Help me wrap my head around this

So, I am a believer that we are all immortal souls. I have no evidence or anything like that, I just feel that this is how it's always been. I feel that we are continually reincarnated in another human form. Although I was raised to be Christian, I have in the last couple years lost my faith in the God of Christianity. I do believe in the possibility of there being some Creator of the cosmos, but there is no way he's just some guy that looks like a human being, and that he just said "let there be light," yada yada yada.

I imagine that when we die, our soul goes to some sort of "heaven", where we get to kick it with our lost loved ones, whilst waiting for the rest of our loved ones to join in the party. I like to think that there is no permanent "hell" for people that do bad, and that they just get some sort of punishment to equalize whatever it is that they did in life. Even the worst of the worst, I would like to think are forgiven after they truly realize the evil of their ways.

These are just my beliefs. I'm not looking for any religious or atheist fanaticals to come here and rip on me for my beliefs. Like I said, this just feels right to me. What I would like is an honest discussion on the matter.

The part that I'm having a hard time grasping though, is that if we are immortal, and we go to this "heaven" scenario, why would we choose to come back and live another human life? Say you're at peace and have the option to either spend eternity with your family, friends, and significant other, or you get to come back to earth and completely forget all the people you loved in the past life. Plus there's the all too likely scenario that you are born into a less than traditional family, and get to live in poverty, or die when you're a baby, or experience any other crappy ways of life. Who would decide while they're happy and spending eternity with loved ones, "you know what, I think I'll go into this woman's womb who lives in an impoverished country, and see how that turns out."

If anyone has any thoughts on this matter, I would like to hear them. I listen to anything with an open mind, and if someone makes a good point, it could help me out in my never ending quest for finding out the answers to life's biggest questions.

I think you could be right about us being immortal souls and there being a heaven that we get to hang out in afterwards. The thing with reincarnation may be right also but with reincarnation I think our souls just have to come back to earth to help learn more things. What I mean by learn more things is that you have to reach your highest potential in order to hang out in heaven forever. Lets say a woman has an abortion in this life, well in the next life she may be the baby that gets aborted in the next one to learn the pain that the baby had to go through with not being able to learn what it was meant to learn in its lifetime. I'm no expert on this stuff and could be totally wrong but it's just an idea.

I never understood the whole immortal soul thing because what happens is that the population of the Earth keeps increasing.

If this was the case with immortal souls, then where do all the extra souls come from?

Originally posted by Michelangelo
So, I am a believer that we are all immortal souls. I have no evidence or anything like that, I just feel that this is how it's always been. I feel that we are continually reincarnated in another human form. Although I was raised to be Christian, I have in the last couple years lost my faith in the God of Christianity. I do believe in the possibility of there being some Creator of the cosmos, but there is no way he's just some guy that looks like a human being, and that he just said "let there be light," yada yada yada.

I imagine that when we die, our soul goes to some sort of "heaven", where we get to kick it with our lost loved ones, whilst waiting for the rest of our loved ones to join in the party. I like to think that there is no permanent "hell" for people that do bad, and that they just get some sort of punishment to equalize whatever it is that they did in life. Even the worst of the worst, I would like to think are forgiven after they truly realize the evil of their ways.

These are just my beliefs. I'm not looking for any religious or atheist fanaticals to come here and rip on me for my beliefs. Like I said, this just feels right to me. What I would like is an honest discussion on the matter.

The part that I'm having a hard time grasping though, is that if we are immortal, and we go to this "heaven" scenario, why would we choose to come back and live another human life? Say you're at peace and have the option to either spend eternity with your family, friends, and significant other, or you get to come back to earth and completely forget all the people you loved in the past life. Plus there's the all too likely scenario that you are born into a less than traditional family, and get to live in poverty, or die when you're a baby, or experience any other crappy ways of life. Who would decide while they're happy and spending eternity with loved ones, "you know what, I think I'll go into this woman's womb who lives in an impoverished country, and see how that turns out."

If anyone has any thoughts on this matter, I would like to hear them. I listen to anything with an open mind, and if someone makes a good point, it could help me out in my never ending quest for finding out the answers to life's biggest questions.

It is a journey to become aware of ones self, just like God in fact is experiencing via all of us.

In that process you create journeys for new souls , in which they will become a part of you and you will be a part of them. We are created to be gods ourselves but at the pace and the path that we choose
ourselves.But without the space to create(female, receptive, dark, the whomb principle) and experience ourselves we can`t reach our full potential.

Well, there are a lot of topics mixed up in the opening post,
but as to the reincarnation thing . . .

I've always had an objection to that.

If Reincarnation were true,
would babies be born potty trained by now?


David Grouchy

This is my personal belief.

Scientifically speaking Energy does not die,it can not be destroyed, and it can not be altered. By mixing, adding or separating different energies you get different outcomes, but the base energy remains the same. Just like water. Slowing down the energy vibration creates a solid, normal vibration is liquid, and speeding it up makes a gas. It is still the effects of hydrogen and oxygen being combined. Everything is made of energy. This energy is part of the whole that makes up matter and physical life. The combination of these energies creates life, as accepted, and the more complex combination's create consciousness.

As my theory/belief is that energy in any form is conscious in some form or another, a soul is created and develops as it goes through the stages of matter. As a rock it begins, as a Plant it develops, as an animal it becomes aware, and as human it becomes SELF conscious. Further development releases the need for a physical body and moves on to the non physical realms of reality. Always a forward movement toward the ONE fully conscious Universe.

As self aware and conscious we(humans) have a set of lessons we must understand to move forward and those lessons must be learned or we return to Fully Understand. Once this is reached it becomes choice. Some move on and join the universal ONE for the next level of understanding, however some souls return in order to help teach the lessons to those still in the cycle of understanding. Our shock and awe of physical reality causes us to "forget" that we have learned or experienced those lessons before, However our souls Still have the agenda they had when they chose to return. These people are "awake". With each lesson we learn and understand our souls vibrational frequency goes up bringing us closer to "Ascension" or moving to the next level of Understanding the ONE.

A very good(IMO) book that shows this process is "Jonathan Livingston Seagull" by Richard Bach. It is a quick 20 to 30 minute read and is very insightful I suggest reading it. Here is a pdf link. img1.liveinternet.ru...

reply to post by Michelangelo


Read some of this authors works
www.abovetopsecret.com...

Good Luck

reply to post by Ophiuchus 13

It is an interesting thread and topic description as are a few of the other threads that person made unfortunately that poster has been banned for some reason as well as a few others that posted replies. I am not going presume as to why. I have not come across anyone who was banned in my short time on ATS but I think it strange that there are multiple people banned in the same thread.

The soul is immortal. It is the spark from the Great Flame.
Think of earth incarnations as progression through schooling - except this schooling is directed by your own concept of what you need to learn. Hence the different experiences individual souls 'choose' to pursue. Yes, i said choose!
Always remember our birthright, the gift of free will. A natural gift and loving addition to the little sparks.
When we are not in the earth experience, domain, plane, dimension - we have an overview of what we have learned, and what we should learn. The conditions for this learning could be severe or gentle, depending on our choice in the non-material plane (whatever you want to call it).
Remembering why we are born into a particular incarnation is almost a no brainer. Some individuals do remember (but this is another topic).
The best way to envisage the reason why the memory is suppressed, is to think of the way you feel playing a video game in which it is easy to die and be respawned. Just that realisation alone could make you somewhat complacent to 'get on with the job'. Memory is supresses so all your attention is focused on the lesson/s to be learned, without the 'out' of respawn.
...until such a time as you can take charge of the complacency, memories of anything beforehand will be supressed...unless you are, for instance, hypnotised and regressed.
Very few people remeber thier birth...does this mean it did not happen?
Very few people remember the things they did or said 5 minutes ago...

Little sparks that are whisked away while still in the womb, or are taken in infancy or youth...are not prepared for the incarnation they chose (yes, we have overseers determining some sort of direction and advising us...call them what you will...they are there with you all the time)...the little sparks have aimed too high, so to speak.
Cheers

Here's an easy-to-read-reply: Short and sweet---and hopefully illuminating:

Life in the physical is a challenging and engaging process. We take for granted what it it's like to smell roses, run our hands through sand, or be touched by someone we love. In "heaven" there is no solid form. It's a place where all is perfect....and after a time...

the soul longs to be back in the physical.

It is a place that is difficult, yes, but those challenges equate to so much learning.

There isn't a whole lot of challenge in "heaven," right? How does a soul grow and mature?

We grow as souls and learn the most in the physical form, experiencing life in a myriad of circumstances and situations.

Our goal as a soul is to reach perfection and become ONE with God (or whatever you choose to call God)---but that's hard to do when you you're hanging out on clouds and playing the harp..... (to put it very simplistically.)

It is impossible to know the answer to life. There are many explantions. The most plausible one is evolution. There are things we will never understand as to how they are created like ghosts, poltergesits, that sort of thing etc etc.

I think there is a chance that there is some sort of god and if there is/was they created the universe (big bang) and not our planet personally. When you look at science it explains a lot of things and i am realy surprised that people still believe in religion.

reply to post by Michelangelo


Have you looked into the Edgar Cayce Readings? They have reincarnation... life between "lives" this system.... God, Jesus on and on..... You might find them interesting, from what you've posted here.

reply to post by Michelangelo


Reincarnation is thought to be a multiple step process. Many feel the ultimate goal is to attain complete enlightenment; nirvana. There is much to be learned, and as we are of free will we may impede our progress by trial or error.

The time one spends in this plane, right here right now, is fleeting and limited. Because of the impurities mankind has tainted his environment with we do not live long. We all know that which lives, dies.

I do not believe we have domain or choice over time we are not 'in the flesh'. Catholicism promotes the afterlife of heaven and hell, implying that a life well lived will be rewarded by reunion with faithful loved ones that have passed on before us. Reincarnation is not a tenet of Catholicism as it is found in Eastern / Occidental faiths. I feel that you may be feeling turmoil or uncertainty with some things you are mulling over because you are attempting to arrange your beliefs by choosing something from Column A, Column B and so on.

It is my understanding that ones transition towards nirvana will include servitude to benefit others. To explain, you may find yourself living a life of poverty and need. The lesson may not be for your benefit, but for some other who has to observe you or is affected somehow by your presence in their life. This is part of the give and take, the yin and yan.

Years ago I arrived at a conclusion that those in our life who we perceive to be of greatest need are actually very far evolved toward perfection. The greater the handicap, disability or affliction, the stronger the soul. Their entire lives repeatedly serve as lessons for others, for good or bad. I began to strongly believe that those in need were angelic warriors.

These days I've come to realize the major religions of the world are another form of politics, of manipulation. I'm now aware that I was indoctrinated into the religious beliefs that my mother experienced and accepted without question. I too followed blindly for many years. When I learned of the awesome wealth and treasure stored away in Vatican City I was dismayed. The faithful are supposed to believe this is Gods treasure on earth. Isn't that a kick in the crotch?

I've seen several TV broadcast documentaries on the atrocities the Catholic church has been responsible for. Years of torture, murder, manipulation, imprisonment. Incredibly vile behavior. The past recent years revealing incredible cover-ups of child molestation across the USA and abroad. It is more than I can bear.

My personal spirituality is bumped and bruised. I've grown old and cold. I use to feel religion was an important part of personal development and family structure, that it represented good things. Now I feel that no one should have that kind of power over another. I fear that religions have done far more damage than good.

The part that I'm having a hard time grasping though, is that if we are immortal, and we go to this "heaven" scenario, why would we choose to come back and live another human life?

The answer is much more simple than you'll believe...

It's because being godlike is BORING...

That's right. Sure, Heaven sounds good on paper, but can you REALLY imagine each day being the same, no challenges, no rewards, no struggle, no new experiences?

We simply aren't engineered that way... We thrive on challenge and conflict, and eventually, we'll run right back to it, just as we pick up a video game we completed, but now want to try and do differently.