Very ancient Egyptians lived in Australia (But the government wont admit it)

Pyramids of the South Pacific; a good read.

Very ancient Egyptians in Australia is commonly known for many years....their presence in Australia in ancient times goes way back before the Aboriginals arrived.

reply to post by Byrd


Thanks for taking the time to reply in detail, was a good read!

Theres nothing I can do or say to prove one way or another but I do know through word of mouth etc these ancient relics don't end up in Australian museums because they would never be placed on display and are mostly in the hands of family hand me downs or private collectors.

Unless you approach these individual collectors or research their name and what they found, its hard to get any form of visual answer.

I have however tracked down some photos (or lack thereof)

Being new here I'm not really sure you can upload personal photos on a post so I'll just give you this website to view for some photos I quickly located.

www.underwater.pg.gda.pl...


There is also a photo here of the Egyptian scarab found.

www.mysteriousaustralia.com...

The “Gympie Ape” idol Egyptian God Thoth in ape form.

www.rexgilroy.com...

Large alter

[url]http://www.rexgilroy.com/uru_chapter2.html

reply to post by SNAFU38


Those are hilariously bad. What you've got here is a case of some dude cutting Egyptian-looking things into a rock because he thinks it'd be neat to do so.

No different from how the Mormons went around carving the ten commandments into every rock in the American west just to say "Oh Em Gee, the book of Mormon are trues!"

I think that now is as good a time as any to abandon the phrase, "written in stone," 'cause, well... that's just goofy

reply to post by Byrd


Totally off-topic, Byrd, but, my offer of marriage still stands

Take me, I'm all yours

Originally posted by FoxfilesMulder
reply to post by Byrd

 

Thanks for taking the time to reply in detail, was a good read!

No problemo! I know it's annoying when we look at stuff and go "aw, c'mon. That's just a LAME fake! -- but never teach you how to tell the real thing from a fake.

Theres nothing I can do or say to prove one way or another but I do know through word of mouth etc these ancient relics don't end up in Australian museums because they would never be placed on display and are mostly in the hands of family hand me downs or private collectors.

You should ask to see some to verify them.

Unless you approach these individual collectors or research their name and what they found, its hard to get any form of visual answer.

...another issue here is that these people MAY not exist. It's easy to make up exciting legends, and every town has its "tale spinner" who loves to tell good yarns. Totally fake or based on partial truths -- but still yarns.

www.underwater.pg.gda.pl...

The items on this page (which I'd found) are why I suggest that you start learning a few interesting things about hieroglyphs and so forth! For instance, iron wasn't in use until fairly recently 600 BC or so. Gods and kings had special staves but none of them looked anything like that "ancient iron staff head face." And it doesn't look much like a face, really.
www.ancientegyptonline.co.uk...

Here's the High Priest Hesy-Ra (3rd dynasty) with his staff. Notice that it's very plain.
theuniversityofgod.org...

Once you learn a little about the REAL cultures (by looking at pictures of real artifacts) the fakes just leap out and shout "FAKE!" So if you looked up Phoenician script and writing, you would see that the "worship Ra" stone is a really bad fake. If you looked up how Egyptians depicted Ra (who isn't a Phoenician deity) is spelled and depicted in Egypt, you would laugh to think that anyone would be fooled by that image.

Same with the drawing of the scarab. That's not even a good tourist fake.

The others... are equally bad. The stone head of "Demeter", for example, doesn't contain the Greek items that identify it as Demeter... nor is that the way Mithras was shown (and the appallingly bad sculpture shows it wasn't from any temple.) Demeter is Greek, not Phoenecian, and may have originated in Crete: en.wikipedia.org...

Phoenicians did include some Egyptian gods in their religion, but no Greek ones. Here's a list of Phoenician gods:
en.wikipedia.org...

There is also a photo here of the Egyptian scarab found.

www.mysteriousaustralia.com...

A nice little scarab, made for the tourist trade I think. I own several like it.
Here's a real one, owned by Rameses II:
commons.wikimedia.org...:Scarab_artifact_Rameses_II_CdM_Luynes881.jpg

Here's another real one:
pottery.about.com...

The “Gympie Ape” idol Egyptian God Thoth in ape form.

[url]http://www.rexgilroy.com/uru_chapter16.html

Check the pictures of a REAL statue of Thoth in ape form. Looks nothing like that "Gympie Ape." The Gympie is a "hoodoo rock" (a geological term for a thin spire of rock):
en.wikipedia.org...

The REAL Thoth in ape form (amulet... click on pictures to see how different it is from the hoodoo rock) :
www.brooklynmuseum.org...

Large alter

www.rexgilroy.com...

Now... there are things known as "balancing rocks" -- so my question is "how do you know it's an altar?" (other than Rex Gilroy, who wants to sell you books, tells you it is.)
Here's a picture of a very old altar:
ancienthistory.about.com...

Here's a modern fake (the lines of the images are bright white, and the "inscription" is just a jumble of signs (you might note that this is "translated" by Rex Gilroy, mentioned above) :
www.mysteriousaustralia.com...

Here's a REAL Phoenician inscription:
www.usc.edu...

And another one here:
news.bbc.co.uk...

They wrote real words... they didn't draw clumsy pictures.

In any case, I do hope your curiosity will lead you to start looking at pictures of real artifacts and alphabets. Once you do that, a whole new world opens to you.

Originally posted by TheWalkingFox
reply to post by Byrd

 

Totally off-topic, Byrd, but, my offer of marriage still stands

Take me, I'm all yours

Awwww! Will you take my hubby, too? We're kind of a matched set.

Originally posted by Byrd

Originally posted by TheWalkingFox
reply to post by Byrd

 

Totally off-topic, Byrd, but, my offer of marriage still stands

Take me, I'm all yours

Awwww! Will you take my hubby, too? We're kind of a matched set.

Careful what you ask for...this is an alternative web site, eh?

reply to post by Byrd


Thanks again for your comments Byrd!

I believe you are probably right in just about everything you have said and respect your comments and theories on the matter.

However, I still believe if ancient Egyptian people were not in Australia some thousands of years ago, then at the least - some ancient civilization was at some point.

My belief follows a small select number of other individuals who theorize for lack of a better term, that whomever these people were, had been in Australia possibly 10,000/15,000 years ago or more. (As with all other countries and regions etc)

With the Gympie ape statue found in Australia that we had discussed and the picture you showed me of a verified Thoth relic found in Egypt, I feel your picture is of the best case scenario when comparing the two.

For example and hypothetically:

The relic you showed could have been made from the countries top craftsman to be given to a Pharaoh and had to be the very best it could be.

The Gympie ape could have been made by a simple farmer for the purpose of honoring their God in private. The difference between Leonardo da Vinci and myself painting a picture.

Also, the other question I raise and presuming these relics are anything at all:

How many years had they been there? Highly unlikely yet possibly 15,000 years perhaps. This along with the other relics found in Australia would be more than enough to make them look like not much at all.

While on the subject, I thought this picture here looked more like what the Gympie ape relic could have been made to look like. www.heritage-images.com...

I don't necessarily believe this Gympie ape to be a statue of Thoth but I do believe this and other things found to be something old and mysterious.

An interesting quote from an article I read states:

Current Research (as at 30th June 2003) Research to date has been limited to surface visuals by private researchers with a refusal of academia to participate on political grounds. Officially, the sites do not exist. Current controversy relative to Aboriginal land claims has the Government somewhat paranoid about a possible land claim by outsiders, relative to the overwhelming evidence being uncovered of such colonies in the BC era. Academia is strictly limited in its research to Aboriginal cultures. First brought to public awareness in 2000 by local researchers, the sites and evidence triggered off media hysteria with the facts distorted into fictions. Other sites, of course, relate and Sarina is not the epicenter but only part of the huge complex now being uncovered. The researchers fight guerrilla warfare against established dogmas and political censorship with no funding and laws that prohibit private excavation, removal of artifacts and investigation of wrecks.

Another interesting article I am quoting from also reads:

The following report is from ABC News, Mackay, Queensland, Australia:

Ancient Queensland mine could change world history. The discovery of a 3,000 year old mine and harbour on the coast of central Queensland is set to change Australian, if not world history. “Resident Val Osborn has traced the remaining structures to the early mining endeavours of the Phoenicians around 1000 BC. “Mr Osborn, who has been closely guarding his discovery for four years, says the area’s rich mineral deposits attracted the Phoenicians to the northern Australian coast more than 2,700 years before Captain Cook. “Mr Osborn says the discovery at Freshwater Point, near the big coal ports south of Mackay, has attracted world scientific attention.. “It includes huge sea walls designed to allow exporting by sea. “’They were labour intensive, huge, the one at Sarina is some 800 metres long,’ he said. “’The harbour wall and the boulders are polished granite and they’re set in iron slag cement and copper slags. “’I mean it’s a monstrous thing. You could put three 200 foot ships end to end in there. It’s as calm as a mill pond and beautifully engineered.’ “Mr Osborn says the structures will be further dated when archaeologists visit Sarina. “ ‘We’ve got also a Phoenician bell temple and it’s typical and we’ve also got a cemetery and we’ll have to wait and see the archaeologist. “ ‘Nothing has been done yet, we’ve got various academics around the world interested in it of course; it’s changing world history.’” Val Osborne claims to have discovered the mine and harbour at Sarina, near Mackay, Queensland. It is reported that Mr Osborn discovered the site, including the jetty, while fishing. He believes he has discovered ancient artefacts, inscriptions and ruins dating to about 1000 BC. He says the mining complex at Freshwater Point is the size of 10 football fields and includes an 800 meter granite wall used by the Phoenicians as a loading jetty. “A half brick found is identical with pre-Roman measurements, which dates the site, and it’s inscribed in an ancient script by a stylus,” he said. “We have a bell temple, a cemetery and a boat harbor, which is typical of the Phoenician culture in that era.” If this find is Phoenician and if it dates to about 1000 BC, then it could be further evidence pointing to voyages by the Red sea fleet of King Solomon and Hiram of Tyre, mentioned in the Bible.

If you are interested further on the above topic I'll leave a URL related to the article on the above subject I found most interesting.

www.ensignmessage.com...

Looking forward to your thoughts

Originally posted by FoxfilesMulder
However, I still believe if ancient Egyptian people were not in Australia some thousands of years ago, then at the least - some ancient civilization was at some point.

I think we'd have to decide what was meant by "civilization" but I absolutely agree that there were people in Australia (Lake Mungo area) around 55,000 years ago and that they lived in small groups and settlements. I think that a close look at when and where the climate changed in Australia may give clues where to look, since humans do need a lot of water.

With the Gympie ape statue found in Australia that we had discussed and the picture you showed me of a verified Thoth relic found in Egypt, I feel your picture is of the best case scenario when comparing the two.

While true, I should also mention that the "Thoth Ape" is a specific breed of ape. No matter how badly it was depicted, these animals have faces/heads like dogs and not humans.

The relic you showed could have been made from the countries top craftsman to be given to a Pharaoh and had to be the very best it could be.

It was actually one of the mass produced amulets from a workshop. They had millions of them (quite literally) -- I own a few little (genuine) Bast amulets.

The Gympie ape could have been made by a simple farmer for the purpose of honoring their God in private. The difference between Leonardo da Vinci and myself painting a picture.

While it COULD have been, it doesn't seem to show any signs of being worked with tools. If you were doing a picture of Jesus (perhaps we can use this for an example), no matter how bad your skills you wouldn't draw Jesus with the long muzzle of (say) a cow. And if you were going to worship it, you would make another and better one to serve for your altar -- or you'd make it in a less difficult material (like wood.)

How many years had they been there? Highly unlikely yet possibly 15,000 years perhaps. This along with the other relics found in Australia would be more than enough to make them look like not much at all.

The trouble with things "dug up" by people is that we don't know what else is found with them. Tying two items together that are found in different areas requires finding evidence that they were placed at the same time and by the same culture. So, although the Hopperstad stave church (1140 AD) and temple Wat Phra Borom That in Thailand existed around the same time, you can't make a case for the same culture leaving both of them.

While on the subject, I thought this picture here looked more like what the Gympie ape relic could have been made to look like. www.heritage-images.com...

Link didn't work, darn it.

An interesting quote from an article I read states:

Current Research (as at 30th June 2003) Research to date has been limited to surface visuals by private researchers with a refusal of academia to participate on political grounds. Officially, the sites do not exist. (snip) .... The researchers fight guerrilla warfare against established dogmas and political censorship with no funding and laws that prohibit private excavation, removal of artifacts and investigation of wrecks.

The site promises lots but falls short in delivering proof (and really gets on my nerves when I see the "Egyptian translation" of his name. It's really, really, really incorrect.) Some of the pages there are truly interesting (like the "cattle marks"... but in spite of them saying it's a language and writing, they fail to establish this. But it's aroused my curiosity and I *truly* want to learn more about this practice!) A number of pages are apparently made up information (in spite of saying that they are using archaeological evidence, the "Phoenician creation" page has no real link to the real Phoenician theology or beliefs.

Given the flaws there (I touched on only a few) it doesn't seem to be a reliable source. And yes, I can see why the aborigines don't want him wandering around their sacred places and digging up stuff and yelling at them (with their thousands of years of traditions), "See? You are all wrong about yourselves and your history! You're Phoenicians!"

Ancient Queensland mine could change world history. The discovery of a 3,000 year old mine and harbour on the coast of central Queensland is set to change Australian, if not world history. “Resident Val Osborn has traced the remaining structures to the early mining endeavours of the Phoenicians around 1000 BC. “Mr Osborn, who has been closely guarding his discovery for four years, says the area’s rich mineral deposits attracted the Phoenicians to the northern Australian coast more than 2,700 years before Captain Cook. “Mr Osborn says the discovery at Freshwater Point, near the big coal ports south of Mackay, has attracted world scientific attention.

Actually, it hasn't attracted worldwide attention. It got the attention of Gilroy (who is promoting the "ancient Egyptians in Australia" idea.)

At that point I was ready to say "bogus!" but I gave it a fair shot. The points against it, as I see them are:
* it's "local resident." What studies has he done so that he can easily tell a Phoenician artifact from any other artifact on the planet?
* Gilroy is involved. My opinion of Gilroy and his identification of "artifacts" is poor -- so we can count this as "personal bias."
* the page says that “It includes huge sea walls designed to allow exporting by sea. “’They were labour intensive, huge, the one at Sarina is some 800 metres long,’ he said. This would be visible on Google Earth (which I have) and I went to check it out. When I zoom in, I don't see any unexplained things that are 800 meters long. Historical imagery of the area (which goes back to 2002) doesn't show any 800 meter structures. So where ARE these huge sea walls? They should stand out like a sore thumb on Google Earth. I see fence rows, dirt tracks, roads. A (real) archaeologist on a radio program says the "sea walls" are natural stone ridges and that there are ancient aboriginal fish traps there that shouldn't be disturbed: www.abc.net.au...
* I don't see any artifacts from this site or any photos (maybe you can find some?) that prove these things exist.
* Claim: “We’ve got also a Phoenician bell temple and it’s typical and we’ve also got a cemetery and we’ll have to wait and see the archaeologist." As far as I can tell, there's no such structure as a "Phoenician bell temple" known to archaeology. In googling for images of Phoenician temples, they appear to all be flat roofed.
* It is reported that Mr Osborn discovered the site, including the jetty, while fishing. (which means I should have been able to see it on Google Earth.)
* "He (Osborn) believes he has discovered ancient artefacts, inscriptions and ruins dating to about 1000 BC." Again, I'd like to know how he dated the artifacts and inscriptions. I would dearly love to see some inscriptions. As far as I can tell, he may have an interest in this but I am skeptical that he could date artifacts. I'm basing this (weak "argument from experience" point here) on my own trying to learn rock art styles and Native American arrowhead point differences.

If you are interested further on the above topic I'll leave a URL related to the article on the above subject I found most interesting.

www.ensignmessage.com...

Thank you! I love text sites (truly!) and I did look up some of the claims. I went out and found copies of Josephus' history on the web... here's the book which talks about Solomon ("The Antiquities of the Jews") :
rbedrosian.com...

Here's what Josephus says

4. Moreover, the king built many ships in the Egyptian Bay of the Red Sea, in a certain place called Ezion-geber: it is now called Berenice, and is not far from the city Eloth. This country belonged formerly to the Jews, and became useful for shipping from the donations of Hiram king of Tyre; for he sent a sufficient number of men thither for pilots, and such as were skillful in navigation, to whom Solomon gave this command: That they should go along with his own stewards to the land that was of old called Ophir, but now the Aurea Chersonesus, which belongs to India, to fetch him gold.

It's available as a free Project Gutenberg book here:
www.gutenberg.org...

I tried like the dickens to read the original text (it's Greek)... I can find 'Egyptian' and 'Solomon' but eventually gave up trying to find "Ophir" and "Aurea Chersonesus"... I suppose I'll have to learn Greek letters. In either case, I think I'd agree that "India" (with which they had regular trade) is meant.

However, if you'd like to try it for yourself (I always ecourage it) *here* is the original Greek. I used a Bible concordance to check some of the Greek words (www.blueletterbible.org...) (in other words, look up words in the New Testament (Greek) that would be "gold" or "Egypt", etc.) but finding that sentence will take a lot more time than I have today.

In any case, I didn't find a compelling case for that website saying that India was really Australia. India was a known (and named) place at that time and since Australia wasn't part of the Indian empire, they would not have mistaken it for India.

At least, that's my reasoning.

Whuf! Brain hurt after all that Greek. Time to go do some naturalist (bird watching) stuff.

Originally posted by PeoriaAZ
NO DOUBT...In 1909 I believe it was they found proof that the Egyptians had a secret tomb deep within the Grand Canyon as well which was also covered up one day after it made front page news

Probably not
www.philipcoppens.com...

Canyonitis: Seeing evidence of ancient Egypt in the Grand Canyon

Is there, within the Grand Canyon, an enigmatic system of tunnels that is evidence of an ancient Egyptian voyage to America? Is it all bogus? Or is the truth most likely somewhere in between?

reply to post by atlasastro


Your signature caught me. She might be the "Antichrist" . . .

Originally posted by JohhnyBGood
reply to post by stumason

 

There seems to be just far to much of this type of ancient legend from all over the world to dismiss it as just nonesense - there is just huge amounts of evidence pointing to alien beings and technology being here prior to Egypt - if this is where the bloodline families originated that have ruled this planet ever since - it is no surprise that they will keep their origins from ever becoming common knowledge.

Around 3,000 BC there came to Ireland a people known racially as the Gaels and specifically as the Tuatha de Danaan (the tribe of the goddess Danu). The word Gael connotes “the pure ones.” They were reputed to be a tribe of powerful Druid-kings, possessed of giant stature, great physical strength and weapons and instruments of “magical” power. They declared that they had come from four islands (Falias, Murias, Finias, and Gorias) in the Atlantic that had been destroyed in a deluge caused by the misuse of “magic.” The High King of the Gaels was, suggestively, called Nuada (pronounced Nuah, like Noah). Upon their arrival they made for the west country and after meeting with the ambassadors of the indigenous Iberians, they made war. The de Danaan were victorious but during the conflict Nuada’s arm was cut off. As a result he had to abdicate from the throne, for it was said that none that were “blemished” in any way could rule over the Gaels (an edict which has interesting connotations concerning genetic purity). Later the de Danaan physician fashioned and knit to his king’s body what is rather abstrusely described as a “silver arm.” A few suspect that what lies behind this tale is cybernetics technology for it is speculated that the de Danaan came from Atlantis. The kings and their consorts ruled from Derry in the north where the burial cairn of Nuada still stands. Derry comes from a word meaning Druids. Of the many strange treasures in their possession the de Danaans had four of especial importance. These are a sword, a lance, a chalice or cauldron, and a stone, called the Lia Fail (Stone of Destiny) which could speak. It is thought that these are the prototypes for the suits of the Tarot and of regular gaming cards. It was recorded of this Lance of Lugh that it shook so violently and radiated such heat that those who went anywhere near it would have their hair and fingernails drop off and themselves finally reduced to a heap of ash.
www.taroscopes.com...

This just screams Sitchin!

The connections between the stories of the worlds is amazing!

the Bible, Ancient Egyptian religion, Greek religion, Roman religion, Aztec religion, etc....

reply to post by FoxfilesMulder


Well, I've got to say first I've heard of such a story, I really don't think the government have anything to hide.... I mean, if there were any credit to this claim, I have no doubt the media would be all over it....

I don't know if anyone can answer this, but when do you suppose the Egyptians resided in Australia?

I ask this because Aboriginal tribes have been around for over 40,000 yrs.....

en.wikipedia.org...

This whole claim is very possible.

I do remember the Aboriginals saying there were white man here before the english convicts. They weren't the Dutch either...

Also there is an ongoing drama going down at New Zealand regarding an ancient site being closed off from the public as well as no studies allowed. Apparently it predates the maori/local Aboriginals.

Who knows... maybe the Egyptians used Australia as a toilet break and went along their way soon afterwards.

reply to post by downunder666


Yeah I guess that's the million dollar question.

Now when I theorized these claims about the Egyptians or another ancient civilization, I didn't mean to sound like I was saying they came here first or anything because the Aboriginal people own this land because they have been here like you say 40,000 years at the least, probably many thousands more.

I really wonder what Australia looked like all that time ago.

(probably a bunch of humans far more advanced than us with free energy and flying machines and stargates)

reply to post by FoxfilesMulder


It certainly is, Ironically I was working with local government last week and had the pleasure of working with Aboriginal affairs, with this I was working with a gentlemen who has worked with aboriginal communities for the past 50 years, he had some interesting stories, I threw out the the theory of Egyptians, and he had never heard of any stories himself, he did mention a few interesting things though, he mentioned there is evidence Aboriginal people have in fact been around for 90,000 years, and he did mention he had found artifacts they could not trace the origin.....

Here in lies the problem,unless artifacts/structures/carvings ect are found ( and recorded ) In situ by academia,they are totally worthless to the pages of our history (everything MUST have context).Contrary to popular belief most archeologists are not out to hide "real" history from us,they are just leary of counterfeiting wack jobs like Rex Gilroy

As hard evidence comes to light,these people work damn hard to make sure theories are revised and or old,outdated ones put to rest.

reply to post by colin42


Although this is possible as everyone knows that Aboriginals of Australia have been in Australial for 40,000 - 50,000 years comping originally from Africa as is the case for all of mankind. but it is still possible that egyptians have come here. back then Australia was attached by land to Papua New Guinea indoniasia, and asia so that is possible that Egyptians had been here long before Cpt. Cook.

BTW, I need to Corect you, Captain Cook was not the 1st European to discover Australia. He did so 164 years after several other Dutch explores, the 1st being in March 1606, by the Dutch navigator Willem Janszoon aboard the Duyfke follwed by Dirk Hartog, then by Frederick de Houtman, then by Jan Carstensz, next was François Thijssen, then Abel Tasman, and finally Willem de Vlamingh. The body of water between NZ and Aus is named after Able Tasman as is Tasmania, but Able Tasman had Originally Named Tasmania 'Van Diemen's Land' or in Dutch it was 'Anthoonij van Diemenslandt'

sorry if I'm nit picking a bit, but I'm Australian, from Tasmania and I do get a bit offended when there is miss infomation, even when I know it is unintentional. that and American Scools don't teach much about the rest of the world

Howdy Byrd

One nitpick, iron was known in AE before 600 BC but was being imported in from the Hittite area. The most famous example is o'Tuts iron knife.

reply to post by FoxfilesMulder


I'm fully aware there have been Egyptian pyramids discovered in Australia many years ago including Egyptian mummies. It's no secret among many Australians.