The Damaging Process of Derailing Threads

So you come across a thread or a post you don't particularly agree with and you set out to derail it, simply because it rubs you up the wrong way...

Is what you are doing right? Do you think it is ok to play and toy with peoples emotions? Is it ok to pi** people off? Wind people up? Just because you want to ruffle some feathers...

I think there should be some form of punishment for people that have nothing better to do than derail a good thread by submitting a provocative and insulting message regardless of how cleverly toned it is.

If you don't like a thread move on... do not try to damage it by leaving an opinion that strays from the point of the OP.

When someone puts their heart and soul in to a post, something they really care about and feel is important, it takes one idiotic fool to come along and quote "oh i think thats agianst T&C" or "you're a troll" or some other damaging sentence which then has to be acted upon by moderators and the band wagon for others to jump upon has been created.

It is extreamly frustrating and it really makes me mad and angry that these people can just come along and for the sake of adding nothing and contributing nothing of relevence, just happen to drop their pants and cra* all over your thread!!

Please ATS let there be consequences for those that do little to enhance an OP but instead slander it and derail it merely to get one up on the OP, to cause friction and to insight a reaction (which is pretty much what this is!)

Grrrr!! and more Grrrr!!

I think you need to learn to manage your expectations.
This kind of thing will always happen.
We don't live in a world which conforms to our individual requirements.
If it is too upsetting, then I suggest not to bare your heart and soul upon a public forum accessible by millions of people worldwide.
Sorry to sound harsh, but in other words, get over it.

Originally posted by Moonbeast1111
I think you need to learn to manage your expectations.
This kind of thing will always happen.
We don't live in a world which conforms to our individual requirements.
If it is too upsetting, then I suggest not to bare your heart and soul upon a public forum accessible by millions of people worldwide.
Sorry to sound harsh, but in other words, get over it.

My case in point!!!

Moonbeast is right.

It sounds like you are bothered by some of the things people say in threads. If it's against the T&C, report it. If it's not, ignore it and move on. You cannot control other people's posting habits. There are a lot of personalities coming together here and we all have to be a little more open to different viewpoints and personalities. Don't let people's words piss you off, make you angry or toy with your emotions. Grow a thick skin and learn to let it roll off your back or you will never survive here.

Being provocative and even insulting (as long as they're not attacking members personally) is allowed. It's part of the wide range of expression permitted on this board. Sarcasm, snarkiness and 'tone' are all valid ways of communication. You choose to participate in your own way. If you want to bring the level of posting up on ATS, then set an example and don't respond to people that set you off. Either report them (if they are violating the T&C) or ignore them.

reply to post by nakiannunaki
I agree wholeheartedly with your concerns. I am fed up of trolls, debunkers, people drunk, misinfo agents etc... as well. As my old aunt used to say: 'If you ain't got nothing good to say, then don't say it at all.'
If I come across a thread I do not agree with, I move on. Maybe I am in the minority but I don't have a big ego or want to create a negative message that puts newbies or lurkers off reading what goes on here as they will just think we are all a bunch of morons who love to cause trouble?
When I come across a thread where this goes on, it puts me off as the thread then resembles a slanging match, with no useful discussion.
Even if the OP has made a good point, their thread is derailed because of pages and pages of insults being thrown about.
I have a thick skin and can take any abuse but this type is pointless, moronic and down right rude.

reply to post by kalenga

If I come across a thread I do not agree with, I move on.

Get's pretty boring when everyone agrees with each other though, doesn't it?

I also think a lot misinterpret being challenged with being attacked.

reply to post by Chadwickus
If you were sitting in a bar having these discussions, would you react the same way? No, you wouldn't as you know what came next would be a punch in the face! There is discussion on these threads but the OP is making the point of the troublemaker who comes onto the thread just to do that, cause trouble.
There is no point to their argument just that they think they want to wind you up to get a reaction.
Just because it is online and you (metaphorically speaking) can't be tracked, doesn't mean you have to turn into a moron just because you can get away with it???
If you go onto scientific websites you will only see this type of behaviour once in a blue moon.
It reminds me of the way the CB radio has went in recent years. In the old days everyone respected each other, banding together for the common cause. But now it is full of wind up merchants out to look for a fight just because they cannot be traced.

ATS is not a bar where you might hold a private discussion with a friend. This is a public forum. You can't expect it to have the same feel as a private discussion in a bar. Well, you can expect it, but you will be disappointed. Neither is this a Scientific Forum. It's a forum of many people throughout the world with many opinions on many topics. This is a place to share those opinions, in any way you wish, as long as it doesn't violate the T&C.

You cannot control other people's behavior...
.

There is a careful distinction between derailing a thread and challenging the arguments made in a thread.

Derailing a thread is usually when someone obviously doesn't read the OP or the posts carefully, and then mocks or makes a joke about the thread in a manner which doesn't violate ATS T&C, but it baits people into arguing about something which has NOTHING to do with the original OP. Usually this is 2 people arguing with each other, and in the end, their posts get removed for violating "manners & decorum".

Even though the mods removed the posts, it still derailed it.

To the contrary, making a post that questions or challenges the arguments made in the OP or subsequent posts is exactly what discussion forums are all about. ATS is here for us not to become an echo chamber (although it does sometimes end up like that) but rather, as a place to make a point and invite others to intelligently evaluate and discuss the points.

Both things happen here, and it's inevitable, but I agree it's a good idea for all of us to remind each other to treat everyone with respect, don't be a mindless idiot making jokes for the sake of mocking and getting stars. That's really a form of bullyism (word? ).

reply to post by Benevolent Heretic
Cool avatar, yes I agree we cannot control everyone but as the last post in this thread highlighted, there is discussion and there is downright mischief makers who want to stop a thread from being successful.

Originally posted by kalenga
there is discussion and there is downright mischief makers who want to stop a thread from being successful.

Yes, this is true. And they are both practiced here as long as they don't violate T&C. If people would just learn to IGNORE the troublemakers, they'd go elsewhere. They're just looking for attention and they get it every time. Don't take the bait. Don't argue with them. They will go away. Hopefully to another board.

The other problem with doing something about these troublemakers is: Who decides who is a troublemaker and who is just genuinely trying to challenge or debate an issue? I have been accused many times of trying to take a thread off topic and it's something I strive NOT to do... If we start kicking people off because they are determined to be troublemakers, I would probably one of the first to go!

reply to post by nakiannunaki


Believe me I agree with you. In fact SnF cause I get it alot. Troll, way to much. But the position I defend, requires a thick skin, or I wouldn't be making the threads I do. That's the only defense I have. I don't let them get to me and it drives them crazy after so long. If I feel someone is even getting to me in the slightest. I stop punching keys. Never punch a key in anger. Best advice I ever gave myself.

reply to post by nakiannunaki


I think any step in this direction will be a bad step. For a start, regardless of how much a person can FEEL a statement, or THINK a statement, there are matters like facts, figures and socialy acceptable behaviour that have to be observed and respected.
For instance: If someone makes a thread about how great Hitler was, then Im going to post against that position. Im not going to just shut up because what I have to say doesnt suit the OP position. And lets face it, if someone wrote an OP that boiled down to "Up is down, left is right, and black is white" and NO ONE posted against that postition, we would officialy be a collection of the dumbest least freely expressive people on Earth.

Originally posted by TrueBrit
reply to post by nakiannunaki

 

I think any step in this direction will be a bad step. For a start, regardless of how much a person can FEEL a statement, or THINK a statement, there are matters like facts, figures and socialy acceptable behaviour that have to be observed and respected.
For instance: If someone makes a thread about how great Hitler was, then Im going to post against that position. Im not going to just shut up because what I have to say doesnt suit the OP position. And lets face it, if someone wrote an OP that boiled down to "Up is down, left is right, and black is white" and NO ONE posted against that postition, we would officialy be a collection of the dumbest least freely expressive people on Earth.

Instead we are a collection of the dumbest most freely expressive people on Earth.

Besides the point i am making is that even when you have a valid not threatening post people will still come along and write bullcrap which has absolutly no relevence to the subject matter at hand...

It happens all the time and i see in almost every thread... sometimes i actually believe that ATS has mods with additional profiles so they can flame a thread anonymously and have it moved to a section with mush less attention.

I have seen this many times as well and i have my suspicions...

In any case what i say isnt going to change anything really... dumb people and those with agendas will prevail on ATS there really is no way of stopping the tide of ignorance.

reply to post by nakiannunaki
Dito, every thread has their additional comments that are not needed but as Benevolent Heretic said just try and ignore these people and they might just get fed up?
It won't happen but keep your head and just let their negative energy emplode into them.

reply to post by nakiannunaki


Like this one perhaps?
www.abovetopsecret.com...

Huge dfference between refuting false claims and derailing a thread. I feel it is the responsibility of those that know correctly to put to rest false claims. However, we should respect the contrary opinions of others.

Seeing as this is the "Age of Information," destroying disinformation and falsities is the new chivalrous crusade!

To be frank in a public forum if you state something that is completely and utterly none sense someone is going to point it out. At other times if you have the back bone then you can back bone your threads as I say. Meaning you can present your information and if you are challenged you can back it up with facts or your hypothesis on the facts. To all and out say, this person doesn't agree with me why is this person doing this, this person made a joke about the subject, how dare they is just plain ignorant. I mean come on in a public forum you are not going to have 100% agreement on anything. That is just the facts of life right there and you are not going to be able to run away from it. That being said I fully understand in a conspiracy forum there is going to be hard lines on both sides, but just learn a friendly debate doesn't have to get personal for one to make a point. Censorship in any form of public debate is not right IMO.

reply to post by nakiannunaki


Lol. You know, every post I made in that thread you are alluding to, even the ones that said that I thought is was the shameless promotion of a musical artist, bumped your thread. And it still did not take off. And chain posting several videos is not really putting ones heart and soul into a thread. Other comments were, "add some explanation instead of just a title and videos."

Originally posted by Illusionsaregrander
reply to post by nakiannunaki

 

Lol. You know, every post I made in that thread you are alluding to, even the ones that said that I thought is was the shameless promotion of a musical artist, bumped your thread. And it still did not take off. And chain posting several videos is not really putting ones heart and soul into a thread. Other comments were, "add some explanation instead of just a title and videos."

yeah laugh away.. its all a big joke to people like you isnt it. Makes me wonder about your affiliations with ATS though... im almost certain im not wrong about that much at least...

so who you working for?? hmm??