The Quest for Physical Immortality

I think I read somewhere that even with the aging process stopped or reversed, the average human lifespan would be only 400-500 years in length. Why? Because eventually all those people who would have died from natural causes would die from accidents; be it car crashes, falling down the stairs and breaking their necks, violence and so on.

Entropy.

By the way, I do believe drastically extended lifespans and near immortality will be achieved within some of our lifetimes.

As for avoiding accidents? They're going to have to think of something else for that. That's where our robotic future comes in...

Originally posted by Maxine1969
reply to post by Maxine1969

 

He has already stated quite openly that he envisages the need to go into hiding at some point, fake his own death, and adopt a new identity, so this would mean abandoning existing family members and friends. And a relocation would also be necessary, to successfully 'hide' he couldn't risk being recognized by someone if he moved only a few miles away.

What advice would you give him, here and now?

In today's modern world, such a decision would be extremely difficult to accomplish with any degree of success. Even as little as 50 years ago, it was still surprisingly easy to do and extremely easy just a few hundred years ago, But today, almost every aspect of normal day to day existence results in a voluminous paper and electronic trail that easily tracks and identifies an individual. In fact, for the average person, it's virtually impossible to not leave such identifying tracks as they go about their daily lives

As for faking his own death in the hope of acquiring anonymity, I'm wondering just how much thought and consideration your friend really has given to the mechanics of such an act ? Would he inform family members and friends beforehand or would he simply "die" ? Faking your own death is not as simple as it may seem as just the slightest loose end or hint that all is not what it seems will inevitably invites the close scrutiny from various governmental agencies. Informing family and friends beforehand will leave him essentially wide open to possible future disclosure - whether intentional or accidental. Is he prepared to completely and irrevocably sever ALL contact and NEVER being in contact with any of them EVER again? Is he absolutely prepared to, and has the will power, to go it alone ?
Will he close all his bank accounts and liquidate his assets beforehand (making any death look suspicious) ... or will he be prepared to abandon all his possessions and attempt to start over with nothing but what he can carry on his person ?
And even if successful, then what ? Unless your friend is essentially very wealthy, day to day survival will be challenging to say the least. Everything will have to be paid for in cash. Renting accommodation require some form of identity disclosure. Purchasing a car or even just renting one will require identity.
What about obtaining employment ? Again, identity required.
Medical treatment ? Again, identity required.
Even minor police actions such as a traffic violation could bring his "disappearance" crashing down around him ... what if he got finger printed ? dna tested ?

Internet access, emailing, etc ... absolutely mandatory to minimize electronic trails and therefore at a minimum, make use of proxy servers and disposable email accounts.

And the above is only a small sample of the difficulties and challenges ahead of your friend that he will have to be aware of and devise contingency plans for. He absolutely can not, and must not, leave any aspect of disappearing up to chance.

Without suitable identity, how will he be able to plan for and prepare for subsequent future identity changes ?
If he doesn't have sufficient finances available (as I'm assuming he doesn't at the moment), each and every identity change will be a long drawn out, very difficult and dangerous period in his existence.
Upon establishing his "new life", it should become one of his main priorities to begin building up a secure and stable financial base that he can easily access during each transition. The greater this financial base, the easier, simpler and more secure will the transition period become.
This financial base should primarily revolve around gold and precious stones - possibly silver. All stored in multiple locations that are absolutely safe, absolutely secure and absolutely reachable at all times. Also various separate storage locations of local currency for immediate transitional access until he's in a position to convert some gold, etc.

So, it's almost a given that he will require a new identity to be created which inevitably means he will need to approach those "members of society" with the requisite skills to create and provide very good quality identification that can stand up to a reasonable amount of scrutiny if the situation should arise. And such a new identity creation process definitely does not come cheaply.The "better" the identity, the more it will cost. Does your friend have the necessary knowledge to be able to locate and approach such individuals ? Can he afford it ? If not, his "new life" will be bleak, indeed.

Having to commit to making ones self disappear for the first time, I have to truthfully say that your friend has picked the worst possible era in human existence in which to do it. How much more prepared would he be if he already had 100's of years, if not millenia, in which to practice and hone such an absolutely essential survival skill. In past eras, as it became necessary to once again disappear, moving on and starting afresh was never so difficult or fraught with complications as it is now. Those were times when slight mistakes or miscalculations did NOT have such critical repercussions as they do now.

Anyway, I can't begin to list all the possible ways that creating a new identity can, and have, gone wrong.

Should he pursue this course of action, then it's inevitable that he will make many, many mistakes.
Unfortunately, the first time will always be the hardest. If he survives, future transitions will get easier and easier if he puts the required effort into forward thinking and planning.

reply to post by Maxine1969


Thanks to everyone who's contributed so far - much interesting material been submitted, and gratefully received

To round up a few responses in one hit - the Christian doctrine of eternal life entails (as I understand it) resurrection, therefore death THEN eternal life. Bit of a "glitch" for someone who has a political goal to achieve?

I don't think fear of dying is a factor, as my colleague maintains that he wishes to achieve his goal, and envisages more than one lifetime being requires.

Vampires - Current "Goth" kids seem to see a chain which goes vampires -> Dracula -> Vladimir the Impaler. This completely ignores the fact that characters such as "Varney the Vampire" were being written about YEARS before Dracula made an appearance in print. (in fact I think Varney was in print the year Bram Stoker was born). So while debate continues about what vampires really ARE, the fact is that they have been in the popular awareness for a long time

Very interesting point regarding establishing a financial base (stones, metals), as well as hard currency. Apart from the fact that it was a badly edited and poorly thought out film (in my opinion) I thought that "Highlander" had a couple of interesting points, about the fact that a Methuselah would be an IDEAL antique dealer, (who would have better first hand knowledge on antiques?), and also (potentially) that antiques might make a good investment if you had more than one lifetime to wait for their value to increase.

Originally posted by Maxine1969
reply to post by Maxine1969

 

....
Vampires - Current "Goth" kids seem to see a chain which goes vampires -> Dracula -> Vladimir the Impaler. This completely ignores the fact that characters such as "Varney the Vampire" were being written about YEARS before Dracula made an appearance in print. (in fact I think Varney was in print the year Bram Stoker was born). So while debate continues about what vampires really ARE, the fact is that they have been in the popular awareness for a long time
....

They have been popular.. probably why they aren't keen on people knowing they are really just a sentience attached to a bunch of virus that take over (infect) bodies... That would shoot the whole 'glamor' right in the foot, if people knew it was just like getting a VERY nasty cold.. *lol* But that is what I see about them in the racial unconscious.
It is interesting that when you factor in their fear of silver (it isn't the cross they're afraid of; it is the fact that crosses in earlier times were made of silver), the awareness that being bitten by a vampire might make you a vampire, and that garlic, an exceedingly well known anti-bacterial and anti-viral herb, will keep them away as well, the idea of their species being pathogen-based doesn't really seem too far fetched, eh??

I believe that most of all the evil committed by E.T.s are the result of thier disbelief in God or an afterlife.

Originally posted by SystemResistor
I believe that most of all the evil committed by E.T.s are the result of thier disbelief in God or an afterlife.

I see them all knowing that there isn't an afterlife.. merely the next life. It is only we humans that can't remember past lives.
And the 'evil' committed by ETs is pretty much limited to the Jue-sah (aka top level of the illuminati which is still alien) and the tall skinny blue people, who are using us against the Jue-sah, their most hated enemy. The rest of them are either watching or as much as possible helping. There are some rat-like semi sentient beings who have found a way to create a 'spaceship' type body who are behind the cattle mutilations and such. They are hunted and killed as much as possible by all the other aliens. Nasty little things...

Your "friend" does sound very interesting and your intriuge is well justified.

Achieving immortality methods have been discussed for many many years and if his agenda is the only reason he wishes to gain it then it seems as if he has two options. 1) keep trying until he reaches his immortality, document his own experimentation privately, search for people that understand the importance of his agenda that are willing to join his plight, annoynomously, have those people pass down their shared plight to their children and have them pick up where they left off. Led by the one who found immortality yet wouldnt share the knowledge and instead planned his fake death to hide the fact. 2) our lifetimes are interconnected with our children living on when we die. How many lifetimes does he need to accomplish it? Pass down the plight to the younger generations until said goal can be reached. He actually will become immortal in a sense here although not the order that he wanted.

It sounds like (without knowing what he is really up to) he is saying that he wishes to gain immortality to have enough time to help our race as he believes that he can. His idea might be so revolutionary that it just might be true but why does he need to be the one to see it through? If I had such a plan I would be just fine with someone else seeing it to the end even if it meant that i didnt get to enjoy its fruit and place my focus on the plan instead of selfish immortality. If he really was in it for the human race then the cure for death is a biggie right there. Going into hiding means that he never intends on helping others over come anything because one with that knowledge could not have anything more important to push. He might have convinced himself that he intends to help others, but live 200 years and he will have a different opinion of humans and have a change of heart anyway but at least he helped himself first. It always was and will be imortality for himself and that sounds too selfish even to him so he added a fix the race idea into the mix to avoid the crazy stares from those he trusted enough to tell his plans to. I am surprised that you speak of him with such regard as most of our brothers and sisters are very quick to run away from those that think outside of society's borders. You have been inspired by his dedication instead of watching him for slips of the tounge. "oh what a tangled web we weave" kinda thing eventually forming a contradiction in his story if you are looking for it.

Its funny but many cults have been formed on this basis only to end up with the leader saying we all gotta drink this stuff to become immortal and poof they are imortal but rather surprised as to where they will be enjoying it.

Someone that has both a legit way to become immortal and a plan to help humanity must decide their choices carefully because they play a huge role in our future. If indeed he has the best intentions then he must look at all perspectives before he decides to do a thing, like hide. If someoe discovered immortality and it wasnt a fluke then they could save the world from death and could re create the steps they took to get there. Why would anyone need to drag the info out of someone who wishes to help humanity. That person wouldnt keep it away from those he is trying help thus nothing to run away from. At that point everyone is immortal because that is something that will spread faster than a sex tape. (joking). and we all know how hard a sex tape is to keep secret once it gets on the net. lol.

He might feel as if without a higher purpose he would'nt deserve the fluke of immortality happening to him since if he figured it out then he could teach it becoming his higher purpose which im sure he would have noticed in the 20 yrs he has been searching, that you know of. He has tried for immortality a very long time it seems and unless he has become imortal im sure his hopes are starting to run low so instead he created this plan just in case he fails now that he has 30-40 or so years left in a normal human life span. He is a dreamer but even if he isnt the one who finds it or takes his plan to fruition, he wasnt the first and sure wont be the last to become obsessed by its temptations and possibilities.

but since there are many perpectives and i just chose to write what came to me first, have you thought that the possibility exists the you are dealing with an immortal not on his first lifetime grooming those around him to play their parts in his ultimate goal, like you for example. Search deeper to find if he acts from love or anger and weigh the two against eachother. This way you'll be able to figure if his intentions are in the right place. If so begin asking the right questions. Really think about what he says that he wishes to come to pass and the steps he has spoken that will need to happen. I dont need to know what it is to know that you can evaluate it and play out the possibilities that might happen from each step. See if you find a pattern and then search for its source. If the source seems fishy to you then get away from him asap. With logical thinking immortality goes against the natural law of things so what other laws does he wish to break. Usually someone in search of finding immortality, finding it and keeping it for themselves, usually is followed by a "follow me because i am a god" break in their mental stability eventualy allowing their original motive to surface. This being that they are deeply pissed at god for the pain and death that they don't believe to be fair, and they believe that they could do a better job until they realize how many sides the coin actually has and that pain and death are on purpose and for good reason.

im not claiming any of this to be true but you asked for thoughts on the subject and after reading, this is what was going through my head, so here ya go. Do with it what you will. I wish you safe journey to the truth. Please be careful because if there are secretive beings out there then they probably wouldnt like the chance of their secret coming out by accident and more so might have a pile of bodies that follow them of those that got too close and thus posed a threat to them. Those types of beings arent known in history to be gentle to us mortals and those that were had been seen as traders. Youve lasted 20 yrs so it seems as if youre fine but it might only be becasue you dont pry, which is why I say be careful with your interests here getting out of hand leading to a confrontation.



.

If I was an immortal being, I would want to hold on to the illusion of death when I reincarnate, it would make life worth living, to tell you the truth.

reply to post by DragonriderGal


I believe that it all has to do with what I call T.A.A. or "Technologically Assisted Ascention" - that is, genuine alien beings that transcend reality as a result of billions of years of evolution vs the use of technology to alter genetics and warp timespace in order to try and ascend. I think the main thing that separates the aliens that are trying to reach the next level and the genuinley ascended beings, is that the genuinley ascended beings have at least died once, that is, died the second death in the afterlife, realised that there is an afterlife, realised what pure consciousness is, and thus have connected to thier true immortality. Its something that becomes increacingly hard to grasp as the level of technical knowledge on energy and vibrations increaces, as they are able to quantify thier souls, they forget that their true consciousness can never be quantified. In that way, faith in God or an extremely suicidal tendency (right hand vs left hand) are the ways that people attempt to find the answer to the meaning of life.

I mean, there could be beings out there that have never even conceived of building a space ship, that led happy and peaceful lives on their home planet, and eventually gained the ability to transcend thier reality, as nature intended. You never know, Earth could have been the home to such beings that were in the middle of thier transition, and were captured and experimented upon by envious aliens.

reply to post by Silcone Synapse


The singularity will give it to us.

If we are able to clone humans and transfer consiousness to a machine then we can be copied to a machine and have a new body "printed" out if we require it. It may be that we no longer want bodies when we are able to operate as pure consiousness driving advanced tools.

Originally posted by DragonriderGal

Originally posted by ShadowScholar
reply to post by Maxine1969

 

Noones to judge of course, I think if it was population wide, people would do the same old same old. If only certain people lived longer emphasis would be placed on doing something clever with it.

They would've had to become adept at keeping their condition well hidden for obvious reasons yes.

If you or I were immortal would we not seek companionship? Someone who could relate to our position within society? Would we not shield those of us in whom we saw ourselves?

This is just what I would consider as a logical response to this rather intriguing question.

You might want to ask the vampires about being immortal, because they are. When they take over a human body, it is transmuted into a much more immortal form via the virus that supports the sentience of the vampire. They can be killed with too much silver or any other antiviral, but in general, if they get enough to eat, they'll live vastly long lives. And if they get too badly damaged, they can just transfer their sentience into another human body via the virus aka infection, and still remember perfectly well who they are, so even if the actual body dies, their sentience is immortal. Changing bodies is more like changing clothes for them.

My reading of the vampires who have died and ended up in our racial unconscious tells me most of them are quite bored, and they do have to take a LOT of care not be discovered. Of course a human immortal may have less to worry about because they don't go around drinking other people's blood. That does make the vampires a bit more unpopular!

Even the E-l*th aka Elves who got stuck here were very bored after a while. They are an immortal species but can be killed, although it would take a LOT to do so because they can use energy to heal themselves very quickly, just as the vampires can.

Difference is that the virus of the vampires is much harder to kill and it keeps the body alive thru most kinds of should be fatal blows, whereas the elves can only heal themselves if they are aware enough to do so. So a blow to the head of sufficient damage could kill an elf, but not a vampire. You really need antiviral stuff for that.

The Elves do things like terraform worlds as a hobby---takes hundreds of thousands of years--but it keeps them busy. Like Earth for example. They were the ones who sent the asteroid into the earth to kill off all the dinosaurs; dinosaurs aren't manipulatable with energy-based 'glamor' having no advanced brain like mammals have, so the big predator types, especially, were an extreme danger to the elves.

But the ones who got stuck here were quite bored by the time the rescue ships arrived around the turn of B.C. to A.D... they passed the time by playing all the gods of Greece, Rome, Scandinavia, and the rest of Europe. But even still, they started taking their frustrations out on each other. That's what a LOT of the bickering was about in the ancient myths of the gods. Immortals stuck here on earth with only each other to keep themselves company. They didn't have to hide, but it didn't save them from leading a bored life stuffed to the gills with no meaning.

edit on 9-2-2011 by DragonriderGal because: spelling

See this is a text book example of the Tin Foil Hat briggade.

1. Google telomerase which comes from astragalus herb.
2. adaptogenic herbs, jioagula, fo-ti, gotu kola, rhodiola rosea
3. Alchemy, elixirs, etc
4. Internal Alchemy especially from Taosim. Check out Book of Secrets of Flower of Life
5. Meditation and transference of awareness
6. Magnetic water
7. Immortal breath exercises. There is one specifically for immortality where you pause between the exhale and inhale. Then you make this pause longer and longer until there is a switch that is turned on in the belly. This switch allows for control over all organs including slowing the heart to 1 beat a minute, etc.

8. Sun gazing (living off light and chi)
9. Kundalini Activation
10 Hypnosis programming or programming the subconscious and cells to always regenerate, etc
Much much more is there. Best thing to do. Study science of Longevity/Immortality and study the ancient scriptures and secret books

If you want the answer to this immortality you do not need to go any further, for you only need to understand that you life is controlled by your DNA, strait and simple, nothing to difficult to understand. The next thing you have to do is learn to talk to your DNA, your DNA controls your ageing proses. You control your DNA you control your ageing.
Thus you become immortal, yes it's that simple. Your question How does one talk to there DNA, think about this for a minute, have you ever tried. Your DNA has a IQ higher than you can ever imagine.

The challenge is who is smarter your DNA or you if you keep ageing they you have let your DNA out smart you and it should. But remember one thing where is your DNA and is it not part of you and is it not alive, then why will it not listen to you, I will tell you why for you need to learn to communicate with your DNA, that is the Mystery.

Solve it and you can live a long life 300 to 500 years with this come no more sickness you get self healing and control of your density, you will no longer need to eat a lot of food and your body will all ways look like it is 25.

There you go the secret of life it has always bin in your own body all the time, right under your nose.

Thats right laugh all you want while your DNA has the last laugh at your expense, your DNA has you by the Balls
the question is Are you going to let your DNA control you or are you going to control your DNA.

Your DNA is smarter than any doctor or any scientist it has bin around for billion of year it's the oldest thing on this planet and yes it's in your body and it know something you don't.

This is the only real answer you will ever get on this topic, don't wast it for your DNA does not care until you talk to it.

Good luck.

I've been having problems with my internet link for a few days, and have only just managed to get back online with some degree of stability. Several posts have happened here, and I appologize for not being able to respond sooner. I'll read (thoroughly) everything which is here, and respond soon.

Maxine xxx

reply to post by jsettica


Have you by any chance been reading Travallian? You seem to have come to some very similar conclusions to the ones in his e-book. Or maybe you went a completely different route and ended up at the same place

reply to post by jsettica


Have you by any chance been reading Travallian? You seem to have come to some very similar conclusions to the ones in his e-book. Or maybe you went a completely different route and ended up at the same place

reply to post by Brianegan


for someone who was "shooting from the hip" you raised a lot of interesting points.

I **DO** regard this individual very highly, I think because I have never met anyone who is so determined to pursue a goal which is so wildly outside the boundaries of society's norms - for as long as I have known him he has been steadfast in his devotion to the task of becoming immortal - I really think that if (say) he was to fall down dead now, he would die with a look of total surprise on his face, because he almost cannot comprehend that death should apply to him

HOWEVER you touched on an important point which I freely admit that I hadn't considered - whether this fixation with immortality is really compatible with the stated aim of achieving his goal (which would affect society on such a grand scale). I'm going to give this some serious thought and return to the forum in a day or so

Thank you for providing such a thought provoking response

reply to post by Maxine1969


Well only the LAMB can go and come back and possess the keys to life and death, so. If not given passage I dont see no other way.

reply to post by Ophiuchus 13


I'll be honest and admit that I don't understand what you're saying. (Sorry). Is this a reference to Christianity?

reply to post by Maxine1969


Revelation 1:
18, Jesus assures us that He has passed through death, is now alive forevermore, and has the keys to death and hell!

REVELATIONS 6:
9When he opened the fifth seal, I saw under the altar the souls of those who had been slain because of the word of God and the testimony they had maintained. 10They called out in a loud voice, “How long, Sovereign Lord, holy and true, until you judge the inhabitants of the earth and avenge our blood?” 11Then each of them was given a white robe, and they were told to wait a little longer, until the number of their fellow servants and brothers who were to be killed as they had been was completed.

BE WELL