Chick-fil-A controversy shines light on restaurant's Christian DNA

Lesson 1 >

Don't piss off the American Gay Lobby. They will come and get you with an over the top smear campaign (bully you etc). This minority will scream to the majority "what and how" we should do things as they see fair. They stand up for what THEY believe to be right.

Lesson 2 >

Follow the lead of the American Gay lobby. Stand up for what YOU believe in. If you don't believe in Gay marriage, then tell everyone, hold protests, run smear campaigns, basically jump up and down and scream how unfair it is.

Ignore "political correctness" and say what YOU feel (PC was a tactic created to mute you, and it's working).

Originally posted by Byteman
It's only a reach if you are ignorant of what misrepresentation means.

It's not misrepresentation.

They've said that they're pro-gay, yet they've donated to an anti-gay organisation. You could sue just about every single business for contradictory claims and statements.

If someone did bring a legal case against them for this reason, if it wasn't instantly thrown out for being frivolous, then their defence lawyer would have an absolute field day !

This is a huge reach.

Originally posted by Byteman
Yes customer DO choose to part their money for the food provided, that is how a restaurant works. I never said otherwise.

So how would their stance on something that is totally irrelevant to the service that they provide possibly be construed as ''gaining money by false pretenses'' ?

If they were an equal rights charity, and still donated to an anti-gay cause, then I could understand it, but seeing as that has nothing to do with their business, I fail to see how any such litigation could possibly be successful.

Originally posted by Byteman
Only if the transaction is permanently satisfactory (within statues of limitation) for both parties.

Which it was, unless the customer had a problem with his meal or service.

Originally posted by Byteman
Yes it is.
The right to privacy doesn't protect you from defrauding customers.

If they take a gay persons money pretending they are neutral, and then give it to an anti-gay organization. They have harmed the gay person by denying the gay person the right to protest the anti-gay organization.

That's not ''defrauding'' somebody.

I wouldn't ethically defend a company saying one thing and doing the other, but this is business. We all know that successful businesses tend to be amoral, and are largely driven by making money.

To selectively point this out about this particular business is ridiculous, as if you scratch at the surface, you'll find most businesses have at least one example of something that blemishes their record.

Like sportswear manufacturers who sponsor charity events while at the same time using Far-Eastern sweatshops.

To sue a company on such flimsy ground is completely frivolous, which is probably why no one has attempted to do this ( even in the litigation-mad USA ).

Originally posted by Byteman
Another way of putting it, if the gay person would have shopped elsewhere knowing Chick-fil-a's real stance on homosexuality, and Chick-fil-a hid that real stance. Then Chick-fil-a is liable for profiting through fraud.

And how would this be proved ? As I say, their lawyer would have a field-day.

The customer got the service they paid for, so their was no deception involved in the transaction.

Originally posted by Byteman
What I find EXTREMELY funny, is how you are gung-ho for the Chick-fil-a's right to be anti-gay, but you refuse to consider the gay persons right to protest.

How come only the private corporation gets all your consideration, but not the private citizen?

Me ?!

Where have I ever said that ? I've said all along:

A private business has the right to donate to any organisation they wish to.

A customer has the right to patronise any business they wish to, and they have the right to protest against any business they wish to for whatever reason.


Where have I said anything differently ? You've clearly misrepresented my words and intent.

Unless you are ignorant of what misrepresentation means.

Originally posted by charles1952
reply to post by Annee

 

Dear Annee,

I'm just a little disappointed that you didn't respond to my last post. Oh well, can't have all the cake.

I'm sorry. There are reasons I'm only here (on ATS) sporadically.

Originally posted by IronArm
reply to post by Annee

 

Its not a matter of gay rights...they can do whatever they please. Its no bother to me. What grinds my gears is when they expect the rest of society to not only support them, but encourage them and fund them.

Please explain.

Originally posted by IronArm
The whole premise of this discussion is about a company supporting a STRAIGHT focused group.

As I previously stated. Marriage Equality is my chosen political focus. I've been following it for at least 10 years.

You really think I don't know what Focus on Family Groups do?

reply to post by Annee

A corporation is responsible for every thing associated with it. Saying "it was a franchise - it wasn't me" - - is not going to cut it.

Providing free food to a group known to politically and financially support denial of Marriage Equality - - - does make Chick A Fil - - - a target - - even if indirectly. You boycott the "power" - - the one who will be most affected.

By that same line of reasoning...

Bob and Tom are neighbors. Bob is an honest person; Tom is a known burglar and thief. Bob is wealthy; Tom is poor.

One day Tom asks Bob to use his hammer, because Tom needs to do some minor house work. Bob lets him use the hammer. Someone who Tom had robbed sees it and sues Bob... after all, Bob is supporting Tom, and Bob has more money than Tom does.

Does this sound fair to you at all?

TheRedneck

At the end of the day it's all posturing. The same people miffed because of a supposed slight probably shop at Wal Mart, does this mean by shopping there they support child slave labor and sweat shops? I mean after all, their politics aren't that great.

Originally posted by TheRedneck
reply to post by Annee

A corporation is responsible for every thing associated with it. Saying "it was a franchise - it wasn't me" - - is not going to cut it.

Providing free food to a group known to politically and financially support denial of Marriage Equality - - - does make Chick A Fil - - - a target - - even if indirectly. You boycott the "power" - - the one who will be most affected.

By that same line of reasoning...

Bob and Tom are neighbors. Bob is an honest person; Tom is a known burglar and thief. Bob is wealthy; Tom is poor.

One day Tom asks Bob to use his hammer, because Tom needs to do some minor house work. Bob lets him use the hammer. Someone who Tom had robbed sees it and sues Bob... after all, Bob is supporting Tom, and Bob has more money than Tom does.

Does this sound fair to you at all?

TheRedneck

I do appreciate the analogy try - - - but it doesn't quite fit for me. We aren't talking about a small neighborhood business.

We are talking about "power money" - - a company/corporation - - - that has political pull/influence amongst a certain group. A certain group interfering in the personal lives of others. Lives that have no affect on them in any way.

Mostly gays want the legal protection - legal marriage affords. Would you want to be in a 60 year relationship - - have your partner die - - then some distant relative of your partner take your home and everything personal that you shared with your partner - - because you have no legal rights. This happens over and over. And that's just one example.

Its inhumane and not right.

I am very familiar with "Focus on Family" groups - - - and their organized anti-gay efforts - - backed by organized religion. Any donation to one of these groups - - is potential support for their anti-gay efforts.

There's been a major campaign started for "Anti-Bullying" in schools. Are you aware how many kids committed suicide in 2010 because of bullying?

Focus On The Family has decided Anti-Bullying Efforts Are A Gay Front. tpmmuckraker.talkingpointsmemo.com...

Originally posted by Annee

Originally posted by IronArm
The whole premise of this discussion is about a company supporting a STRAIGHT focused group.

As I previously stated. Marriage Equality is my chosen political focus. I've been following it for at least 10 years.

You really think I don't know what Focus on Family Groups do?

this is correct, I am ABSOLUTELY certain you have no idea whatsoever what focus on the family is does or represents.
I will ask you again, Is it a lie to call Dr. James Dobson a reverend?
Don't you think that might be significant if you have been at this topic for 10 years?
I mean, what gain is it for you to misrepresent those you choose to demonize and protest?
Doesn't it destroy all your credibility? So why do it and make the claims?

reply to post by Annee


no, you just must not read your own sources.
What they said was that the gay rights groups are using this issue to politicise their own indoctrination tools into the school systems
"Cushman cited a "back to school guide" published by GLSEN and books titled Two Moms, the Zark and Me and The Full Spectrum as examples of GLSEN's tactics in action."

So, now we are saying this is about anyone that sells processed meats or biblical marriage supporters that have a business and makes money that others are offended by, and whether or not 1'st graders learn about sexual desires and what they, who or what this has to do with tetherball, 4 square and spitballs

sheesh, I am almost sad I got into this topic..
Is this really how far we have come the last few years since I looked at this?
It's now a punishable offense to not want gay/lesbian/transvestite literature given to Johnny and Susie years before puberty?
This is starting to freak me out.
Seriously, this is your big arg about the "anti-gayness" of focus on the family?
Man, you have been at this for 10 years and this is what you are coming up with when you google?

reply to post by Annee

I do appreciate the analogy try - - - but it doesn't quite fit for me. We aren't talking about a small neighborhood business.

Exactly my point... you are using situational ethics to press forward a viewpoint without regard to actual facts! I just posted an excerpt from Dan Cathy wherein he stated that his organization has no political aspirations, never have had, nor ever intend to have. There is also no evidence I have found that Chik-Fil-A is a regular donor to the Pennsylvania Family Institute... only that they agreed to donate food for a single event.

And yet, none of that matters. You hate them, so they must be bad, must be political, must be after your rights, must be 'anti-gay'...

No! It doesn't work that way Annee!

We do not have laws that say one person has to do so-and-so and another has to do something else. The law is the law for everyone... that simple concept is the very basis for your argument. But now you seemingly want to break this legal equality for everyone in order to get it for a minority?

I have been trying to get you to see this, but apparently you cannot. A pity...

Focus On The Family has decided Anti-Bullying Efforts Are A Gay Front.

Really, you should stop reading these hateful reports. I tried to, and just got confused. It appears to be a bunch of allegations and out-of-context quotes thrown together in a blender to sensationalize an issue. The anti-bullying efforts are at best a joke and at worst doing the opposite of what they were intended, anyway. I have personal experience that the bullies are typically treated as a victim while the victims are typically treated like a bully.

Care to explain what the "Gay, Lesbian and Straight Education Network" has to do with the effort anyway? Or, for that matter, why there is such an organization at all when schools shouldn't be teaching sexuality?

TheRedneck

reply to post by Annee



...Whats to explain? My taxes go towards supporting gay parades for example. Massive orgies in the downtown of my city, covered in half naked men and women in BDSM gear, disgustingly repulsive launguage, stuff that my child should not be seeing! Yet....they recieve hundreds of thousands of dollars in order to shut down roads, blockade streets, recieve donations, etc... All for a giant orgy. This is one example that truely drives me mad. How would a Straight Pride Parade go? Sounds like prosecution lawyers making money for the offended homosexual populace!

And as a side note...you really do have a huge hate-on for Focus on the Family eh? Well...the group was created by a reverend (as previously noted), so I'm quite sure that he is permitted to create a group that is indeed, focused on a traditional family system. Evil? Apparently so! For no man shall stand up against homosexuality if his moral compass points him otherwise! THIS is forced conformity. I'd have to say...for being so worried about 'rights' you forget everyone elses! This group can and will support what and who they want. So will Chick-Fil-A. So will Nike. So will Pepsi. So will Bob Dylan and Paul McCartney and blah blah blah. This isn't in your control now is it? Fight for your ideals, go ahead, but do not, please, do not tread on our toes.

I made a follow up thread to this one that states how I feel about factory farming:

www.abovetopsecret.com...


Hopefully TheRedneck doesn't beat me up for spaming his forum with Chick-fil-A threads. It has a purpose, i swear!

Originally posted by TheRedneck
The law is Care to explain what the "Gay, Lesbian and Straight Education Network" has to do with the effort anyway? Or, for that matter, why there is such an organization at all when schools shouldn't be teaching sexuality?

TheRedneck

Sorry - - I support the "Gay, Lesbian and Straight Education Network".

Children are a lot smarter and more aware then many adults give them credit for. My 10 year old granddaughter knows what gay is - - and just accepts it as part of natural life - - and the way some people are born.

Its really sad when Adults force their prejudices on children.

reply to post by Annee

Please, feel free to support whomever you wish... however, this statement worries me:

Its really sad when Adults force their prejudices on children.

Are those educating our children not adults also? I entered this thread because I firmly and wholeheartedly believe that it is my decision to run my business as I see fit and not how others think it should be run... but I am also firmly and wholeheartedly convinced that it a parent's inalienable and inherent right to raise their children as they see fit. Yes, that means keeping sexual indoctrination out of public schools.

If allowing gay marriage means either of those principles must be sacrificed, I assure you I will fight tooth and nail against any attempt to legitimize gay marriage from here on out.

You right to equality ends when it infringes upon mine.

TheRedneck

reply to post by TheRedneck


We obviously live in different worlds.

Signing off - - as there is nothing more to say.

reply to post by Annee

That we do, Annee. May your world be happy and pleasant for you, but may it never cross the boundary into mine.

TheRedneck

reply to post by TheRedneck



Redneck....Thank you for saying the points that so desperatly needed to be said.

Originally posted by Annee

Originally posted by Lemon.Fresh
Reply to post by Annee

 

Well go ahead and boycott them for providing a lunch to a group of people.

Ridiculous.

Inequality is not ridiculous.

Religion is the #1 reason for inequality IMO.

I will continue - - as many others do - - boycotting these companies.

REPLY: .... and they'll notice your absence like another gallon of water over Niagara Falls. Inequality is caused by many socio-economic reasons, and is different from one person to the next. I don't see inequality caused by Christianity; Islam? ..... number one.

Originally posted by Annee

Originally posted by TheRedneck
The law is Care to explain what the "Gay, Lesbian and Straight Education Network" has to do with the effort anyway? Or, for that matter, why there is such an organization at all when schools shouldn't be teaching sexuality?

TheRedneck

"Sorry - - I support the "Gay, Lesbian and Straight Education Network".

REPLY: There are those who believe in that group who also believe in inter-generational sex; You OK with that, too?

"Children are a lot smarter and more aware then many adults give them credit for. My 10 year old granddaughter knows what gay is - - and just accepts it as part of natural life - - and the way some people are born."

REPLY: Using the word "natural" is one thing, but homosexuality is not "normal." Especially when only 3 to 4% of a population leans that way.There is no "gay" gene, so why is someone "born" that way? Your granddaughter has been demoralized and taught about perversion, and you're proud of that? It's much more than being a homosexual; the tearing down of morality affects us all because it constantly tears down the morality of a society as a whole, and homosexuality becoming "normalized" was one of the planks of Communism intended to change America.... death by a thousand slices. "Gay" means happy and carefree, and has nothing to do with sexual preference, and that's what it is, a preference. There is no such thing as "Gay or Lesbian marriage because it doesn't exist; you have to invent something before you can outlaw it.... kind of like a square wheel. If "marriage" means everything, then it means nothing. A woman in Germany wanted to marry her horse a few years back, too.

"Its really sad when Adults force their prejudices on children."

REPLY: Prejudice? .... how about common sense? Just a few decades ago children were taught to be "discriminating" IE: to use one's knowledge and common sense to make decisions about a given topic. That has been taken away from their education, now they are being taught "situational ethics," with the intent and result being that each individual is to ignore what they're parents or preacher has taught them, and just do what feels right at the moment; a recipe for personal disaster in future years. America''s tolerance for homosexuals is one of the reasons Islam hates us so much.