Massive Canadian melt may have triggered flood of biblical proportions

I've always had a gut feeling Canada was guilty of something, just couldn't quite put my finger on it..

Just putting it out there.

Anyone want to chip in on a submarine with me?

A British researcher has published a startling new theory that the remains of untold ancient settlements from a 100,000-year stretch of human history were submerged by the rapidly rising waters of the Persian Gulf around 6,000 BC — the result, in all likelihood, of a catastrophic, planetwide flood triggered in Canada. There's a consensus among scientists that the collapse of a kilometres-high glacial dam at the end of the last ice age caused a massive outflow of meltwater into the Arctic or North Atlantic Ocean near Hudson Bay, generating a sharp rise in sea levels around the world and profoundly altering the Earth's climate. Some scientists have even speculated that ancient myths about great floods — culminating in the biblical story of Noah's Ark — were inspired by the worldwide deluge.

what do you think?

reply to post by WHOS READY


Looks like South Park got it right.

Makes you wonder. So god saw what was going to happen and warned noah. hrmmmm.

Yes, I think this is entirely possible. Basically every continent has different myths of a great flood, so it's quite clear there was something massive. I doubt Noah himself ever really existed or built an ark - I mean, seriously, even if he did, I doubt the ark would have held up to massive deluges of water like that. But it's more than likely that this was just how later cultures explained the fact that they were still alive after a flood that destroyed everything because they didn't realize that this flood didn't actually destroy everything - they only saw the stuff around them being destroyed.

reply to post by WHOS READY



S & F

Adds more weight to the hypotheses I outlined earlier when I wrote the following two threads. Don't let the thread titles fool you. They are related.

Origins of Atlantis/Lemuria Myths Part-1

and

Origins of Atlantis/Lemuria Myths Part-2

Never mind. Bad joke

The flood was not entirely global, it was regional occurring on a global scale, with Eastern Europe being hit hard. With no real access to news in what was happening to the rest of the world they looked at it as 'the end of the world'. If all you ever knew was an island and that island started to sink into the ocean, you would think the world was ending.

There is no evidence however of a single huge flood, which covered all the mountains of the world, only many stories from throughout the world of great floods, which decimated humanity in the distant past and changed the map of the world in the process.

Sumerian origins and the great flood

With this said, floods don't occur like this from huge tidal waves. They propagate slowly from glacier melt and sea level rise. The Mediterranean, Black and Caspian Sea were hardest hit in this region for we have archeological evidence now showing cities under these seas. To create a big tidal wave you need a tsunami 'maker', this being a comet/meteorite strike which tidal waves would be the least of our worries and there is no mention of other effects from this type of event or earthquakes/volcanoes which again would only affect specific local coastal areas and would not be a world wide calamity. These submerged cities/buildings they have found are intact for the most part which coincides with slow water level rise not tidal wave for a tidal wave would of wiped the slate clean.

Back to the island example, if I was on an island and saw the water slowly rising I would start to make a sea worthy vessel. What I am in dispute over is the biblical 'story' of how Noah sailed the Ark with all those animals. The thought of one man having 2 of every animal on one ship with provisions for them all (duties including cleaning the pens, feeding, navigation, repairs) makes no sense to me whatsoever. The Ancient Alien theory that the Ark was a alien 'gene bank' is even more believable. He would have to be an 'alien' to do all that work including sailing a ship that size during a catastrophe. There may have been a group of people that used this vessel to save themselves or relocate. But as for anyone thinking it was Noah's Ark I would believe in Santa Clause or the Easter Bunny first!

Originally posted by WHOS READY
I've always had a gut feeling Canada was guilty of something, just couldn't quite put my finger on it..

Blame Canada WAS my first thought...
I don't have the figures at hand, but there was a lot of water tied up in the glacial melt, and it was dammed up creating glacial 'Great Lakes'. Shouldn't take much to find the numbers and do the math. I'm only suprised it took this long to make the association.

It would explain much...line-up for reparations starts on the left. No jostling now.

God damn. I come here ready with my Blame Canada comment, thinking I'll be all original and funny, only to see just about everyone else on the board has already had my "highly original" thought...

Originally posted by spacekc929
I doubt Noah himself ever really existed or built an ark - I mean, seriously, even if he did, I doubt the ark would have held up to massive deluges of water like that. But it's more than likely that this was just how later cultures explained the fact that they were still alive after a flood that destroyed everything because they didn't realize that this flood didn't actually destroy everything - they only saw the stuff around them being destroyed.

From a Biblical perspective, it was Enki who (with the critical assistance of his half-sister, Ninki, aka Nin-khursag) created Adam and Eve. It was Enlil, on the other hand, who created “Edin”. Enki was the serpent in the garden, who urged Adam and Eve to eat of the fruit of the Tree of Knowledge of Good and Evil (which was infinitely beneficial to their spiritual growth). It was Enlil, who drove them out of Edin, while Enki was there to clothe them. It is worth noting that Zecharia Sitchin [2] claims that the biblical word for “snake” is nahash, which comes from the root word NHSH, and which means “to decipher, to find out.” In other words, Enki, the God of Wisdom.

In the time of Noah, it was Enlil who either created the Great Deluge/Flood as a means of wiping out mankind (because they supposedly made too much noise), or else refused to warn the humans or do anything to save them or help them to save themselves. Enki, on the other hand, apparently against orders of the Anunnaki (who Enlil now controlled), provided the boat plans for Noah to build his Ark, and thus save him, his family (and likely a fair number of helpful artisans and their families). Enki included as well the seed of other living things (a “natural” kind of thing to do).

www.halexandria.org...

Graham Hancock's "Underworld" describes this completely. How can you get a tidal wave from glacier melt? Take a look at Hudson Bay. It's round, an old asteroid or meteor strike. Being effectievly a heat sink, the ice in Hudson Bay melted before the surrounding ice dam on land. Now you've got a very full Hudson Bay, much higher than it is today with the melt off from the surrounding glaciers, held back by an ice dam that is melting.

Then you have a breach of the ice dam. Then you have a Flood. Not only do you have a tidal wave, but the level of the oceans rises by several feet in a few hours, thus inundating the coastal civilizations. How advanced were they? We don't know, but probably just about pre-Renaissance. Good candidates are India and Japan. In both cases there are extensive underwater ruins. This also explains the universal flood stories found not only in the Bible, but as far removed as Native American legends.

I can't help thinking that something has been lost between Prof Jim Teller's ideas and what's been written in the article? Exactly how many cubic metres of water would it take to cause catastrophic floods in the Persian Gulf?

The world is covered by an approximate 139,397,000 square miles of water (Source). Some 1.3 billion cubic kilometres (0.75 billion cubic miles) of water!! I wonder how much water was supposedly sitting behind the walls of this truly awesome glacier to cause huge ocean rises across the world? A one foot rise would be pretty catastrophic, but would require a body of water thousands of cubic miles in volume.

If there's a maths guy reading this, please crunch the numbers. What volume of water would create a one foot rise in seal levels based on the figure above?

The Flood Myths (great pdf) are region-specific accounts from a distant time when localised flooding due to habitation around coastal/sea/river/lake occurred. A tsunami in Indonesia would generate flood tales that would take on the form of myth. Likewise a flood event in Canada could be mythologised. That isn't to say that Indonesia or Canada compared stories...they had no connection whatsoever. Instead we have hundreds of stories with the same features due to the frequency of floods in the best locations for humans to be living in. It's probably our modern minds seeking to connect the multitude of floods into one 'great flood.'

EDIT to add: This is interesting...throws some of my ideas above into question...

Influence of the large ice sheets in Greenland and Antarctica, ice caps and glaciers, and terrestrial water reservoirs Besides steric changes, sea level varies also due to non-steric volume changes – these relate to mass changes from adding water to the oceans from external water reservoirs. The world’s largest fresh water reservoir is the Antarctic ice sheet. Its volume is currently estimated as 24.7 cubic kilometers; melting of the entire ice sheet would raise sea level approximately 56.6 m. The second largest water reservoir is the Greenland ice sheet. Its volume is currently estimated as 2.9 cubic kilometers, and melting of the entire ice sheet would raise sea level approximately 7.3 m.

Max Planck News

Again, if there's someone good at the numbers please have a look at these figures and post your thoughts.

reply to post by Kandinsky


I think too many detractors are stuck on arguing against the "Single massive flood myth" instead of the possible [sometimes gradual, sometimes massive and rapid] coastal flooding evidence now starting to come to light.

This [sometimes gradual, sometimes massive and rapid] coastal flooding both could have occurred over a period of say a day to two or over a period of a few years or more. I doubt anybody who has a real interest in discovering what really went on about 8,000 to 12,000 years ago would take the "Noah's Global Flooding/Great Deluge/Flood " myth seriously


Here is an interesting story I bookmarked a few years back.
Bursting Ice Dam Flooded the Ancient Ocean

LiveScience Staff Writer posted: 29 June 2006 02:00 pm ET

Near the end of the last Ice Age 8,000 years ago, an ice dam on North America's east coast broke, releasing a torrent of fresh water seven times more voluminous than all the Great Lakes combined. It all rushed into the Atlantic Ocean over the course of only a few months.

At around the same time, ocean circulation worldwide slowed to a crawl, plunging Europe into a second ice age that lasted centuries.

Scientists have long suspected the two events were linked, and now they have the evidence from sediment core samples to prove it.

edit on 13-12-2010 by SLAYER69 because: (no reason given)

reply to post by SLAYER69

I think too many detractors are stuck on arguing against the "Single massive flood myth" instead of the possible [sometimes gradual sometimes massive and rapid] coastal flooding. They both could have occurred over a period of say a day to two or over a period of a few years or more.

True. From an anthropological perspective, there's no way of connecting the flood myths to a single event. We can't date their origins, but we do know that diverse cultures (separated by landmass) had no way of communicating their experiences. This is why I favour the notion that the flood myths are largely the echoes in time of regional events transmitted through oral histories/mythologies to the present day.

Perhaps yellow stone played a part in warming the glacier and forming the dam. Just a guess but whatever caused the Dam if it is the case I would think the effect of this would be global even before the dam wall broke.

Once this happened the amount of heat being reflected by the white ice would be reduced causing a cascade effect. I would also guess the extra water would absorb more heat warming the planet faster.

So I could imagine a huge overnight rise in sea level followed by an extra but slower rise after.

May even explain why the area surrounding the pyramids turned from fertile to a desert.

BTW I would narrow the blame to the French Canadians for no other reason than they are French.

Originally posted by FatherLukeDuke
God damn. I come here ready with my Blame Canada comment, thinking I'll be all original and funny, only to see just about everyone else on the board has already had my "highly original" thought...

Hey man
GMTA

Originally posted by colin42
BTW I would narrow the blame to the French Canadians for no other reason than they are French.

Sorry, man...they're my cousins and we stand together. And my Canada includes Florida!

I'm going to stick my foot out and say that this one, like the "meteor bursting over the Canadian ice shield" is a nice try but totally wrong.

There were several ice dams that broke, and they left quite a footprint on the Earth. HOWEVER... checking the sea levels at the time showed that they caused a small rise in the sea level (about 70% of the Earth's surface is ocean, according to several sources.)

In addition, none of the archaeological evidence supports this. We do see settlements that (occasionally) were submerged (one within a few hundred years of the time that Plato lived), but not the edges of the entire world. The assemblages in the Gulf of Aden are assemblages and not typical of the cultures that were in the Levant around 6000 BC.

Finally, if you knew how to build cities and had good technology, the coastlines being flooded would affect you but wouldn't wipe out your technology. If New York and Atlanta and all of Florida went underwater (and Houston, too) everyone who wasn't flooded out would still have cars, cattle, corn, cotton, oil, shovels, and everything else. We wouldn't go back to swinging in the trees just because the coastline flooded.

Originally posted by colin42
Perhaps yellow stone played a part in warming the glacier and forming the dam. Just a guess but whatever caused the Dam if it is the case I would think the effect of this would be global even before the dam wall broke.

The time sequence won't work there -- the last time Yellowstone was active was 640,000 years ago.
answers.yahoo.com...

May even explain why the area surrounding the pyramids turned from fertile to a desert.

The desert was already there, and began getting bigger about 5,000 years ago ... when goats were domesticated.

reply to post by Byrd


Still....pieces of a big puzzle, need someone to correlate the timeline....difficult, due to a lot of uncertainty, of course, of exact sequences and order of occurrence.

Of course, the "legends" of all cultures, to include (I must emphasize) the over-simplistic children's story of "Noah" can serve as disparate clues, once one removes the emotional attachments that sometimes are associated with "religious" fables. For, as in many cases, much of oral tradition stems from some event....usually to be embellished in the retelling over generations.

Archaeology, and the continued increase in technologies used to study the signs of ancient settlements found jsu toff the coasts, underwater, all will contribute. A rational, neutral clearing-house repository of all these discoveries, and a way to sort them as "improbable", "probable", "likely", etc could be useful.

I don't know the timeline (might be way too ancient, pre-dating any Human histories) but the Straits of Gibraltar have always struck me a suspicious. Not that the Mediterranean formed immediately FROM that breach, but a possibility that the Sea was much smaller, and grew rapidly as a result of a fairly sudden widening of the gap, in the Straits. Just one other nut to toss on the delicious Sundae of possible contributing factors. To account for what we observe, and the odd coincidence of "flood legends" from so many different cultures.

I know that the Islands of Japan have some ingriguing underwater sites....we seem to be missing (or, I've never heard of) any reports form that other very old, long-lived culture, that also has a presence on the shores of oceans...China!

Yeah, it makes sense. And then through the generations it went from rapid sea-level rise to world-wide cover up by miles of water. Much the same way as when you play telephone.