Is climate change real?

reply to post by Misterlondon


Hey Misterlondon, thanks for actually asking this question with an open mind. You will find most people around here don't do that at all and I agree with The Sword, chances are this thread will just degenerate into another schoolyard recess debate like all the rest of them do.

The best advice I can give you therefore is don't listen to ANYONE on here. Take the time to investigate it properly and come to your own conclusions. Because everybody and their monkey has an opinion on this, but unfortunately 98% of them are horribly misinformed yet foolishly arrogant ones.

You will have people constantly tell you all sorts of supposed facts about global warming like "all the planets are heating up" or "carbon lags temperature and therefore is an effect and not a cause". Take note these are all actually complete MYTHS that are being spread around the internet by mostly irresponsible automatons who don't know any better yet think they're all sudden climate experts now.

All of these myths can be debunked here:
Skeptic Arguments and What the Science Says

So next time anybody tries to lecture you with some obscure "fact" about global warming, head over to that link and look it up and read the WHOLE story first.

In the meantime, let me leave you with a couple more resources -

Most people, even around here, will agree that climate change is real - just not that it's man made.

Well I would recommend that you read up a little bit about The History of Global Warming and see for yourself that the climate change we're seeing today was predicted (as man-made) over a hundred years ago. Also here's a great video explaining why what we're experiencing right now can't be explained as just some natural cycle either:



Furthermore check out some of the following links showing that, despite the illusion that there's all this heated professional debate going on, numerous studies and surveys have found that there is a MASSIVE consensus (~97%) amongst actual climate scientists over this being the real deal:

Report: 97 percent of scientists say man-made climate change is real
Examining the Scientific Consensus on Climate Change
Expert credibility in climate change
Scientific Consensus on Global Warming
Logical Science: The Consensus on Global Warming


And last but definitely not least - you may be wondering why there's all this public doubt over global warming then? It's because it has been quite literally manufactured by a denial industry largely backed by fossil fuel industries that are trying to derail the issue altogether, because they stand to lose everything from it. If you have 40 min, here's a great video detailing this movement:

Google Video Link

Also some further reading:
Think-tanks take oil money and use it to fund climate deniers
Smoke, Mirrors & Hot Air: How ExxonMobil Uses Big Tobacco’s Tactics to Manufacture Uncertainty on Climate Science
Koch Industries: Secretly Funding the Climate Denial Machine
32000 Scientists
The Climate Killers: Meet the 17 polluters and deniers who are derailing efforts to curb global warming

Judge for yourself, cheers

All this I gleaned from googling, also print outs from other sites, TV programs, newspapers, books, etc.
Volcanic activity has gone up 300% in the last 2,000 years, the 'natural' world pumps out roughly 3.5 gigatons of crap, such as CO2, ash, sulphur dioxide hydrogen, helium, argon,water vapour, Methane, any other nasty stuff you can think of, the Human world pumps out 50 gigtons of the same stuff, you do the math.
Last time I looked, CO2 was 383 parts per million, that is less than 1%! of the atmosphere, can so little affect so much? Here is a choice morsel, Termite produce more Methane than cows! by the way, cows burp, they don't fart, cows have four stomachs, the first two produce the flatulence.

reply to post by pikestaff


This is just more myth-mongering:

Do the Earth’s volcanoes emit more CO2 than human activities? Research findings indicate that the answer to this frequently asked question is a clear and unequivocal, “No.” Human activities, responsible for some 36,300 million metric tons of CO2 emissions in 2008 [Le Quéré et al., 2009], release at least a hundred times more CO2 annually than all the world’s degassing subaerial and submarine volcanoes (Gerlach, 2010).

Besides, volcanic eruptions are well known to have an overall cooling effect:

The most significant climate impacts from volcanic injections into the stratosphere come from the conversion of sulfur dioxide to sulfuric acid, which condenses rapidly in the stratosphere to form fine sulfate aerosols. The aerosols increase the reflection of radiation from the Sun back into space, cooling the Earth's lower atmosphere or troposphere.

Source: USGS

And yes CO2 is less than 1% of the atmosphere, but 99% of the atmosphere is not a greenhouse gas - so it has absolutely NOTHING to do with this conversation. It's just a trick propagandists use to try and make things seem insignificant. But it has all the logical relevance of me telling you a vial of poison can't hurt you because it's nowhere near the size of an elephant.

CO2 makes up about 10% of the concentration of greenhouse gases in our atmosphere, and studies have shown it's impact ranges from something like 9-26%.

Originally posted by mc_squared

Originally posted by fixer1967
Yes it is real but guess what. Is is happening on other planets as well.

www.abovetopsecret.com...

The sun is going though some changes. It does that from time to time. It is just that we human were not around the last time it happened. If there were any one around they sure did not write about it.

Yes and guess what - that thread was debunked on page 3. But of course most people don't bother reading the details, only the headlines.

The Sun's past influence can be evaluated through proxy data, and in the meantime it has been closely monitored by satellites for the last 3 decades. It is showing a cooling trend:

[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/0943566b2fef.gif[/atsimg]

Well I have been keeping up with this and it is real. Temps on the other planets is on the rise. What does that mean for us here on Earth is anyones guess. No one as of yet really can prove anything thing one way or the other. I guess we will all keep debating over this until in no longer matters

go look up the "freezing river Thames in london".
before the industrial age it would totaly freeze up.
they had markets on it.
and horses and cartridges would cross it.
Now it does not get icy.

reply to post by mc_squared


good answer... thanks....

my house sits atop a sand dune created by strong northwesterly winds blowing the sands of a glacial lake created 8000 years ago and dried up 3000 yrs ago.


climate change is on-going.

reply to post by Misterlondon


There are actually 4 answers to this:

1. Yes, the climate changes constantly, and sometimes drastically. (objective standard)

2. a. Manmade climate change is real. (subjective standard)

b. Manmade climate change is a hoax. (subjective standard)

3. ANYTHING that takes billions of dollars from some economies/businesses/ people and gives it to others for any reason has real, and sometimes unexpected consequences. (practical standard)

Answer No. 1 is based on simple observation, and requires no projections or speculation.

Answers 2a and 2b reflect differing interpretations of data.
Noone has proven 2a or 2b; there are theories and projections supporting each.

The only answer that REALLY matters is No. 3. It will make you rich, or can make you struggle as NGOs and governments alter the conditions under which you will live and function depending upon their policies based on 2a and 2b.