The Masonic agenda revealed

Originally posted by Boreas
It's the 21st century and our freedom to express has never been better. I doubt masons need fear a witch-hunt anymore, besides, fearing the consequences of revealing what you claim is enlightenment seems a tad unenlightened to me.

It IS the 21st century. And yet, just 10 years ago it was the law in Iraq under Saddam Hussein that any Masons be arrested and executed. Fascists and dictators tend to be afraid of us, because we're semi-organized and operating autonomously from church and state.

Can I ask why? Why the secrecy? I consider myself somewhat a student of history and can understand while the brotherhood would choose to stay underground at different points in history (if indeed your order is out for enlightenment), but why still keep things so ritualized?

Ritual is tradition. It's a way to impart the knowledge in the same way it has been taught for hundreds of years. It tends to protect it from corruption.

I'm not trying to knock your group, but if you do indeed possess through your collective wisdom some truth that might serve mankind, I'm not sure keeping things so select and seclusive is a good thing to do.

It's not knowledge that can serve mankind. It's knowledge that can serve men. We can't change the world, just try to take one man at a time and make him a better person if that's what he wants to do. Nothing more.

reply to post by network dude


, but for most of the brethren, we would be elated to share what we know to any and all who were willing to learn

But without being specific on your knowledge , are you saying i couldn't obtain it by other means ?
Are you saying that its knowledge that Everyone could gain from ?

Originally posted by Doomzilla
But without being specific on your knowledge , are you saying i couldn't obtain it by other means ?

It's knowledge you could gain anywhere. Walk into your local bookshop and browse the philosophy aisle, then hit up the religion aisle for a bit, then maybe the classics from ancient greece. It's all there. Or go to church; or meditate; or take a self-help class; or enroll at the university. Masons make no claims that their path to enlightenment is any better than any other path.

Are you saying that its knowledge that Everyone could gain from ?

Sure, but not everybody is going to take the effort to try learning it.

Originally posted by JoshNorton

Originally posted by Doomzilla

Are you saying that its knowledge that Everyone could gain from ?

Sure, but not everybody is going to take the effort to try learning it.

Oh, that's wonderful. When is the Mason-approved book coming out giving the information that it can be learned - after all, wouldn't that help others? - or is there a reason this information is out there but hidden in diverse places?

I mean... Why hide anything? Or is it a "happy fuzzy tummy" feeling to feel superior because the information was compiled and given to [the mason] (feels so special!)?

Not trying to attack, here. Just very unclear.

reply to post by Doomzilla


14 presidents, lastly being Ford. He was a 33rd degree though. I am not sure about UK leadership. It may be the case for that. We are proud of most of the leaders who were masons. I am sure Napoleon had his fans as well. I have no doubt that you are correct in that leaders are chosen by some group long before anyone knows anything about them. I think what we see as politics is a big play like production that is meant to keep us entertained while the world is being run behind the curtain. Knowing what I do of the structure of masonry, and the leadership, I cannot see how it could be involved in any facet. The only structures that are large enough to support any global agenda are the UGLE (which US masonry has no contact with to my knowledge) and possibly the Scottish Rite, but it is broken down into jurisdictions and to my knowledge, they don't share any joint leadership either. Like each state has it's own grand lodge and makes it's own rules based on the will of the lodges in their respective states. I am not saying there is no way it could happen, just that based on what I know, it's highly unlikely to impossible.

reply to post by Amaterasu


Duncan Ritual. It's a book that I saw just after becoming a master mason. I was completely blown away. It had every secret that I thought I was supposed to keep. How could I keep these secrets if they were out in the open in a damn book that anyone could buy? Then I leaned a bit more and understand why we keep those things secret. Not to keep them from others as you or anyone can read them, but to keep ourselves loyal to that which we swore we would not tell. Honor among brethren is how it's best explained. But the words you would read in that book or any other that would tell all about the words we use, only tell a small portion of the story. The lessons are taught in the way that they are to expose the initiate to exactly what he needs to be able to put a complete picture together of each lesson. I could use terminating fiber optic cable as an example. I could tell you all about how you have to be careful how much pressure you put on a connector when polishing it on the 1000 micron paper, but until I physically teach you, or you teach yourself through action, you will not truly know. The lessons are taught so that each person will have the exact same information that every master mason before him was given, how he choses to apply that to his life it his choice alone.

Originally posted by Lateralussicksicksick
I'm sorry if you see Hitler as evil, I guess I cannot change your mind if you wish to view him as evil.

Yeah, that is so laugh out loud.

I have zero issues being in a Fraternity that places me on the polar opposite of that cowardly turd-gobbler.

reply to post by AugustusMasonicus


Turd-gobbler? What do you know about Hitler? Where did you get that information history books?

I'm sorry this might be off-topic and let's stop arguing about Hitler, if you view him that way then I cannot help you, Only you can decide for yourself others can only guide you but in the end the decision is still yours.

If you view the Masons as a good brotherhood scratching each others back then I cannot help you plus you are a Mason I am just me.

Originally posted by Amaterasu
Oh, that's wonderful. When is the Mason-approved book coming out giving the information that it can be learned - after all, wouldn't that help others? - or is there a reason this information is out there but hidden in diverse places?

here you go

Originally posted by Lateralussicksicksick


I would stop arguing with you because we won't get anywhere with you being a Mason and me just being myself.





Saturn ascends, the one the ten.

I agree that further discussion on this would be pointless, but not because I am a mason. I have actually never heard any reference to Hitler or Jews in lodge. My views are because of what I have learned throughout my life. Thanks for the talk.

Originally posted by Lateralussicksicksick
Turd-gobbler? What do you know about Hitler?

Substantially more then the average person as my history collection focuses on, among other topics, World War I and II.

I'm sorry this might be off-topic and let's stop arguing about Hitler, if you view him that way then I cannot help you, Only you can decide for yourself others can only guide you but in the end the decision is still yours.

I am not the one who needs help in this regard. Revisionist history will not enable anyone to make him anything more then he was, a megalomanical mass-murderer who was not 'compelled' (as you pro-offered it) to kill anyone.

If you view the Masons as a good brotherhood scratching each others back then I cannot help you plus you are a Mason I am just me.

Helping non-Masons, which constitutes the bulk of the charity work our lodge participates in, does not seem like 'back-scratching' to me, but then again, I am not the person who has the skewed view of one Adolph Hitler as well.

Oh look the whole klan is here to prove they are a friendly bunch of folks that knows more than everyone else. Daddy mason taught him how to tie a bowlan knot. Your a secret society you stand for evil end of story. Any group that thinks it is in good morals to keep secrets from mankind and to only help a select few scratching the backs of the wealthy for gain might as well be the mob they were probably masons too. Stay in your lodge and do your studies but your not fooling anyone.

Hey I just noticed a trend here at ATS when someone talks about a Mason of course he would get a Mason to reply to him then other Masons will join too, soon you'll see a mob of Masons. Next you'll see a couple of stars in a Mason's reply. Isn't that what we call back scratching? Isn't it obvious? The things you deny are being evident here?

reply to post by Lateralussicksicksick


I had comishiner Gordon flash the big "M" in the sky and they all came.

OR

there is an active thread in the SS fourm and they happened to see it.
(I gave you that star BTW)

reply to post by network dude



14 presidents, lastly being Ford.

I find that hard to believe he was the last , imo hes the last Confirmed one but hey ho .

I am sure Napoleon had his fans as well.

The only respect I show to leaders like him compared to todays leaders is that todays advocate War but don't have the courage of their convictions ie chickenhawks . Napoleon and others at least would have known the horror of war 1st hand .

. I am not saying there is no way it could happen, just that based on what I know, it's highly unlikely to impossible

Ok but this is what I would have said about 911 being an inside job BEFORE it happened .
Time will tell whose intentions were honourable and karma always catches up with us eventually

Originally posted by JoshNorton

Originally posted by Amaterasu
Oh, that's wonderful. When is the Mason-approved book coming out giving the information that it can be learned - after all, wouldn't that help others? - or is there a reason this information is out there but hidden in diverse places?

here you go

I'm seeing little I was not aware of - does that mean anything about me? I mean, does that make me a Mason in spirit?

If we suppose a nefarious group at the core, would we not expect sites like this (with lots of debunking and stuff) put out as the cover? Would it not be useful to keep the lower ranks believing the lie?

I'm just sayin'.

reply to post by Doomzilla


if you can find me any more, I will gladly add them to the list. I liked Reagan even though most didn't. I didn't like either Bush after seeing the bigger picture, and Clinton was good for my wallet, but not what I would call a great leader. Maybe a great fornicator. He was in the Demolay, which is a childhood version of masonry. But he never petitioned a lodge that I know of. Obama is not a mason or a Prince Hall mason. When he was being touted as the only thing better than sliced bread to the world, I think masons would have jumped all over that bandwagon to promote the craft. But hey, Colonel Sanders was and Dave Thomas was. maybe there was a masonic plot to fatten up the US population so they could introduce the new masonic weight loss video series, "sweating and preforming ritual to the oldies". Just a thought.

Hmm . . . well, to each his own, but from my perspective, it sounds a bit like the Masons might simply be failing to adapt to modernity. Proclaiming to have truth that can only be garnered through membership (with a dash of ritual + hierarchy thrown in) sounds a lot like a Church by another name. Just my two cents.

Originally posted by network dude
reply to post by Doomzilla

 

if you can find me any more, I will gladly add them to the list. I liked Reagan even though most didn't. I didn't like either Bush after seeing the bigger picture, and Clinton was good for my wallet, but not what I would call a great leader. Maybe a great fornicator. He was in the Demolay, which is a childhood version of masonry. But he never petitioned a lodge that I know of. Obama is not a mason or a Prince Hall mason. When he was being touted as the only thing better than sliced bread to the world, I think masons would have jumped all over that bandwagon to promote the craft. But hey, Colonel Sanders was and Dave Thomas was. maybe there was a masonic plot to fatten up the US population so they could introduce the new masonic weight loss video series, "sweating and preforming ritual to the oldies". Just a thought.

My opinion as an outsider ? Your worst ever President was Bush , Hes the most unintelligent person in power ever .
Your best president got murdered by the people he tried to warn us about .
He was your last real people s president imo and hes sorely missed.

Ahh I love watching the Masonry discussions as you have your usual characters popping in and becomes quite predictable as time goes on.

The secrecy behind Masonry is the driving force for the conspiracy. I'm sure masons have come accustomed to this being "the nature of the beast" so to speak.

The coincidences of certain people in powerful positions throughout history being masons added with the secrecy that is inherent in the "craft" takes the conspiracy up a notch.

A mason in one sentence will decree he is bound by secrecy and in the next sentence confirm the truth from another horses mouth what that secrecy was/is. The irony is thick lol....

goes a little something like this:

Mason: I cannot divulge the secrets of my craft, if you with to learn you must first join and you can only join if you believe in god.

Agnostic/Athiest: I just watched this discovery show about masonry and they said this is what the craft was all about...

Mason: (if its positive ) Why sure that is correct and its the truth!!
Mason: (if its negative) Why absolutely not, stop believing everything you see on TV!

So basically the only option one is left to find agreement with any mason is to just accept they are mundane nothing to see here "do gooders"..which may very well be the case...

I honestly thought about joining masonry to see what all the hub-bub was about but I would be super pissed if it was really as mundane country club as they would like you to think.

I'm on the fence with masonry, I see their symbolism everywhere and in everything, I see their checkered floors in almost every freaking movie there is, along with the sun, eye, pillars JB etc.etc....I see their members running countries, presidents, politicians, etc....pretty impressive for some mundane Sunday get together do-gooder club.

Pike and Crowley REALLY confuse the consensus on "masonry" even more...just so much conflicting stuff to "trust".

People probably wouldn't care about masonry if it was just a simple do-gooder lunch club...

but because we see your symbols on all our buildings, we see them in our movies, currency, stores, etc... then we see one of you lunch club do gooders make it as president of the US, then another...and another....and holy crap another...surely there won't be ANOTHER!!

we start to care...

its hard to believe masonry is mundane when your accomplishments anything but that....