Muslims, what do you do if your children want to convert?

Originally posted by beezzer
reply to post by TheWalkingFox

 

whaah.

I like muslims just fine. Especially the ones that don't try to kill me. But we are talking about a religion that would kill someone for drawing a cartoon about mohomed. (sp?)

No, you're talking about a religion that you're so informed about that you have no idea how to spell the name of its prime figure. I suppose Jay-Z is the christian dude, right?

I'm talking about a religion that contains 1.7 billion human beings across pretty much very country an culture in the world. You're talking about a religion that mumbers in the low thousands and exists primarily in tabloids.

Not a whole lot of tolerance. If you'd care to address the issue at hand, that would be great.

The issue at hand is yet another dopey-ass "Hurp durp Muslims are BAD!" thread on ATS.

I take it your religion is Islam.

This would come as quite a surprise. I'm not even monotheist

What would YOU do if your child switched to christianity?

Pity them for joining a slave religion that teaches their entire reason for existing is to tremble in fear of eternal torture at the hands of a loving undead god who has condemned the whole of humanity because some chick ate a fruit, unless they supplicate hard enough at his feet. Same as I do for all Christians. Really, it seems like a terrific way to waste your life.

Of course, my kids would probably grow out of that "Joining an apocalyptic death cult to piss daddy off" phase eventually, and will look back on the misspent time with humored resignation. We'd all sip our beer and laugh at the silliness of youth.

Just curious.

Satisfied?

Originally posted by FalselyFlagged

Originally posted by beezzer
reply to post by catwhoknowsplusone

 

cat, you have your answer. It is punishable by death.

]

Cat has their answer? From who? A bunch of people are not muslim told them something they heard on fox news?

Most muslims these days are moderate (including me) and I would let my kid make their own decisions. A lot of muslims wouldn't be happy, but death is a bit outlandish. Think about this. There's millions of muslims in the US, a good percentage of which are not practicing or even atheist muslim (just like there are many athiest jews). How many people do you hear getting murdered for apostasy in the USA every day? Oh, that's right. None.

You people ask the questions, but you already have your preconcieved notions. Actually, most of you answer is if you actually are a muslim. But you're not.

Sorry to rain on your ignorance parade...

edit on 6-2-2011 by FalselyFlagged because: (no reason given)

Ooops, sorry captain harsh. But. . . .

Maher al-Gohary has converted from Islam to Christianity. In spite of facing death threats, he's engaged in a legal battle to have his changed religion recognised on his official Egyptian documents.

news.bbc.co.uk...

Hanged for being a Christian in Iran
Eighteen years ago, Rashin Soodmand's father was hanged in Iran for converting to Christianity. Now her brother is in a Mashad jail, and expects to be executed under new religious laws brought in this summer. Alasdair Palmer reports.

www.telegraph.co.uk...

Rifqa Bary, 17, ran away from her family in Columbus, Ohio, in July and took refuge in the central Florida home of the Rev. Blake Lorenz with the Global Revolution Church in Orlando.

The teen heard of the pastor and his church through a prayer group on Facebook. The girl's parents reported her missing to Columbus police, who found her two weeks later in Florida through cell phone records.

The teenager, in a sworn affidavit, claims her father, Mohamed Bary, 47, was pressured by the mosque the family attends in Ohio to "deal with the situation." In the court filing, Rifqa Bary stated her father said, "If you have this Jesus in your heart, you are dead to me!" The teenager claims her father added, "I will kill you!"

www.sodahead.com...

These are but just three examples. Would love to debate the issue with you.

reply to post by TheWalkingFox


So you reply with insults, rhetoric. . . . . but sadly no facts.

Please, tell me where I am wrong. Show me links, proof that I am wrong. I am willing to debate the issue. Are you?

Originally posted by beezzer
reply to post by TheWalkingFox

 

So you reply with insults, rhetoric. . . . . but sadly no facts.

My post was full of facts - I'm talking about Islam, you're talking about ultra-fundie sensationalist tabloid Islam. That's a fact. My issue is with another dumbassed "ISLAM ARE BADS!" thread. That's another fact. I'm not even in the same neighborhood as Islam - yet another fact. Christianity is an apocalyptic death cult - ANOTHER fact.

And all of these facts were direct answers to the questions you posed to me.

I'm not sure how I insulted you, or left your pressing questions unanswered, or responded without facts. As far as I can tell, I responded completely thoroughly, and you're just shoving the goalpost somewhere else.

Please, tell me where I am wrong. Show me links, proof that I am wrong. I am willing to debate the issue. Are you?

Prove you wrong. Okay, here's me proving you wrong.

Muslim parents not killing their children is not news. The insanely vast overwhelming majority of them obviously do not murder their own children. You will not find any news stories, no links, no articles where an astonished reporter is going "My... my god, the child is still alive!" If non-murder were in fact newsworthy, you would have a very valid point. But really, "Muslim parents fail to kill child!" is a headline sort of like "It rained somewhere today!"

Incidentally, by the rules of logical debate, you need to prove yourself right. So far you have shown us three stories about apostates targeted for death by someone. Overlooking that this is different from parents killing their own kids over it, that's still three people. Out of one billion and seven hundred million people.

So if you're trying to "prove" that this is a common practice with wide acceptance - as far as I can tell, that is what you're trying to prove - you're going to need to do a bit better. Well, a lot better. You need a lot more data. You need to gather instances of parents murdering their kids, as well as parents NOT murdering their kids, for instance. You're going to need to do this in a fairly great quanity - remember, we're looking at over a billion people here, from all walks of life. You then compile this data, present it to your peers, and state what your gathered evidence seems to support - even if it radically contradicts your initial hypothesis.

Sounds hard? Yeah it is. But you're the one that wants to prove your case, aren't you? Have fun with hte scientific method, Beezzer.

Originally posted by catwhoknowsplusone
reply to post by beezzer

 

Fox is a total arsehole.

He is probably the site owner.

He likes to stir #.

I'm certainly not the site owner. As for the rest? Glass houses, chuckles.

reply to post by TheWalkingFox


So the muslim parents that ARE killing their children are what? An anomoly? You still provide nothing but rhetoric.

They (the people that kill) are stating that they are doing it in accordance to their beliefs. And you argue. . . . what?

That muslims who don't kill are the example?

I don't get it. Please elaborate.

reply to post by TheWalkingFox

Overlooking that this is different from parents killing their own kids over it, that's still three people. Out of one billion and seven hundred million people.

1- The government is your parents parent. (Whether hippies like this or not, this is todays world)

2- I find the fact that you in a way excuse the killing of 3 people rather telling of ignorance. Sure, only 3 cases were linked. Yet, how many do you think go unlinked?

It's not a competition, remember that.

reply to post by TheWalkingFox


These are facts:

www.telegraph.co.uk...

www.abovetopsecret.com...

www.abovetopsecret.com...

reply to post by TheWalkingFox


Maybe you missed this earlier in this thread...

When asked about the death penalty for those who leave the Muslim religion, at least three-quarters of Muslims in Jordan (86%), Egypt (84%) and Pakistan (76%) say they would favor making it the law; in Nigeria, 51% of Muslims favor and 46% oppose it

Your arguments against being against the insanity of Islam do not hold water...

You make the same mistake as all of the other apologists out there. You try to claim that it is only a very minute percentage...a crazy, perverted, wacko minority of Muslims...who hold these homicidal views. The facts are that it is the vast majority who support this blood lust.

Using simple averages from the above...74% of the Muslims in these countries believe that a person who leaves the Muslim faith should be killed. That means that at least 300 million Muslims believe that their children should be put to death if they change religions. If one were to survey all Muslims in all Countries around the world, obviously the number would rise.

This is more than 3...

Still want to rant?

Those who want sharia law, send them away - go back to your oppressive country. But the women will have no choice.

In fact, those who want sharia law should be watched closely - this is where the terrorists come from.

Those who want freedom - let them stay.

Just as I thought. When provided the oppourtunity to debate the issue we either get rhetoric or
*cricket*
*cricket*
*cricket*

Pity. I was looking forward to debate. Didn't anticipate a cowardly hit and run.

disown them.

Originally posted by Seagle
disown them.

Um they're muslim, not episcopalians. BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA -sorry got disowned a while back-HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

reply to post by beezzer


This is somewhat off topic, but...

When did rhetoric become a dirty word? It seems to have begun with that Sarah Palin assassination scandal. Do most ATS members/Americans that use the word rhetoric think that it means "empty, meaningless drivel" or something?

I mean, Rhetoric is the Art of Being Right. Without rhetoric, you are just spewing gibberish.

I don't mind.

I will teach them what I know and leave them to make their own choices when they become adults.

Times have changed now, and people have changed.

This is what would happen:

1) Terrorize the kid with slander.
2) Kick the child out.
3) Murder.
4) Break every bone.
5) Break furniture.
6) Spit on the child.
7) Take him to a mosque and let someone from the mosque hit him or worse. OR just question the child.
8) No food for the child and more restrictions.
9) Torn the child's clothes or throw them away since the parent's bought him it. Especially robes and hats.
10) Torture, no joke.
11) Let a friend to the family hit the child.

You may call this bull, but I can assure you these things happen.

Originally posted by sallamy
I don't mind.

I will teach them what I know and leave them to make their own choices when they become adults.

Times have changed now, and people have changed.

I find it interesting that the only Muslim reply I saw in this thread is calm and moderate while those speaking for Muslims are defaming the religion and saying they all want to kill anyone not Muslim.

Before we go pointing fingers at Muslims look at Christianity's track record during the inquisition, witch trials, and in general it's whole history. How soon we forget Bosnia, Ireland, German death camps, Crusades... If you add up all the numbers I think Christians might be on top in total killings.

Before we go blaming a religion, I suggest we point to the human heart and the human condition.

ETA... please see my post here probing this tendency.