Overwhelming Evidence Pentagon Aircraft Data Is Not From An American Airlines 757

Originally posted by Thermo Klein
A couple reference photos from the IAD website:

Link to alleged offical NTSB data points plotted on map

There ya go. You got it.

And the data is not "alleged" to have come from the NTSB. It in fact did come from the NTSB. Here is a direct link to the cover letters and names, including addresses and phone numbers.

www.warrenstutt.com...

Since C46Driver even admits Lat/long is aligned at the gate and then perhaps a "fast align" at the runway (supported by numerous verified pilots and the 757/767 Operating Manual Pre-Flight Checklist), the above NTSB Lat/long plots don't look very aligned to me. The data must not be from an American Airlines 757.

Yet "C46Driver" and others want us to believe them when they say "P4T are liars", and yet P4T put their faces and names to their claims.

patriotsquestion911.com...

I don't blame "C46Driver" for evading my questions. The answers are fatal to his established beliefs.

Originally posted by beyondsense

Originally posted by Viking9019
reply to post by dereks

 

Yeah the whole holographic planes theory to me is very outlandish but theres still many things that don't add up and not covered in the official report.

To be honest the whole holographic plane theory is quite possible when you consider the impossible, far-fetched, story-like-Hollywood-conceived official story that 19 morons high-jacked 4 planes with pocket knives and a mean face.

Originally posted by rjh01a

Originally posted by Thermo Klein
A couple reference photos from the IAD website:

Link to alleged offical NTSB data points plotted on map

There ya go. You got it.

And the data is not "alleged" to have come from the NTSB. It in fact did come from the NTSB. Here is a direct link to the cover letters and names, including addresses and phone numbers.

www.warrenstutt.com...

Beautiful! Isn't this how denying ignorance is supposed to be? Teamwork, collecting data, comparing verifiable evidence, and reaching a solid undeniable conclusion.

Great link! Thanks for the info!

Originally posted by ROBthaBANK

Originally posted by TrickoftheShade

Originally posted by TrueAmerican
reply to post by rjh01a

 

Agreed, and good point. P4T would have no reason to go faking the data.

Are you serious? P4T thrive on the oxygen of publicity and sell stuff on their website. You'd have to be particularly naive to think it impossible that they might have reasons to fabricate evidence.

Anyway, it doesn't particularly matter, since it's a simple fact that they have lied in the past.

Are YOU serious?
The only pilots in this thread can be found here pilotsfor911truth.org...

The Official Story is a lie, and you know it all!!!

I don't care if they're pilots, roadsweepers or ice cream makers. P4T have a track record of trying to mislead people, I assume - although I can't say for sure - because they enjoy the tiny amount of notoriety it affords them, and because they make a trickle of income from selling merchandise.

As a result a dwindling number of people take them seriously. And they're getting nowhere near their stated goal of revealing and popularising some sort of hidden "truth". You might be taken in by their nonsense but out there in the real world they don't even register.

Originally posted by TrickoftheShade
You might be taken in by their nonsense but out there in the real world they don't even register.

This IS the real world, and P4T's work is registering loud and clear, thank you.

Originally posted by rjh01a

Originally posted by TrueAmerican

Originally posted by TrickoftheShade
You'd have to be particularly naive to think it impossible that they might have reasons to fabricate evidence.

And you'd have to be particularly naive to believe P4T would alter data obtained from a FOIA request in the face of so many who have checked it.

Apparently those who make such claims that P4T altered the data, do not know how to plot a Lat/Long.

It's easy Trickoftheshade. you can do it yourself!. Since the people who claim to be pilots here refuse answer this question, perhaps you might?

Does this lat/long plot look like it was fully aligned at the gate and then "fast aligned" at the runway?



Do you think P4T "altered" the above lat/long plot? Do you know how to plot a lat/long?

Rob, I don't care. Troll somewhere else. Like all your other world shattering discoveries this one will come to nothing. The difference is that every time you wheel out another barrel load of nonsense fewer and fewer people can be bothered to look at it.

reply to post by eliade


The holograph theory doesn't hold up to scrutiny. To ensure success, this operation would need to make use of tried and true conventional means. There has been exhaustive research on the subject of what was accomplished on 911. I can dig up a link if anyone wants to hold my feet to the fire, but the objectives appear include, but were not limited to:

Demolish the WTC complex...all of it.
Recharge the political viability of a curiously homogeneous middle eastern country.
Silence the Office of Naval Intelligence who were on the verge of exposing massive corruption within the military.
Silence the SEC investigations whose records were lost with the WTC
Steal a bunch of gold as payoff for the "wet workers"
"Disappear" the inside men at the FDNY, NYPD, OEM, etc. as payoff for their roles in the scam.
Gain a pretext for long-planned wars and further erosion of freedom.


There's more of course, but the obvious beneficiaries aren't "we the people".

Because there was so much on the line, they couldn't rely on a stooge pilot who might lose his nerve. They couldn't rely on a remote controlled aircraft in case it missed its target. They couldn't use actual jets because they can be and ARE identified at crash sites. They needed precise destruction of the evidence, so that no one would be able to recover it if it survived the collapse of the buildings. Only pre-positioned explosives could accomplish that; even guided missiles couldn't guarantee a precise hit as well as pre-positioned charges, but that doesn't mean they weren't thrown in for good measure.

There is plenty of evidence they didn't use holographs for their hijacked jets; that they simply used bad graphics on almost live video, transmitted to the major media outfits from a central military command center. As a military operation, standard operating procedure is to jam the enemy's communications and electronic devices, as was reported by the fire and police departments, citizens and local TV stations. In this case, "we the people" were the enemy. Once effectively blacked out, they could transmit any message they wanted over the world's largest megaphone (ABC, CBS, FOX, etc).

With perfectly blue skies, it was a simple thing to use existing "green screen" chroma key technology and layering techniques to superimpose transparently fake images of jets over delayed live video.

Folks have a hard time stomaching this argument because it lays bare the fact that all our major media are complicit, as is anyone who is still prosecuting a war on terrorism and not prosecuting BushCheney, but when scrutinized, it appears to be the only way to answer all the questions.

It will be ridiculed and ignored as much as possible, but watch both halves of the september clues video for more details.

septemberclues.info...

Originally posted by TrickoftheShade
I don't care..

... and yet here you are.

Anytime you wish to address the data, people are waiting.

Originally posted by TrueAmerican

Originally posted by TrickoftheShade
You might be taken in by their nonsense but out there in the real world they don't even register.

This IS the real world, and P4T's work is registering loud and clear, thank you.

Let me know when the trial starts. Can't be long now, what with all this incredible "evidence" coming to light.

Originally posted by rjh01a

Originally posted by TrickoftheShade
I don't care..

... and yet here you are.

Anytime you wish to address the data, people are waiting.

Why? What are they waiting for? I assume you mean that you're keen to have my opinion on it, but I can't for the life of me see how it will benefit you.

I suppose you think that if you win an argument on the internet then the 9/11 "false flag" will turn out to be true. But it's kind of telling that you choose to have that argument on this forum as opposed to presenting your data in the wider public arena.

Originally posted by TrickoftheShade

Originally posted by TrueAmerican

Originally posted by TrickoftheShade
You might be taken in by their nonsense but out there in the real world they don't even register.

This IS the real world, and P4T's work is registering loud and clear, thank you.

Let me know when the trial starts. Can't be long now, what with all this incredible "evidence" coming to light.

I have a feeling if elements within the US Govt are tried and convicted of crimes related to 9/11, you will still be here defending their story, saying "I don't care what the evidence shows, nobody is looking at it anyway!".

But that's just my opinion of course.

As for the "dwindling number of people looking at the work of P4T", you may want to visit the home page of ATS every time a P4T article is posted here. Try visiting the entry page of the 911 Section now as well.



Ouch, that's gotta hurt.

You may want to visit this link too... patriotsquestion911.com...

If you consider up is down, left is right, and black is white, then perhaps I can understand why you think growth means "dwindling".

Anytime you wish to address the data, people are waiting.

reply to post by rjh01a


That's weird, because I have a feeling that if elements within the US government have not been tried and convicted in ten years time, you'll still be trumpeting your "proof" and insisting that your little club isn't becoming more risible by the day.

As for waiting for my ever-so-important take on the "data", what happens if I don't answer? Does Obama automatically get impeached?

Originally posted by rjh01a

Ouch, that's gotta hurt.

Yes, it hurts an enormous amount. When you get a two-page spread in the Charlestown Farmer's Advocate the I'll be even more pained.

Originally posted by TrickoftheShade
As for waiting for my ever-so-important take on the "data", what happens if I don't answer?

Ignorance is bliss I suppose.

But then again, you "don't care", right?. Even your own kind has stepped in it, deep. They corroborate the findings of P4T and they didn't even realize they had done it because they didn't even bother to look at the data. Typical.

Anytime you wish to address the data, let us know.

I find it interesting that in this thread, where real and official data and evidence has been presented, the "rational" rebuttal has been nothing more than ad hominems and denial without substance.

I see people saying, "this will amount to nothing" but failing to explain why, when in fact it seems to me that this evidence does in fact need to be addressed legitimately.

It is true that a core belief is this hard to shake, and so someone who's been convinced that questioning 9/11 (the greatest murder in the history of our nation) is 'stupid' or dumb, just because it's been 8 years and 5 months since it happened. This despite the fact that some murder convictions come 30 years after the fact, and there is no statute of limitations on murder.

I would love to see some legitimate arguments against the op here, but instead all I am finding is vitriol and denial without substance, in the face of substance.

EG people are being faced with hard evidence which contradicts their core belief (9/11 was official story), and this is the natural reaction they are having.

It's okay, this is expected, but now that I've pointed it out can anyone provide some real arguments which might counter what is being presented here? I was not and am not necessarily an adherent to the belief that the USA perpetrated this attack against itself, but after reading this topic I'm far more open to the idea and oddly the truthers seem to be, at least in this thread, the group more willing to discuss using facts and substantiation.

When one side of an argument is substantiating its claims and the other is simply screaming "NO!" like a child, I tend to take the side with substantiation more seriously. Bravo, while some in this thread with like 200 replies are saying that this sort of thing doesn't grab attention, coming from someone who hasn't really bought into a conspiracy this whole time, at least my views are being shifted and as a result I am definitely going to research this further.

Those of you fighting for 9/11 truth know that in fact you are still acquiring interest, even on a widely public scale. Charlie Sheen recently came out saying he believed 9/11 was a conspiracy, and was immediately labeled an anti semite "caught" being a druggy (everyone already knew, but now he's speaking about conspiracies so it 'comes to light'), and his show was abruptly canceled.

Who has something to hide? I don't know, but while I don't necessarily buy into "the US gov did it", I am starting to believe that the official story is a bull# lie, and that the true events of 9/11 are obfuscated.

reply to post by Yankee451


As I showed it was punched by piece of landing gear truck found in alley just beyond the hole



The so called called "rebar" looks to be part of a drop ceiling can see the ceiling hanging down from top of hole

Another piece looks to be part of concrete frame where the brick walls were set into

As for the jet engines were recovered from inside the building

Here is analysis with picture of engine pieces recoved from Pentagon

reply to post by rjh01a


?????

Up to your old tactics, eh???

Weedwhacker evaded it as well when asked.

Lie. Utter lie....but, of course, you seem to "represent" the PfffT crowd....

Let's see....you had a "question"?? Sorry that some people actually sleep, eat, and do other things, and here to be YOUR personal slave and answer immediately...but again, good to see our style peek through in your post, so others (who may temporarily be your "fans") will see too....


The "question" was some crappy marked-up (looks like) Google Maps image? Some blue squiggly lines, and other colors. Wanna describe exactly what it is supposed to convey?? Because, although I have a pretty good idea, I smell a bait and switch coming up, here....and only because it is SUCH a common M.O. of the PfffT, and have seen it so many times before....

This post is to the member Thermos, since I am restricted from responding to PM.

Thanks for your PM and I am going to look at the information you offered and further develop an opinion on this subject.

reply to post by thedman

As I showed it was punched by piece of landing gear truck found in alley just beyond the hole

I have not seen it reported where all that debris was found..
Your pic in not as it was found. It's been collected..

BTW, there are many differing reports as to the renovation work done..
This site clearly states the outside walls were reinforced with steel...

Structural steel, running through all five floors, strengthened the walls around the blast-resistant windows. A Kevlar cloth stretched between the steel tubes prevented debris from becoming shrapnel during the explosion.

www.architectureweek.com...

But what I'd really like to see is someone dispute the OP with some FACTS..
They seem a bit light on with the debunkers on this subject..

Originally posted by weedwhacker
reply to post by rjh01a

 

?????
Up to your old tactics, eh???

Weedwhacker evaded it as well when asked.

Lie. Utter lie....but, of course, you seem to "represent" the PfffT crowd....
Let's see....you had a "question"?? Sorry that some people actually sleep, eat, and do other things, and here to be YOUR personal slave and answer immediately...but again, good to see our style peek through in your post, so others (who may temporarily be your "fans") will see too....
The "question" was some crappy marked-up (looks like) Google Maps image? Some blue squiggly lines, and other colors. Wanna describe exactly what it is supposed to convey?? Because, although I have a pretty good idea, I smell a bait and switch coming up, here....and only because it is SUCH a common M.O. of the PfffT, and have seen it so many times before....

edit on 5 March 2011 by weedwhacker because: (no reason given)

Great answer weed, totally enlightening....