Laws Do Not Work

reply to post by kwakakev


I agree in part with your reply. Personally, I am too honest, treat others with respect and am expected to use integrity in my dealings with others bith inside and out of the workplace. Maybe that explains why I am not rich?
It seems like those who have, and crave even more wealth and power over us, are the very people who should not have such powers. Career politicians are one of my biggest pet-hates. Most are nothing more than sociopathic, greedy and downright dishonest individuals, but that seems to be a requirement these days. Most would sell out their countries in a heartbeat if it enriched them personally or gave them a little bit more power.
Big businesses break laws all the time as well. Is it ok for them, and the politicians who shield them, to brush it off as simply the cost of doing business, ignoring both national and international laws? Of course not! But when the highest office in the land can subvert the rule of law on a whim to protect big party contributors and money men then hasn't the rule of law already broken down?

If laws are to be enforced then they must apply to everyone, from the man in the street to the highest levels of power. Until this happens, the government is going to come under more and more pressure from the people to do something, resulting in ever more paranoid and police-state tactics to stamp out dissent.

The reason Laws don't work in America is because we are a REPUBLIC.

THAT is why the rich don't have the law applied to them. If you have money, the law does NOT apply to you.

We are the most corrupt nation on Earth. We've got the most political prisoners in jail...we have the most citizens in prison than any other country on Earth.

Most of those in prison here in the United States are in jail for crimes where no party was injured. Maybe they had a bag of weed...went to jail..

WHY do we have so many people in jail for crimes where NO PARTY WAS INJURED? Because rich people make money putting them in jail. That is the purpose of our legal system. Protect the wealthy families/Corporations.


Look at the retired US Air Force colonel that had a job in PACOM as a Federal Civil Servant. He got caught selling national secrets to China. He only got 36 months in a low security prison with tv, internet, pool hall, a commissary to shop in...he can work and make money...even get paid overtime.

Now you, Mr. Poor American, if YOU sold national secrets to China...you'd end up in a high security prison with 20 to life....no tv...no pool hall....no ability to work and make money in prison....

Because YOU are one of the little people. Not one of the RICH/ELITE whom this Republic was made to protect.

reply to post by kwakakev


So if I throw a rock an environmental lawyer wacko is going to sue me or I may get thrown in jail for injuring the rights of a ROCK?

Think I am going too far? Hell, they have animal lawyers now in some wacked out countries over in Europe.

I suppose you think that is just grand huh?

As I said, if someone damages the environment, they can be held accountable because someone else's rights have been infringed. There is no HUGE leap in logic here.

The whole problem here is that government and the wackos that believe they can legislate what I or anyone can do with their own Property, Life or Liberty.

And I am sick and tired of the control freaks, just as everyone should be. Kinda getting a little rediculous out there don't you think? Over 600,000 statutes and climbing.

One need not have more than 1.

Do no harm to another and do not infringe on their right to Life, Liberty or Property.

You then have citizen Grand Juries decide to press charges on an act that has been called into question. This is how the US was supposed to operate. But NOOOOOOOOOOOOO, we got the control freaks into power and people are just a bunch of damn monkeys-

Start with a cage containing five monkeys.
Inside the cage, hang a banana on a string and place a set of stairs under it.
Before long, a monkey will go to the stairs and start to climb towards the banana.
As soon as he touches the stairs, spray all of the monkeys with cold water.
After a while, another monkey makes an attempt with the same result - all the monkeys are sprayed with cold water.
Pretty soon, when another monkey tries to climb the stairs, the other monkeys will try to prevent it.

Now, turn off the cold water.

Remove one monkey from the cage and replace it with a new one.
The new monkey sees the banana and wants to climb the stairs.
To his surprise and horror, all of the other monkeys attack him.
After another attempt and attack, he knows that if he tries to climb the stairs, he will be assaulted.
Next, remove another of the original five monkeys and replace it with a new one.
The newcomer goes to the stairs and is attacked.
The previous newcomer takes part in the punishment with enthusiasm.
Again, replace a third original monkey with a new one.
The new one makes it to the stairs and is attacked as well.
Two of the four monkeys that beat him have no idea why they were not permitted to climb the stairs, or why they are participating in the beating of the newest monkey.
After replacing the fourth and fifth original monkeys, all the monkeys that have been sprayed with cold water have been replaced.

Nevertheless, no monkey ever again approaches the stairs.
Why not?
Because as far as they know that's the way it's always been around here.

Originally posted by saltheart foamfollower
reply to post by kwakakev

 

So if I throw a rock an environmental lawyer wacko is going to sue me or I may get thrown in jail for injuring the rights of a ROCK?

Think I am going too far? Hell, they have animal lawyers now in some wacked out countries over in Europe.

I suppose you think that is just grand huh?

As I said, if someone damages the environment, they can be held accountable because someone else's rights have been infringed. There is no HUGE leap in logic here.

The whole problem here is that government and the wackos that believe they can legislate what I or anyone can do with their own Property, Life or Liberty.

And I am sick and tired of the control freaks, just as everyone should be. Kinda getting a little rediculous out there don't you think? Over 600,000 statutes and climbing.

One need not have more than 1.

Do no harm to another and do not infringe on their right to Life, Liberty or Property.

You then have citizen Grand Juries decide to press charges on an act that has been called into question. This is how the US was supposed to operate. But NOOOOOOOOOOOOO, we got the control freaks into power and people are just a bunch of damn monkeys-

Start with a cage containing five monkeys.
Inside the cage, hang a banana on a string and place a set of stairs under it.
Before long, a monkey will go to the stairs and start to climb towards the banana.
As soon as he touches the stairs, spray all of the monkeys with cold water.
After a while, another monkey makes an attempt with the same result - all the monkeys are sprayed with cold water.
Pretty soon, when another monkey tries to climb the stairs, the other monkeys will try to prevent it.

Now, turn off the cold water.

Remove one monkey from the cage and replace it with a new one.
The new monkey sees the banana and wants to climb the stairs.
To his surprise and horror, all of the other monkeys attack him.
After another attempt and attack, he knows that if he tries to climb the stairs, he will be assaulted.
Next, remove another of the original five monkeys and replace it with a new one.
The newcomer goes to the stairs and is attacked.
The previous newcomer takes part in the punishment with enthusiasm.
Again, replace a third original monkey with a new one.
The new one makes it to the stairs and is attacked as well.
Two of the four monkeys that beat him have no idea why they were not permitted to climb the stairs, or why they are participating in the beating of the newest monkey.
After replacing the fourth and fifth original monkeys, all the monkeys that have been sprayed with cold water have been replaced.

Nevertheless, no monkey ever again approaches the stairs.
Why not?
Because as far as they know that's the way it's always been around here.

This post is a work of art.

Your thought experiment may not always prove true (say 1 monkey is able to eventually fend off the group)....but it is an outstanding parable.

I will likely retype it and use it elsewhere. Thanks for sharing.

reply to post by Pervius

...We are the most corrupt nation on Earth. We've got the most political prisoners in jail...we have the most citizens in prison than any other country on Earth....

May I suggest you read this Article especially the bottom of page one and the top of page two?

It explains the exact cause of the "moral breakdown" and the ripping apart of American Society.

Laws work if you follow up with severe punishment if they are broken. Nothing works for some, they are simple criminals and nothing more.

In example: inmy area we are notoriously soft on crime.. including rape and murder. Our prosecutor acts more like a defense atty than a prosecutor. Peopel wprk for our city with felonies and the last one that was exposed went on a drive by with his son during a gang thing and killed an innocent 15 yr old kid in broad daylight. He was not prosecued, but the son was. Last night 2 17 yr olds called into a pizza guy and robbed him at gunpoint for the pizza, chicken wings and money. If you take thieves out to the town square and give them public lashes it is a deterrent especially for thugging teens who in our area are taking over. If you take a person who murders ( not kills, but murders) another and kill them in public, it works... execute all involved including the "parent" that went along on a drive by and supplied the gun.

We are way too soft on crime for laws to have any power behind them. Way back when laws were simple and punishments were solid.. when this changed is when we empowered and emboldened the criminal.

reply to post by saltheart foamfollower

So if I throw a rock an environmental lawyer wacko is going to sue me or I may get thrown in jail for injuring the rights of a ROCK?

No. If a rock is an entity that we are yet to comprehend, but one day learn how to interact with then it needs a place in our constitution. It is part of life and we are the guardians. There is a lot of review and reassessment going on at them moment and I am just trying to identify what is most important so we can build from a sustainable foundation. The Universe is a big place with many unknowns. Size is a relative thing and if we are to continue to grow and expand our frontiers it will only work with a universal approach. There are many threats and surprises for anyone who walks into the unknown. The biggest threat I see is that if we are unable to be accepting then the universe will shut us down. The universe is also compassionate. If we have to break a few rocks to learn how to communicate it will be forgiving as it does understand the struggles involved.

The monkey story is great about the problems of tradition and where it can lead. We all need to find a better way to the banana.