Republican bill would halt 'unauthorized' U.S. strikes in Libya

Originally posted by Bordon81
reply to post by ProtoplasmicTraveler

 

You would think that with the US debt ceiling situation they might try something else other than pumping more hype and resources into the military complex. Of course that didn't stop the military complex during WW1 and 2. The cost of those wars went way above the realized benefits. Is military action really the only way the world can get out of recession? Granted munitions and bombs don't seem like a constructive solution to anything, yet somehow these wars bring nations together get everyone marching to the same band and stimulate the world economy.

The truth is we are still paying the War Debts of World War II, the Nation has been in Chapter 11 Bankruptcy with select congressment appointed as trustees since the Great Depression.

We have been in debt since our founding, and actually still make regular payments on some colonial era obligations to European Banks and investors in the Stock and Bond investments made in early pre-revolutionary and post-revolutionary America.

It is those same Bankers and their sister Oil Corporations and Military Industrial Corporations that simply drive this whole process through the leverage that they have created through loans, the control of vital resources, the ownership of vital infrastructure and a relentless thirst to expand the same into nation after nation.

They simply sell it to us, and make us subsidize the cost through taxation and labor to that end as somehow making the world a safer and freer place.

Safer for them to keep dictating the rules and pace of evolution and overall quallity of life, freer for them to exercise unlimited control.

reply to post by ProtoplasmicTraveler


Yeah I remember that thread. That is plausable too, imagine a few thousand fake personas stiring around the rage, emboldened by what they think is 20 thousand strong angry people turns out to be less than half, because a bunch of personas were not real people at all...

They start getting their asses handed to them, all the world is suddenly involved, trying to help the "good guys"....

Obama is said to have been in a secret deal to overthrew Gaddafi. Gawker has the story.

reply to post by PsykoOps


Yes nothing says democracy like 'secret deal'!

I think the funniest part of all this is the video of Biden, describing exactly what Obama did here in a video and calling for impeachment is making the rounds. It was about Bush, but now Biden will look like a total idiot if he does not call for Obama's impeachment. Words do come back to haunt people.

But then, that would make him President. I'd better shut up

reply to post by Blaine91555


You know I don't care who is President, but I don't want a government where 30% of the defense budget is tied to secret projects and missions no one in congress or the public knows about and a 100% of the intelligence budget is tied to secret projects and missions no one in congress or the public knows about, and a handful of people in government like the President, Secretary of State, Secrretary of Defense and the Head of the CIA making backroom deals that no one in Congress or the public knows about.

Sadly the only consistent thing about our government is the constant secrecy, the double talk, and the endless war.

is this a little too late? I thought the government extended vacation is coming...

Originally posted by ProtoplasmicTraveler
reply to post by Blaine91555

 

You know I don't care who is President, but I don't want a government where 30% of the defense budget is tied to secret projects and missions no one in congress or the public knows about and a 100% of the intelligence budget is tied to secret projects and missions no one in congress or the public knows about, and a handful of people in government like the President, Secretary of State, Secrretary of Defense and the Head of the CIA making backroom deals that no one in Congress or the public knows about.

Sadly the only consistent thing about our government is the constant secrecy, the double talk, and the endless war.

You know, I don't always completely agree with what you say, Proto, but this I have to side with. I have said this twice within the week.

This is a horrible situation. I don't agree with our country's attacks on Libya or the President's decision to attack, frankly I believe he has broken his oath to uphold the Constitution. Now, to make matters worse he has signed "a secret deal" to aid these "rebels" and government spokesmen refuse to give the public information on what's going on because it has to do with the CIA. Back in '01, what was it, $2.1 trillion that auditors discovered missing from the D.o.D., right before 9/11? I'd like to see how many resources have been dedicated to our shadow government.

Talk about adding insult to injury.

reply to post by Konah

You know, I don't always completely agree with what you say, Proto, but this I have to side with. I have said this twice within the week.

That's just crazy talk, I know for a fact everyone agrees with me all the time. it's just that it's so darn embarassing people feel compelled to pretend not to!

Just kidding!

I know I have very strong views but I also have a very strong belief the situation is bad, and that it needs to be corrected from the bottom up by people like you and me and all of us being honest with our selves about what's going on, what's wrong, that we don't like it and approve, and that it needs to change, in an ongoing exchange of information and grassroots investigation meant to counter the constant stream of propaganda, and distortions and omissions from the government and the media.

There are a whole lot more of us than them, and when enough of us talk, and keep on these issues, sooner or later momentum is going to be on our side, because truth is on our side.

We aren't the ones lying, we aren't the idiots those in corporate and government and media positions of power and control believe us to be and try to make us out to be, and what's more important we are the ones who are paying for all this and having our collective names and reputations destroyed and sullied.

We need to show we aren't the lethargic complacent lazy idiots that don't care that they assume us to be, or the easily confused or put off vassals that they want us to be and start giving them what for.

I get cranky too when woken from a sound slumber and a lot of Americans are going to be irate as they are challenged to wake up to the truth and take some real responsiblity for a change, but hey, no one said life would always be easy or fun.

We have to try, and we have to stop accepting excuses for not doing so.

Thanks my friend.

Originally posted by razrburn
is this a little too late? I thought the government extended vacation is coming...

It's never too late.

Never give up, never stop trying, never surrender!

It ain't over until the fat lady sings!

The War Powers Act wasn't enacted and passed until 1973 by Congress (article 1 section 8), in order to limit the power of the President. The ironic thing is that the same bill gives the President the power, alone, to launch a nuclear attack. Technically, Obama hasn't violated any part of the U.S Constitution in utilizing missile attacks in Libya. I am not saying I support the action, but technically under the definition of the WAR Powers Act. Maybe the U.S. Supreme Court should review the constitutionality of the Act. I also find it interesting to note that I have not seen one member of Congress willing to introduce a bill to modify the amendment. Isn't the job of Congress to modify and ratify amendments to the Constitution? I think the failure doesn't lie with the President, it lies with the people in Congress. Just thought I would provide an alternative thought to the discussion.

Has anyone stopped to think that Obama is using the air campaign to cover up for the botched revolution.

Kinda like using one lie to cover for another lie.

reply to post by fatboyinternational


It's a real possibility but the history of Iraq and the no fly zone there, is one bound to surely repeat itself, first it's a no fly zone, the endless propaganda against the unwanted leader, sanctions, and then there will be tales of weapons of mass destruction and Gadafi wanting to get even with the West, eventually followed by an invasion, to install Libyan Americans who into the head of a new government propped up by the US Military who will then fight an endless insurgency of the locals rebelling against the invasion and imposition of the government that it sets up.

It's a formula they have used before, got away with, and will no doubt attempt to use again, because they got away with it the first time.

If we could be fooled once, conventional wisdom is we can be fooled again.

Where we erred is not holding the politicians and intelligence officials and military commanders who lied to us the first time, even though we do know they lied about and manufactured the intelligence.

So they will not have any fear of doing it again, and as long as the government can play upon religious fears and a sustainable number of religious Americans who fear and or dislike Islam will support the aggression, any aggression aimed at Islam then you have enough of a power base to ward of in theory the abuse of the truth and the American people, and those abroad yet again.

Wiki

I see Obama's has changed his tune.

That’s what I’m opposed to. A dumb war. A rash war. A war based not on reason but on passion, not on principle but on politics
Now let me be clear — I suffer no illusions about Saddam Hussein. He is a brutal man. A ruthless man. A man who butchers his own people to secure his own power. He has repeatedly defied UN resolutions, thwarted UN inspection teams, developed chemical and biological weapons, and coveted nuclear capacity.

He’s a bad guy. The world, and the Iraqi people, would be better off without him.

But I also know that Saddam poses no imminent and direct threat to the United States, or to his neighbors, that the Iraqi economy is in shambles, that the Iraqi military a fraction of its former strength, and that in concert with the international community he can be contained until, in the way of all petty dictators, he falls away into the dustbin of history
.

reply to post by ProtoplasmicTraveler


That was a brilliant video protoplasmic traveler!!!! I watched it and was amazed at the insight in layman terms. The film in its entirety is a must for all to see.

Originally posted by agentblue
reply to post by ProtoplasmicTraveler

 

That was a brilliant video protoplasmic traveler!!!! I watched it and was amazed at the insight in layman terms. The film in its entirety is a must for all to see.

Glad to hear you found/made the time to watch it, it truly is a must see for people looking into better understanding the problems and challenges that confront us, as he clearly outlines each aspect in clear, simple precise terms, that really do sum it all up in both insightful and truly disturbing ways.

I was very impressed by the depth of the man's knowledge from history, to finance, to military affairs, the intelligence departments, the bankers, and the political process.

It would be a mistake not to find the time to watch that video!

Thanks for sharing your take on it.

Oh thats Rich.
The Repubs who couldnt wait too sink their teeth into Iraq and save the people(no 911 terrorists there btw)
and generally are pro military and war approving dont like what about this Libya action?
Is it that a Black Dem President is Helping perceived Muslims and fulfilling a Nato request.
Bush took us too a total war and on the Wrong guys lolz...
Obama hasnt mobilized but a fraction of whats needed ina Total war.
More BS from the Tea Party side. If a Black pres does it its wrong but if a Bush did it well hey its saving the Iraqis from Sadam......
Crap is Crap.
Sorry folks but this Pres is For the People and By the People and thats what makes things so Unfair for the Tea Party folks or should I say Top 10% wage earners?
Go Obama Go!

Originally posted by ImplausibleDeniability


But it seems to me that action is being taken based on a sense of moral obligation here. I am sure you would join me in castigating the firefighter who watches a house burn because it's 10 yards outside his jurisdiction...

Oh can I count the number of ways this is wrong.

I just started reading but got to this comment and started having a panic attack and had to respond.

First and foremost the letter of the LAW is very important, because what we see that we believe is law are actually acts and codes.
They only reason that the POTUS can unilaterally move for a short period of time revolves around the Supremacy Clause in the US Constitution that states that Our Corporation.... I mean country must adhere to all international treaties regardless if they supercede LAW.

Those are all very important words, because it is impossible to supercede LAW, but that is exactly what is happening.
Article 1 section 8 of the Constitution FORBIDS the POTUS' actions, explicity.

More legal magic from the creations of the court esquire magicians, semantic interpretations that were a slippery slope leading for more and more power to the executive branch.
And that is what you are unknowingly supporting.

Your moral argument is an appeal to emotion.
That is all. It is based upon NO rational objective reason, other than the fact that YOU think that it's wrong.

Your form of reasoning holds no merit.

That is why the founding fathers were AGAINST a democracy. They wanted the most enlightened men of their day to run the government, not the most paid for men of their day like we have today, but the MOST LEARNED.
The ones who understood that we have an enemy that does not sleep and rests in the shadows.
One so frightening that even men of power dare not speak its name.

They understood that the mass populace lacked the education to truly understand their insidious enemy and the means to combat that enemy.

They were afraid of the tyranny of the masses. The very same masses that they had sworn to protect.

so what is it? repubicans want obama to do something in libya, then do a full about and condem him for doing it? LOL! I thought dems were whacky,seems repubs are spinning for the election.They're all corrupt arsehats. And the main reason i stopped voting many years ago.both sides are whack jobs.

It's everyday and this (well I'll try and be civil) president (small p on purpose) and by the way .... still can't produce a birth certificate .... I mean you know one of those real ones like I have and our supreme court (small letters again on purpose) looked the other way. Now our supreme leader is again writing exe orders that will be obeyed.

"Yes we can" bomb Libya while congress cows to this clown (only my opinion) .... so please no one have a heart attack ... What has this white dirt house done that hasn"t be illegal and up your a**.. Next election I'm voting for planet X .... then maybe things will get back to normal ....