Why Not Use Hydrogen as the World's Commercial Fuel?

reply to post by leaualorin


Well, that's the thing, once you get better production of electricity, it does away with the fuel altogether.

Bob Lazar's Hydrogen Powered Corvette


www.youtube.com...
It seems to work well for Bob)

reply to post by kon1foundas


James1982 needs to do much more research before acting like a physics doctorate. OP: Do not believe anyone who thinks their opinion is the 110% truth and only truth.

Please, both of you, do MORE research before coming to CONCLUSIONS.

Upon a higher intellectual enlightenment, you may come to a better understanding of the possibilities that surround us all.

I can tell you that it does not take "more energy to make hydrogen than you get from it".

Do either of you even have any first hand experience with electrolysis?

This is a great thread topic and I wish more people would grow to be interested in the solutions to this mess of a world.

reply to post by bluemooone2


"burn dinosaurs"...
WHAT A SCAM!
I didn't quite understood from WERE does bob lazar gets electric energy !
FROM A BATTERY?
So that battery will never discharge?
I see it this way :
you start the car using electric curent and gasoline ;
IF you produce hydrogen "on site" you will be using electric energy wich comes from the alternator, RIGHT?
The alternator is beeing spined by the engine witch runs on gasoline , CORECT?
By burning the hydrogen IN THE ICE with an efficiency of maybe 25% you get FROM START only 25% from what hydrogen the "device" gets out of the water!
WHERE IS THE POINT IN ALL THAT COMPLICATION IN USING HYDROGEN?!
I SINCERELY CAN'T SEE THE BENEFITS!
And my "friend" some information for you :
oil is not dinosaurs!
Chemical composition of oil
Oil and natural gas are mixtures of hydrocarbons that are found as deposits in the earth's crust in various regions. Oil (crude) always contains representatives of three classes of hydrocarbons: saturated acyclic (alkanes), saturated acyclic (cycloalkanes) and aromatic. Their ratio varies from one reservoir to another. Alkenes and unsaturated hydrocarbons, especially oil composition acetilenele missing.
There are two theories :
1.abiotic oil
2.biotic oil
Look here :
nostrabrucanus.wordpress.com...
use google translator to read it in english!
romanian>english
In 1951 Nikolai A. Kudryavtseva abiotic theory states the first time, then other scientists have joined the theory, bringing new features, samples, etc. .. In 1956, Prof. Vladimir Porfir'yev announced the conclusion: 'crude oil and natural gas drill with no intrinsic connection to the earth's surface organic matter. They are primordial materials that erupt from deep within the earth. "
OIL IS ALL OVER THE EARTH , IS BEEIN CREATED DEEP IN THE EARTH AND IT DOESN'T "RUN OUT" AT ALL!!!
All the "peak oil mockery" is an excuse to INCREASE PRICES!
OIL = our slavery
SOLAR POWER = absolut free energy indefinetly (or as long as there is a SUN in the sky!!!) .

reply to post by leaualorin


Bob uses solar cells to generate the hydrogen. It takes about 2-3 days for a full tank that will go about 600 miles
For the internal electric supply Im assuming he uses a generator on board and a battery, yes.

reply to post by kermithermit111


electrolysis uses more energy than what is obtained . THAT'S ALL THERE IS TO IT!
And bob lazar is a shameless croock!
SOLAR ENERGY IS THE ONLY REAL FREE ENERGY!
Everyone should focuse their attention on how to obtain a higher efficiency out of solar panels or whatever device and design that gets a higher efficiency out of solar rays!
some even use a sterling engine :

susty.com...



" SunCatcher click image to enlarge »

The SES SunCatcher is a 25 kW solar power system that has been designed to automatically track the sun and focus solar heat onto a power conversion unit (PCU). This in turn converts the intense heat to grid-quality electricity. The concentrator consists of a 38-foot diameter dish structure that supports 82 curved glass mirror facets, each three feet by four-feet in area. These mirrors concentrate solar energy onto the heater head of a high efficiency, 4 cylinder reciprocating Stirling cycle engine, generating up to 25 kW of electricity per system "

Originally posted by prof7

The sea. H2O. It can easily be extracted

No, it can NOT be easily extracted. You need more energy to extract it than you gain from burning it. Where should all the energy come from?

The sun can be used to separate Hydrogen from Oxygen. Also algae under certain circumstances can produce Hydrogen as well from it's metabolism.

As far as I know, cold drains the power out of batteries. So people living north could have problems running electric. Wouldn't have the same issue with hyrdrogen.

reply to post by bluemooone2

solar panels and 2-3 days of waiting for the hydrogen to be made is nothing and useless!
More important is a big surface covered in efficient solar converters and high efficiency electric cables! From that you get to solar re-charging stations just like a gasoline station , and electric cars!
At every moment in a "day" Earth is exposed to the sun, wich means free energy to EVERYONE AT ANYTIME OF DAY OR NIGHT!

If electricity were extremely cheap and plentiful, hydrogen for cars might make a lot of sense. But with today's current technology, I don't see the production of hydrogen being cheap enough to replace oil any time soon.

reply to post by Turq1


problem solved during cold-season :
www.evdrive.com...
through insulation and electric heating and cooling during summer !
And believe me , LiFePo4 and LiPo technology have come a looong way in energy density + cycles using!
I have A123 systems LiFePo4 cells that are rated 3,3 V , 2300 mAh , 23 Ah discharge , and a 90% capacity after 1000 charge/discharge cycles !
The same company has 20Ah cells with better ratings even!
Hydrogen is nonsense!

Originally posted by LS650
If electricity were extremely cheap and plentiful, hydrogen for cars might make a lot of sense. But with today's current technology, I don't see the production of hydrogen being cheap enough to replace oil any time soon.

Not to mention that people in the know everywhere say that it would take 40-50 years from now to develop it to a state of being used for commercial.

reply to post by MrSmith


better even :
charging your car AT HOME AT NIGHT , with a normal charger , using SOLAR POWER generated ANYWHERE on earth would make a whole lot of sense...

Originally posted by leaualorin
reply to post by Turq1

 

problem solved during cold-season :
www.evdrive.com...
through insulation and electric heating and cooling during summer !
And believe me , LiFePo4 and LiPo technology have come a looong way in energy density + cycles using!
I have A123 systems LiFePo4 cells that are rated 3,3 V , 2300 mAh , 23 Ah discharge , and a 90% capacity after 1000 charge/discharge cycles !
The same company has 20Ah cells with better ratings even!
Hydrogen is nonsense!

I have experience with LiPo s and there are great ececpt one lill teeny lil problem . They tend to do this :

HEMP IS THE NUMBER ONE biomass producer on planet earth: 10 tons per acre in approximately four months. It is a woody plant containing 77% cellulose. Wood produces 60% cellulose. This energy crop can be harvested with equipment readily available. It can be "cubed" by modifying hay cubing equipment. This method condenses the bulk, reducing trucking costs from the field to the pyrolysis reactor. And the biomass cubes are ready for conversion with no further treatment

www.druglibrary.org...

reply to post by leaualorin


leaualorin you are a fool to be so closed minded. you're starting to make me think you're a paid disinformation troll.

please, unless you do some research, do not act like you know the rules of the universe.

for anyone wanting or caring about the most efficient energy system for this planet, this is my opinion.

first of all, there are many ways to live in harmony with this planet.

(be aware you DO need an understanding of simple electro-magnetics and electronics to comprehend the following)

1. we have radiant energy that is every where every minute of every day. look up teslas work on it, and how it was and still is hidden from main stream science and media.

2. we have the utilization of radiant energy in a vacuum in the form of a spark gap with insulated copper plates surrounding it to capture the radiant energy which is then used to charge, say, another battery, while the spark circuit completely maintains the first battery.

3. we have hydrogen from electrolysis. using torroidal cores and step up coils and pulse wave modulators in order to send high voltage electricity into a cell of high surface area cathodes and anodes at the determined resonant frequency of the container being used for the cell. (another way to simply boost a car's gas mileage is to use only a cathode and anode with an electrolyte and low voltage with higher amperage, it creates more heat, but if you reach a stable operation, it is easy to use less gas by utilizing your alternator's electromagnetic momentum to recharge the battery at the same rate)

4. we have solar, wind, and kinetic energy sources, some of which are extremely easy to build.

5. we have many other highly potential forms of natural energy NONE of which include petroleum such as algae, biomass, radio waves... etc.

Now

as far as food, clothing, materials, oils, proteins, string, wood, and medicine, we have the humans boilogical sibling, that has been used since the terraformation of this planet: cannabis.

this world is currently in a brainwashed confuzzled state of manic all over one main thing: oil.

it is sad, and I am honestly hoping that the very near comets (elenin) fulfill the hopi kachina prophecy and bring an electromagnetic pole shift to reset this infestation of a race.

no i dont want this world to end, no im not a "doomsdayer"... i have just been born into, and lived my life in a generation where i have had a front row perspective on this race, knowing i would be one of the humans alive in the next 50 years to live and deal with the consequences that those who wont be here are leaving us with.

our current global situation is surpassing the pinnacle point of no return, after which the only solution to reestablishing a natural global ecosystem, is cosmic intervention.

say what you will.

reply to post by kermithermit111


paid disinf...
that's a good one!
I'M UNEMPLOYED FOR ABOUT A MONTH , thank you for your interest!

Maybe you "boiz" were referring to "heavy hydrogen "?!
www.britannica.com...
" deuterium, (D, or 2H), also called heavy hydrogen, isotope of hydrogen with atomic weight of approximately 2. Its nucleus, consisting of one proton and one neutron, has double the mass of the nucleus of ordinary hydrogen. Deuterium is a stable atomic species found in natural hydrogen compounds to the extent of 0.014 to 0.015 percent.

Deuterium was discovered (1931) by the American chemist Harold C. Urey (for which he was awarded the Nobel Prize for Chemistry in 1934) and his associates F.G. Brickwedde and G.M. Murphy. Urey predicted a difference between the vapour pressures of molecular hydrogen (H2) and of a corresponding molecule with one hydrogen atom replaced by deuterium (HD) and, thus, the possibility of separating these substances by distillation of liquid hydrogen. The deuterium was detected (by its atomic spectrum) in the residue of a distillation of liquid hydrogen. Deuterium was first prepared in pure form in 1933 by G.N. Lewis, using the electrolytic method of concentration discovered by E.W. Washburn. When water is electrolyzed—i.e., decomposed by an electric current (actually a water solution of an electrolyte, usually sodium hydroxide, is used)—the hydrogen gas produced contains a smaller fraction of deuterium than the remaining water, and, hence, deuterium is concentrated in the water. Very nearly pure deuterium oxide (D2O; heavy water) is secured when the amount of water has been reduced to about one hundred-thousandth of its original volume by continued electrolysis. This was the standard method of preparation of D2O before World War II.

Deuterium enters into all chemical reactions characteristic of ordinary hydrogen, forming equivalent compounds. Deuterium, however, reacts more slowly than ordinary hydrogen, a criterion that distinguishes the two forms of hydrogen. Because of this property, among others, deuterium is extensively used as an isotopic tracer in investigations of chemical and biochemical reactions involving hydrogen.

The nuclear fusion of deuterium atoms or of deuterium and the heavier hydrogen isotope, tritium, at high temperature is accompanied by release of an enormous amount of energy; such reactions have been used in thermonuclear weapons. Since 1953, the stable solid substance lithium deuteride (LiD) has been used in place of both deuterium and tritium. "
DARPA says YES , "no doubt that anomalous excess heat is produced in these experiments" !
all you need is palladium cathode , deuterium and an electric current!
Considering palladium is about 850 $ an ounce , and gold is about 1400 $ an ounce , and the excess heat is about 25 times the electric current that is being put in , I'LL SAY IT'S GOOD!
P.S. : I like to HELP PEOPLE , to have A CONSTRUCTIVE DISCUSSION , but if the person to whom I am talking DOESN'T WANT TO HEAR ME , well then I think I'll keep walking my way!
Good day!

Originally posted by James1982

Originally posted by kon1foundas
The process of investing, spending and making money will not be any different from refining oil.

That is where you are 100% wrong. As has been said like 5 times already, hydrogen takes more energy produce, than it puts out. Oil is the opposite. Which is why we use oil. You just don't seem to get this.

This, for once, is not an issue of big oil's greed. This is an issue of economics. Producing hydrogen is causes us to loose energy, not produce it. Hydrogen is basically like a rechargeable battery. It's a way to transfer energy, no produce it.

I'd suggest reading up a little more on the production of hydrogen, and you'll understand why it's not being used. It's not a way to produce energy like fossil fuels are, it's just a way to take electricity that already exists and turn it into a fuel. A hydrogen car would be able to carry more energy on board pound-for-pound than an electric car with a battery, but just like the electric car, hydrogen just consumes power, not creates it.

edit on 1-3-2011 by James1982 because: (no reason given)

I think hydrogen does have a place in the energy chain. How about this: Use solar or other mean such as geothermal to produce the electricity separate the hydrogen for use in internal combustion engines.

The hydrogen burned would put out more energy than batteries, and have much less of an ecological footprint than battery powered engines - those batteries are ecological nightmares to make and dispose of.

reply to post by Unity_99


"Bob Lazar's video is suggesting something else. It isn't about storing the hydrogen, the system in the vehicle creates the hydrogen from WATER.

It does it safely. The tanks can be sawed, in half with chain saws, and impacted, lit on fire, and they only smolder, unlike gas tanks. The amount of hydrogen running in the system as a combustible gas at any given moment is small.

So,what is being said here, is not so much, storing the hydrogen, distributing the hydrogen, as simply having a mechanical system in place."

Indeed! Yes. And this is one way it could be done. Given time, you just never know, some other more efficient and practical method may succeed. Thank you for pointing this out.

It's easier said than being done, we still got 50 more years in order to have fusion as a viable fuel source.

reply to post by LS650


"If electricity were extremely cheap and plentiful, hydrogen for cars might make a lot of sense. But with today's current technology, I don't see the production of hydrogen being cheap enough to replace oil any time soon."

Electricity from ocean wind turbines and ocean currents is never ending, cheap and it can do the job of producing electricity for hydrogen and/or battery cells in vehicles. Do you really think the exploration, production, shipping, distribution and all of the nasties associated with oil (inflation, conflicts etc etc) doesn't come at a price?