Is it really that important what the rest of the world thinks of the United States? Should Americans

reply to post by FarFromEden


Here is an interesting fact: do you know that no American has ever been Secretary General or even Deputy Secretary General of NATO? Look it up and tell me I'm wrong.
So, does the US control NATO?

reply to post by Kryties
I don't mean to be insulting, or arrogant. I just get a little frustrated at times....please accept my apology. As for the Pearl harbor incident, my father's big brother was killed there. My family is sensitive about that subject to this day. It didn't help matters when I married a girl of Asian extraction. And by the way, The " LEND / LEASE ACT " signed by Pres. Roosevelt sending billions of dollars in naval vessels, tanks, aircraft and munitions of all kinds to England made us Hitler's u-boat target WAY before Pearl Harbor. It wasn't declared, but Americans were dying in that European crap a long while before anyone ever knew where Pearl Harbor even was.

Originally posted by FarFromEden
reply to post by deltaalphanovember EXACTLY....NOW YOU'RE TALKING. Why shouldn't the U.S. use food as a weapon the way the OPEC countries used oil as a weapon in the '70s for the support the U.S. government gives to Israel?? Why shouldn't the U.S. take FULL advantage of our economic, agricultural and military power to cancel our debts and do as we please?? Many countries do as they damn well please, why not the United States? After billions paid out in foreign aid and disaster relief, saving Europe twice in one century, forming NATO,etc, DOES THE WORLD OWE THE AMERICAN PEOPLE, OR DOES THE AMERICAN PEOPLE OWE THE WORLD??

 

So you mean the US should threaten the rest of the World with their Military and dominance of Food etc? Meaning "Do as we say,or we drop a few Nukes on you" or "Do what we want or no Food for you" ?

reply to post by FarFromEden


My grandfather was on the signals team that intercepted the "Tora Tora Tora" message and remained adamant until the day he died of cancer a few years ago that the US Government knew it was coming and stood down forces to allow it to occur. I'm not trying to overshadow your dads brothers death - I just thought I would add that.

Originally posted by FarFromEden
reply to post by Kryties

 

And by the way, The " LEND / LEASE ACT " signed by Pres. Roosevelt sending billions of dollars in naval vessels, tanks, aircraft and munitions of all kinds to England made us Hitler's u-boat target WAY before Pearl Harbor. It wasn't declared, but Americans were dying in that European crap a long while before anyone ever knew where Pearl Harbor even was.

Very true - the Lend Lease Agreement did help England. In fact, Britain stored most of her gold and forex in a Canadian Bank when they thought they were about to be invaded.
You have some good points, and i understand you are playing devil's advocate to a certain degree - my question is what is your ultimate point to this topic. Surely you have received a fair amount of participation to reveal your true thoughts.

reply to post by FarFromEden


Oh and the bankers financed both sides of the war for profit. Do a search on ATS for it, there's plenty of proof.

reply to post by Golf66

We do way more good than bad when we go somewhere - I have fought in those wars for 24 years now. Ask the little Afghani girl who is going to read for the first time, or the people with cataracts we removed or the Haitians how many meals they had yesterday

And all the while, there are thousands of homeless people, including children and veterans inside America dying from starvation and exposure to the elements. I could never understand why America, our government, always rushed to help others and not do a damn thing for their own people who needed help.

TO OP: To answer your question, I don't think America owes the world anything, accept an apology for some of its warmongering actions and I dont think the world owes America anything. I think we should stop all foreign aid and keep the money here to help Americans that are living in tent cities because of the failure of the Big Banks. We as a nation give away hundreds of billions of dollars each year, when our economy is about to crash. If we would keep all that money, then it would be a start to getting our economy going in the right direction.

We should bring all of our troops home and worry about our homeland and let the rest of the world take care of themselves. We shouldn't have to be the World Police or the Worlds Nanny, while our own country is dissolving. We seem to want to stick our noses into everybody elses business without taking care of our own first IMO

reply to post by deltaalphanovember The U.S. is the major financial supporter and military supplier of NATO. Go to Google and see how many U.S. military bases there are in Europe. Look how many NUCLEAR armed U.S. forces there are in Europe under the guise of NATO. NATO was really formed to keep the fighting on European soil and away from the U.S. OOOOPS, that just slipped out.

reply to post by FarFromEden

Originally posted by FarFromEden
reply to post by Kryties

 

That is the whole point of my question....After decades of handing out billions of dollars and saving Europe TWICE in one century, DOES THE WORLD OWE AMERICA, OR DOES AMERICA OWE THE WORLD??

See, this is one of the main gripes I have with America and you can especially see this in Hollywood films about the two world wars. "The Americans descend from the heavens like some kind of godsend and fight off the tyrants and are the big heroes who saved the day", downplaying all other efforts by any other army who fought.
Yeah, like no other forces from Europe have come to save you at all, not like any armies from Europe participated in any of your wars. This argument almost suggests that "because we helped out a bit in the two greatest wars of the 20th century we have the right to do whatever we like."

Does the world owe America? Well, you answer me that. As the supposedly most "powerful nation" as it stands, do you think that with your power you should give back to the world and make it a better place or does that give you a right to look down on the rest of the world from your crumbling ivory tower?

The US sold a load of weapons to the Russians, that's what won ww2.

[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/f989bdde3ecf.png[/atsimg]

Originally posted by FarFromEden
reply to post by deltaalphanovemberBut we have the largest economy on Earth...we have the most high-tech military ever concieved by humanity. What if we used our economic / military power to close off your country like we are starving out North Korea? We have the power to take what ever we want, why should we not use it? What do Americans, who have been FAR more generous than any other nation in general foreign aid, on top of disaster aid, owe to the rest of you people?

 

Not so long ago there was another country who thought their economic and military might gave them the right to run roughshod over other nations, take what they wanted from and starve those people they seen as "beneath" them in order to further their goal of supremacy. It was Germany and they were called the Nazis, you might have heard of them. You might also want to see how that worked out for them.

The question isn't what do you owe the rest of the world, rather what the hell do we owe you?

Originally posted by FarFromEden
reply to post by Vicky32

 

DOES THE AMERICAN PEOPLE OWE THE WORLD, OR DOES THE WORLD OWE THE AMERICAN PEOPLE??

Right now I'd say probably the first one. By alot. en.wikipedia.org...

Seriously though, there's no doubt that America played a huge role in liberating Europe. But like people here have said they definitely do not deserve the full credit many of them seem to claim. In Holland for example, people largely see Canadians as their liberaters.

But seriously though, no country should have to "owe" another country anything. It is totally 100% your choice to shower some countries with aid and "liberate" others. In my opinion, you wouldn't have alot of these of problems if you kept to your own borders. The times America has been most prosperous seems to be during periods of isolationist policies (as you'll find is the case anywhere).

reply to post by FarFromEden


I personally do not give a rats behind what the world thinks of me the american...We americans have alway opened our wallets in times of disasters for the world. Do they consdier this? no. SO as for your question no it dont matter...when our dollar collapses, when we are broke and cannot help the world, it is then and only then the world will realize, americans do care...What sucks is, Our government has dihonored the citizen. There decisions have been locked into our lives...But, just wait and see when we cannot buy their goods. When we are in need. Do you honestly believe they will come to our rescue. nope, we will be on our own, only problem is, our governmetn will probably sell us out and push us into further distress by allowing them to make our decisions...It is a gloomy outlook in my opinion...

reply to post by FarFromEden


Uhh, yeah we should care what other Countries think of us. We are making more enemies than we are friends. I would think that is not a good thing. It becomes quite worrisome when you have no more shoulders you can cry on. U.S certainly fails at playing the victim role thats for sure.
Us as Americans really need to drop the arrogance role also. What do we have as a Nation to be arrogant about, corrupt Government, drowning in debt, brink of collapse? People hold on to the arrogance like a life long grudge. Its worthless and asinine when you have no more energy or right for the cause.

america has the most number of dumb people when it comes to the average joe.
America has the worst international policy i've ever seen , as a american why would you trust your goverment anyway ? they lie , kill people without a reason and spend tax money into the worst projects.
detroit is becoming a ghost town, infrastructure like bridges are crumbling - why the hell go to war and ?

Originally posted by Lodewijkp
america has the most number of dumb people when it comes to the average joe.

Speak for yourself.
Are you one of them? To belittle people and call them dumb is really unnecessary. You show your lack of intelligence by voicing untruths. It's obvious you have no idea what you are talking about.
We have our share of "dumb" people sure. To say we have the most? That was dumb.

reply to post by FarFromEden


You're wrong, I'm afraid. Maybe in 1949, we were "feeding and leading the world." But these days? Nope. The United states is the world's largest consumer country; that is, we receive far more than we give, and we buy more than we sell. Much of our monetary "foreign aid" in fact goes to repressive dictators and military states, or otherwise carries a high interest that harms developing nations more than helps - especially since our aid deals usually have strings attached that greatly devalue the goods of those countries so we can wolf it all down on the cheap.

We don't give aid so much as run protection rackets and commit usury.

reply to post by drkylefletcher


where do you pull China from?

reply to post by Lodewijkp


"america has the most number of dumb people when it comes to the average joe." Wow learn sentence structure before you call anyone else dumb.

Based on what i have read thus far it seems to me that this thread only has the intent of inflamatory spite, i say this due to the unneccessary screaming and the content you included in your opeing post.. you have said that you are to wait before you reveal your true intentions on this topic, i dont beleive you...

Originally posted by FarFromEden
The question I really would like an answer to is this; Do we as Americans owe the world anything, or do we have the right to tell the rest of the planet to go to hell, and keep their opinions to themselves?

it is apparent from this post what direction you intend to lead this topic, if not, it seems that a more suitable, simple question would have been posed.

Originally posted by FarFromEden
...We have the power to take what ever we want, why should we not use it? What do Americans, who have been FAR more generous than any other nation in general foreign aid, on top of disaster aid, owe to the rest of you people?

a slight divergence from the original question, you seem to be looking for authorization to act in such a manner...

Originally posted by FarFromEden
...And why should the American people, the most powerful nation EVER KNOWN in world history to date, care what the world thinks??

The answer here is self evident to any one who knows anything about world history...ie; the American revolution...power is not everything

Originally posted by FarFromEden
REMEMBER TWO THINGS; THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA FEEDS THE WORLD WITH OUR GRAIN AND OTHER FOODSTUFFS AND THAT CAN BE CUT OFF, AND THE ROMAN EMPIRE DIDN'T HAVE ABOUT 20,000 NUCLEAR TIPPED CRUISE MISSILES, AMONG OTHER VERY NASTY HIGH-TECH DEVICES ON SUBMARINES, AIRCRAFT CARRIER BATTLE GROUPS

wow, more inflamatory comments, lemme guess these are not your true feelings either? Firstly the world ate food long before we appropriated the Native American lands, im sure they could get by without us. Also if you have a firearm please turn it in to the proper auhorities...

Originally posted by FarFromEden
...Plus, do you have any idea how much money the rest of the world has invested in the U.S. economy? Look what happened in 2008 when our stock market crashed...the world crashed with us. What if we decided to be bad guys and froze EVERYONES assets until we got terms to settle our international debt WORLDWIDE. Who could stop us?? The U.S. gets most of our imported oil from Mexico and Canada, a small percentage comes from OPEC Arab states. Mexico and Canada may as well be the 51st and 52nd states anyway. They would never turn on the U.S.A. no matter what happened. I'm not saying what my true opinions are on this subject until more views have posted, I'm just throwing stuff out there right now.

They "were" invested in our dollar, prior to the crash changes were happing and since then the global economy has changed and is leaning away from the dollar. If your going to be so aggresive in your stance you could at least be current, besides even if your statement was true the world as a whole would probably just turn thier backs on us and chuckle. As for mexico and canada, i would not bet too much on that, but again..these are not your true opinions?

Originally posted by FarFromEden
...Would it be arrogant if the United States couldn't care less about world opinion, or should we care what the world thinks of us?? Why is this so difficult to answer without twisting it into something I'm not saying??

probably because for as much as your not saying, your spouting alot of arrogant cr@p...

Originally posted by FarFromEden
...After billions paid out in foreign aid and disaster relief, saving Europe twice in one century, forming NATO,etc, DOES THE WORLD OWE THE AMERICAN PEOPLE, OR DOES THE AMERICAN PEOPLE OWE THE WORLD??

you are stuck on this saving of europe thingy and the money for foreign aide, do you have any current information to relate this too or have you based the words and opinions (which are not yours) on something that happened 2-3 generations ago?

Originally posted by FarFromEden
I don't mean to be insulting, or arrogant. I just get a little frustrated at times....please accept my apology.

though it was not directed towards me i will accept your apologies, given the topic frustration is understandable, but to be honest you seem to have gone out of your way to be insulting and arrogant.

Perhaps if you were to come on here and give an accurate account of your opinion on the matter there would be no misunderstandings and no need to apologize...

Food for thought...
Since the time when we saved our own asses in WWII, the united states government has done some very bad things, whether thier intentions were noble or not is obviously debateable. Please concider the more recent history when you ask these questions and ask yourself, do other countries like Iran or Venezuela or Pakistan, Cuba, Vietnam or China, really care what we think of them.....