Life inside black holes? Awesome theory...

If this is a duplicate I apologize, but my phone is having issues with the search option and I found this very interesting.

I've always believed this since I was little, at least the part about life existing in black holes, I'm glad to see a well formed respected theory.

news.discovery.com... Could Life Survive Inside a Black Hole? April 13, 2011 12:13:00 PM Planets and maybe even advanced life could theoretically exist inside a black hole, according to a new theory. The idea by physicist Professor Vyacheslav Dokuchaev from the Russian Academy of Sciences, Moscow appears to go against the common belief that black holes are giant gravity wells gobbling up anything that gets too close. In a paper written for the journal Journal of Cosmology and Astroparticle Physics and appearing on the pre-press website arXiv.org, Dokuchaev follows on from previous theories that subatomic particles such as photons can have stable orbits inside the internal structure of some black holes. He says supermassive black holes at the center of galaxies could allow particles, and perhaps even planets with life, to orbit the singularity without being destroyed. The singularity is located at the heart of a black hole, and is the place where the laws of physics and space-time break down. It's surrounded by the event horizon, a region beyond which objects need to travel faster than the speed of light to escape the black hole. Because nothing can theoretically travel faster than the speed of light, nothing escapes once it's passed the event horizon. In his paper, Dokuchaev studies hypothetical orbits in the area between the event horizon and the singularity to understand their dynamics. He says while conventional orbits wouldn't be possible, there are some places where particles and planets could have stable though unusual spiral orbits. Dokuchaev calculates, such a planet would be brightly illuminated by the singularity and by photons trapped in the same orbit. "This planet might even support a complex chemistry rich enough to allow life to evolve", says Dokuchaev. "Advanced civilizations may live safely inside the black hole without being visible from the outside". Dokuchaev admits such a civilization would have to cope with extraordinary conditions including huge tidal forces and massive energy densities as photons become trapped. And he admits there's also the problem of causality violations, where the rules of space-time don't apply. Astronomer Dr David Floyd from the Australian Astronomical Observatory and the University of Melbourne says even if the theory is correct, it would be impossible to know what is occurring beyond the event horizon of a black hole. "At this point - and perhaps forever - we're restricted to making untestable assertions," says Floyd. "As far as we know, matter would go into free fall, that is, it would all fall into this tiny infinitesimal point at the centre which forms the singularity." Floyd says the paper one shortcoming of the paper is that it assumes radiation has no impact on orbits inside the black hole. "It wouldn't take much to produce drag which would slow down the orbits described in Dokuchaev paper, causing them to collapse onto the singularity". But Floyd admits it opens up some interesting philosophical questions. "Given the number of black holes in the universe - lots - one might infer that life is inevitable inside at least one of them if there really are stable orbits," he says. "Maybe there are entire universes inside black holes." Sent from my iPhone

reply to post by sparda4355


This guy is about a 1/3 of the way there... At least he has an open mind.

reply to post by Americanist


1/3 of the way to a legit theory? What do you mean?

I suspect that, even for a supermassive black hole, spaghettification/tidal forces would still be extreme enough to proclude the existence of life inside the event horizon.

We could also postulate the existence of life within stars or as organisations of matter within clouds of diffuse gas in space. Either way, we would not neccessarily identify them as "life" due to the differences to what we already know, but it is interesting to play with these ideas.

What about organisms that live on timescales that would appear static to us, or that we would appear static to them?

reply to post by chr0naut


Well considering until a very very short time ago we assumed all lifeforms to be carbon based and we now know of an arsenic based lifeform, I don't think it's that far of a stretch to think other types of lifeforms exist. But I do see your point, there isn't much proof... I just like the theory and how he came to it.

Originally posted by sparda4355
reply to post by chr0naut

 

Well considering until a very very short time ago we assumed all lifeforms to be carbon based and we now know of an arsenic based lifeform...

Could you point me in the direction of that story please?

I remember a few claims made based on arsenic and phosphorous being used as food for particular cells but I also remember these not standing up to much scrutiny. If it's accepted as fact now I'd like to read why.

Thanks in advance.

-m0r

reply to post by m0r1arty


I'm sorry, I should have used the word "potentially". It's not accepted as fact, But not many things are... There is a lot of scientific data that backs it up. And although disputed, it doesn't sway my opinion. I like what I've read and always snicker at the fact that at one time Columbus was ridiculed for believing the earth was round.

Of course Nassim Haramein say's that we already live in a Black Hole, that's why when we look out to space it's all black!!!

"The Heechee do not appear until book three in the series where the reason for their absence is explained. Some 500,000 years earlier, the Heechee were active in discovering the galaxy, including an Australopithecine-inhabited Earth (where a sampling of the creatures were extracted and left to propagate to modern time on a Heechee station). The Heechee found out that there was a race of pure energy called simply The Foe (or alternatively called either The Assassins or The Kugel) wiping out civilizations on any planet where they emerged. The inherently cautious Heechee retreated to the interior of the black hole in the Galactic Core hoping to avoid being destroyed. Due to time dilation, only a few hundred years have passed in the interior of the black hole since the Heechee left the universe. After going into hiding, Heechee scout ships are periodically sent outside the black hole to check on developments through the universe in general and the emerging Earth in particular."

it's been done and been there.

really great read.

check it out.

Originally posted by m0r1arty

Originally posted by sparda4355
reply to post by chr0naut

 

Well considering until a very very short time ago we assumed all lifeforms to be carbon based and we now know of an arsenic based lifeform...

Could you point me in the direction of that story please?

I remember a few claims made based on arsenic and phosphorous being used as food for particular cells but I also remember these not standing up to much scrutiny. If it's accepted as fact now I'd like to read why.

Thanks in advance.

-m0r

I believe what Sparda was talking about was the discovery of a bacteria living in a dry lake bed in California. The content of arsenic left over in the remaining mineral salts should have been enough to sterilise any life-form from the mud but in this incredibly extreme environment, life had once again adapted and survived. The bacteria, while not exactly arsenic based, was surviving and may even have begun to make use of some arsenic chemistry.

Link to the NASA Astrobiology site regarding this is down but there is this link on Wikipeda regarding it.