Ranting, The Origins of Phi & Pythagoras

General Thoughts

I haven't been active on ATS recently, however my spiritual and intellectual pursuits that lie on and beyond the 'fringe' level of things have continued to be very much active. I would like to begin by showing my deepest gratitude to ATS and its dedicated members. I truly believe there are no other sites like this out there that cover absolutely every topic worthy of serious discussion. The ultimate goal of all this mental contortion is the truth right? Well, and its consequences - what this means for us; what can we/should we do about it, etc. But ascertaining the truth can be a very difficult process; especially for unenlightened individuals conditioned to think within and only the status quo of mental capacity. I was very much within that mental framework before I underwent a spiritual awakening in 2008. Believe me: they are very real and can happen to anybody.

Here's one question: does anybody feel like the more they look into these topics, the more disconnected they feel from the people around them? I mean, I personally would love to have friends who were interested in spirituality, consciousness, alternative science, crop circles, hypnotherapy, near death experiences, human origins, etc, etc. The lot. And spend time discussing it EVERY DAY. However, I find people are more interested in watching rot on the television, discussing what team they support, and complaining about sour relationships. I don't care or bother with any of them. It seems most people are content operating on the lowest level of consciousness without any consideration, care, or awareness for REAL topics of discussion.

I don't mean that in a scathing way. Just, honestly, for me, it appears to be that way with the people in my life.

The Golden Ratio (Phi) 1.618...

That aside, I was wondering if anybody had any thoughts or ideas to share about Pythagoras? My initial interest with Pythagoras began after realizing the amazing properties of the golden ratio (1.618...). The golden ratio is seen in our DNA (the fundamental building block of life); the human arm, face and ear; many of the genuine crop circle formations; in nature around us (e.g. Indian nautilus shells); in the swirl of our galaxy. Check this, if you take the average distance between the planets in our solar system in Astronomical Units (the distance between the Earth and the Sun) you get approximately 1.618. If that's not amazing enough, you can use the golden ratio to analyse stock markets if monetary gain is your sole objective in life.

Pythagoras

So Pythagoras is hailed as the founding father of this divine proportion (assuming no help from the Annunaki, spawning Sumer, spawning Bablyon, etc). Not only that, Pythagoras taught reincarnation as one of his spiritual philosophies and was apparently able to recall past lives. Being a believer in reincarnation, and being aware of the many cases out there (Jeffrey Keene, David Wilcock, James Leninger, etc) this intrigued me. I believe Pythagoras was an enlightened individual first and a mathematician second.

Now, while I believe Pythagoras was aware of the spiritual, metaphysical, and mathematical importance of the golden ratio, I consider it unlikely he is the founding father of this truly amazing irrational number. Why? Well, the golden ratio is seen in the Great Pyramid for a start. If you take the area of the pyramid's surface by the area of the base you get approximately 1.618. In addition, the tablet of Shamash depicting the Sumerian sun-god exhbits dimensions with the golden ratio. Also, more obscurely, the golden ratio is seen in the relic of Noah's Ark! Pythagoras was born around 570 BC, while the Great Pyramid is pinpointed to at least 2700 BC and Noah's Ark around that time or older (assuming the pyramids are not much older either - which they could well be).

Noah's Ark - A Geometric Study Dr. Barry Warmkessel

www.barry.warmkessel.com...

Annunaki & Phi

So who really discovered Phi? It's seen in nature, and it is seen in structures and civilizations that mystify mainstream academia - thousands of years before the birth of Pythagoras. Well, it has been demonstrated during the time of Mesopotamia (e.g. Tablet of Shamash) so that pretty much rules out the belief that Pythagoras is the founding father (as much as I love Pythagoras for his contributions towards spirituality and mathematics). Zecharia Sitchin in his book The 12th Planet, after translating many of the mysterious Sumerian Tablets, proposed most of human accomplishment in just about every field can be traced back to the Sumerians; Including, of course, mathematics. And of course, he proposes in his book that these Sumerian 'gods' - who came here from Nibiru to mine gold - are responsible for the creation of homo-sapiens who miraculously appeared in South Africa, say around 200,000 years ago.

The Sumerian tablets tell the story of Enki, an Annunaki god (son of Anu) who gave Noah the blueprints to create an ark to save humanity from an imminent flood. If the golden ratio is seen in the relic of Noah's Ark (which does exist in Mount Ararat, Turkey), and an Annunaki - 'non-earthly' - god gave Noah the blueprints which contain the golden ratio, this is more evidence in favour that human knowledge was given a kickstart by these beings perceived as gods. While Pythagoras knew of its importance, the golden ratio can be traced back to a blueprint given to Noah by Enki; as seen in the relic up in the Turkish mountains.

Ever wondered why Babylonian mathematics is so amazing? ;-)

I don't know any Babylonian Maths, great another thing I missed from wagging school. Cool story tho

reply to post by IrnBruFiend


I think the reason why it seems common for anyone with a high interest in conspiracies and unravelling mysteries to feel disconnected, have a really small band of friends or even none at all can be summed up by saying that you become who you associate yourself with and what you think about.
If you are spending more time reading things that friends are not, you are associating with things they do not, therefore it is only a matter of time before you are alien to them and vice versa.
I find it best to keep things in your head until another person asks, these days more and more people are noticing that life is not all fast cars, fast food and crap tv.

Quite often too, people have things on their minds that they just do not want to share yet, it might surprise you how much you can learn just by listening and empathising with others.

Everytime I look at the formula of Pi, I cannot help but think to myself "as above, so below" if that makes sense.

reply to post by XXXN3O


Hey I think you're absolutely right. I actually think it's surprising how many people are thinking or have thought along the same lines at some point or another. It's just not something we are accustomed to talking about regularly. However, that said, I still think far too many people prize the importance of the X-Factor in their lives over the importance of philosophical and spiritual truth haha.

Originally posted by IrnBruFiend
reply to post by XXXN3O

 

However, that said, I still think far too many people prize the importance of the X-Factor in their lives over the importance of philosophical and spiritual truth haha.

If you flip the coin though and try to see the opposite side, someone who values that would think that you spend too much time looking into things.

I think there has to a balance between people if you get me and I think empathy is what is lacking in a lot of people when it comes to understanding. If you can see what another person sees, you can also see a way to approach topics that you would like to share with them.

If you blurt a topic out at them without attempting to understand them, most of the time they will be defensive.

I do agree with you though but imagine a world where everyone was the same in almost every way? That would be far worse than a world with differences in most cases.

Heck, imagine the whole population of this planet loved looking into conspiracies and mysteries etc. That would be almost 7 billion individual interpretations of what the truth is!

Or from an indivual perspective, a full planet of liars!

Maybe, just maybe, its not as bad as a lot of us think it is or could be.

If any of you want to learn the TRUE nature of Pythagorean mathematics (not the garbled fables one reads in books on the history of science and mathematics), study the research at:
smphillips.8m.com...
Provided that you make the effort to master the work (and that may take months!), it will change for ever how you regard ancient philosophy and mathematics and their relevance to modern discoveries in physics, etc. In the original material presented at this website, you will discover mathematical miracles and wonders to fill you with delight and awe. In particular, how Fibonacci numbers are present in music and sacred geometries is discussed (no - REVEALED) at:
smphillips.8m.com...
smphillips.8m.com...
smphillips.8m.com...

reply to post by XXXN3O


Agreed dude. Empathetic understanding is one of most important characteristics to possess on an interpersonal level with people. It's been linked to the success and failure of many top business executives also. Although at times I'll feel frustrated with people and their lack of interest in such topics, on the flip side of the coin I absolutely agree I may be perceived as someone who spends too much time looking into such things. If you take it even further onto a spiritual level, you could argue that if everybody was meant to have full spiritual awareness at birth they would. I view Earth as a school where we are meant to try and figure things out for ourselves without total recall. Although we see many fallacies in the world around us, the spirit world is infallable with an explanation and karmic solution to everything.

I guess it would defeat the purpose here if everybody was singing from the same hymn sheet and marching in the same direction. Despite that, I still believe Phi can be traced back to the blueprint given by Enki to Noah before Pythagoras. I should've posted the rant perhaps as a seperate thread!

Cheers

reply to post by IrnBruFiend

Here's one question: does anybody feel like the more they look into these topics, the more disconnected they feel from the people around them? I mean, I personally would love to have friends who were interested in spirituality, consciousness, alternative science, crop circles, hypnotherapy, near death experiences, human origins, etc, etc. The lot. And spend time discussing it EVERY DAY. However, I find people are more interested in watching rot on the television, discussing what team they support, and complaining about sour relationships. I don't care or bother with any of them. It seems most people are content operating on the lowest level of consciousness without any consideration, care, or awareness for REAL topics of discussion.

I don't mean that in a scathing way. Just, honestly, for me, it appears to be that way with the people in my life.

I know what you mean here. This is not an easy observation. In many cases these observations involve our closest and dearest.

A cognitive scientist at the University of California named George Lakoff has written several books on the most recent findings in the cognitive sciences and one of the observations that are developing is that 95 to 98 percent of what we consider human behavior and human thought is really UNconscious thought and behavior. The following of unconscious patterns. We think we are thinking and active within ourselves but really we are stuck in the ruts of life. For me this put a whole lot of things in a different light. Imagine that.

Anyway here is a wiki link to him which can provide other links if you like.

Nice post by the way.
"George Lakoff'

In fact everything we have learned at school was propagande re: pythagorus
if you want the real deal on pyramidal and pythagorean geometry / math
www.1minpages.com...
www.atara.net...

Originally posted by XXXN3O

Originally posted by IrnBruFiend
reply to post by XXXN3O

 

However, that said, I still think far too many people prize the importance of the X-Factor in their lives over the importance of philosophical and spiritual truth haha.

If you flip the coin though and try to see the opposite side, someone who values that would think that you spend too much time looking into things.

I think there has to a balance between people if you get me and I think empathy is what is lacking in a lot of people when it comes to understanding. If you can see what another person sees, you can also see a way to approach topics that you would like to share with them.

If you blurt a topic out at them without attempting to understand them, most of the time they will be defensive.

I do agree with you though but imagine a world where everyone was the same in almost every way? That would be far worse than a world with differences in most cases.

Heck, imagine the whole population of this planet loved looking into conspiracies and mysteries etc. That would be almost 7 billion individual interpretations of what the truth is!

Or from an indivual perspective, a full planet of liars!

Maybe, just maybe, its not as bad as a lot of us think it is or could be.

edit on 17-3-2011 by XXXN3O because: (no reason given)

OK. Enough philosophy and preaching BS. Can you contribute to the topic?

Or is it going to be circling conversation without any meaning ?

Originally posted by hp1229

Originally posted by XXXN3O

Originally posted by IrnBruFiend
reply to post by XXXN3O

 

However, that said, I still think far too many people prize the importance of the X-Factor in their lives over the importance of philosophical and spiritual truth haha.

If you flip the coin though and try to see the opposite side, someone who values that would think that you spend too much time looking into things.

I think there has to a balance between people if you get me and I think empathy is what is lacking in a lot of people when it comes to understanding. If you can see what another person sees, you can also see a way to approach topics that you would like to share with them.

If you blurt a topic out at them without attempting to understand them, most of the time they will be defensive.

I do agree with you though but imagine a world where everyone was the same in almost every way? That would be far worse than a world with differences in most cases.

Heck, imagine the whole population of this planet loved looking into conspiracies and mysteries etc. That would be almost 7 billion individual interpretations of what the truth is!

Or from an indivual perspective, a full planet of liars!

Maybe, just maybe, its not as bad as a lot of us think it is or could be.

edit on 17-3-2011 by XXXN3O because: (no reason given)

OK. Enough philosophy and preaching BS. Can you contribute to the topic?

Or is it going to be circling conversation without any meaning ?

edit on 17-3-2011 by hp1229 because: (no reason given)

You did read the forum that this was posted within, right?

Pythagoras: Very few people are aware that he spent a good deal of his education in India. In fact, many controversies surround "ownership" of his ideas.

Even the triangle that adorns his name... can be found far earlier in Vedic mathematics.

While there is no doubt that he brought this information to a broader audience, it is safer to assume that he was simply teaching a concept he himself had learned earlier in India.

Below is a link to some related info:
Vedic/Indian Mathematics

Pythagoras was a genius... because of his "experiments" we have a stronger understanding of our reality.

Originally posted by Areveli
Pythagoras: Very few people are aware that he spent a good deal of his education in India. In fact, many controversies surround "ownership" of his ideas.

Even the triangle that adorns his name... can be found far earlier in Vedic mathematics.

While there is no doubt that he brought this information to a broader audience, it is safer to assume that he was simply teaching a concept he himself had learned earlier in India.

It is very believable and very likely true since many civilizations have ruled India and plundered its wealth and exploited its resources including Knowledge. Too bad the only way to preserve the knowledge and history is through the hymns and shlokas in Sanskrit which not many know about it even in India.

I think the Germans also relied heavily on the ancient conceptual knowledge of Indian Physics and Avionics back in WWI/ WWII period.

While there is a lack of evidence due to lack of authentic archived documentation, the Vedic Literature has tonnes of theories and concepts which are still a mystery to many PHDs around the world.