House Approves 4.6 Billion Settlement For Native Americans And Black Farmers

The government has admitted to decades of discriminatory practices and a recent Senate vote brought the federal government closer to finding a way to make amends.

The two settlements are related to decades of discriminatory practices and injustices that swindled the two groups out of billions of dollars. But views remain mixed within the two communities of how the money will be divided and if it is enough to make up for the suffering they claim.


www.edmondsun.com...

reply to post by speculativeoptimist

Black farmers would receive $1.2 billion, after they alleged they were cheated out of loans from the Agriculture Department. The government will direct $3.4 billion to American Indians who say the Interior Department swindled them out of royalties from natural resources like gas and timber. 

www.foxnews.com...

I had heard about this years ago and remember some people scoffing at the idea. I think it is fair and a positive gesture to attempt to repair some of the damaging history that has occurred.
I would imagine trying to sort the details of this will be a logistics nightmare, but at least it is in motion.

Naturally there are some that oppose the effort.

Rep. Michele Bachmann, R-Minn., opposed the settlement. She says that many of the programs designed to accommodate black farmers are easy targets for fraud. 
Rep. Steve King, R-Iowa, tried to delete money from the program with an amendment but was blocked by the House Rules Committee. 

www.foxnews.com...

I can appreciate some concern regarding fraud, but that would not keep me from supporting the notion.
I hope this effort creates more healing than strife, but who knows.
What do you all think?

Peace,
spec

Black farmers would receive $1.2 billion, after they alleged they were cheated out of loans from the Agriculture Department. The government will direct $3.4 billion to American Indians who say the Interior Department swindled them out of royalties from natural resources like gas and timber. 

link

When I read "billion" I knew it wasn't enough. How much is this country worth, exactly? If they wish to make amends to the people of this planet, then The Queen of England, BP, and The Vatican are going to have to come out of pocket.

Who is going to get the money? Do we really think they can pay the dead, who slaved in the attempt to get back what was stolen from them?

is this truly a move toward justice, in the 'positive' direction? Or are we the sheople selling ourselves for cheap, once again? If congress is willing to admit it, then I want to see some heads, G-ddamnit! You can't put a value on injustice, PAYMENT will NEVER be enough, how bout, instead of accepting The Federal Reserve's monopoly money, we politely ask our Corporatized government to go F-k off to a distant island, far far away from this Beautiful Planet. Yeah, somehwere dark an cold, where they can wage all the wars and Monsanto-bioterrorist attacks against themselves until they are all dead.

If I were those farmers, and land owners, I WOULD NOT ACCEPT their money, but instead, demand they give me my land back, tell them to stop poisoning my Grandchildren, let the government know that I am fed up with them being in bed with Monsanto.

You can Keep the Change, OBAMA, I'll fix Mother Earth myself, I'll fix her the best way I know how, by leaving her to do what she does best, by letting her be herself.

Ain't no corporation gonna buy me, now is the time to stand up - F The Money!!!

reply to post by speculativeoptimist


So... If they DO get paid, does that mean that we can finally lay that racism BS to rest? Does a payment somehow equal years and years and years of wrongdoing? Just wonderin'...

MOTF!

reply to post by leira7

If I were those farmers, and land owners, I WOULD NOT ACCEPT their money, but instead, demand they give me my land back. Keep the Change, OBAMA, I'll fix Mother Earth myself, I'll fix her the best way I know how, by leaving her to do what she does best, by letting her be herself.

I had not thought of it like that leira7, and I kind of agree but wonder too if something is better than nothing, or is it too little too late and considered offensive?
I guess I will have to leave that up to the Afro and Native Americans. I am sure this will be welcomed by some and shunned by others, but at least it is some new attention for an old sore. Let's just hope it heals and not tears further.

Thanks for the reply,
spec

Just to bring a different side to this-

Does our generation treat the decendants of these people the same way our ancestors treated their ancestors??
Why does our generation have to pay then??

It'd be like you having to pay back money your great-grandparents robbed from a bank..

Yes, what happened was wrong, theres no doubt about it...
But why should our generation, who for the most part treat these people with equality, which is probably more than our forefathers did, have to pay for the mistakes of others???

I'm not meaning to offend anyone, i'm just stating my opinion on the subject.

Peace and Love.

reply to post by MessOnTheFED!

If they DO get paid, does that mean that we can finally lay that racism BS to rest?

I am guessing that will depend on the individual MOTF, but I would bet this is a double edged sword that will both heal and further cut(divide), just by shining a new light on the situation. And "racism BS," I doubt will be laid to rest anytime soon, in fact this could potentially make it worse by putting people on the defense.
Thanks for the reply...

Peace,
spec

Some people are going to feel a bit tiffed about this.........

I would say they are robbing Peter to pay Paul.

But then,has it ever been any other way?.




www.abovetopsecret.com...

reply to post by speculativeoptimist


Exactly. It will ultimately seperate us further IMHO.

MOTF!

reply to post by speculativeoptimist


In the words of Langston Hughes I think we the sheople, need to stop "Passing the Buck" this is not only an issue for the ones deeply affected (Afro and Native Americans), but it's also an issue that ALL AMERICANS need to speak about, because, if you think about it, how would this country look, if things were done decently and in order, and by decently, I mean, without all of the killing, raping, and pillaging of our peoples, land, water, and food supply. Perhaps if we had listened to the ones who knew this land best, we wouldn't be in so much distress: Cancer, Great Depression (dust bowl), Sodium Flouride in our water, Endangered Species like the grey and red wolf through agricultural practices, trampling of rare plants and water contamination because of cattle...

think about how different our lives would have been, if only we had listened to them.

If you are breathing, then it's not to late for life, for us, BUT I say, it is TOO LATE for the U.S. of A.

reply to post by billb1215

Yes, what happened was wrong, theres no doubt about it...
But why should our generation, who for the most part treat these people with equality, which is probably more than our forefathers did, have to pay for the mistakes of others???

Maybe because we have all benefited from the travesties? We now own the land taken from Native Americans and many families prospered from the slave work back in the day, and many families continue to benefit from the wealth acquired back then, that helped make them rich, in terms of labor, and the prosperity from the past continues to keep those families wealthy.
Before anyone flames me, I am just trying to address some of these questions with speculation, and am refraining from really taking a position, other than leaning towards this decision by Congress being a good one.

spec

Originally posted by speculativeoptimist
reply to post by billb1215

 

Yes, what happened was wrong, theres no doubt about it...
But why should our generation, who for the most part treat these people with equality, which is probably more than our forefathers did, have to pay for the mistakes of others???

Maybe because we have all benefited from the travesties? We now own the land taken from Native Americans and many families prospered from the slave work back in the day, and many families continue to benefit from the wealth acquired back then, that helped make them rich, in terms of labor, and the prosperity from the past continues to keep those families wealthy.
Before anyone flames me, I am just trying to address some of these questions with speculation, and am refraining from really taking a position, other than leaning towards this decision by Congress being a good one.

spec

edit on 30-11-2010 by speculativeoptimist because: (no reason given)

It still doesn't change the fact that we are paying for somebody elses crimes.
Why not use that money for the betterment of this nation as a whole, and not just to benefit certain races?

reply to post by billb1215

Why not use that money for the betterment of this nation as a whole, and not just to benefit certain races?

My honest reaction to your question is, sometimes part of a "whole" nation is the overall health of it's community, and this may sometimes mean acknowledging injustices done to part of that whole, by the whole. So in this case, that money may actually be for the betterment of our nation.
This is just my opinion though, and I understand where you are coming from. The timing of this is a bit troubling in the mix of chaos going on right now, and I agree, there are many things that could use some financial assistance right now, but I hope this can be a positive ingredient for the mix.... thanks for your input.

spec

We have all benefitted through travesties and the ill's of the past, but it doesnt guarantee a cash payout to anyone alive today because their ancestors suffered.

This sets a dangerous precendent, as why and how can it be limited to only select groups of "minorities"? And if this is the path we will take, why can't other people from other supposed discriminated and oppressed groups stake a claim to government money as well? Where will it all end?

Hell, my family is traditionally Scots Irish so I feel that I deserve a billion dollar payout from the Brittish government for hundreds of years of imperialism and oppression of my people. Hows about while we are at it I can sue the Italian government because at one point and time in history the Roman legions overtook my country men and forced them into servitude and slavery?

See how stupid does this whole notion of reparations sounds when you get down to it? Where does the tit run dry? Where does one group get the right to collect monetarily for damages that were not done directly to them? What case does a black person living in modern day America have toward any payout when he/she has suffered in no way directly? How many folks do you know who are alive today who were slaves in the cotton fields of Mississippi? Whats that you say...none?

If this holds up then it would entitle any group, race, creed that has ever been wronged in the past to collect damages from their perceived oppressor. Why cant we all as a people just say that YES we understand that wrongs and atrocities have been commited in the past against MANY different groups of people, and that moving forward in an enlightened age of reason, these practices shall never again be permitted. Thus we are all choosing and agreeing to live as free and equal men?

What good will money do anyway, aside from creating more hatred, jealousy and divisiveness?

reply to post by BlackOps719

Why cant we all as a people just say that YES we understand that wrongs and atrocities have been commited in the past against MANY different groups of people, and that moving forward in an enlightened age of reason,

Hey BlackOps, I hear what you are saying and I guess saying "yes we understand," in some peoples minds include reparation maybe. Oh those bleeding hearts .
I can't help but compare the mentioned injustices too and while I feel Imperialism and oppression are horrible, I also think genocide, poisoning with small pox, experimenting on with syphilis, forcing emancipation, stealing one from their country, chaining them, bringing them to another country to be bought and sold and making them a slave, ....all of these weigh heavier than oppression and Imperialism, imho.
Don't get me wrong, I do understand you're perspective, but I think the Native American and
African American is different/worse than many historical travesties, and it is part of our history.
But it appears I may be in the minority here, interesting nonetheless.

spec

Do giving reparations truly work?

All one needs to do is look at how well it worked out for the Jewish people who had to suffer through the holocaust, and the recently reported embezzling of the Holocaust Trust fund. As many members stated with that issue, most of the time, you have business men pocketing and profitting off of others past grievences.

The Holocaust Trust Fund disaster is the perfect example as to why these sorts of things will NEVER work, even if the victims that suffered the loss are still living.

reply to post by speculativeoptimist



The mere fact that Native Americans have real legal claims to the land that was stolen is one truth that I won't overlook. Also the fact that the US government commited genocide against the native people's of America, killing over 60 million people and dishonoring legal written treaties and land agreements.

In this case, yes. I can see where some sort of reparation may be in order. The slavery thing, not so much.

reply to post by BlackOps719


Thank you for your replies BlackOps, I appreciate the perspective.

spec

Who qualifies for this? What if you are half native american?

What about the white farmers who didnt do so well with loans etc? How about the black slave owners.....do they get money fot their farms? This is another pathetic attempt at buying votes, nothing more nothing less, having it approved the way it was makes it appear legit......but lets call it what it is, a bribe.