What if the "elite" were attempting to do what they believed was best for everyone?

I am not saying I believe this, I am asking the question. What happens when a society does not have a ruling elite? People tend to be even more selfish and harsh with one another. Anarchists did not create the education system, government, business or anything else. In political science there is one iron clad rule, it is the iron clad rule of oligarchy. It means that all societies are eventually run by a small group of elite.

There was a great video, maybe someone can post a link, of a woman in Chicago celebrating Obama's election. She said something akin to she wouldn't have to work anymore and would get everything for free. What is the "tea party" all about, is it about freedom, no, it is about taxes. When over half the population believes that torture is okay when used on "terrorists" we can see what people really believe.

There are so many threads on the illuminati, the New World Order, Masons and the people in control. If they invited most people to join, they would, just to get the goodies. The Eastern Mystery Schools and all the traditions of the groups mentioned are not evil at heart, they are based on ruling people in a methodical manner. Historically, "good rulers" were raised to view their subjects as children. The leaders ruled with a carrot and stick approach because it was the only thing that worked.

Plato believed that the person best suited should rule. Aristotle believed in a form of democracy. He did not believe the majority was "good" he just thought the elite should have as many people involved as possible. Aristotle believed that the leaders of all forms of "government" would eventually put their own wants above those of the people they ruled. The basics of humanity and society have not changed and history continues to prove itself.

The best form of government is where the people elect those best suited; but, that means voting your morality rather than who you believe will most benefit you. To understand the world you have to put in the time and lets face it, most people make little effort to understand. The average American's understanding of other countries is pitiful and full of bias and ignorance. We may live in a world where we are controlled; but, to replace it with anarchy would be even worse.

Without leadership we would have no streets, no sewage facilities, no electricity and no mass distribution of food or water. Please do not misunderstand, I am not a cheerleader for the world's current leadership or direction. There are many who fear that there is a plan for depopulation, there is, it was written about by the Rockefeller foundation and published in 1971. The title was something like "Population Stabilization". It was not about starving or killing everyone, it was about promoting birth control, population control and stability.

Look at "Road Rules", "The Real World", "Survivor" and how people act on these shows. If you have ever been to a rave you see what people are like, want them to rule the world, unrestrained and high as a kite, only concerned with sex and drugs. What if the ruling elite was trying to keep things in order, would the masses do the same? My guess is not. Jesus called us sheep because we are.

Prior to the housing market collapse, millions of people bought houses they could not afford with the sole intent of selling them and getting free money. They were like kids in a candy shop and exhibited no restraint. As the economy continues to collapse we see people fighting over the last crumbs like wild wolverines. We see the corruption of the police, churches, all parts of industry and that should tell us why we need leadership that is better than us.

I expect this thread will anger many, good. The question is not whether or not our current form of government is good, it is a question of what should we replace it with. That is and has always been the most fundamental question in political science and we have struggled with the answer for thousands of years. The bible says that God appoints our leaders and we should be good slaves, even Christians hate that answer because we all want to be God for the wrong reasons. We want to be in charge so that we can have things our way, not for the benefit of all.

Well, if they think they are "helping" us, than they are very terrible at it.

I look at it like a company with a poor quality manager.
The company suffers as a result.

What more can I say?

Im sorry Im just answering this after reading the title, as that is a huge post,

but I was just thinking that these ETs that may be the ones looking to help us [ humanity ] wouldnt necessarily come down and save us. I pray Im wrong, but what if they actually have to let nature wipe out 2 /3 of the world in order for humanity to be able to advance to a type 1 civilization [ as kahchu would say. ] I hope they intervene, as I believe there certainly are multiple intelligent races out there shaking there heads at us while we blow our planet up and live so primitively.

in a sense I think thats exactly what 'the elite' are trying to do, theyre just kinda a little bit greedy, immoral, and evil about it.

I don;t know if I understand directly what you are asking or what point you are trying to make. But I believe the American system of government is a good system it is just the people in their that our corrupting the system. I mean people can disagree with this one because I don;t know if I agree with it myself but I thin the founders meant for the common man to serve in political office. I believe that this is what made Geroge Washington such a good president was because he didn;t want to be president.

The Government needs to be change in my view they need to change democracy to meritocracy. There would be no rulers only "guides" who knows what would be better for humanity. In meritocracy everyone would be able to go as far as they can (if they can) but the thing that separates meritocracy from democracy is having a limit in how far can someone go without being too greedy ie. getting too much like the elites do and that creates and imbalance in the resource available. We need change now.


Also the NWO is a good thing actually, but the NWO I'm talking about is not the same as others view it here. The NWO is described here as the OWO which are the elites and that's the reason we need a NEW world order, to stop those who have been in control over the past millenia. The government today is not doing anything other than control people, yes I agree with your view that without government people are just gonna be worst, but we can change this government into something much better, something more humanistic and spiritual. We would let others "guide" us if they have the ability to.


This topic is really hard to explain in a simple way look at this site if you want to know more:
armageddonconspiracy.co.uk...

Like i always say without satan and such you would not even had an education system. Thats the paradox for life, satan has made man open up, and made them create civilisation, so how do you live your life knowing that.

I stay away from society knowing this.

Originally posted by iversusvsversusi
Im sorry Im just answering this after reading the title, as that is a huge post,

but I was just thinking that these ETs that may be the ones looking to help us [ humanity ] wouldnt necessarily come down and save us. I pray Im wrong, but what if they actually have to let nature wipe out 2 /3 of the world in order for humanity to be able to advance to a type 1 civilization [ as kahchu would say. ] I hope they intervene, as I believe there certainly are multiple intelligent races out there shaking there heads at us while we blow our planet up and live so primitively.

in a sense I think thats exactly what 'the elite' are trying to do, theyre just kinda a little bit greedy, immoral, and evil about it.

I think the ET you are talking about is your higher self the ET is all within us, wonder why someone see's a UFO in a particular area but he's the only one who sees it? It is his higher self trying to connect with it's lower self (the physical matter).


The Elite's are not trying to do anything about it, they are hindering the process. They want to people to stay asleep so they could rule the world. And greed can never be good in any way.

when they stop the greed, then i will think that they are doing good. raul castro gives himself a wage of $30 a week, i know in cuba everyone gets a home for free and the economy isnt as strong etc.... but that is still a sign of a non greedy head of state as that is a miniscule amount of money for a politician in any nation to pay themselves.

First I want to say that I read you're post.. and I don't understand why anyone wouldn't before they reply, or at least admit that.

Honestly, I don't think government is doing that bad.

I really think our largest issue in America ATM is lobbyist. A couple of the congressmen that just came in admitted that one of the first things they did was went to a couple companies and asked them what they could do for them. Wish I knew off the top of my head who. Point is, they lobbyists don't even need to go to them anymore, its gotten out of hand now and they are even considering doing away with public funding for the next presidential election and only using corporate funding. It's really not the way things should be.. at all.

The next largest issue is derivatives. They should be outlawed just like lobbyists, or corporate donations should. First we had the housing crash, but now we have them creating derivatives out of FOOD! They are betting on food and raising food prices around the world! Top this off with the fact that we are converting corn exports into bio-diesel and you have what we have today. The riots in Egypt. Have no doubt that they are in fact food riots.

If we could fix these two things, among some others, that I won't get into, capitalism could probably continue for a few more years. As it is now, its as if every one is grabbing the gold before the castle collapses.

What if the "elite" were attempting to do what they believed was best for everyone?

You are either very optimistic, or you have a sense of humor. Both are good to have, keep them.

The question is not whether or not our current form of government is good, it is a question of what should we replace it with.

There is nothing wrong with our current form of government. It is a constitutional republic. And it works. As has already been said, it is those who are running it that are the problem. So they are what needs to be replaced.
And once they have been tried for treason by a jury of their peers, we replace the ones who are found guilty with those who will be the servants of the people they are supposed to be. At least it sounds good in a post.
Unfortunately, none of that is going to happen.

reply to post by Klassified


I have to disagree. The kleptocrats ruining our nation are only a symptom of the real problem. The real problem is a lazy electorate too worried about american idol, and paris hilton etc... to get their fat ass off the couch and control the politicians.

If they consulted the rest of the population through the constant use of referundums the results of which are NOT counted electronically then OK but then it would be a democracy then wouldnt it?

They take the view they should govern the rest of humanity because they think they know whats best for everyone elese thats an example of absolutle power corrupting absolutely.

Total anarchy is certainly the fastest way to purge a population of the weaker elements.

Total anarchy is likewise the fastest way to shed fringe liberal interests from the tails of a Bell Curve.

Total anarchy is again the fastest way to purge those who consume and don't contribute.

Would the elite ever steer us in that direction?

If they want to solve our problems quickly and efficiently, they will.

Originally posted by FarArcher
Total anarchy is certainly the fastest way to purge a population of the weaker elements.

Total anarchy is likewise the fastest way to shed fringe liberal interests from the tails of a Bell Curve.

Total anarchy is again the fastest way to purge those who consume and don't contribute.

Would the elite ever steer us in that direction?

If they want to solve our problems quickly and efficiently, they will.

What if that was what they were trying to avoid and have concluded is inevitable. Consider what is going on in Egypt. Wouldn't it be better to motivate people to contribute and refuse to give them help if they do not participate? How many children are you willing to allow to die while anarchy reigns? Why must we be so harsh with one another, why extreme answers? Are we really that unwilling to work together?

Perfection is not a result, it is a process of continual growth. If perfection were a result you could reach than stasis is perfection and that is nothing more than eternal boredom.

Originally posted by sonofliberty1776
reply to post by Klassified

 

I have to disagree. The kleptocrats ruining our nation are only a symptom of the real problem. The real problem is a lazy electorate too worried about american idol, and paris hilton etc... to get their fat ass off the couch and control the politicians.

I see where you're coming from, and I don't completely disagree. But at the same time, you can't blame a date rape victim because she didn't know her drink was drugged. And that is how I see much of the public today. They don't realize that those shows are called programming for a reason. They don't realize that TV is a weapon of mass destruction. They don't realize they're being lied too daily by a corporate owned, and government run mass media who are skilled at bypassing their critical faculties. Which they've been conditioned not to use anyway.

If any among us are to be blamed for letting it get this far. It is we who claim to see the truth of the matter. Yet, even we are divided by the very same weaponry used against the masses. And therefore, cannot, as a group, see through the modern dialectical mess enough to stand together as one, laying aside our petty disagreements until the real work is done.

BTW. I like that. "kleptocrats". That's funny. And true.

reply to post by Klassified


The problem I have with the idea of eliminating all the bad people is that we just get new ones. People are basically the same throughout history. Aristotle said all societies devolve into selfishness. It is about designing a government that resists this human folly. Why did we vote for these evil people in the first place? Everybody knew Clinton was a liar and an adulterer, why did they vote for a liar? And it doesn't matter if you liked him or hated him, it's not about him, it is about why we voted for him. I could have used Bush an example too.

I will keep this simple since I have spoken this at length in another thread. The equation is wrong!

If we look to Nature we see that fundamentally aggressive animals work well within the Matriarchal Mode, not the Patriarchal.

We must shift ourselves from the current "Power" which is Patriarchal, and finally embrace the Feminine and realize who the real leaders are and how best to open to a better way; a Matriarchal Society.

However, the women of today do not qualify, they are simply women who have learned to play in the Patriarchal playground! This means you Hillary! This means you Nancy! This means you Janet! Oh yes, let us not forget, this means you too Michelle!

Yes
You are better off dead and the planet will be better off without you.
this is going to hurt you a lot more then it is going to hurt me.
but never mind that
My wealth and happiness benefit you and give your sacrifice meaning
true nobility indeed
be glad it is for your own good.

PS
as Bill Gates said
( I aproximate..its on u-tube)
"we hope the achieve a 15 percvent reduction in the worlds population through use of vaccines"

never mind

Originally posted by AQuestion
reply to post by Klassified

 

The problem I have with the idea of eliminating all the bad people is that we just get new ones. People are basically the same throughout history. Aristotle said all societies devolve into selfishness. It is about designing a government that resists this human folly. Why did we vote for these evil people in the first place? Everybody knew Clinton was a liar and an adulterer, why did they vote for a liar? And it doesn't matter if you liked him or hated him, it's not about him, it is about why we voted for him. I could have used Bush an example too.

Of course we get new ones. Aristotle was right. But so was Thomas Jefferson.

“Experience hath shewn, that even under the best forms (of government) those entrusted with power have, in time, and by slow operations, perverted it into tyranny”

“If once the people become inattentive to the public affairs, you and I, and Congress and Assemblies, Judges and Governors, shall all become wolves. It seems to be the law of our general nature, in spite of individual exceptions.”

“Every generation needs a new revolution.”

There is no form of government any better at resisting this human folly than the one we are supposed to living under at present. It has all the checks and balances needed to guarantee the rights of the individual. As well as the rights of the masses.

But "we the people" needed to stay attentive to public affairs, and we should have been watching our servants. But instead, we were lulled into slumber by them, and they have convinced us they are the masters, and we are the servants.

We voted for all of them because the majority of us don't know the system has been broken and usurped for a very long time. And we have an illegitimate government who writes policy instead of law.

We voted for them because few realize the two parties are just two sides of the same coin. And when those few speak out to warn us, we marginalize them to the fringes of society, and call them crazy, and tell them to shutup.

We voted for them because the brainwashing, and the lies, and the dumbing down of the masses, and the perpetuation of fear works.