Bradley Manning's health deteriorating in jail, supporters say (WL)

Originally posted by purplemer
reply to post by FlyersFan

 

why is a traitor.. A traitor to whom exactly... He Is giving us truth, truth is the basic premise on which to form a balanced opinion. Maybe it is you whom is the traitor tby denying the truth and accepeting ignorance.......

edit on 17-12-2010 by purplemer because: (no reason given)

That's because in US truth is considered treason, and lies and murder are considered to be patriotism. And some people support that insanity. .
second

As a human with compassion, I feel bad for the guy.

But as a military brat, this guy knew what was coming. The monk who set himself on fire wasn't complaining it was too hot did he? Don't step up to the plate if you're not ready to swing for the fences.

Originally posted by newBodyoldSoul
As a human with compassion, I feel bad for the guy.

But as a military brat, this guy knew what was coming. The monk who set himself on fire wasn't complaining it was too hot did he? Don't step up to the plate if you're not ready to swing for the fences.

I haven't seen anywhere anything which says Bradley Manning is complaining. Your comment is actually based on an incorrect assumption.

However, others, who see the treatment he is receiving, and who are immensely grateful to him arespeaking out. The distinction is important.

I would say that Assange had Bradley Manning in mind when he commented, in the press statement after the court hearing, that others also in solitary, on remand, also needed our support.

I'm so glad the Guardian published this information, and well done to that brave friend who has spoken out on his behalf.

This intimidation, harrassment and threats by government agencies is outrageous and unacceptable. I can't understand how anyone can call US a democracy. It beggars belief. These are SS tactics pure and simple.

Originally posted by GogoVicMorrow
reply to post by FlyersFan

 

Actually.. Manning didn't publish them.
Maybe one day in your life you will feel strong enough about something to try to make a change (doubtful, and it's very unlikely you will ever do anything half as important in your life as this man). There is no proof he got anyone killed. He actually probably saved lives with these documents. He couldn't cause more harm than the wars which by the way aren't for our freedom. You said people fighting for our freedom, have you been living under a rock? They aren't fighting for freedom, they are fighting for nothing and if anything it's a land grab and a military contract to make the rich richer.

Don' talk such non sense. This man did an extraordinary and good thing , and solitary is being treated like an animal.

He gave them to WL knowing full well what they would do with them. Give me a break. Treason is treason. Stolen property is stolen property.

The rationale of those defending these actions is disturbing. Suppose the information was more sensitive and that it was given to Iran, China, Venezueala etc etc. Would anyone consider Manning to be a traitor then? Same tactics, same theft just a different recipient of the intel.

I'll put Manning into the same corral with Robert Hanssen when the truth finally surfaces during his trial.

Robert Philip Hanssen (born April 18, 1944) is a former American FBI agent who spied for Soviet and Russian intelligence services against the United States for 22 years from 1979 to 2001. He is currently serving a life sentence at the Federal Bureau of Prisons Administrative Maximum facility in Florence, Colorado, a "Supermax" federal penitentiary in which Hanssen spends 23 hours a day in solitary confinement.[1]

Hanssen was arrested on 18 February 2001 at Foxstone Park[2] near his home in Vienna, Virginia and was charged with selling American secrets to Russia for more than US$1.4 million in cash and diamonds over a 22-year period.[3] On 6 July 2001, he pleaded guilty to thirteen counts of espionage in the United States District Court for the Eastern District of Virginia.[4][5] He was then sentenced to life in prison without the possibility of parole. His activities have been described as "possibly the worst intelligence disaster in US history."[6]

en.wikipedia.org...

reply to post by wcitizen


Didn't say he was complaining did I? I said the monk who set himself on fire didn't complain. You're not going to change my mind. I spent 23 years living on a military base. I commend his efforts, but the soldiers know their rules, end of story.

Wow, the hyperbole is off the charts in this thread.

Seriously.

How is stolen property stolen property when our government is here for us. We elect the officials and what is theirs is ours. This isnt the governments country...it is the peoples country and we have the right to know whats going on and what secrets the government keeps from us.

Just by providing support to Manning, you become a target of the US government.

They obviously were monitoring his friend/supporter to have known to be at the airport on his return from Mexico. They confiscated his electronics and demanded all passwords; etc. but the guy refused -- good for him.

Are these strong arm tactics not suggestive of a bully state? How long will they be able to keep him confined without some sort of trial? I am glad some news outlets are carrying the story or else the public will eventually forget about him and his heroic deed.

He has sacrificed his life for our good and people just don't care.

Originally posted by newBodyoldSoul
reply to post by wcitizen

 

The monk who set himself on fire didn't complain.

....interesting example you chose there.

reply to post by ATLien


Well why did the monk set himself on fire? Oppression. He didn't set the entire village on fire, only himself.

I SUPPORT THE TRUTH BEING EXPOSED, BUT IM NOT IGNORANT TO REALITY.

I think what people are forgetting are these soldiers take an oath. Even though it says defend against domestic enemies, it also states:

I will obey the orders of the President of the United States and the orders of the officers appointed over me, according to regulations and the Uniform Code of Military Justice.

The UCMJ states:

“(1) Any person subject to this chapter who, with intent or reason to believe that it is to be used to the injury of the United States or to the advantage of a foreign nation, communicates, delivers, or transmits, or attempts to communicate, deliver, or transmit, to any entity described in paragraph (2), either directly or indirectly, anything described in paragraph (3) shall be punished as a court-martial may direct, except that if the accused is found guilty of an offense that directly concerns (A) nuclear weaponry, military spacecraft or satellites, early warning systems, or other means of defense or retaliation against large scale attack, (B) war plans, (C) communications intelligence or cryptographic information, or (D) any other major weapons system or major element of defense strategy, the accused shall be punished by death or such other punishment as a court-martial may direct.

So what Ive been trying to say is I know he did the right thing, but he swore under oath, he signed his enlistment papers. At the end of the day, he KNEW the rules. Therefore I commend his efforts but in no way do I feel sorry for him. People have been doing this for years. The first law to protect whistleblowers was like 1910!

reply to post by newBodyoldSoul


You need to understand- laws, oaths, verbal or physical commitments...in its simplicity, the world is about one man controlling another man..they disguise the agenda behind tradition, literature and time..Think about it, tradition, literature and time...Dictated orders are turned to literature and over time they become tradition..You're born into this world with every question already answered for you..The do's and don't, what you are and aren't allowed to know..
There is no God here, "Only god can judge you", Incorrect, only the judge can judge you..and the judge is following the tradition..You have to learn to see the world for what it is...A pyramid of control

reply to post by ATLien


Thanks for your concern, but I already know the reality of the world we live in. That's why I didn't join the service like the rest of my family. That still doesn't take away from Manning signing his name on the dotted line does it? My mom is in the military, and she won't speak out on anything, no matter how much I can tell it pisses her off. Why? Because she signed the papers. It's called responsibility.

FOR THE LAST TIME, I SUPPORT THE TRUTH BEING EXPOSED BUT IN THIS SITUATION MANNING KNEW THE CONSEQUENCES. I will kindly excuse myself from this discussion since I'm so loony.

Originally posted by newBodyoldSoul
reply to post by wcitizen

 

Didn't say he was complaining did I?

No, not explicitly, but that was definitely the implication of the analogy - otherwise using it would make no sense.
[/quote

I said the monk who set himself on fire didn't complain. You're not going to change my mind. I spent 23 years living on a military base. I commend his efforts, but the soldiers know their rules, end of story.

Mm, the 'rules is rules' mentality - which incidentally didn't fly at the Nurenberg trials.

second

reply to post by wcitizen


Well.. at least these leaks aim to put people like the ones you just described in the hot seat.

reply to post by wcitizen


Army personel are people too and should be treated as such regardless of the crimes they have apperently commited. It seem s a bit odd that the usa will go half way round the world in the name of democracy and human rights and then treat its own like this.
Evidently the truth does need to be exposed...

kx

reply to post by newBodyoldSoul

Thanks for your concern, but I already know the reality of the world we live in. That's why I didn't join the service like the rest of my family. That still doesn't take away from Manning signing his name on the dotted line does it? My mom is in the military, and she won't speak out on anything, no matter how much I can tell it pisses her off. Why? Because she signed the papers. It's called responsibility.

Uhmm, no, your mother isn't displaying responsibility. She is being subservent or obedient. She has a responsibility to the truth and well being of your countryment which she is ignoring.

You, on the other hand, were showing responsibility by not volunteering in the first place. You show responsibility there for your actions and deserve credit for that. Your mom by just doing what she's told is giving over responsibility to someone else.

reply to post by newBodyoldSoul


I doubt he got into the military with intentions to leak, but he saw the chance and he grabbed it. You would have to be in the military to have that chance.

Originally posted by plexus
There are convicted rapists and pedophiles that get better treatment than he does.

Again ... solitary confinement is for his safety. He made a big name for himself and every thug in prison wants a piece of him. That's how they make big names for themselves. And again ... boooo-freak'n-hooooo. The idiot did the crime, now he can do the time without a pillow or TV. Awwwww .. poor lil' guy .. he should'a thought of that before he stole classified documents and broadcast them all over the freak'n planet.

Originally posted by GogoVicMorrow
Actually.. Manning didn't publish them.

Actually, he turned them over knowing full well that they'd be published. So he's just as guilty of it as the publisher.

Maybe one day in your life you will feel strong enough about something to try to make a change

1 - You don't know me and have NO CLUE as to what I've volunteered to do or given my time to.
2 - If I feel strongly about something, I don't break the law to get the job done.
3 - He felt 'strong enough' about something alright .. but it was the WRONG THING TO DO.
4 - What he tried to change wasn't anything for the better. He made things worse.

(doubtful, and it's very unlikely you will ever do anything half as important in your life as this man).

:shk: Again .. you know nothing about me. NOTHING. But yes, he did something important .. important on the dreadful and illegal and wrong side. But it's definately 'important'.

There is no proof he got anyone killed. He actually probably saved lives with these documents.

So you claim there is no proof anyone got killed, but then turn around and claim he probably saved lives .. but offer no proof yourself? Comical. The proof that he probably got people killed is that the sensitive diplomacy that was going on and the deals that were going on have been revealed. MANY people from around the world put their lives on the line to try to bring peace in the world through these covert diplomatic means. By him stealing and releasing the info, their lives are put in danger by those around them who disagree with them. It's very simple.

Don' talk such non sense.

Back atchya.

This man did an extraordinary and good thing , and solitary is being treated like an animal.

He's a tool of the NWO and he did NOT do a good thing.
Being in solitary is what he deserves. He's a thief and a criminal .. and not too bright.
Poor lil' guy misses having a TV ... that's just too damn bad.
If he can't do time without a TV .. then he shouldn't have done the crime.

Originally posted by purplemer
why is a traitor.. A traitor to whom exactly...

Traitor - someone who betrays his country by committing treason
double-crosser: a person who says one thing and does another
He fits the bill. He promised and swore to take care of his country
but instead he betrays it by stealing from it. And no .. his theft wasn't
patriotic or helpful but instead was HARMFUL. He blew apart delicate
diplomacy and negotiations.

Maybe it is you whom are the traitor to your own people by denying the truth....

If denying truth is your criteria for 'traitor' then you'd best take a look in the mirror.

Originally posted by lspilot6946
it is the peoples country and we have the right to know whats going on and what secrets the government keeps from us.

That's completely wrong. Everyone in the country does NOT have a right to know everything that is going on. Things are done in secret for our own security. Negotiations are made in secret and in quiet so that diplomacy can move forward. Example - You have no need to know about the stealth technology in a B2. It is for our own good that certain information isn't revealed. NO .. you do not have a right to know everything that is happening.