Muslims, what do you do if your children want to convert?

Depending on how OPEN-MINDED and LOVING these parents are towards their children, let the children decide what is best for them. After all, the children will move on with their lives and the old parents will be stuck in their old ways, wondering what happened. That's the beauty of this world. Too many creative spirits want to be free of being hunted down and killed because of the decision they made in this lifetime.

You stone them with stones obviously. Haven't you seen the youtube videos?
I thought this was common knowledge.

Originally posted by Q2IN2Y
You stone them with stones obviously. Haven't you seen the youtube videos?
I thought this was common knowledge.

edit on 6-2-2011 by Q2IN2Y because: (no reason given)

I thought the in thing today was to behead them? Stoning is soo last week man.

This topic is very personal to me. My parents (and the majority of my family) are Muslim. About two years ago, I had to open up and tell my parents that I was agnostic (I believe in god, but I believe that the only real way to live your life is to be a good person and that it does not need to be as specific as that). My family and I live in Canada. My parents were fully supportive, albeit, a bit dissapointed, but to be honest, we've stayed as close as ever.

A have a cousin that lives in Washington who converted to Christianity (we are all a very close family), and his parents were fine too. They still visit a lot and the whole family is close with barely any problems. We acknowledge how in the end we believe in one god (something other people don't believe, which is totally cool).

I really love my family. They have always cared a lot for me. We are of Pakistani descent (Parents and I were born in Canada though). My dad refers to Pakistan as the #hole of the world, and I agree. There is so much bull# being pulled there, along with many places of the middle east. We DO NOT agree with honor killings and although this is all anecdotal evidence, for the many years of my life that I went to the mosque with hundreds of others, they were VERY peaceful people who were disgusted by the acts of extremist (and even some regular) Muslims.

I am not telling you to ignore the bad things Muslims do. Those are Muslim acts. They are done by a mix of extremism, anger, looking for hatred in verses, a persecution complex, etc. etc., and yes, religion does have something to do with that. However, it's unfair to say that all the Muslims like my family, who honest to god try to live their lives in peace (and have recieved a lot of help thanks to the community), are "not real Muslims". The five pillars of Islam are not about spreading by the sword, or hurting others. They are about charity, prayer, and one God. That is why I still respect the religion. It is also why I hate those that harm others, regardless of faith. And my parents would agree with me.

To be honest though, your mistrust is more than justified. The # that goes down in England (family there too ) is disgusting, and I have heard a lot about it. There are many sects of Islam however, many many many different sects. Mine alone has 60 million people, so just remember that there are 1.4? 1.5? billion Muslims, and actually pay attention to that number. It is very big.

But in the end, the Muslims are way better of here than in the Middle East, all of my relatives included. I want to acknowledge though, that the law there is so perverse and backward that you cannot call it the fault of a religion. After countless wars (due to MANY different causes, it's not all black and white), spread of poverty, and the fist of the powerful few over the many weak, anything can be used to manipulate hatred. Religion especially, which is the downside.

By the way, if you want to know why I'm no longer a Muslim, it is from an ayaat that says that you should trust your Muslim brothers over Non-Muslim friends. I cannot in my right mind do that, as my friends have been amazing and I love them with my heart.

Thanks for giving me the chance to voice my opinion. I'm a newbie btw

Originally posted by pianopraze


I find it interesting that the only Muslim reply I saw in this thread is calm and moderate while those speaking for Muslims are defaming the religion and saying they all want to kill anyone not Muslim.

You will see that all over the internet, I've seen many extremist views from non muslims, such has very serious replies, something like " we should nuke the whole middle east, turn it into glass" "Kill them all" etc etc etc

Then you would see thousands of intense threads all over the internet with arguments, opinions, debates about muslims, Mostly from non muslims, you would get a few friendly comments from muslims here and there, but they would often be ignored so they can continue their rants and hatred.

It's like there is a crazy phase in the past 10 years.
While most Muslims just live their life and enjoy life with their families, the rest of the world seems to spend all their free time debating, analyzing, panicking, getting paranoid, arguing, hating etc etc forever and ever about Islam and Muslims.

I think this thread explains it well, I see where he's coming from, it's almost comedic but so true. haha.
"I'm going cold turkey off of Muslims and Islam. I'm done with it"
www.abovetopsecret.com...

The reason you rarely see Muslims reply to these threads is because a lot of people are not INTERESTED in real Muslims opinions, and muslims have figured that out, there's no point trying.

For some reason a lot of people always prefer to focus on the negativity. Why are moderate nice muslims almost never in the news? because nobody cares about them. No everyone would much rather hear a story about a Muslim fireman deciding to pray when he was supposed to save a little girl's life. (that was made up by the way lol)
It's called propaganda, selective stories usually with headlines to get attention to anger and influence the public perspective.

Originally posted by trumpetthief1

"To be honest though, your mistrust is more than justified. The # that goes down in England (family there too

) is disgusting, and I have heard a lot about it."

I am from England and I was just wondering what s*** you meant?

Originally posted by MissTiger

Originally posted by trumpetthief1

"To be honest though, your mistrust is more than justified. The # that goes down in England (family there too

) is disgusting, and I have heard a lot about it."

I am from England and I was just wondering what s*** you meant?

Hey. My uncle and aunt and their 3 wonderful daughters (my cousins) live in England. My aunt (non blood related) also has a Christian brother with his own family, all whom we are close to.

What I'm referring to is the cases of certain extremist Muslims protesting in England AGAINST the country that they live in. I saw a few topics on ATS (been lurking for a while) which I think was about something that took place in England. It was about Rememberance day, and how certain Muslim people were protesting against it. As well, the cases of honor killings (my cousins told me about these), and the stuff that you guys are talking about right now. In our sect of Islam, one of the higher ups (we essentially vote a leader of the time to "guide" the community) made a statement that as a Muslim, you must be loyal to the country that you live in, no matter what the circumstances, so it's disheartening to hear about Muslims escaping the problems in the Middle East by coming to Europe, and then protesting in Europe essentially against the country they are living in.

Originally posted by trumpetthief1

I can only give my opinion but by what I see in England it is not the Muslims who escaped the Middle East in search of a better life that cause problems. Those that seeked out a better life worked, mixed with english people and I guess fitted in, maybe some denounced their religion in order to fit in which is sad but most tended to keep their religion private. English people would make comments about how blah blah was ok because he ate bacon or had a pint of beer down the pub which angers me because of the ignorance but as you say it was for a better life even if they had to put up with elements of racism.

It was when some of their children started to grow up that some of the problems started, in my opinion they had no real identity to cling onto. They were born in Britain, so they were British but they had dark skin..........it didn't matter if they were a Muslim or not, they still stood out and so some suffered attacks of racism,it wouldn't matter how many times they said they were born here, they would never be accepted as British by some white people. One minute we want them to fit in, the next we want to "send them back home" when they are actually home. Disowned by the country they were born in and unable to relate to their relatives from Bangladesh or Pakistan that was a totally different life to what they knew, they were lost, and the only thing that united and tied them all together was Islam. So Islam became stronger in this country in certain areas where they all tend to live together and they started to fight back against the racism and started to protect their religion that united them. It's true there has been honour killings so as not to bring shame on the family or religion but these are rare and most in my experience disown or try to send their children to the middle east.

All Muslims I have known call the middle east home and when they visit they are "going back home". I think it is easy for them to see it in a better light when they have money they have made here to spend there as they are seen as rich and do not have to suffer in the ways the first Muslims who moved from there did.

The protest march on Rememberance day was so wrong and disrespectfull to the dead and the relatives but maybe from their point of view this is their country too and they don't want to be at war.We allowed our country to have large amounts of mosques built, Islamic schools to be opened, Friday afternoons to be taken off, time for prayers, people who can't speak a word of english to live here and our benefit system allowed to be abused by people who have never paid a penny in tax (quite alot of white people do that too) . We wanted people to feel welcomed but it seems, not too welcome.

Originally posted by mobiusmale
reply to post by TheWalkingFox

 

Maybe you missed this earlier in this thread...

When asked about the death penalty for those who leave the Muslim religion, at least three-quarters of Muslims in Jordan (86%), Egypt (84%) and Pakistan (76%) say they would favor making it the law; in Nigeria, 51% of Muslims favor and 46% oppose it

Your arguments against being against the insanity of Islam do not hold water...

You make the same mistake as all of the other apologists out there. You try to claim that it is only a very minute percentage...a crazy, perverted, wacko minority of Muslims...who hold these homicidal views. The facts are that it is the vast majority who support this blood lust.

Using simple averages from the above...74% of the Muslims in these countries believe that a person who leaves the Muslim faith should be killed. That means that at least 300 million Muslims believe that their children should be put to death if they change religions. If one were to survey all Muslims in all Countries around the world, obviously the number would rise.

This is more than 3...

Still want to rant?

The problem with statistics like these is that you simply cannot generalise these findings for over a billion people - when approaching statistics, generalisability (sp?) is an effective measure of accuracy. However, a lot of researchers tend to interview individuals from backgrounds (such as lack of education) that they know will conform to or support the preconception that they want to present. To be honest, most Muslims won't do anything violent - they're just as human as everyone else and as long as their kids are good people then they'll eventually leave them to it - they're their children man! A minute portion of families in the most remote villages in extremely poor or uneducated countries might kill or hurt their kids, but in most households they'd probably just be temporarily ashamed at most. To be honest, there's no point converting between the big three religions seeing as they're already so similar, Islam has Jesus and Moses as well as most other prophets mentioned in the Christian and Jewish Holy Books - it doesn't make much sense that a Muslim would appreciate the relevance of Jesus and Moses but not Muhammad. I think a lot of parents would just say do as you please, as long as you're not hurting anybody. Maybe they would try to indoctrinate the kids (as would any Jewish or Christian parent, if they're that into it) but certainly wouldn't kill them, that is an act of uneducated savages, which is not a predetermination of Muslims - savages are a type of person you find worldwide. Hindus do the same thing, so do Christians, as do South East Asians. It's true that it's technically forbidden to convert from Islam, but hey I'm still breathing and have a great relationship with my parents - spiritual ideas and religious ideas often intertwine.

Originally posted by catwhoknowsplusone
reply to post by TheWalkingFox

 

A message to Fox.

I am not trolling.

If I was trolling I would be on the streets right now,

What the eff are you talking about?

The only thing I have probably done right in my life is speak the truth.

Lmao you can't be serious. Here is what a troll is en.wikipedia.org...

People that use computers and the internet never cease to amaze me.

reply to post by catwhoknowsplusone


If my child tried to convert, I would do the same as any Christian or Jewish parent and try like hell to change his or her mind. I would NOT however take their life. To the second poster who said that a "devout" muslim would kill them, that is complete bull. In the time the Qur'an was revealed, a lot of people of ANY faith would respond to a breaking of religious commitment with violence. That was then, and this is now. In all honesty people need to learn to apply the teachings of the faith to 2011, and so forth.

Sincerely,
A Proud Muslim

Originally posted by pianopraze

Originally posted by sallamy
I don't mind.

I will teach them what I know and leave them to make their own choices when they become adults.

Times have changed now, and people have changed.

I find it interesting that the only Muslim reply I saw in this thread is calm and moderate while those speaking for Muslims are defaming the religion and saying they all want to kill anyone not Muslim.

Before we go pointing fingers at Muslims look at Christianity's track record during the inquisition, witch trials, and in general it's whole history. How soon we forget Bosnia, Ireland, German death camps, Crusades... If you add up all the numbers I think Christians might be on top in total killings.

Before we go blaming a religion, I suggest we point to the human heart and the human condition.

ETA... please see my post here probing this tendency.

edit on 6-2-2011 by pianopraze because: (no reason given)

Fact Check: Muslims started the genocide in the Balkans not Christians.
50,000-200,000 are estimated to be killed in the Witch hunts that where often carried out by secular governments at the request of women who accused other women of being witches(akin to modern day false rape and false DV accusations). Ireland, or more correctly N Ireland had more to do with nationalism then religion. Crusades, again caused by the Muslim invaders. The Nazi's where left wing atheist's that held a gun to the German Church's head(a good number of preachers who wouldn't go along ended up in the death camps), inconsequentially Hitler was a big fan of islam. Infact the SS units responsible for causing the most European Jewish deaths where muslims from the Balkan area that enlisted.

P.S Genghis Khan is still the record holder for person responsible for most human deaths and suffering, and if history serves me correctly didn't the mongels convert to islam?

P.S Marxist come in second with atheist in third place.

...

reply to post by catwhoknowsplusone

But what makes me really angry is the fact that a lot of Muslims are given a hospitable welcome in foreign countries, having run away from their own countries, but they will not let their children integrate into those countries.

If this were true we wouldnt have people like...

Amir Khan

Yasmin Qureshi

Zinedine Zidane

Omid Djalili

Naseem Hamed

Frédéric Kanouté

Art Malik

Sami Yusuf

Mishal Husain

Samira Ahmed

Khalid Aziz

And there are many many more...

Every Muslim i know is happily settled in to western life. In every culture/religion/race you will get a small minority that wish to remain on the fringes of society or hold extreme views. However, do not believe the daily mail/fox news/msm hype which tries to make us believe that, with regards to Muslims, it is the rule rather than the exception.

It’s simply not the case.

Peace