Is ATS Supporting Ignorance Concerning Chemtrails? I think so.

THE FOLLOWING IS A QUOTE FROM educate-yourself.org...

If you are unfamiliar with the subject of chemtrails, you should first read this general overview of the chemtrail spraying operations which began in earnest in late 1997. Without first reading the introductory overview, it's difficult to understand the later informaiton that is being presented here. There are several key points to understand about the chemtrail spraying program. Most people discover the reality of chemtrails by initially reading about it on the Internet and then going outside and looking up into the sky. They are shocked to realize that what they had been reading about (and studying photographs of) is also taking place right over their heads. What some people had dismissed as mere "jet plane exhaust" (because there are now scores of internet propaganda web sites trying to convince you that 'everything is well' and 'there's nothing to be alarmed about' and that unaccountable 'jet plane exhaust' plumes are magically being converted into horizon-to-horizon overcasts of "cirrus clouds" !) are dismayed to realize that chemtrails are indeed the toxin-laden aerosols that have been described here and at other web sites since 1998 and they are not being sprayed for any benign or national security reason as the disinformation peddlers would have you believe.

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  edit on 1-3-2011 by Ahabstar because: (no reason given)
  

hahahahhahaha oh we have the magical sylphs now. You will truly believe anything you read, as long as its online and on a conspiracy site.

You forgot to bring in the Reptilians though. I would love to see them and the sylphs go at it

THE FOLLOWING IS A QUOTE FROM www.rense.com...

Chemtrails: Prove-It-Yourself
By Diane Harvey
[email protected]
7-15-1

As the extensive operation of anomalous aerosol activity in our skies continues, the efforts of many hardworking and deeply concerned activists are bearing fruit. Despite the ongoing intense secrecy and a particularly vicious disinformation campaign designed to dissuade the public from even looking into this matter, more and more people are nevertheless becoming aware of this phenomenon. Every day, the original salient questions are being asked all over again by a number of newly awakened and startled citizens. What am I looking at here? How can I know that something strange is going on? How do I know who to believe? The following information is an attempt to provide a model for individual investigation, suitable for use by any interested and open-minded citizen.

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THE FOLLOWING IS A QUOTE FROM www.lightwatcher.com...

The Chemtrail Smoking Gun
Proof of global atmospheric geoengineering
by: Bruce Conway

"There are more things in heaven and Earth, Horatio, than are dreamt in your philosophy." - Shakespeare

Five years ago I founded the Chemtrails Hall of Shame web site to document and investigate the elusive Chemtrail spraying operations in the skies above my home in the Pacific NW. The site can be found at: www.lightwatcher.com...
During this time I have had the opportunity to work with and befriend several of the luminaries within this field of investigation: Diane Harvey, Brian Holmes and a very special investigator who chooses to remain anonymous in this article. Each of these individuals has contributed greatly to the subject, keeping this topic alive within the alternative media . These chemtrail spraying programs, which are apparently being conducted on a worldwide basis, are evident to anyone who has the desire to look up and perceive the evidence. Yet, definitive proof has remained elusive.

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Papers of special interest to Chemtrail Investigators

Jay Michaelson 1998 Geoengineering: A climate change Manhattan Project - Stanford Environmental Law Journal January - www.metatronics.net...

Edward Teller (director emeritus, Lawrence Livermore National Laboratory), "The Planet Needs a Sunscreen" Wall Street Journal, October 17, 1997. - www.ncpa.org...

Climate Change 2001: Working Group III: Mitigation - by the Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change - www.grida.no...

Ramanathan, V. 1988. The greenhouse theory of climate change: A test by an inadvertent experiment. Science 243:293­299 www.gfdl.gov...

Schimel, D., D. Alves, I. Enting, M. Heimann, F. Joos, D. Raynaud, T., Wigley, M. Prather, R. Derwent, D. Ehhalt, P. Fraser, E. Sanheuza, X., Zhou, P. Jonas, R. Charlson, H. Rodhe, S., Sadasivan, K. P. Shine, Y. Fouquart, V. Ramaswamy, S. Solomon, J., Srinivasan, D. Albritton, I. Isaksen, M. Lal, and D. Wuebbles, 1996: Radiative forcing of climate change. In Climate Change 1995: The Science of Climate Change, Cambridge: Cambridge University Press, 69-131. www.gfdl.gov...

Ramaswamy, V., R. J. Charlson, J. A. Coakley, J. L. Gras, Harshvardhan, G. Kukla, M. P. McCormick, D. Moller, E. Roeckner, L. L. Stowe, and J. Taylor, 1995: Group report: what are the observed and anticipated meteorological and climatic responses to aerosol forcing? In Aerosol Forcing of Climate, Vol. 20. John Wiley & Sons Ltd., 386-399.
www.gfdl.gov...

Ramaswamy, V., 1988: Aerosol radiative forcing and model responses. In Aerosols and Climate, A. Deepak Publishing, 349-372
www.gfdl.gov...

Ramaswamy, V., and J. T. Kiehl. 1985. Sensitivities of the radiative forcing due to large loadings of smoke and dust aerosols. Journal of Geophysical Research 90(D3):5597­5613. www.gfdl.gov...

Reck, R. A. 1984. Climatic Impact of Jet Engine Distribution of Alumina (Al2O3): Theoretical Evidence for Moderation of Carbon Dioxide (CO2) Effects. Report GMR-4740. Warren, Mich.: General Motors Research Laboratories, and paper presented to the American Geophysical Union, San Francisco, Calif., December 1984.

Hunten, D. M. 1975. Residence times of aerosols and gases in the stratosphere. Geophysical Research Letters 2(1):26­27.

Mueller, A. C., and D. J. Kessler. 1985. The effects of particulates from solid rocket motors fired in space. Advances in Space Research 5(2):77­86.

reply to post by MathiasAndrew


OK gotcha

You make some very bold claims, especially regarding contrailscience, and the best you can come up with is "they claim they don't exist" to debunk the entire site.

Why can't you, or anybody else helping to line the pockets of charlatans like Carnicom and his ilk actually refute the science with science?

If it is nothing but lies, then you should have no problem outlining them and refuting them with evidence to further your agenda.

ahhhhh more cut and pastes, listings of research papers, youtube videos, and fanciful stories of magical slyphs that eat chemtrails.

How about this. Deal in your own words, and give specific evidence for the claims. Show us a photo of a chemtrail plane, tell us why contrails should not persist, hell show us a magical slyph photo too. Even tell us the bases the chemplanes, and magical slyphs, fly out of

reply to post by firepilot

people.ucalgary.ca... ok now will you Chem trails are real or is this not real for i can find the GOV funding mind you this is just one program flight op or dispersant op can not get page to copy for so all i can do is this, from link Geoengineering Cost Analysis Aurora AR10-182 Oct 30 2010. what type of Air Craft Used!!!!! let the debunking begin. i so hope you read it it not well then may you remain in the dark. it will not let me do the EX thing,

reply to post by MathiasAndrew



You know that is almost good advice.

REally the only thing wrong with it is that it presupposes that chemtrails exist - it is not actually asking you to look at he evidene and make up your own mind - it is asking you to look for evidence that chemtrails exist to confirm that preconception.

Eg this -

The first easy step towards proving to yourself and others that chemtrails actually exist will present itself when three or four or more planes fly back and forth close together across the sky.

And while we are on it I have yet to see any video of anything like this happening either - even from a known chemtrail liar like Tankerenemy - he can't show this, and I dont' think anyone else actually has.

Oh sure lots of people have said that they have seen it......but we're used to people saying all sorts of thigns to support het chemtrail hoax - it is verifiable evidence that is lacking, not unsupported assertions.

So yes, by all means familiarise yourself with the sky and check out the aircraft.

A good pair of binoculars will reveal that the common type of white chemtrail planes have no company logos or any other identifying markings.

Better still get a great phtographic setup like this so yuo dont' have to present shapeless blobs as "evidence". this isn't all that expensive - the telescope retails for about $600 in the US and there are smaller versions that are hundreds cheaper.

then you will be able to see the actual markings and won't have to rely upon insufficient magnification.

Here's another "little" bit of disinformation:

Under the very same weather and altitude conditions in which you have been seeing normal commercial traffic emissions produce whatever kind of contrail is normal for your locality, you will most likely now see something else entirely.

how do you know it is "the very same weather and altitude conditions" for every flight you see? they haven't told you to go gather data for the weather conditions at the altitude of the flight!!


which leads us to this:

The standard explanation of ice crystals and contrail formations self-destructs here right before your eyes. Because under the conditions in which we have observed chemtrails, all the other air traffic in the vicinity at the time, at approximately the same altitudes, are leaving normal contrails.

note teeh use of "approximately" - ther is a self-serving assumption here that the conditions across teh sky are identical at "approximately the same altitudes". there's a really obviously thing wrong with this:

..... there is no reason why it has to be true!! Contrail formastion can be altered by jsut a couple of hundred feet of altitude for teh same reasons that cloud formatino can be altered by a small change in altitude - ie teh conditions are not the same! And all you ahve to do to see this is go outside on any day where clouds are in a layer.... below the layer now clouds.....100 feet up there are clouds.....often a bit higher again and there are no clouds again.


check out the flight routes - but remember that aircraft are NOT always limited to specific lanes in the sky. Use sites like www.flightradar24.com... to see if they can show you what is going on.

Also check out MODIS for satellite photos of near yuor area on teh same day to see what you can see - often contrails are shown in these, and often they are in areas of cirrus cloud exactly where you expect them.

so yes - again - please do establish some facts for yourself, without the preconceptions and strawman arguments of this piece of propaganda.

reply to post by MathiasAndrew


Usually, the "chem"-trail believers receive either pity, or scorn. For their beliefs are pitiful, and so ridiculous that it amazes intelligent people that anyone can be that uneducated and ignorant.

But, the maker of THIS video?: www.youtube.com...

Is a truly disturbed individual, if the message conveyed is an actual thought and intent (and not just more BS, to perpetuate this hoax, and "stir up" the believers...).

The fact that YOU chose it, to post here, is doubly disturbing. Also, indicates even less connection to reality than previously guessed.

The rhetoric and imagery, when that video first starts out was amusing....in the way you chuckle at a small child, and how they make mistakes of perception and life experience...part of the learning process.

Typical, the slide photo of a KC-135 tanker (@ 0:37), dumping fuel. That is ALL it was doing, and many times Jet fuel is dumped. Not often, since it's expensive....and not all larger commercial airliner type airplanes even have that capability. Usually, only the larger ones, the wide-bodies. The KC-135, being a tanker, requires that feature because, like all large jets, the maximum take off weight is much higher than the maximum landing weight. IF a mission is aborted for some reason, and its load of fuel doesn't get transferred to another airplane (per the original mission plan), then they dump just enough to lower the weight, to max for landing. For passenger and cargo airliners, the only reasons for such dumps is in emergencies, and situations that require an unscheduled landing....a landing earlier than originally planned.

Fuel dumping IS not really "good" for the environment, of course....but, it is about as bad as a gnat's fart in a hurricane, on a percentage overall with the rest of the globe, and atmospheric layer.....!!


The video opens with the photo of a Boeing cockpit (looks like a 767 to me) with the ominous implications....(totally FALSE and unfounded)....but any humor and feelings of condescension (because it moves into the "New Agey" crap early on, too...but....) those feelings towards the maker dissolve, when the full-blown "Paranoia Central" idiocy becomes apparent.

The short clip is based on a FALSE premise from the outset....of "chempilots"....further reinforced by that Boeing cockpit photo again. And a lot of not-so-subtle threats in text slides. With accompanying imagery, to include gallows at one point.

Folks, any light-hearted dismissal of these "chem"-kooks should be redirected to valid concern, IF this hoax gets to some level to actually stir that kind of BS. It is eerily similar to the diatribes that "abortion foes" spew, and their calls to violence. Difference is, though....abortions DO occur. "Chem-trailing" doesn't. And, neither do the (made-up term) "chempilots".

We see an almost religious fervor of belief, here in these threads on ATS.....similarly on the YouTube.

I used an "abortion" analogy earlier.....but, maybe the "Salem Witch Trials" of the 17th century is more apt?? The rampant, and tragic misinformation then, regarding the non-existent "witches", and the horrible consequences suffered by completely innocent people.....

....."chem"-trail believers are seeming to be embarking on a similar sort of "witch hunt". From beliefs steeped in the same sort of ignorant, superstitious dogma, and egged on by "peer pressure" from packs of equally idiotic, ignorant and utterly stupid people.....

reply to post by firepilot


How about this I won't tell you what to think or what to post and you do the same

Oh but then you wouldn't be doing your job then would you.

reply to post by Aloysius the Gaul
well you should check out my above post then lets talk Chemtrials, i knew if i looked long enough i would find it

reply to post by MathiasAndrew

A fallstreak hole, also known as a hole punch cloud, punch hole cloud, canal cloud or cloud hole, is a large circular gap that can appear in cirrocumulus or altocumulus clouds. Such holes are formed when the water temperature in the clouds is below freezing but the water has not frozen yet due to the lack of ice nucleation particles. When a portion of the water does start to freeze it will set off a domino effect, due to the Bergeron process, causing the water vapor around it to freeze and fall to the earth as well. This leaves a large, often circular, hole in the cloud.[1] It is believed that a disruption in the stability of the cloud layer, such as that caused by a passing jet, may induce the domino process of evaporation which creates the hole. Such clouds are not unique to one geographic area and have been photographed from the United States to Russia.[2] Because of their rarity and unusual appearance, fallstreak holes are often mistaken for or attributed to unidentified flying objects.[3

en.wikipedia.org...

Ever thought of researching something before posting a youtube video for it? It isn't hard to do.

Originally posted by MathiasAndrew
reply to post by firepilot

 

How about this I won't tell you what to think or what to post and you do the same

Oh but then you wouldn't be doing your job then would you.

This isnt my job, its a hobby and pure fun at times. And if you did not notice, the motto of this site is "deny ignorance".

You have every right to believe in magical sylphs as much as you want, and I have the right on here to make fun of you for it too, and for your silly chemtrail religion.

reply to post by MathiasAndrew


I see your YT spam and raise you some actual science....expressed in lay-mans terms of course

Hole punch clouds

A hole punch story

NASA on hole punch clouds

reply to post by weedwhacker



Yep - I've seen calls for "action" against "chempilots" and the like........unfortunately this bunk may not actually be harmless.

yes i new it , put the truth in front of you and you just keep saying i am blind to your self and people wonder why the GOV does what it does, there is the truth and you do not want the truth are you all to sheepole?, how blind are you?? the facts are there do you not care?? well that is just one operation anyway there are more.www. Aurora. aero. com

Originally posted by bekod
people.ucalgary.ca... ok now will you Chem trails are real or is this not real for i can find the GOV funding mind you this is just one program flight op or dispersant op can not get page to copy for so all i can do is this, from link Geoengineering Cost Analysis Aurora AR10-182 Oct 30 2010. what type of Air Craft Used!!!!! let the debunking begin. i so hope you read it it not well then may you remain in the dark. it will not let me do the EX thing,

edit on 1-3-2011 by bekod because: (no reason given)

edit on 1-3-2011 by bekod because: added info. and word edit.

If you did not notice, that is a proposal, not something in real life. An internet webpage is not evidence. How about leave the computer, internet and twinkies behind, and actually go look at airports and aircraft in real life

reply to post by Aloysius the Gaul


Here is your video evidence of chemtrails that were made by multiple planes turning around

And as for the sylphs I didn't say I believed in them. I am here to provide the evidence from opposite side of this argument.

I am going to leave my personal beliefs out of it. Unless you want me asking if you believe in God and will you please prove your beliefs. At 26 second of this video is the picture I am refering too
www.youtube.com...