who just died a little over a year ago but I rarely get to talk to him, just see him at whatever he may be doing I don't remember but he acknoledges that I'm there and I feel his love. Same thing I don't know if I've just cracked or what whatever it is I will take it and I feel blessed.



posted on Apr, 21 2011 @ 06:55 AM
link   
reply to post by Invariance
 


You know, that is the best advice you can give someone. It's strange but everytime I've went against my gut feeling I've ended up in a horrible mess. That's something, I believe, we all have.. our gut feelings that wont steer us wrong.




top topics



 
3
<<   2 >>

log in

join