Friend says Abercrombie told him, ‘There is no birth certificate!’

reply to post by kinda kurious


It is totally airtight.

B. The affidavit prescribed in subsection A shall include references to and attachment of all of the following, which shall be sworn to under penalty of perjury:

1. An original long form birth certificate that includes the date and place of birth, the names of the hospital and the attending physician and signatures of the witnesses in attendance.

Everyone American is born in a hospital with a doctor and is given a loss proof, original birth certificate so I see no issues with this at all.

Originally posted by Sinnthia

Originally posted by butcherguy
I bet if I were POTUS....

So close too, huh?

I could show you my birth certificate.

Like Obama did? You can do it now. You do not have to be president to post a picture of your currently held Hawaiin birth certificate too you know? Just show it.

Damn powerful position.

Hmmm...jealous?

One would think that he could do it.

One would think birthers would do the minimum of research about birth certificates and stop repeating lies they heard on an AM radio morining show.

One would think. When it comes to the birther argument, there seems to be little thinking going on.

You should take a little time to read your post that I've quoted.

If you are the least bit objective, you may see that you may have issues that you need to resolve in your life.

You seem to have hatred brewing in you. I simply stated my opinion. I didn't call you any names.

I didn't attempt to belittle you.

I didn't accuse you of having emotional issues....

Until now.

I am suspicious of a lot of politicians, including Barack Obama. IMO, his place of birth is in question. I question it because he had been described as 'born in Kenya' by an American newspaper while he was running for the US Senate in Illinois.

I'm beginning the think this Abercrombie is a real DOOFUS! Hospitals don't keep birth certificates. He might as well look at the bank and declare it doesn't exist because it's not at the bank!

Birth Certificates are kept on record in the state Health Department. NOT at hospitals.

Originally posted by butcherguy
I bet if I were POTUS....

I could show you my birth certificate.

I bet Obama could, too. I'm actually pretty darn sure of it. But it's not whether he CAN or not, it's his choice and he's exercising his right to privacy.

His passport, however, he's apparently willing to share.

reply to post by Benevolent Heretic
Indeed he does! Thanks for putting that up, never saw it before.

I wonder why he doesn't show the BC, I think IF I were in that position, I would want to. I would proclaim it, not hide it.
BTW: How are your puppies, my friend?

reply to post by Missing Blue Sky


Conveniently passed away.... Implying foul play in his grandmothers death?? wow.. So birthers have no moral compass. Maybe you should stop reading Tom Clancy and watching spy movies.. Completely ignorant statement!

reply to post by Benevolent Heretic

Originally posted by Benevolent Heretic
Hospitals don't keep birth certificates. He might as well look at the bank and declare it doesn't exist because it's not at the bank!

Birth Certificates are kept on record in the state Health Department. NOT at hospitals.

§338-5 Compulsory registration of births. Within the time prescribed by the department of health, a certificate of every birth shall be substantially completed and filed with the local agent of the department in the district in which the birth occurred, by the administrator or designated representative of the birthing facility, or physician, or midwife, or other legally authorized person in attendance at the birth; or if not so attended, by one of the parents.

The birth facility shall make available to the department appropriate medical records for the purpose of monitoring compliance with the provisions of this chapter. [L 1949, c 327, §9; RL 1955, §57-8; am L Sp 1959 2d, c 1, §19; HRS §338-5; am L 1988, c 149, §1]

Link.

I guess the hospital eats the paper after delivery to the state...

Originally posted by Benevolent Heretic
I'm beginning the think this Abercrombie is a real DOOFUS!

We may agree, but for different reasons:

Three weeks into his term, newly elected Gov. Neil Abercrombie told The New York Times that with regard to the birthers, he is "going to take care of that."

He said he is talking with the state attorney general's office and the director of the Health Department to see how he can release more information about the president's birth. The confidentiality of birth records is protected by state law.

"It's an insult to his mother and to his father, and I knew his mother and father; they were my friends, and I have an emotional interest in that," Abercrombie told the Times. "It's an emotional insult. It is disrespectful to the president; it is disrespectful to the office."

Abercombie was quoted by the Chicago Tribune as saying, "What bothers me is that some people who should know better are trying to use this for political reasons," he said. "Maybe I'm the only one in the country that could look you right in the eye right now and tell you, 'I was here when that baby was born.'"

Source.

See also:

Obama Birth Certificate Mystery Grows: Is the Answer All in the Name?

Former City and County of Honolulu Elections Division temporary employee Timothy Adams signed an affidavit Thursday attesting that supervisors in his former job told him
no long form birth certificate exists in Hawaii for President Barack Obama. World News Daily reported on the existence of the affidavit as well as the intricacies of laws governing birth certificates in Hawaii in the 1960s.

Adams attested in the affidavit:

"During the course of my employment, I came to understand that for political reasons, various officials in the government of Hawaii, including then-Governor Linda Lingle and various officials of the Hawaii Department of Health, including Dr. Chiyome Fukino, the director of the Hawaii Department of Health, were making representations that Senator Obama was born in Hawaii, even though no government official in Hawaii could find a long-form birth certificate for Senator Obama that had been issued by a Hawaii hospital at the time of his birth."

...Adams claimed in June that his supervisor at the elections office confirmed that neither the hospital at which Obama claims to have been born or one previously identified as his birthplace had a birth certificate or form signed by a doctor stating that Obama was born there.

Unlike many so-called "birthers" who contend that Obama is not an American, Adams believes that Obama is an American citizen, just not one born in Hawaii.

More...

Originally posted by Benevolent Heretic

Originally posted by butcherguy
I bet if I were POTUS....

I could show you my birth certificate.

I bet Obama could, too. I'm actually pretty darn sure of it. But it's not whether he CAN or not, it's his choice and he's exercising his right to privacy.

Also ridiculous:

Section 1 of Article Two of the United States Constitution sets forth the eligibility requirements for serving as President of the United States:

“ No person except a natural born Citizen, or a Citizen of the United States, at the time of the Adoption of this Constitution, shall be eligible to the Office of President; neither shall any Person be eligible to that Office who shall not have attained to the Age of thirty-five Years, and been fourteen Years a Resident within the United States."

THAT is the right of the people.

How did I know, when I saw your name at the end of this thread, that your response would be directed at me?

Yes, Loam. the hospital fills out a certificate and files it with the Health Department. I don't know what they do after that, but they needn't EAT it to dispose of it. There are other ways. The bottom line is that they are not required to KEEP a record on file. Edit: By record, I mean Birth Certificate.

The hospital's Birth Certificate usually include a footprint of the baby (and is considered a "Novelty" or "Souvenir" Birth Certificate) and is given to the mother.

Originally posted by loam
Section 1 of Article Two of the United States Constitution sets forth the eligibility requirements for serving as President of the United States:

No where does it say that the POTUS must prove his eligibility to the masses.

THAT is the right of the people.

But you stated no right. Just the eligibility requirements (as if I didn't know ). It doesn't say anything about our right to SEE and be satisfied with his personal papers. You're extrapolating to the extreme.

Besides, he has already shown us his proof of citizenship.

I'm not going to participate in another birther thread fiasco. You guys think whatever you want. I was just commenting on Abercrombie and his misinformed ignorance. Like I said, he might as well look in the bank or McDonald's for Obama's BC.

reply to post by Benevolent Heretic

Originally posted by Benevolent Heretic
How did I know, when I saw your name at the end of this thread, that your response would be directed at me?

Just addressing your specious assertions....like this one:

Originally posted by Benevolent Heretic
Yes, Loam. the hospital fills out a certificate and files it with the Health Department. I don't know what they do after that, but they needn't EAT it to dispose of it. There are other ways. The bottom line is that they are not required to KEEP a record on file.

Really? Just because you say so?

How is it that you "don't know what they do after that" but are certain no record retention requirement existed or that the hospital appropriately disposed of his record of birth?

Are you also saying that if one called the two possible hospitals in question, that neither could produce other records of birth prior to and after Obama's birth?

I'm pretty certain you are wrong about that.

Moreover, wasn't it you who said:

Originally posted by Benevolent Heretic
Hospitals don't keep birth certificates. He might as well look at the bank and declare it doesn't exist because it's not at the bank!

Birth Certificates are kept on record in the state Health Department. NOT at hospitals.

I haven't had time to check the law prior to 1988, but today it appears hospitals in Hawaii are required by law to retain records of birth for a minimum of 43 years. But never let the facts stand in the way of a good argument, huh, BH?

Haw. Rev. Stat. § 622-58 : Hawaii Statutes - Section 622-58: Retention of medical records.

The health care provider, or the health care provider's successor, shall be liable for the preservation of basic information from the medical record for twenty-five years after the last entry, except in the case of minors, whose records shall be retained during the period of minority plus twenty-five years after the minor reaches the age of majority. If the health care provider is succeeded by another entity, the burden of compliance with this section shall rest with the successor. Before a provider ceases operations, the provider shall make immediate arrangements, subject to the approval of the department of health, for the retention and preservation of the medical records in keeping with the intent of this section.

I guess it's easier for you to make-up or assume the facts that support your position...



Here's to denying ignorance with ya!

“Former Hawaii elections clerk Tim Adams has now signed an affidavit swearing he was told by his supervisors in Hawaii that no long-form, hospital-generated birth certificate existed for Barack Obama Jr. in Hawaii and that neither Queens Medical Center nor Kapi’olani Medical Center in Honolulu had any record of Obama having been born in their medical facilities.”

Full Story Link

reply to post by EssenSieMich


For sake of clarity your linked article at Infowars is mired in innuendo and although cleverly worded simply non factual.

A case in point:

“Now he admits publicly that there is no birth certificate,” said Evans of Abercrombie.

Specifically note wording: "Said Evans of Abercrombie"

Gov. Abercrombie HAS NOT "publicly admitted" anything. It is an inference, a fallacy. Evans claims Abercrombie told him details because he is allegedly a friend, in private. How does hearsay (he said,he said) suddenly become a public admission? Hint: it doesn't.

Regarding the affidavit, ANYONE can swear to ANYTHING. It doesn't make it true. If untrue, it makes it perjury.

All these latest "revelations" are nothing more than hearsay strung together. In a word...gossip.

Originally posted by loam
I haven't had time to check the law prior to 1988, but today it appears hospitals in Hawaii are required by law to retain records of birth for a minimum of 43 years.

Records of birth, NOT birth certificates. Of course the provider has to keep records, but they aren't required to keep birth certificates, which is what Abercrombie is looking for and can't find at the hospital (or the bank, 7/11 or McDonald's).

.

reply to post by Benevolent Heretic

Originally posted by Benevolent Heretic
Records of birth, NOT birth certificates. Of course the provider has to keep records, but they aren't required to keep birth certificates, which is what Abercrombie is looking for and can't find at the hospital (or the bank, 7/11 or McDonald's).

M'kay.

Can you show me where Abercrombie said he was looking for the 'birth certificate' at the hospital??? Or are you just parsing the statements of another to make this lame argument that Abercrombie is too stupid to know what documents a hospital might have with respect to the births taking place there?

Originally posted by loam
Can you show me where Abercrombie said he was looking for the 'birth certificate' at the hospital???

No. I'm done with you. You can read the OP and see what this supposed friend of Abercrombie said.

Here: This should make you feel better:

“I’m done!” cried out the governor. "Not only did I go through the records vault at the Hawaii Department of Health for a THIRD TIME, I went to BOTH HOSPITALS where Obama could have been born in 1961, and there is absolutely NO RECORD of Obama being born ANYWHERE in Hawaii!”
...
Abercrombie added:” In fact, I hereby declare that Barrack Obama is an illegal alien and that if he tries to come to Hawaii again, I’ll have him arrested and deported!

SpoofTimes

reply to post by Benevolent Heretic

Originally posted by Benevolent Heretic
No. I'm done with you.

How convenient for you.

Seems the "friend" has changed his tune.

FOX

A celebrity journalist now claims he misspoke when he said last week that Hawaii’s governor told him he was unable to find President Barack Obama’s original birth certificate after a search of state and hospital archives.

Mike Evans told FoxNews.com on Wednesday he was remorseful and embarrassed that he appeared to have given the impression that he had discussed the search for Obama’s birth certificate with Hawaii Gov. Neil Abercrombie.

Read more: www.foxnews.com...

:shk:

reply to post by Benevolent Heretic




This stuff just seems to write itself...



By the way, do you now retract your Bank/McDonalds/7-11 statement concerning Abercrombie?

You obviously unjustly accused the poor man of being too stupid to know what documents he might find in a Hawaiian hospital.

Oh,

And still...there is no real birth certificate in evidence...retractions, notwithstanding.

Originally posted by Benevolent Heretic
Seems the "friend" has changed his tune.

FOX

A celebrity journalist now claims he misspoke when he said last week that Hawaii’s governor told him he was unable to find President Barack Obama’s original birth certificate after a search of state and hospital archives.

Mike Evans told FoxNews.com on Wednesday he was remorseful and embarrassed that he appeared to have given the impression that he had discussed the search for Obama’s birth certificate with Hawaii Gov. Neil Abercrombie.

Read more: www.foxnews.com...

:shk:

That is too good not to repeat. Nice work BH.

@ loam Why on earth would BH need to retract her opinion regarding Ambercrombie just because Evans has truthiness issues?

ETA: And if I may toot my tiny horn, I wrote this on page 1:

Originally posted by kinda kurious

I suspect it was a slow celebrity news gossip day and the shock jock waas just trying to get some action. FAIL

About these flipfloppers: "I can't find a certificate"--to-- "I was wrong"

When I was in military tech school, grooming for a job in access to exotic Top Secrets, I always remember how us newbies were required to be inculcated with how important 'blackmail' was, -of course though,- the Soviet KGB's utilization of such. I know, I'm just Conspiracy Theorizing.
I am a left leaner, but a lot of things have bothered me about the President. He is not against free trade, which has flushed the US down the proverbial toilet. I did not listen to his speach by-the-way, but I heard he made fun of people's upset at the TSA fascist demonics who chortle and drool while sexualy molesting and assaulting people, and forcing ancient elderly with colostomy bags, to "get up" out of those wheel chairs, etc. I am convinced that his identity is a confusion. At the same time we want his birth certificate, ( I have mine, with "the raised seal on it" ) he is 8 cousins-related to Dick Cheney. www.timesonline.co.uk...

reply to post by kinda kurious
Hi friendly rival!

I don't often give you a star, but I did give you one on your last post. (But I still think B. Obama is a very shady character...but what politician isn't?)

My friend BH gets one too!